transcript

Speaker 1:
[00:00] Well, I am really excited for this episode and for some of the crazy topics we're going to get into with my next guest, Jim Vieira. I've been a fan of this guy's research going back to like 2014. He's been on the cutting edge of talking about one of my favorite subjects, and that is ancient giants, ancient hybrids. In this episode, we're gonna talk about his new book, Footprints of the Gods, Extra Digits and the Mark of Giants. Jim, how are you doing? And thank you so much for joining me.

Speaker 2:
[00:34] Doing well. Yeah, thanks a lot, Derek. As we were just talking about, we have investigated a lot of the same bizarre, controversial subjects for a couple of decades now. And I know you're friends with my boy Hugh Newman, and have gone on tour with him as well. And yes, this book for me, it's been 15 years researching and studying and traveling to put together this book. I take a long time to write books. But it's funny because I started off very conservatively, studying Native American stonework. Basically, I'm an economist who turned into a stonemason, who understands the academic world, who understands the scientific method and the importance of following it. But I was drawn into this bizarre subject by a coincidence of investigating old town and county histories, old Smithsonian documents. And I started to stumble up across this phenomena, which most people would consider, you know, it might be good fairy tale, but there's no basis in reality. It is considered a religious idea or a mythological idea, or just a silly idea. And I am thoroughly convinced there's a story here. And I started out on the fence with the orientation of it deserves further investigation. But now I am fully invested, giantologist, so I'm full of guns and I'm ready for any questions. And I think I've stumbled across something very, very interesting, a cold case that's about 15 to 20,000 years old that we could talk about.

Speaker 1:
[02:17] Cannot wait to hear about this. I mean, this must be quite the book if it took you 15 years to write it. I mean, what an accomplishment. That's got to be like the weight of the world lifted off of you to have this book ready to go.

Speaker 2:
[02:32] When I met Hugh Newman around 2011 in Glastonbury, Connecticut, that's when I started to get rolling with this idea. Because I had whispers of the understanding of the giant of Gath in the Bible and Samuel 2120, had six fingers and six toes, 24 digits and all. But I read an obscure paper by Dr. Richard Barnett in the Anglo-Israeli Bulletin in 2007, where he talks about the occurrence, he was a Middle Eastern expert, and he talked about the occurrence of six fingers or polydactylism in art and artifacts all around the Middle East. His quote, which I have in my book, is, the academic world has given this subject zero attention. And he was a code breaker who worked at Bletchley Park and helped break the access codes in Turkey and Istanbul in the early 40s. And so he had the mind of a code breaker. And he was successful at it. And he is the first one who looked at the code of polydactylism. And that's the way I operate. I'm kind of, I must be on the spectrum or something like that, because I see patterns everywhere and I'm the freaking rain man. And, but I can't take care of my own basic needs. So I fit well as a researcher in this world. But he brought up a really interesting point that there are academic sources all around the world that talk about this phenomena in isolated situations, but they haven't pieced it together cohesively because it is considered so bizarre or so controversial. And that's why it's taken me so many years of travel and investigation to do this. And I just think it's, you know, it's a ancient cold cold case that's been waiting to be pieced together. Let me, let me make one point first. Because some people might say, I actually did it. So what? I know, knew this dude. My uncle had six toes or something like that. It's a rare genetic condition in humans called polydactylism. But there is no association, there is no genetic condition that explains gigantism and polydactylism. So it's a complete mystery. And that's where we take off on this journey of understanding this bizarre mystery, this specific anatomic trait associated not just with giants, but the divine, the supernatural and the malevolent as well.

Speaker 1:
[05:02] So before this book, and again, Jim's new book, which just is releasing now, you got to get it, Footprints of the Gods, Extra Digits and the Mark of Giants. He's got it right there. You can get this, I'm sure, on Amazon and everywhere books are sold. But before this book, you co-authored with Hugh Newman, Giants on Record, America's Hidden History, Secrets in the Mounds and the Smithsonian Files, and then you also co-authored the Giants of Stonehenge and Ancient Britain. I've got both of these books in valuable resources on the subject. But I want to go back even further to, again, 2014, I think it was when you had this TV show documentary that featured you and your brother called Search for the Lost Giants. I want to go back here because today, more and more people are talking about Giants, it seems like. It's become kind of like UFOs and aliens. It's not too insane to talk about. Even Tucker Carlson, a couple of months ago, had a show about Giants and Nephilim. But back in 2014, when your show came out, it was a very, very fringe topic. So give me a little bit about what did people think you were nuts with this show? What kind of reactions were you getting back then?

