transcript

Speaker 1:
[00:02] It's the Locked On Podcast Network, your team every day.

Speaker 2:
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Speaker 3:
[00:41] There are a whole lot of defensive options still available to the Cincinnati Bengals, and one will be there at 41. Let's reset the draft for day two for the Cincinnati Bengals.

Speaker 4:
[00:58] You are Locked On Bengals, your daily Cincinnati Bengals podcast, part of the Locked On Podcast Network, your team every day.

Speaker 3:
[01:08] What up, Bengals fans, and welcome to another episode of the Locked On Bengals podcast. He's James Rapien. I'm Jake Liscow, and day one of the NFL Draft is in the books, which means it's time for us to take a look at who might be available for the Bengals to pick at 41. In today's episode brought to you by FanDuel, where new customers can bet just $5 and get $250 in bonus bets. If your first bet wins, check it out at fanduel.com to get started. And James, we are looking ahead to round two. First, we start by talking about who wasn't picked, who we're hoping makes it to the Bengals at pick 41. And there's a big block of players that I think will be very similarly graded after a handful of guys at pick 41. The way things have gone, a lot of offensive tackles in the first round, two running backs, two quarterbacks, helping to push some defensive players into the second round that you might have thought would be picked in the first round. We'll finish the show by talking about, of course, what happened at pick number 10 and the reactions after we saw how things played out in the early part of the draft. But we start by looking ahead to what the Bengals will be picking from at pick 41. And it looks like it's fallen reasonably well for them to have their choice of a starting level defensive player with that pick.

Speaker 5:
[02:26] Yeah, they, I think the board fell really well, you know, about as well as you could hope for. If you're the Cincinnati Bengals, I look at this and I kind of put it into different groupings and corner linebacker, obviously two positions we really focused on who could be there in our final mock. And in an ideal world, I think you would have said, well, it'd be great if going into day two, Jermod McCoy, Colton Hood, Emmanuel McNeil-Warren, Avian Terrell, D'Angelo Pons, Brandon Cissé were all available, right? And they are, and I know McNeil-Warren is a safety, I get it. I understand D'Angelo Pons is undersized, get it. Terrell, to a lesser extent, I understand there's medical concern with McCoy, but there are some corners there. And for me, if the Bengals are hell-bent on getting a corner or want to address their secondary or really, really like McNeil-Warren, maybe they had McNeil-Warren high and that was part of why they were like, do we need to keep 10? Do we need to stick there and see if Caleb Downs is going to make it there? Which obviously we'll talk about him making it to that pick later in the show. Like, there's a chance that McNeil-Warren is there at 41 and gives you that good value. And that's it is there's just a lot of the guys that we thought could be there are still there now. And there's eight picks between now and when the Bengals are on the clock. They have the ninth overall pick in the second round. So they're going to get it like if they just stick and pick, if they don't move up, they don't move down. Even if they're not in on some of the guys that I have listed here, we can go over. I just wanted to start with the corners. I think they're going to get a heck of a player. And that's a good position to be in. And it's how we projected it, but now we have a pretty decent idea of who they could be targeting at 41 with who's left.

Speaker 3:
[04:19] Yeah, the only players that I think we were really fantasizing for a lack of a better word about making it to 41, that got picked in the first round was Chris Johnson. Chris Johnson goes 27 to the Dolphins, the second corner picked in the first round, but only one linebacker picked in the first round. So maybe Jacob Rodriguez goes in the first three picks of the second round. And maybe they're then looking at some of the other linebacker options if they're interested in a linebacker with that second round pick. But out of all the guys we talked about as potential targets, Chris Johnson is really only one that went. Sonny Styles goes seven, of course, to Washington. He was always destined to go in the top ten, but that's the only linebacker picked on day one. So this group of linebackers for day two to go along with the corners. And I'll shout out TJ Parker here, because to me, the group of players, before you even get to Jacob Rodriguez, maybe Jermaw McCoy pending what the Bengals think about his knee. But TJ Parker and Colton Hood will be the two guys that I wouldn't be surprised if those are in the back end of the first round group for the Bengals. And then you get to maybe the top of the second round, Jacob Rodriguez, Emmanuel McNeil, Warren, or maybe those guys are even in that one C back of the first round group. But that TJ Parker name, just want to put that out there. I think he'll probably be picked before 41. But if he does make it to 41, I think the Bengals would strongly consider that one. But the group of linebackers, Rodriguez, Golda, Allen, even Hill, none of those guys go earlier than expected to maybe trigger a run on the position earlier. And maybe that happens at the top of the second round. We'll see. But a lot of offensive tackles getting picked early, as some analysts were talking about. And the extra quarterback and running back, I think helping the Bengals here to push some defensive players down the board.

