transcript

Speaker 1:
[00:00] This is The Guardian.

Speaker 2:
[00:14] Hello, and welcome to The Guardian Football Weekly. We'll begin with the sacking of Liam Rosenior, unsurprisingly dismissed by Chelsea after a truly horrendous run, culminating in being walloped at Brighton. Did he ever stand a chance? He didn't have the experience, and by all accounts, the players didn't believe in him, and perhaps he didn't help himself with some of the LinkedIn nonsense. But equally, there are big issues with the sporting directors above him and the owners above them. Which genuinely good experienced coach would view this as a sensible career choice? Then to the title race, Man City win at Burnley, but miss out on a chance to rack up the goals, so they go top on Goal Scored. Displacing Arsenal, who have spent over 200 days at the top of the league this season. Leeds must be safe after a late point at Bournemouth. There's the FA Cup semi-finals to preview and the Premier League weekend. A lot of excellent correspondents. Your questions and that's today's Guardian Football Weekly. On the panel today, Barry Glendenning, welcome.

Speaker 3:
[01:04] Hi Max.

Speaker 2:
[01:05] Hello Lucy Ward.

Speaker 4:
[01:06] Hello.

Speaker 2:
[01:07] Is that your dog in the background, Lucy?

Speaker 4:
[01:09] Yeah, something's been delivered, apologies.

Speaker 2:
[01:13] No, not a problem. I mean, it's either that, or that's Neil Redfern's actual voice, and how exciting that would be. Welcome Jordan Jarrett-Bryan.

Speaker 1:
[01:20] Morning mate, how you doing?

Speaker 2:
[01:21] I'm good, thank you. Let's start then with Liam Rosenior, sacked as manager of Chelsea. Duncan Alexander tweeting, there have been more managerial departures than direct free-kick goals in the Premier League during 2026. What a league. Bill Edgar saying Liam Rosenior was sacked by Chelsea with 96% of his contract time remaining, 74.5 months out of 78. Still, he lasted 15,264 times longer than his dad Leroy at Torquay in 2007, appointed 10 minutes before a club takeover that ended his reign. Chelsea said, this has not been a decision the club has taken lightly. However, recent results and performances have fallen below the necessary standards with still so much more to play for this season. As the club works to bring stability to the head coach position, we will undertake a process of self-reflection to make the right long-term appointment. Only Spurs have taken fewer points than Chelsea over the last nine games. No clean sheet in the last 12 games, no goal scored in a five-game losing streak. They haven't scored since they all huddled around Paul Tierney in that game. Jacob Steinberg, writing that Chelsea Spanish speakers were once the players who were not fans of Liam Rosenior's approach. He lacked respect from seasoned internationals apparently. Him replacing Sanchez with Jorgensen against PSG was apparently a problem. But more than one thing can be possible at the same time, Lucy. He was not experienced enough. This is a terrible run, but there are huge issues all the way up the chain with Chelsea.

Speaker 4:
[02:53] Yeah. I mean, the problem is not Liam Rosenior. I don't think he helped himself at times. But the thing is, though, he was working for that company and they offered him a promotion. So he's not going to say, no, I don't want the promotion. So he was probably stuck in that sort of place as well. But yeah, just the people above in Chelsea, it isn't the manager's fault. I remember speaking to somebody who was aware of what was going on. And they said that the players were right on the edge of having him or not having him. And that was pretty early on in it, just because I think maybe the language and the way he was. Players are an absolute nightmare. I mean, we had it at Leeds when Massimo Cellino was the owner and Neil Redford was the manager. Players just, if they decide that they're not doing something, so they were basically told by Cellino not to play in a certain game. So six of them pretended, allegedly, to be injured. And we all watched them come in one at a time because nobody is more popular than a narcissist who was the owner at the time. And we watched these six players come in. They became known as the SickNotes 6 just before an away trip. So the point I'm trying to make is that players will always look after number one. If they're told to do something or if they're not having a manager, then that's it for the manager.

Speaker 2:
[04:17] What do you make of it all, Jordan?

Speaker 1:
[04:19] Yeah, a couple of thoughts on this one. I think what Lucy said there regarding him having to take the job seems to be the majority view. But I actually disagree. I think that once he's offered that Chelsea job, I think he should have turned it down. I understand that Chelsea is a huge club, great opportunity. I understand that they're part of the same company as well, and it's a promotion, right? But I think if you're looking at your long-term career, the chances are this was always going to go badly wrong at some point anyway, and the stain that is now left on him, I think could affect him long-term in regards to his managerial prospects, right? So I think he should have said, you know what, I don't want that job. It's too big too soon.