Speaker 2:
[06:23] Yeah, that's funny you should say that. What we did was, I had a friend of a friend who was a producer in Northampton, John Marks, that left right. Him and Ted Bourne were my EPs, my executive producers. Ted did the first 48. John did a bunch of mob specials. They did stuff for Frontline and Nat Geo. Very accomplished production team. And his buddy said, oh, you're going to check this dude out up in Ashfield, which is like half an hour north. And I was giving these talks on these stone mysteries and the mysteries of giants. And what we did is we cooked up a five minute sizzle rail to show at the network conference. And a bunch of networks wanted it. In history, after they saw it, they said, we'll give you a season without a pilot. So they gave us that season, which was interesting. And the execs, who were friends of ours, said, I've never seen two regular guys talk about such an outrageous subject. And in my life, my brother and I, we've been coaches for like 20 years, former decathletes, we run a successful business. People know that we're not full of shit, that we're not self-promoting. I'm in the witness protection program of Ancient Mystery of Research, I'll post some cat videos, but I don't put out a lot of content on the web. But I feel like there is a mystery here, and it is rooted in creating data sets. Data sets that clearly show that the Smithsonian received or their scientists unearthed an enormous amount of giant skeletons. Even in the show, in episode 2, we found in Staleville, Missouri, a photograph in the front page of the Staleville Ledger, and the St. Louis Dispatch of an eight and a half foot skeleton laying in the office next to six and a half foot Les Eaton. We found that. We found the notation with the Smithsonian Asteroid in 1933, found at the Staleville Cave. We found the cave. We found the relatives. We found the doctor's office. We found that it was wired together by Missouri archaeologists and sent to the Smithsonian. But the Smithsonian claims that the largest skeleton they have in their possession is a six foot three Sioux Native American with acromegaly, which is a disease condition. So how do you get this eight and a half foot skeleton shipped to you? And it doesn't end up in your records. And that was the same year the Nazi eugenist weirdo, Dr. Herlitschke, who ran the Smithsonian with an iron fist, said, Giants know more. This is all fantasy and wishful thinking. He actually said that, and his own scientists uncovered a mass of enormous skeletons. So I say that to make the point that during our show, it's just like, here you go. What is the story? I took it to evolutionary anthropologist, Todd DeCetel, a friend of mine at NYU, who was in the show. I'm like, I'm not a lunatic. This is a data set. I'm just pointing to it. I in fact had a TEDx talk that was the number one, watched TEDx talk in the world that got taken down because it was considered unscientific. I was just like, I'm just like reading reports from like the Smithsonian or Town and County Histories, page 463. I'm not even theorizing here. You can imagine how much shit you take when you do a show in the History Channel about giants. But I really feel like a lot of people, a lot of celebrities, I get bank presidents, and cops, and TSA agents, like I love your show. It's really interesting. And people ask why we didn't get more seasons. The numbers were great. People loved it. They showed it around the world. They keep showing it like during the holidays, up until this day. And the liaison between the Smithsonian and the History Channel voted down a second season for us. And so it wasn't based on the merits of a show, it was based on internal politics. So to encapsulate that whole episode, it really ended up putting me on the track where I investigated further. In fact, they gave us two Lost Colony Roanoke shows, the History Channel did, because the execs really liked us. And if you've watched them, they came out really successful. We found a massive Native American settlement. And I've been on about 12 other shows. I've been on Megan Fox, Josh Gates, William Shatner, Danny Trejo on and on, Ancient Aliens for 7 seasons. So I feel like people are interested in these subjects.

Speaker 1:
[11:01] Yeah, big time. That had to be wild. So it sounds like you're saying the reason you didn't get a second season of the Search for Giants show was because the Smithsonian was literally squelching that.

Speaker 2:
[11:15] Yeah, we talked about the finding the skeleton. We made this case like, what happened to all these skeletons that were shipped to the Smithsonian? That long case I just described, there were dozens of them. There are Donald Cazow driving to 7.5 with skeleton, Harrisburg, Pennsylvania also in 1933. He's writing about it and then six months later, he talks about getting it shipped to the Smithsonian. That's 7.5. I know it's not a giant, but it's certainly not 6.3. It's like, what is the story? Because the Smithsonian scientists, early on, they had this belief that there was a reality to giants. They studied a lot of the Native American legends, the unearthed enormous bones, like specific measurements, 29-inch femur, Catalina Island. That's like a nine-foot skeleton. You have specific anatomical measurements. And if you are a pseudo-skeptic or a debunker, the way you take on this to try to make it seem foolish or sensationalized, is to take some facts like, yes, of course, there were hoaxes. There was disarticulation, faulty regression formulas, incompetence. But at the same time, these are not animal bones. These are not mastodon bones. Maybe a couple were. They're found in Native American graves. They're found in mounds. They're specifically noted to have these burial techniques that were known about, excuse me, and artifacts in context. So the idea that this is silly and you're out of your mind, it has no basis in reality because I deal with a lot of shitheads and pseudo skeptics and a lot of miserable cult-like people in the debunking community. And they basically are not objective. They violate the first law of science is follow the scientific method and be objective and be unemotional, not get all whipped up and shit on somebody because they talk about Atlantis or Giants or whatever. Like who the hell cares, by the way? It's like, oh, I'm following Native American legends. There's a lot of lore about Giants. I think it's cool. Who gives a shit if you're studying this? Like it's some terrible blight on society. It is so lame. I've had my fill of skepticism, I'll tell you that.

Speaker 1:
[13:34] Well, I definitely want to ask you near the end of this, you know, especially with the Smithsonian, why the cover-up? So we'll get there, but let's dive into this new book, your latest findings, the most exciting research. I can't wait, Footprints of the Gods, Extra Digits and the Mark of Giants. Let's go down this rabbit trail.