Speaker 5:
[06:05] Yeah. Yeah. It helped a lot in shocker. Offense, offense, offense, offense matters a ton. It's a reminder, I think, to some, I mean, you see what the Titans did with Carnell Tate at four overall, obviously love went third overall, which stinks that landing spot. Not necessarily ideal, but it matters, right? Adding weapons matters. The Jets, they go get two weapons to help in their hopes of being better at football than they were last year. So look, it's, I never really bought the, the no offense narrative in the top 10 and it wasn't just no offense in the top 10. There's plenty of offense in the top 10, plenty of offense in the first round and that bodes well for the Bengals because even more so today, Jake, we've said this a few times the past couple of weeks. I don't really see a path where 41 is an offensive player, like especially now, like it, it is, it's one of those where like you saw the offensive line run and that went in and you just look, there's just a lot of guys like you mentioned TJ Parker. Absolutely. But the other guy that stands out and there's more here, but like Cade McDonald is still there. Like they say, hey, we would just want this big physical front and we are just going to bully you. Like when's the last time that the Bengals could even say that from a defensive front standpoint, like it feels like it's been a while. Is there reason to believe they want to move on from TJ Slayton? Because if so, for whatever reason, like then take Cade McDonald because he could help you right away. And so him falling out of the first round, I think Cassius Howe is someone that's interesting. He's not complete like TJ Parker. I agree with you. I think TJ Parker would be ahead on their board because they probably project him to be a three down player versus more of a pass rush specialist like Howe. Gabe Ackes, someone that made it out of the first round. That I think we expected to, but maybe he's next at 41 as well. Like there are guys, and if you just play the counting game, someone's going to be there at 41, probably multiple at 41 because there's going to be offensive players. I've counted 13 defensive players that could theoretically be in the mix at 41. Now, those won't be just in general. We know that. And offensive players are going to go off the board as well. And there's only eight picks that need to go. So could there be a scenario where the Bengals are attempted by a trade down? I think so. I think as of now, there's enough defensive talent on the board where that could be the case. I also wouldn't be shocked. You mentioned the McNeil Warren. I think he could certainly be in that one C group. I wonder if Hood is even higher than that.

Speaker 3:
[08:48] I think he is. I think what is a clear first round corner to them.

Speaker 5:
[08:52] Yeah, I think so too. That's what I mean. Like, I wonder if Hood is the top player on their board right now.

Speaker 3:
[08:58] I think it's between like Hood, McCoy, Pending, the Knee and TJ Parker.

Speaker 5:
[09:03] And yeah, and that's what I was going to say is like the McCoy stuff is so interesting because if they're comfortable with him medically, like comfortable enough. I'm not sure there's a scenario where he's not the top player on their board at 41. If they're comfortable, I don't know if they are. But like, I don't think we were off base thinking he was in play at 10. I don't. And so whatever new news they have knee-wise across the league, fine. That's impacting some teams. How much has it impacted the Bengals? It impacted them enough to where they traded the 10th pick, right? They felt like that they should do that. But the Jermod McCoy, Colton Hood, like let's just say both of those guys go. Or they're comfortable with McCoy, where that's two of the eight, two of the nine, I guess, if you include their pick, players that are going to be picked between now and 41, if you include the Bengals pick. So it's really easy to get to that 41st spot with a good player on the board.