Speaker 2:
[05:02] It's so hard, right? Because you're getting millions of a six-year contract. I don't know what his payoff is, but like, totally, it's big money. It's an amazing amount of money.

Speaker 1:
[05:09] But look where he is now, Max. My second point would be, once you take that job then, you only have one job. You're not going to win the league, you're not going to win the Champions League, League Cup, but they were in at that point, the FA Cup, they're still in it. You're not going to win anything. Because we know that Chelsea's model doesn't allow them to win the big trophies anyway, because of their model and the lack of experienced players. Your one job is to ensure that when you do get sacked, because you will get fired at Chelsea, 18 months max, it's been shorter than that. When you do get fired, you've left enough of an impression whereby other clubs look at you and think, you know what? It didn't go away from Chelsea, but it's Chelsea. The Fulham's, the Palaces, the Bournemouths, the Brighton's, those are the sort of clubs that you want thinking, all right, it didn't go well at Chelsea, but you know what? We'll have a look at you. What's happened is, is that on the field, his reputation is now trashed and off the field, he's now a bit of a laughing stock. So it's actually gone wrong both ways and his reputation is in such a bad place. He'll get another job at some point soon, I'm sure. But I don't think he's in a position and a trajectory where he was on before, whereby he can get the jobs now that hadn't have gone better at Chelsea or hadn't turned it down, he could have got, do you know what I'm trying to say here?

Speaker 2:
[06:27] No, I do understand. And actually, if you look at Graham Potter, it took him a long time now and he's at Sweden. And so it's put Rosenior back. I wonder if you take Barry, someone like Iriola, right? You'd think he would be mad to take this job. But does he have enough credit in the bank as manager to go to Chelsea and when it doesn't work, he can say, well, it's Chelsea? Well, Liam Rosenior can't do that because he doesn't have a body of work like Iriola. So is it a free hit for an experienced, good coach who we might all go, you'd be mad to take this job?

Speaker 3:
[07:02] First of all, I don't think Rosenior's reputation is as stained or trashed as Jordan seems to think it is. I'd say he emerges from this fairly unscathed. And I would imagine he would easily enough get a job in, with a championship club at least, next season, should he want one or some go abroad. I don't think he's done himself any favors with the LinkedIn Liam stuff. But that's a bit of a side issue. I don't think Anthony Iriola would touch this job with a 40-foot pole because he will be able to have his pick of a lot of jobs at clubs that are much better run than this circus. I noted with interest the... If he, for some reason, he did take it, if they made him an offer he couldn't, felt he couldn't refuse. Yeah, it is a free hit for someone like him because we've seen what he can do elsewhere. I like the bit in the Chelsea statement where they said that the club hierarchy would embark on a period of self-reflection because I suspect self-reflection would not be a strong suit of Todd Bowley and his mate who run the club.

Speaker 2:
[08:19] I mean, on that, Barney has written, I'd never compliment him directly, but a brilliant piece about this and about Blue Co. About the fact that, was it? Graham Potter said, they're billionaires, so they must be right kind of thing at some point. Actually, that may not be the truth. Barney writes, look, this is a regime so fundamentally strange, it would come as no surprise to discover it is in fact a public art happening. The work of brilliant pranksters designed to demonstrate the emptiness of corporate life, the piddity of commodified sport, the comic potential of what happens when the self-appointed cleverest guys in the room turn out to be the stupidest. And like this project we've talked about, it is weird and they've made some utterly bizarre decisions.

Speaker 1:
[09:02] The Chelsea model is in trouble now because the whole point of their model is to make money, flip players and generate money. These are venture capitalists. Well, if they don't get Champions League football, which I think has gone, they might not even get European football. Are they now going to have to go against their model and sign some experienced players who will cost money in wages at the bare minimum? And then what does that do for their financial model, which was to try and spend as little as possible to make money? Well, now they're going to have to spend money and put money into the club and into the playing squad.

Speaker 2:
[09:34] Yeah, but they haven't spent as little as possible. They spent like a billion pounds. Like, it's like their recruitment, Lucy, is so bizarre. And like so many of, like recruitment is difficult and it doesn't always work. But Dilap hasn't worked, Garnacho hasn't worked, Gittins hasn't worked, Joe Felix didn't work, you know, Joe Pedro has been good, but recent recruitment has been almost disastrous.