Speaker 2:
[13:52] Absolutely. The interesting thing is the entire globe is littered with not just giant hands and feet on statues, with extra digits and rock art. It's littered with Aboriginal traditions that name the giant, name the exploits, show the enormous artifacts with extra digits. I'll just start North Carolina, Judah Culler, right? The Cherokee, they tell James Mooney, the Smithsonian ethnologist, that the giant Judah Culler had seven fingers and seven toes on each appendage. He was this giant that was thousands and thousands of years ago. Then there's Judah Culler Rock that has the seven-fingered handprints of Judah Culler. Then there was a giant seven-toed footprint of Judah Culler that was destroyed when they were making a railroad a little north of that site. Then you go to the giant of the Bible once again, Extra Digits, the giant of Gath. Then you go to Australia. We have Baimei, the giant, 11-foot tall, two wives, six fingers and six toes, etched in rock art. Also in Australia, in the Arnhem region, last year, there were a group of indigenous Australians, ancestral owners of the property, that redid a 30-foot-long panel. It's in Cosmos Magazine, it's in my book, of the giant Noworo. He came from the north, he had two wives, he had six fingers and six toes, I have the pictures in my book, and they're repainting this enormous giant mural. Then you go to Motsang, the giant, in Kediyah, which is in Botswana. Two giants there had six toes, they emerged from the underworld, and they brought the animals and the first humans with them, and they have that specific marker as well. The giant Cormoran and the giants of Tren in England, same thing. All the tradition states, six fingers, six toes, and on and on and on. Isolated Pacific Islands, you have Tubariki in Kiribati. Eric Von Daniken visited the island, wrote about it, and these giant footprints, car footprints, with six toes, 12 toes, absolutely enormous. Give me one second, I'll read Professor Paul Tasson. I will say, my book, 80% of it is gleaned from academic journals and sources. And it is not wishful thinking or cooking up a theory in my mother's basement. So we have this, there's the sixth toad, that's Mara Wanga in 2022. As I wrote this book, more and more findings came out. So I want to read a quote. Professor Paul Tasson, who studied Mara Wanga, it's the Seven Sisters' ancestral narrative, which is like tens of thousands of years old. So what do you have there? Enormous six-toed footprints. And Tasson, I spoke with him, I spoke with all the academics that I interact with when I write books, and visit, and interview. And he wrote a paper about, about polydactylism. And he says this, Footprint petroglyphs with six toes are often larger than the average human size. And the two largest at Mara Wanga have six toes. Professor Paul Tasson, 2022. And the size of them, four foot tall, four foot wide. You know, not just like, you know, I'm wearing a size 13, like you have these super ancient rock art traditions, carvings, and they have extra digits over and over again, in every corner of the globe. Now you're out of your freaking mind, if you don't think there's a story there. You go to Texas, you go to the Big Foot Man Petroglyph in Vernal, Utah, you go to Illinois, you can't believe every corner of the globe has like, the five-toed small footprint and the giant six-toed one. And I highlight that over and over again. And I'll lastly say on this long rant, in Kara-Hantepe, as you know, they unearth the 16-fingered statue, Otishe Pillar. And we did a, me, Andrew Collins, and Hugh did a ancient epings, ancient aliens episode about it, called The Lost City. And also at Saberge, you have that the figure holding his hand up, and he has six fingers. And Hancock thinks that might be an earlier iteration of the Epic of Gilgamesh. And if that figure is Gilgamesh, he is listed in the Enochian Book of Giants, the apocryphal work that he was a pre-flood giant in the Book of Giants, in the Book of Enoch. So, I take that all together and say, I've never seen this level of coincidence. And a lot of these sources are between 10,000 and 20,000 years old, mind-bendingly old, not Christian missionaries spinning tales of giants. So, one of the reasons I put this book together was to encourage people to be open-minded about alternative ideas, to blend the scientific method with the mythological and oral traditions, and improve to the pseudo-skeptics, which who won't listen, but the masses will, that like, holy shit, there are subjects worthy of a further investigation.

Speaker 1:
[19:36] Yeah, we've got all these ancient texts, the Bible, the Book of Enoch, and many others talking about ancient giants, hybrids with all these extra digits. We've got historians even, I think Homer mentions giants, Josephus mentions giants. We've got all these depictions like you're saying of petroglyphs all over the world depicting these six fingers, toes, the newspaper reports from the late 1800s, early 1900s, from big publications even like the Smithsonian, the New York Times, referencing giants literally everywhere. Yet today, well, and I should say we also have, you know, the mounds and reports of the skeletons being pulled from the mounds. But we also have all kinds of skulls and even I think some skeletons you can see today that are of large stature. So why, let's go back to the Smithsonian. Why do you think they went from the, as late as the early 1900s, saying yes, there's giants, we were getting them shipped here, we were writing about them to today, no, they didn't exist, it's a fairy tale, you're crazy if you talk about it.