Speaker 3:
[10:03] Yeah, I think the trade back is quite loud. I think we should talk a little bit more about the Dermot McCoy stuff as well because that he has fallen into the second round, I think is very scary and we don't know. It could be Will Johnson last year fell out of the first round altogether because of injury concerns. But the reports are not great for McCoy. There's some suggestion that he might need a surgery. So let's unpack that one a little bit more. I want to talk about who the top players available by consensus are. And we'll continue to talk about who we think the favorites for Pick 41 are later in the show. We'll circle back to what happened around Pick 10 for the Bengals, but we'll continue the conversation with the second round targets coming up next. This episode of Locked On Bengals is sponsored by Rugiet and the NFL draft were in the middle of it. And this is where preparation meets opportunity, where every decision matters. It's about being ready when your moment comes. When the Bengals are on the clock at 41, they better be ready. And that same mindset applies off the field. And that's where Rugiet comes in. Rugiet offers treatments designed to help you feel ready and confident when it matters most. Rugiet Ready is a mint, their top option that dissolves under your tongue and has clinically proven ingredients that will work quickly. Often in about 15 minutes can last up to 36 hours. They've also got Go Long designed to help you with performance and control. Head to rugiet.com/locked On NFL and get 15% off your ED treatment. That's rugiet, rugiet.com/locked On NFL for 15% off. Rugiet Performance Medicine for men.

Speaker 5:
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Speaker 3:
[12:33] So Jermod McCoy making it to the second round. I talked about this right as we were ending the segment. The fact that every team passed on him, nobody's willing to take that risk. That's just really scary to talk about, even if he makes it to 41. And this could be a player that maybe there's a team that feels like they have time to give him a chance to develop if he needs time to get through that knee injury or whatever it is. But if he needs a surgery, for all of the talent that he put on tape, you're then talking about a guy who potentially could miss the entire year. And this is like probably worst case scenario, but is then missing two straight years of development at age 20, age 21, some very important developmental years. So where he goes will be fascinating. What the story turns out to be for him will be fascinating. If it's a Will Johnson kind of situation where there's just concern about the long-term viability of the knee, that's one thing, and then maybe we'll see him go in the first couple of picks of day two. But if it's more of a man, he's going to need surgery, he might not play this year. I really wonder where that lands for him and where the Bengals come down on that discussion as well. Right. Because that certainly affects whether or not the Bengals can even consider picking him this year.

Speaker 5:
[13:51] For sure. That's a huge factor. I do think there are going to be teams that feel one way and teams that feel another. Then you're right, teams that say, hey, it's worth the risk, let's take him and redshirt him if we need to. The Bengals aren't one of those teams. I don't think they would view it that way. Just looking at this board, there should be a guy that they feel like can help them now. Maybe he is that. I think a lot of fans have seen the reports and just assume that he doesn't need that second surgery. We don't know. We don't know and the unknown is scary, but the Bengals should know. As long as the Bengals know and they're comfortable with his medicals one way or another, they may be comfortable saying, we're going to pass on him because of the medicals, by the way. Being comfortable doesn't mean, well, we're comfortable taking him. It could be the other way. As long as they're comfortable with whatever decision they make, I get it. But from a talent standpoint, without a doubt, the top player left and certainly someone that you have to have a conversation about assuming, and maybe not even assuming, but if the medical staff gives you the thumbs up. Even if the thumbs up is a sideways thumb or closer to up than down, well, you have that conversation because he's certainly a first-round talent and someone that would have went early on Thursday night had health been thrown out. But the fact that there are so many teams concerned, it matters. There's no doubt about it.