Speaker 4:
[09:56] Yeah, it has. I mean, I understand why you can't just put young and inexperienced players together. You need to have something else because they're not very consistent. So they do what they're doing now. And I think the last few games, you can just tell that they're just not having him. Even the players like Kukureya, who would always give and look like he's, you know, trying to be the best player on the pitch. I just watched and just think, well, you know, that they've obviously decided as a group that maybe they got a sniff that the owners weren't particularly happy. But in terms of recruitment, you know, if they then start like John said, if they start changing the model now and bringing in experienced players that the wages will be higher, those experienced players are not going to sign for six years because the wages won't be high. So then they go into a changing room where the other players that are already there who think they're big hitters are on a lower wage for longer. It'll just be absolutely carnage. And again, so which manager is looking at that and think, I'll have a bit of that, you know, especially when, you know, like Rossini was hired to be a yes man and it didn't work. You know, it obviously never was going to work. But, you know, even, you know, if they want a yes man in there, which now there's rumblings that they're not, they don't want a yes man in there, but they still want a little bit of control over it. It just, I mean, Chelsea fans, you know, the experience that they've had over the last sort of 10 or 15 years. I mean, this must be absolutely horrendous for them because they're just like, well, where's it going now? Who's going to come in next? And which players are going to come in next? Because all the players now are talking about, well, we want to go now.

Speaker 2:
[11:29] And actually, I don't think they've sold their allocation for the semi-final, right? That shows the disconnect. And as with any club, Barry, at any level of the pyramid, having so little power over what happens to your football club. But like you would feel so disaffected as a Chelsea fan.

Speaker 3:
[11:45] Yeah, if I was a Chelsea fan, I just wonder what is happening here. This club, it has no soul, no mojo. Its identity is gradually being eroded. I mean, there's a certain delicious irony about the fact that the result that led to Rossiniers sacking was a thrashing at the hands of Brighton, which is the club Chelsea kind of aspired to become by just taking everything Brighton had. And it's, that's like being a disaster for them. Whereas Brighton are still chugging along wonderfully in their own little Brighton way. A club with a, that's well run, has a good young manager, has good committed players and a very happy fan base who have a fair idea what they're going to get when they go to watch their team play.

Speaker 4:
[12:41] And I'm looking at the semi-final on Sunday and up until last night, I was thinking there's no other winner than Leeds on Sunday just because of the way that the effort that looked like the Chelsea players were putting in and it didn't look like they quite believed what they were doing. But now I can completely see a completely different performance from Chelsea on Sunday because the players obviously want to get into an FA Cup final, but they've got what they wanted. So the Chelsea fans will be like, well, why can't you perform like that? Why haven't you performed? And then is it that, what's the name of the guy that's in there, Callum McFadden, is he? So he was part of a number of coaches that were, because that's the other thing that's happened in the background. I think it's Joe Shields has brought all these little coaches in who have taken jobs from other coaches that are quite well qualified and sort of part of the, have been part of Chelsea for a while and moved up as you do the, up from 15, 16s to 18s. And then they've just sort of been slotted in. So that, I think that causes a little bit of trouble in the background as well with, because people sort of don't agree with that. But yeah, I can see a completely different, so now I'm not so sure that these will win on Sunday.

Speaker 2:
[13:58] We'll get to Leeds game last night in just a second. I mean, Brighton were brilliant in this game and 3-0 is, flattered Chelsea, especially the first half. Brighton could have scored like 100 goals. The absolute highlight of all of this was the fact that Mark Kukurela let slip to his hairdresser, that Joe Pedro and Cole Palmer were injured, and Keith, amongst many others, Barry before this pod started, me on the radio yesterday, all making exactly the same joke, but it is worth repeating with the suggestion that Mark Kukurela's barber leaked the Chelsea team news before Tuesday's festival of disrespecting the ball and running and in any way competing. The question is, do we really believe that Mark Kukurela has a barber? I mean, it is very unlucky for Chelsea that, how often is he going? Once every six months. There are footballers that get it cut twice a day. I seem to remember Dion Dublin has his hair cut twice a day back in the day, but to be on the annual time.

Speaker 3:
[14:57] Dion Dublin?

Speaker 2:
[14:59] I think so. I have this memory. I mean, I presume he just clipped it himself.

Speaker 3:
[15:01] I don't ever remember a time when Dion Dublin wasn't completely bald.