Speaker 2:
[20:58] It reminds me of True Detective season one, where McConaughey tells Woody Harrelson, we guard the door from bad men basically. And I say that to highlight the Epstein files and the insidious nature of what is found in there. And if you really exam them, it's so nauseating that most people don't want to. It clearly highlights that a satanic cult has ruled the planet for a long, long time that has demanded child sacrifice. And that sounds like, well, you're out of your mind. And I used to shit on that idea, that like the idea of, oh, the elites, they're just boring bureaucrats, blown off some steam. There's no organized cabal. That's all wrong. And that if you look at the documents themselves, it'll just turn your hair white to way for me. But you start there, and all the apologists and all the mainstream narratives just fall apart when you understand the nature of this, you could call it, it's an iconic control system in a demiurgic simulation, like the Gnostic say. You can make that case. But off-road history, it's been these control mechanisms and conspiracies that are quite insidious. Now, metaphysically, I study a Course in Miracles and a lot of Ramada Maharashi and stuff. I do believe there's a role for us to energetically break this ancient prison that humanity has been trapped in. But to the point of these ancient mysteries, I used to be against that idea of there's a massive conspiracy, because I know a lot of academics, I've organized archaeological digs and things of that nature. But I don't know of all the answers. I could tell you it's very easy with groupthink to get people to believe ideas that just aren't true. Even Darwinian evolution as it pertains to Homo sapiens. Emanuel Velikovsky said, who wrote Rolls and Collision, I've read all Darwin's theories and he goes out of his way to try to make humans fit in the proven progression of natural evolution and it just doesn't. And there's a lot of scholars who think the same thing. So you have these ideas, but you see you deal with pseudo skeptics and debunkers all day. There's no objectivity. It's just like I have this laundry list of cult like ideas, just like in politics, left and right. And I'm going to stick to them. And I'm not just going to ignore or marginalize my perceived ideological enemy on the other side, the alternative realm. I'm going to denigrate them. I'm going to mock them. I'm going to make a sport of shitting on them. And that is what has happened. So you have the ego possessed by the ego, running the show in the scientific world. No question about it. And the algorithms weaponize people's preferences. So Professor Skeptic, his entire threat is filled with cult-like mind rot and getting all his pronouns right or whatever. And I'm moderate. I'm not taking any side here. I'm just saying that the academic world should be objective and they are not. Not at all. And these ideas are just driven into your head when you're in college, which I went to UMass. These are all ridiculous ideas. There is no basis in reality. And giants is a religious idea. It's a mythological idea. It's a anti-scientific idea, although it isn't. And that being said, who the hell knows? You have a lot of giants in the Solomon Islands, the giant of Kandahar in Afghanistan. The Special Forces guy captured one. In fact, you have that story. And the dude was like 12 to 15 foot tall and specifically noted by the Special Forces guy to have six fingers and six toes. Now I didn't take part in that recovery, so I can't see it's totally true, but that's an interesting idea right there.

Speaker 1:
[25:06] I've listened and heard people break that down. And I mean, if true, that would be the most incredible recovery mission to be a part of. So with this new book, Footprints of the Gods, I know you've been studying this giant phenomenon again for decades. What's one of the more recent accounts of giants you come across that really got you excited? Maybe it was a depiction, a petroglyph, maybe it was just a newspaper report you found. Is there one that jumps out to you as, wow, this is cool?

Speaker 2:
[25:46] Yes, I found, I was shown a cave in Baja, California, an isolated cave, the El Carmen Cave, you can Google it. The story is really fascinating. I usually research and find, and I give very little tips that I don't know already, because I really have a mind that scans massive amounts of data. But I was shown this isolated cave in the Baja Peninsula. That's in Baja, Mexico. So, in the cave, there are paintings of male and female giants with six fingers. They are enormous, like 15 to 18 foot tall. When the Jesuit priest showed up in the region, the Kichimi, the Native Americans who lived there, told them that we did not make these drawings. In fact, it was a race of female and male giants who came from the north. And the depictions are women with breasts on the side, these giant men with the Extra Digits. So the Jesuits wrote it all down. I have all the correspondence in my book. But it is utterly fascinating because you go to Australia and it's the same thing. You have these giant beings with the Extra Digits and the same stories. And the Aboriginal storyteller is saying, this is the name of this giant. Here are their exploits and they have Extra Digits. That to me was just like one of those moments like, wow. And a new rock art study just came out that identified that the rock art found there and up and down the Baja Peninsula pushes back against the Ice Age, 11,000 years old. So the Jesuit priests are coming in. The Kachimi people are there. They're saying, our ancestors didn't make these. This was a race of giants, a very important message to these people. And if you will indulge me for a second, I wanted to read a quote or two about, I know you're well versed in Native American oral traditions. Vine Deloria was Lakota Sioux elder. He organized a conference in the late 1990s. His vine passed away now. He was a very well respected scholar who organized Native elders in Washington state to share the wisdom and the traditions of giants amongst their tribes. You can't name a tribe in the US without legends of giants, which is astounding. So here are a couple of quotes from him. The Indian explanation is always cast aside as a superstition, precluding Indians from having acceptable status as human beings and reducing them in the eyes of educated people to a pre-human level of existence in ignorance. The stereotypical image of American Indians as childlike superstitious creatures permeates American society because Americans have been taught that scientists are always right, they have no personal biases, and that they do not lie. And that encapsulates it right there. You have thousands and thousands of years of all these tribes with traditions of floods and giants and gods, and they're all cast aside, and we are made, even though we respect Native legends ourselves, we have been coerced into thinking like, they're silly, they're superstitious, they're childlike. The same way, modern day scientists, modern guys like us, that even though if you have an advanced degree in something else or you're studying academic sources, you are still a fruit loop or should be mocked for your beliefs. So you have these traditions that go back much closer to the time that is being discussed and analyzed. So it's throwing out thousands of years of good science by ignoring oral traditions. And that's one of my beefs once again, because we get the racist cod thrown at us a lot. Because you go to Peru, who built Soxiwaman? Who did the Inca tell the Spanish Conquistadors? They said it was the Huarís, the Giants, the ancient ones. You go down to Tiwanaku, what did the Aemira tell the Spanish? They said the Veracoches, the Shining ones, the Giants built it. People didn't build it. So I'm racist for listening to the oral traditions of these people. And then like you go to traditions everywhere, Malta, Giants, Gigantia, you go to Ireland and you go to Newgrange, right? I'm half Irish. So I'm not getting in a fistfight with Sully at a bar in Southie because I said your ancestors didn't build Newgrange. The traditions are the 12th of Day Danine in 3200 BC built Newgrange. These magnificent high tech shining beings who came from four islands in the North Atlantic and taught the arts and civilization. So it's nothing about race. The gods visit everyone all around the planet and teach them the arts, science, arts and sciences and megalithic building or they build it themselves. So anyways, it's a long-winded way of saying, I'm pretty sick of the fake racist card getting thrown at us for respecting oral traditions.