Speaker 3:
[15:26] Yeah, it adds fuel to the fire at the very least, and so that will be fascinating to watch on day two. When you look at the rest of the consensus top players available, the only offensive player that I even really see in this list is Denzel Boston, who is 29th by consensus, but the next handful of guys by consensus, Emmanuel McNeil-Wern at 22, Denzel Boston at 29, Caden MacDonald, who we talked about at 31, Avion Torell at 32, TJ Parker 33, Colton Hood 33 as well, so 32.8 for Parker, 33.3 for Colton Hood. Next will be D'Angelo Pond, CJ Allen, Cassius Howell, Zion Young. Then we finally get to our next offensive player, Emmanuel Pregnone, Christian Miller, Jacob Rodriguez, Brandon Cisse. That's a lot of names. That's a lot of defensive names. That is, I think, probably the list of players that the Bengals are considering. I think there's probably a chance that they're looking at Jake Golde, who we've talked about, Gabe Ackes, who we've talked about, and Trudan Stukes has a lot of love from the NFL. I know that Trudan Stukes has a lot of love from the NFL. I think the Bengals probably are a fan as well, so I don't want to dismiss that name outright either. I think that will be in play for the Bengals. But the bottom line is that when we're looking at Pick 41, there are a whole lot of defensive players there, and you can go way past 41 with players that are probably going to be in a similar bucket, that second round bucket of grades for the Bengals, which is why I think we're once again thinking hard about a trade back. We saw a lot more trade activity at the back part of the first round, probably for first round option considerations, which obviously won't be in play for the Bengals. But I do wonder if we start to see teams maneuvering a little bit more here to try to get the last guy from a tier of players and how that could play with the Bengals potentially looking to add picks if they feel like they need to do that, which does make a lot of sense, at least on paper.

Speaker 5:
[17:29] Sure. It is interesting. You mentioned Stukes. He's 25. The 24-year-old second-rounder, better player than Demetrius Knight, someone that I think coverage-wise, reading offenses, making right plays, reacting. I get it. I understand. Man, that would be tough, especially with some of these other guys on the board. But you're right. If he's in that bucket of the other guys there, then that's going to count toward the trade-down option potentially, and what can they get to move down? I do wonder though, just looking at it, let's say they're not in on the D'Angelo Ponzes of the world, or they have the medical red flag on McCoy, and you do the math, it could get close to the next tier. I wonder how far that is and who's in the tier where they get to 41, and they don't want to drop down to that next tier, that next rung of player, and it might be there. That fall off might be right around 41. And that's what's interesting here is like, Hood could go 33rd, right? And or 34th. And then that's the end of the one C tier, or the one B tier, or whatever. And then the next couple picks go, and then where are you at? Wouldn't shock me one bit, if they're right at the end of the 2A at 41, and they want to get one of those guys and not move down. Because I know there's been a lot of talk about moving down, and I could certainly see that being the case. But I could also see it, honestly, going pretty well to the extent of, to the point of the Bengals getting a guy. And it's like the last guy in the tier that they would ideally get at 41.

Speaker 3:
[19:20] Yeah, I can see that too. That could definitely be the case. The way that I have it laid out right now, I think there is that like TJ Parker, Colton Hood group. And then I think there's a Jacob Rodriguez, Emmanuel McNeil, Warren group. And then there's a big group. And maybe the Bengals don't see it that way. Maybe Jake Golda is higher for them. Maybe Tridan Stukes is higher for them, despite the age concerns. We know the NFL might see it a little bit differently. Maybe CJ. Allen, Avian Carell is higher for them. And maybe those guys are part of the 2A group.

Speaker 5:
[19:51] No McDonald's for you?

Speaker 3:
[19:53] I have a hard so I get it. I think that given the investment in Dexter Lawrence, it would still be a little bit of a surprise to me, but maybe that's naive on my part. And knowing that they have TJ. Slayton on the roster as well, like maybe the player is just so good that he gets into that conversation anyway. He would be more in the 2B group for me because of the investment the Bengals have at that position and the investment that they made in Dexter Lawrence.