Speaker 2:
[15:05] Well, he clippered it back in the day. He could have had a proper Bobby Charlton comb over Dion if he'd let it grow. The thing I like Barry is the thought of Mark Kukurela at the hairdressers, and the hairdresser doesn't know it's Mark Kukurela. He just says, are you up to anything later? He's like, I'm just playing football. He's on his phone and he goes, Jow and Cole can't make it, and it's like that, that's where it's come from. But it's a great story.

Speaker 3:
[15:29] I mean, I find the task of having to make small talk with my barber excruciating. So I would divulge any information at the drop of a hat just to say something, just to break the awkward silence.

Speaker 2:
[15:48] Anyway, that will do for part one. Part two, we will look back at Man City, going top of the Premier League. Welcome to part two of the Guardian Football Weekly. So Man City are top, played 33, Arsenal played 33. Wins, Man City 21, Arsenal 21. Draws, Man City seven, Arsenal seven. Losses, Man City five, Arsenal five. Goal difference, plus 37, Man City, plus 37, Arsenal. They have scored three more goals and conceded three more goals, and that is why Man City are top of the league on goals scored. It is so brilliantly poised here, and they won 1-0 at Burnley. I suppose my question to you, Jordan, as an Arsenal fan is, given we've talked about a possible shootout and it might come down to how many goals you've scored and goal difference, would you have taken a 1-0 win for Man City at the start of the night?

Speaker 1:
[16:46] Yeah, for sure. I think everybody expected Manchester City to rack up the goals last night against Burnley. As an Arsenal fan, I'm sure Arsenal are breathing a slight sigh of relief that it wasn't a 4-5-0 because after the defeat on Sunday at the Etihad, I turned to my mate and I said, we're going to lose this title and goal difference, aren't we? Nodin said, yes, we are. It's going to be that tight. Look, I think the message for Arsenal is really clear. If you're going to catch the City team, you have to start scoring lots of goals. It's as simple as that. Easier said than done for this Arsenal team at the moment, who can't even get a win, let alone rack up the goals. But for City, I think for them, they will feel now that going back to the top of the league, it's their time. They've been handed the initiative, they've been handed the motivation, the momentum, they've got the form, they've got the players. And they've got the manager, most importantly. They are now in the box seat in terms of who your smart money would probably go on to see this through. They will feel confident about getting this title over the line now. And if you just look at how the players are playing, it's such a takeout Sunday from the last handful of games. But the way City are playing versus how Aston are playing, they just look so much freer. They're enjoying it. They're smiling. You know, there's a meme of Erling Haaland now because he's just going around with that look of like, yeah, we know what's coming versus the Arsenal players who just look like they're scared, they're frightened, and they know what's coming as well. So for City, it's ominous now because not only are they playing well, they look like they're enjoying the battle, they're enjoying the pressure. And I think that for Arsenal fans is what should be very concerning.

Speaker 2:
[18:30] Yeah. I don't know, Lucy, they're running. I don't think it's done. You know, City, of course, have got the FA Cup. So Arsenal will play two league games before City have another one. Of course, Arsenal have got the Champions League, two games against Atleti. That's not a relaxing time, is it? But City's running, I think, is trickier. City go to Everton, home to Brentford, go to Bournemouth, home to Palace at some point, home to Villa. Arsenal home to Newcastle, home to Fulham, West Ham away, Burnley at home, Palace away. What are the vibes with you, Lucy?

Speaker 4:
[18:59] Yeah, I agree. I don't think it's straightforward. And all I was reading last night was how stressed out City fans were that they hadn't scored more than one goal. I've just got a feeling that City have gone a little bit too early with the sort of it's going our way and a little bit arrogant, you know, pet praising Arsenal players. You know, he always does that when he's trying to be condescending. You know, he's praising Declan Rice saying it's not done. And I'm thinking, you know, Noel Gallagher appearing multiple times on Talksport talking about what Arsenal have done wrong, Haaland with that look on his face. I just think maybe, you know, now they're the ones, you know, that are leading. It's not particularly straightforward as we saw last night against Burnley. I think that the way that Arsenal performed against them, I mean, I did the Bournemouth game where they were absolutely frightened to death the week before, but I thought they were very good against City and that could quite easily have gone either way that game. The main thing I took out from last night was Pep's jumper with the big letter P on it. Like we didn't know who he was wearing the jumper. The most, Puma have obviously bought out this range for Pep with a big P on it. I thought that was quite amusing. That was probably the best bit of that game.