Speaker 1:
[31:17] Yeah, I just was watching a clip of Graham Hancock talking with Randall Carlson in a discussion they did a couple of months ago. Graham made the great point. He was talking about all the debunkers that come against him. And he was calling them the quacka quackademics. And but he was saying how it's so hypocritical basically, because they they basically act like they are the defenders of the indigenous populations and that Graham's a racist. And if you know, Graham, that's anything but the truth. He's all about honoring the indigenous cultures. But he's saying these quackademics are these eyebrowed academics who don't want people like us to have a voice in this discussion. They act like they're the champions of the indigenous cultures until you ask them about the indigenous cultures legends. And then they say it's all hogwash. It's all fantasy proving that they don't believe or care about what the indigenous actually say they saw or believe. And so such a great point you make up. Man, I have so many questions for you. You sent me several pictures that are featured in your book. And one is of this. It's like it looks like a early 1900s photo of this eight foot tall statue in Tahiti, I believe with six fingers. Incredible. Is this statue still around? And tell me about it.

Speaker 2:
[32:54] Interesting. You should say that because it's a story behind it. First of all, Terry Dahl was in our first show, Search for the Lost Giants. He's like the modern-day Thor Haia doll, Norwegian sailor who took his boat to the Pacific Islands and traveled around. And he said he had no idea, he thought giants were like a silly fantasy when he went there. And he said he would spend all this time with elders all around the South Pacific and they'd item in it and they all want to talk about giants. And they talked about extra digits as well. And Terry figured out that a lot of the Tiki statues have six fingers and six toes. And the Tiki are, they're not human, they're like godlike or semi-divine giants. So the largest statue on Rava Vey is this enormous eight and a half foot tall Tiki that has six fingers and it was moved to the Paul Gagin Museum in Tahiti, probably like a hundred years ago now. But the natives literally would not touch the statue and they had to hire independent contractors to move it because it possessed mana, it possessed power, spiritual power, and they didn't want to violate it. But the Pacific Islands, we just did an Ancient Aliens episode about the mysteries of the Pacific, where I talk about a lot of these accounts. There are giant footprints, there are statues with extra digits. It's in legends everywhere. Fiji, Easter Island, I showed you. When I posted a bunch of extra-digit stuff, Giorgio from Ancient Aliens, my friend, he kept chiming in and reposting it and getting off light up because he loves that subject. Because him and David Hatcher Childress went to the South Pacific a couple of years back for an episode and saw the same statue you're talking about in Tahiti. So there's all this lore behind it. The levels of specificity are multiple. It's not just like, oh, there was this myth about this hungry giant and he ate a bunch of shit. It's like, here's his name, here are the extra digits, here are his exploits, here is where he marauded, things like that. It's not all unicorns and rainbows because there's a lot of malevolence in the story as well.

Speaker 1:
[35:22] Yeah, there's so many legends like this. I did a blog a couple of years back on, I don't know if you've heard of the Legend of Taga, but it's this little island in the middle of nowhere. And there's these Megaliths made of, you know, kind of the coral limestone, massive Megaliths on this tiny island. It's called Rota. And it's like, what are Megaliths doing? A lot of them unfinished in this quarry, huge. Well sure enough, you get into the local legend and it's the legend of Taga. It's all related to this giant who was about 10 feet tall, who they say literally carved these himself, built a village for the, built a village there. And the main archaeological site is known as the Taga House. I mean, to this day. So it's just so fascinating to me how the local legends seem to sync up with the Megaliths.