Speaker 5:
[20:22] Yeah, yeah, I get it. And I wonder what it would take for them to do that. And maybe that's it. They're like, man, he's still available. We'll trade down. It's one of the many discussions, talking points. One thing we do know, they plan to address defense. They're in a position to do that. We'll continue the conversation and discuss what happened at Pick 10 coming up next.

Speaker 3:
[20:49] We're in the middle of the NFL draft and we're brought to you today by Cal-She, where every pick is a tradable moment. And right now, I'm looking at the second linebacker drafted this year. Sixty percent of Cal-She users or at least the implied odds suggest that Jacob Rodriguez will be the next linebacker drafted. After that, it's a relative toss-up between CJ Allen and Anthony Hill. And the Bengals are certainly looking at linebacker. And so on Cal-She, where you're trading against your peers in a live market, where there's no house, you can take a look at those linebacker options and go with that kind of trade. And as the probability changes, you can buy in and out of your position. You can trade the draft pick, the game and more on Cal-She. For a limited time, download the Cal-She app and use code Locked On. You'll get $10 when you trade $10, Cal-She, K-A-L-S-H-I. You can trade on anything. Should we go to pick 10, James? Are you ready to talk about what happened at pick 10 and the reactions that you saw? I know you were live streaming during the draft. I was streaming during the draft and there were more than a handful of comments after all of those offensive linemen went and we saw a couple wide receivers go in the top and they were like, oh man, they could have picked Bain or Downs. Both of those guys were options and the caveat, I think I threw out before the draft is that Dallas might have traded up, right, if the Bengals were still picking 10th and they did eventually trade up to make sure they got Caleb Downs. But what were your thoughts as you watched that play out and Sexy Dexy was doing the dance at the draft party down at Paycore with all of the Bengals new additions, making their appearances as the Bengals weren't picking tonight and making sure the fans had a good time. And the scenario or the line of thinking that the Bengals weren't going to have a pick of one of the defensive players they wanted did not exactly play out as the draft played out early on Thursday night.

Speaker 5:
[22:47] Yeah, it's one of those things where we knew there was a chance Rueben Bain would fall. There were reasons why Caleb Downs would make it out of the top 10. I mean, the Giants passed on him twice. The Giants passed on him and they said, hey, think about what Harbaugh was talking about, Hall of Fame safety and all that stuff. And it felt kind of odd during the pre-draft process. And you look up and they take Francis Maunoa at 10 overall. And so, yeah, I think a lot of Bengals fans looked at that and said, Caleb Downs, Rueben Bain, man. But I found myself getting it, understanding it, like what Dexter Lawrence could mean to this defense right now. Compared to what Caleb Downs would mean. Compared to what Rueben Bain could mean. And the other thing that I think was a good development, because if this happened, my oh my, Rueben Bain Jr. would have went to Baltimore. That would have been, people would have lost their mind. And instead they take a guy that they're banking on in Yawani, Veda Yawani, to block Dexter Lawrence now. So that's an interesting subplot to this. But instead of Rueben Bain Jr. going to Baltimore, he ends up in Tampa Bay. So that helps some. But yeah, I mean, the two guys were there. And so now you can have the real conversation. Who's going to have the bigger impact this year? Rueben Bain Jr., Dexter Lawrence. What about next year? What about the year after? And the same thing goes for Caleb Downs versus Dexter Lawrence. I think that's something that we'll continue to look at and monitor over the next few years.

Speaker 3:
[24:23] And we get the fun subplot this year of the Bengals playing the NFC South, which means that the Bengals will be playing against Rueben Bain this year and the Tampa Bay Buccaneers. But I did think it was interesting as well, James, just talking about the first round before I circle back to Dexter Lawrence. All of the AFC North rivals for the Bengals picked offensive linemen. Spencer Fennot to the Cleveland Browns at nine, and then Vega Iwanyi to the Baltimore Ravens at 14, Max Ahenator to the Pittsburgh Steelers at 21. All of those guys now may get to block Dexter Lawrence at some point this year. You can have the fun conversation about whether or not the AFC North started picking guys to deal with the Bengals acquisition of Dexter Lawrence. I also was very tickled when the news came out that Pittsburgh was on the phone with Mackay Lemon when Philadelphia traded up and sniped Pittsburgh.