Speaker 2:
[36:30] Absolutely. That's a great point. Why are the Pacific Islands lidded with Megalithic ruins? You go to Nand Madal, which we're familiar with. They moved 250 million tons of basalt across the island. It is thought to be built by the Sauralaya dynasty in 12th century AD. And just like Angkor Wat, the same dating of 1200 AD, that they found ruins that were there, I am thoroughly convinced, from an earlier age. And what do the traditions specifically say on Nand Madal? You can read it in Smithsonian Magazine. They say that Olapisha and Olapisho, giant divine twins, traveled from a lost continent in the Pacific and showed up there. And they levitated the stones to build that. That's what Edgar Cayce says about the Great Pyramid and other sites. He said, there are survivors from a lost world that used advanced technology and levitation to build these things. The mystics, Steiner, Blavatsky, Cayce, the Rosicrucians, the Freemasons, on and on. They say Atlantis was a historical reality. They say that giants were a historical reality as well. All these sources around the world, virtually every source, except the tiny slice of modern academic ignorance, is saying that giants exist. In our Non-Midal, my buddy Al Parapan, he was in our show. He used to teach English there. He lived there in the 50s. And Al, I used to rent his house when I was filming Search for the Lost Giants. Al went to the place of ghosts to where the Non-Midal ruins were found, or are, where the tombs were. He got a coconut. He brought it back to his buddies in town. They said, don't eat that. That place is cursed. Don't even eat the fruit that you pick there. And in 1564, I'm sorry, 15, 1864 in the American Geographical Society, Professor, I'm sorry, Captain Charles Coffin is one of the first Westerners who lands in Non-Midal in the American Geographic Society Bulletin. He writes that he took giant bones from the crypts. And there are more stories of giant bones. You have these early explorers. Oftentimes, they find bones, they get lost, they get somewhere to buy them. I don't know, but you have the legends of giants. You have the stonework. You have the idea that these two giant twin brothers with the flying dragon created the walls of Non-Midal. To your point, it's utterly mind bending on its own. And then you add in all the details, extra digits, giant footprints, legends, and the lack of intellectual curiosity stifled by a cult-like academic world that we live in or profession that we are told has all the answers, is very childish and disturbing. I'll just throw one quote. I always say this, Jonas Salk, the intuitive mind shows the thinking mind where to look next. So you have intuition and you have ego. Because a lot of pseudo skeptics are like, oh, you're going with your feelings and ha ha ha, you're an idiot and you're not basing any of this up with facts or anything like that. The intuitive mind knows the truth. Look at the amount of excitement that the SAR scans create in Egypt. So many people intuitively know that there is something under the Giza Plateau. Now, I'll make no comment on satellite aperture radar. I'm not an expert. I'm just saying all these traditions, including at your KCC, there's a lost Hall of Records there. The archetype of Indiana Jones is to find the lost records of Atlantis. It is not to find a freaking crystal skull or anything else or go to India. That is the archetype everybody understands, the search for the lost Hall of Records and the understanding that there was a lost world with metaphysically high principle people that was destroyed in the cataclysm, and the technology was transferred at places like Obekwi Tepe. So that's a long-winded way of saying that the intuitive mind knows, your viewers know, your viewers follow you because they know you're on to something. Not like you're a bullshit artist making up stories in your mother's basement. It's like you dialed in with the intuitive, Jungian collective unconscious mind. When you piece this together in a cross-cultural analysis, you quickly realize that is just the lack of imagination and immaturity and smallness of the academic world not to recognize this. I'm sorry, I keep shitting on academics and I don't mean to. I'm talking about the cult of gatekeeping because I work with a ton of cool academics. I interview, hang out, we talk sharp, like I said, organize archaeological digs. But you don't hear about them because they're not like hurt little weasels who spend all day on Twitter like a high school girl. They are open to new ideas. So, my book, I believe, is the synthesis of the two, of the alternative oral tradition realm, the mythological realm, and the scientific method realm that incorporates both levels of expertise. And I think it's a good blueprint or footprints to use to, you know, just like in Egypt, all these, oh, you know, are there structures under the Great Pyramid, blah, blah, blah? Yes, let's dig there. I got a show into Netflix for the last year about a search for lost hall records with my production team. And that's going after Edgar Cayce's Three Hall of Records in the Yucatan, off the coast of Bimini, in the Sunken Temple, and under the right power of the Sphinx.

Speaker 1:
[42:40] Wow.

Speaker 2:
[42:40] So I think that's the greatest idea ever. And it's just like, yes, let's explore that and verify or not this information.

Speaker 1:
[42:50] Back in 2012 or so, when I was first going down some of these rabbit trails of giants and legends, I came across the Lovelock Cave Giant Legends. And, you know, it's one thing to read about this. It's another thing to like go to the cave. And I'll never forget, this is one of the moments that kind of helped me realize I want to do this full time. It's when I was living in Sacramento at the time, I convinced a friend to go with me to the middle of nowhere, Lovelock Cave, Lovelock, Nevada. And we found the cave and we went inside and it felt so other worldly. You know, it felt like, man, if I can feel anything, this feels like the legends were true. Well, then you go into what the archaeologist uncovered and what the miners said. I believe it was a true legend of this city car giant red haired cannibalistic race. Is there anything like that? Location wise that you've been to? Maybe it's in the northeast somewhere, caves. Tell us about a couple of places you've been where there was giant legends that you were like, this has to be true.

Speaker 2:
[44:07] Well, you're reading my mind because I was just going to say a buddy of mine, Clifford Mahouty was a Zuni elder and he's passed away. But I got to spend a lot of time with Clifford. And one of the interesting things that he told me was that the Zuni and the people out west have legends of giants warring with their ancestors. And that sounds kind of like science fiction. But when you go up and down Baja at all the sites like I've been talking about, what you have are figures littered with arrows with six fingers. And these are all super ancient sites. This dude right here, he's got to put some pants on, but like six fingered hand, littered with arrows. And then I think most potently is Douglas Whitley. Check this one out. Let me see here. Do do do do do. See that right there?

Speaker 1:
[45:08] Yeah.

Speaker 2:
[45:09] You have the enormous being shooting arrows at a normal size person. And Whitley is a rock art expert, and he writes about this. They call the panel six, six toes. So the being has a feathered headdress already showing signs of supernatural potency. And he is casting a spell and attacking the humans. And he has six massive toes that are highlighted to really drive home that point. And this is academic expertise, legends, rock art. So you have Clifford Mahoudy's Zuni traditions showing up at all these sites. And yes, there is like the cave in El Carmen Cave in Baja. There was a presence at these places. That's my entire book right there. Like you descend into the Hypogeum of Malta. This ancient underground temple complex, which in its own right had elongated skulls and thousands of bones and animal bones. When they broke through construction workers in like the early 1900s, you go to room 20 and what do you find? An oversized handprint with six fingers. And this is everywhere I tour, everywhere I go around the planet, the same story keeps showing up. Palenque, you travel all around the temple of inscriptions everywhere there. Six fingers, six toes everywhere. And the beings who possessed them were considered living divinities. And the academics write about it, I write about it. These beings were considered divine and supernatural. Not just keenly, supernatural. So what is that? How can this be a marker of the malevolent of divinity of giants if there's no story? And I'll quickly say, the Sumer Ibsu is a compendium of 2,800 tetralogical omens found at the library of Ashurpanabel in 1700 BC or 700 BC. But it's actually much older back in the Sumerian times. And the temple priests and the exorcists and the sorcerers of Sumeria were obsessed with polydactylism. And they instruct people on what you do if your kid's born with six fingers on one hand. It's utterly wild. And I unearth a six, I wish I unearthed it. I unearthed a picture of a six finger diorite hand found at Tel Farah, Iraq in 1931. So the University of Pennsylvania is in Iraq at Tel Farah. It is Shuparak, the biblical, I'm sorry, the historical home of Utnapishtim, the Sumerian Noah. So at this place, they find this artifact in 1931, which is astounding because it is a six finger diorite hand right there.

Speaker 1:
[48:10] Wow.

Speaker 2:
[48:11] It comes from Tel-Furar. It's at least dated at 3100 BC, super ancient from the flood heroes hometown, who may have been one of these hybrid beings, Noah, Hercules, Gilgamesh. They're all listed as semi-divine giants, sometimes with extra rows of teeth that Robert Temple wrote about. So the University of Pennsylvania, they find this artifact under a pre-flood level of sediment in Tel Farah. They photograph it, write about it. I contact the head of records at Penn University and said, we don't have it. It never made it back from Iraq. We don't know what happened to it. Now, that doesn't mean a conspiracy necessarily, but it's just one of these astonishing artifacts. Thankfully, there's a picture of it and I was able to find it. But you have this story every corner of the globe. The supernatural association with Extra Digits, how the F can that be? I hope you don't have to edit out all my squares, but I'm like Baja California, isolated Pacific Islands, the Middle East, Africa. Every corner of the globe, legends of giants, artifacts with giants with Extra Digits. And there's no story that you should be. It's just like so... And I know you feel this too, with like elongated skulls. Why would you do the most bizarre and insane thing to your kid? And forget about if they're alien or not. They might be emulating alien beings. I don't even know, but there's no global connection. There's no global culture.

Speaker 1:
[49:47] Yeah.

Speaker 2:
[49:49] You kid me. And that's what we're up against. It's like, you take your crazy pills. Like, what point am I living on? The infantile orientation of so many pseudo skeptics is really infuriating because we're cast as lunatics. And I'm sorry, I don't want to talk up my game. You know, I have the mind of an academic, I have to say. And I respect the academic world when it's run right, when the scientific method is respected. And I understand all the jargon. I read scientific papers. I understand that it takes a lot. And there's a lot of amateurs who really don't understand that. So I get that. But this idea that there's like Graham Hancock, he's like vanilla compared to us, you know. The heat that he catches for like perfectly reasonable hypotheses is outrageous.

Speaker 1:
[50:40] Yeah, it's crazy. Even his recent Ancient Apocalypse Season 2, you know, you watch these episodes and he's actually out interviewing the local experts. And it's like, how could you think this guy is, you know, this crazed conspiracy theorist? He's just there trying to get the local legends.

Speaker 2:
[51:00] But I'll just quickly say he's in a biracial marriage. He was a journalist for The Economist, you know, out of the gate, who was taken to task like aid programs and how they screw poor people over and they don't, you know. So he's like a humanist and he's a intellectual and he's an accomplished journalist, who's very intelligent. And that's what he's coming out of. So if he didn't say any of this stuff, nobody would ever like take a run at him. But he's like, he's a Nazi. He's, you know, this is the most dangerous show on Netflix. How could this be allowed? That kind of garbage. So it shows you that that allergic reaction by the academic world or the debunking world shows you he's on to something. No question about it.

Speaker 1:
[51:46] Sure does.

Speaker 2:
[51:47] That's Psychology 101.

Speaker 1:
[51:48] I was going to ask you about Judicola Rock, because I've seen photos of this strange rock. Isn't that North Carolina?

Speaker 2:
[51:55] Yes.

Speaker 1:
[51:55] And so you've got this strange rock with these engravings or these paintings, but you're saying it goes back to an actual supposed giant named Judicola in that region. Tell me a little bit more about it.