Speaker 5:
[25:24] Can you imagine?

Speaker 3:
[25:27] Oh, I personally was, I was very hopeful to pick Mackay Lemon for my shadow team at 22. And as soon as I saw Philly trade up, the scenario that popped into my head was Philly's taking Lemon, they're going to trade AJ Brown, and I'm going to be sad. And then I end up picking Casey Concepcion at 22, and he goes two picks later, now he's at Cleveland Brown, and it's just another wide receiver black hole for my little make-believe team. But yeah, I was very amused with that news.

Speaker 5:
[26:01] The Lemon scenario, I didn't see that in real time. And so I saw it like right before we jumped on, and man, Pittsburgh, they were trying to get Aaron, we got you another weapon, Pittman and Metcalfe and Lemon. That's what they were thinking. They were thinking, hey, let's go get dudes, let's go get weapons. And that didn't work out that way. But smart move by the Eagles. I like that. I think that makes a lot of sense. Get another guy, you're trading AJ Brown, all the craziness that comes along with making that move. And now you have Lemon and Smith, and they just invest in weapons and you need to. It's important. So yeah, I like that and you're right. I like that Pittsburgh got burned. But overall, the AFC North, in on the trenches, shocker. AFC North focused on the trenches outside of the KC Concepcion pick. And the Cleveland Brown certainly needed weapons in general and offensive help in general. And they got it to a degree for sure.

Speaker 3:
[27:06] Yeah, the Browns needed, I mean, need just about everything. They still need so many things. And I'm sure they'll still be a thorn in the Bengals side. The Bengals lost to them in week 18 last year. So let us not forget. But the way this first round in general played out, I mean, you can, I would equate it just crying over spilt milk a little bit because this is in the past at this point. But the Bengals, I think, approach to trading for Dexter Lawrence here was a multiple prong reasoning, right? One was, do they think that defensive player will get to them? And look, Joe Goodberry, who we had on this podcast, a bunch leading into the draft has been saying for a while that Caleb Downs and Rueben Bain will be available to the Bengals at pick 10. But the Bengals were still weighing that risk, right? Dallas would jump them and pick Caleb Downs. Like Cleveland couldn't trade back a few more spots and still get an offensive lineman they liked if they wanted to trade back again. And Dallas really felt like they had to get above the Bengals to pick Caleb Downs. That could have happened. And who knows where the Bengals were on Rueben Bain? I think they liked him. I think they would have picked him if they were sticking at 10. But the other big part of the equation was not just who they could draft, but then was this idea of the window that they're in and looking for the maximum impact for their defense that they could find in the next year, next two years. And they decided, and I think very reasonably so and rightly so, that Dexter Lawrence, an established player who's been dominant at the NFL level, would be the better use of their money and of their draft pick. And now we see what they do on day two of the draft where we've talked about a bunch of targets and we'll be very interested to see what direction they go there. Do they find a corner that they can pick that they're comfortable with? Do they feel good about the linebacker depth? Is Jacob Rodriguez going to end up being the guy? Is it a different Jake at linebacker Jake Golda from the University of Cincinnati? There are a ton of defensive players that are still available to the Bengals and they should be able to get a good one at pick 41. And so that is what we'll be watching tomorrow. We'll pick 41 and of course the Bengals are picking in the third round too. So after a day with no picks for the Bengals, we'll get two, maybe more. We'll see if the Bengals are trading around tomorrow or not. So we'll continue to have you covered here on Locked On Bengals throughout this NFL draft. And until next time, we appreciate you listening to this episode of the Locked On Bengals podcast. Huda and have a good one.