Speaker 2:
[52:08] Absolutely. James Mooney was a Smithsonian ethnologist who lived with the Cherokee in the 1800s. And they told them about the legend of Judicola. Like the giants in the Southeast, they live in the mountains, the Thunder beings, the giants. So they're up in the mountains, just like in Wales on Sedonia and Snowdonia. The giants live in high places oftentimes. Sometimes they're malevolent, sometimes they're the teachers of humans. And the Cherokee tell Mooney, and he writes it all down in Smithsonian ethnology literature, that Judicola was a giant. His exploits are known. He had seven fingers on each hand and seven toes on each foot. And here on Judicola Rock is his seven-fingered handprint that he scratched, he etched there. And then, I had told this previously, a little north of there, there was a giant seven-toed footprint associated with Judicola, that the Cherokee told Mooney as well, that was destroyed by railroad construction. So, another example of the levels of specificity. And then, like I said, then you go to Central Africa, and it's the same story. You go to Australia and isolate the Pacific Islands. This book is a litmus test for anybody who's full of shit or isn't. That's what I really feel, that the assemblage of putting together this cold case that's been laying around for 10,000 to 20,000 years, and piecing it together with academic sources, shows you that where you're coming from. You can say, I need more evidence, but if you're saying there's no story here, you get to check yourself, because as we were talking earlier, the oldest sites on Earth have yielded the same evidence in real time. Iain Gazal in Jordan, Jericho in Israel, Kara Han Tepe, Saberch. If you will indulge me, I'll quit till to tell this story. Wherever I go, I am showing this phenomena in my travels around the world. I feel like I'm being led to tell this crazy story for some reason. I don't know what the hell it is, but we'll see. So, me, my brother and Hugh Newman pitched a show to Discovery called The Megalith Men. We were going to, this was like six years ago or eight years ago, we were going to study the origins of the megalith builders around the earth. We'd go to Orkney, we'd dive in the Sicily Channel where they found a 40 foot long megalith that's 10,000 years old, Italian archaeologists did. We would go to obviously Gobekli Tepe at the time. But Kara-Han Tepe was unexcavated when I pitched the show. And Hugh knew the farmer or the landowner. There were a couple of T-shaped pillars organized and understood by the University of Chicago in 1963. So there was an inkling there was another site there. This is before everything blew up in the Tast-Tepler region with all the new sites. So I write out the episodes for all my shows. Episode 1 was we were going to hire a contract archaeological team from Turkey out of Istanbul. And we're going to excavate Kara-Han Tepe with the explicit goal of finding a statue with Extra Digits to match the iconography of Ayin-Ghazal and Jericho and these other super ancient sites. So what happened? We didn't get the show, which blows. So I didn't get to reveal this in real time. But Professor Karool from Istanbul University, he excavated Kara-Han Tepe and what did they find there? A 16-fingered statue. Just like I predicted, not because I'm Nostradamus, but this phenomena would carry through to even older sites, was my thinking. And then they found the panel at Saberich, where the dude is holding up his hand, with six fingers. Now, Professor Karool excavated the site, and this is what he had to say after that excavation. The humanoids have strange numbers of fingers, never five. That's from the archaeologist who excavated Karahan Tepe. So it's just like, once again, he's making shit up, or he's out of his mind, or Professor Tassan in Australia, highly regarded academics, explorers, excavators. So that's a long-winded way of saying that, I really feel that this book encapsulates what's right and what's wrong. It's the best of the academic world, because I've been helped so much from academics, and it's the worst of the cult-like, egocentric, gatekeeping part of it as well.

Speaker 1:
[57:04] So Jim, where can people get your new book, Footprints of the Gods, Extra Digits and the Mark of Giants? Hit us with that.

Speaker 2:
[57:13] Yeah, I think right off of Amazon. It's on Kindle now. I got a proof here. It'll be a couple of days. It'll be up and running. And just where you can get it, you know, just on the Amazon, along with my other books, Giants on Record and the Giants of Stonehenge. I'm on Facebook. I'm petting a dog in Egypt. I'm a Luddite, so I got like locked on my account like three times. But anyways, I have an account where I'm in Egypt. I got like 5,000 followers or something like that. That's the one to get at me. If you have any questions. I study a lot of the aggregation material. I'm doing a tour to Egypt in October with those guys. Yeah, yeah, Facebook, I post everything and what I'm doing and where I'm going. I'm going to the Contact Modalities Expo in Wisconsin on May 1st, May 2nd. And then I'm going to Megalithomania with Hugh Newman, May 7th, 8th, 9th, I believe. So I'll be floating around. Yeah, just reach out if you're interested. And I appreciate the audience showing up and being interested in these ideas. Takes a lot of courage. You take a lot of shit from people in your life when you talk about these things. But I'll tell you what, if you really went into the Epstein files, there's a lot of vindication that's going around the block right now. And that has to be shifted to the academic world. The disdain or the lack of veracity of the mainstream media in the academic world needs to be really strongly questioned now. All these traditions, metaphysical ideas, psychedelics, they're pushing for Ibogaine and other things to be legalized. It is time to upend these old archaic, incorrect ideas and not take any shit from people who want to run their mouths. I lead with kindness, always. But I'm from the wrong side of the tracks and I'm like the Tom Hardy of Ancient Mysteries. I don't have a problem with somebody's head through a wall. I really feel like enough bullshit, enough weasels, enough flint dibbles running their mouth out there. They got no gain. There's no grace, there's no humor, there's no intuition. So anyways, sorry about the rant, but I know you've caught a lot of it too. And it's just like I've had my fill of it. And I appreciate your audience showing up and who's supportive.

Speaker 1:
[59:39] Well, thank you so much for your time. And I'm going to link your book in the show notes. So to everybody watching, listening, click the link in the show notes to get Jim's book, Footprints of the Gods, Extra Digits and the Mark of Giants. It's, I can't wait to read through this thing. It's going to be amazing. Follow him on Facebook as well if you want to stay up to date with where he's going in the conferences. And hey man, good luck on the book and I hope this thing blows up. Thanks so much.

Speaker 2:
[60:11] Thanks Derek, thanks for having me. I appreciate it man.