Speaker 3:
[20:13] City were comfortably better than Burnley last night, but the outcome was never the foregone conclusion everyone thought it would be. Burnley were only one skanky, deflected shot or a lay header from a corner away from actually snatching a point off them and blowing the title away. It's even more wide open than it is already. Pep was on the bench. He was sweating last night. He was very agitated. He needed a big P jumper. I thought Burnley were going to nick something at the end of that game. They didn't. They had chances.

Speaker 2:
[20:50] Yeah, they had a few chances and also they did have that corner in injury time, didn't they? You thought, oh, this is just when there's a corner in injury time in those kind of moments, you think they couldn't, could they? It does mean Burnley are down. Second time in a row, they've come up and gone straight back down. What do you make of their campaign, Jordan? Their recruitment wasn't life-changing, and I feel like they've never given up. I feel like if I were them, I would stick with Scott Parker and say, we go again.

Speaker 1:
[21:18] Yeah, I agree. I would stick with Scott Parker again. I think he's proven that he can get them up. He's done it before. I don't think it's been an embarrassing campaign from them. I wonder if teams that go down now are looking at the Sunderland model of you might have to spend big and smart to have a chance now. Teams have spent big and still gone down. Teams try to be shrewd and gone down, but they seem to crack the model. Maybe Sunderland are one-off. I don't know. But they're going to have to go down and really, it's recruitment, isn't it? Coming up, you have to bring in the right players. It's the right balance. You don't want to upset the guys that got you back to the Premier League too much. But equally, there's a level in class that you need to bring in to compete in the Premier League. But I don't think for Burnley it's been a particularly embarrassing campaign. I don't want to patronise them a little bit, which I'm going to do now, inadvertently. But they can go down with their heads held high. I think, as you said, or Barry said, they were in that game until the last minute. While the game is 1-0, even against Manchester City, you're always in the chance of getting something from that game. Can I just quickly mention something about Arsenal? Just briefly, is that allowed? Sorry, I know we're in the Burnley bit. Apologies.

Speaker 2:
[22:30] No, you're okay.

Speaker 1:
[22:31] The Madrid game is where I have concerns. I think that Atletico Madrid tie might take a lot out of Arsenal's run in. I think they've got Fulham after the second leg of that one. I just fear that it could really drain them a little bit. The other point I want to make as well is about the goals. Do you remember when Liverpool played Crystal Palace in that Cristian Ball game, and they were going for goals, they were three up, and they wanted to rack up the goals and ended up drawing the game 3-3? I think Arsenal have to just focus for now, just beat Newcastle, just win the game. If you're in a chance where you can get four or five, great. But don't go into that game thinking we're going to win this game 5-0, because you could lose sight of what's really important, which is just win the game. That's the most important thing. Also, take to the last game. Arsenal have to now take to the last game. If nothing else, they owe it to the fans, make sure that City win this game, win this league, sorry, on the final game. What can't happen is they implode, and it's done with two games to go. They have to now take it to the last game of the season.

Speaker 2:
[23:34] It's interesting, we talk about Burnley and Barry, we feel that they've done themselves like a decent...

Speaker 3:
[23:40] I don't.

Speaker 2:
[23:42] I think they've been awful.

Speaker 3:
[23:43] They've won one game in the league since the start of November. I think it's been a pretty dismal effort on their part. I'm sorry, Burnley fans.

Speaker 2:
[23:53] That's okay. The interesting thing is because they've actually only got three points more than Wolves now. We didn't really talk about Wolves relegation. I just wonder if the same questions about, I think Rob Edwards has actually done quite a good job since he came in in November. Michael Butler wrote a piece about how many players that they have let go of. You know, Cunha, Stran Larson, Ait Noori, all sold in the summer. Like it's unsurprising they are where they are, but I think they are not in a bad position to bounce back up.

Speaker 3:
[24:20] Well, bouncing back up is very difficult. You could have spurs in the championship next season. Everyone will expect them to bounce straight back up as they go down. There are a lot of good teams that spend a hell of a lot of money in the championship already. I'd imagine Leicester were among the favourites to bounce back last season. Look what happened, or this season. Look what happened to them. Barney, when they came up, their whole thing was built on their defence, wasn't it? They conceded like three goals all season, last season in the championship. They were never going to be able to keep that sort of solidity going in the Premier League. So I guess if you do come up, you have to do a Sunderland on it and have a complete squad overhaul and that's hard.

Speaker 2:
[25:12] Yeah, I mean, they've conceded 68 goals. I suppose that we can come to Leeds now, Lucy. They did recruit and they sort of went big and strong, but they didn't rip up the whole squad, did they? Like Sunderland?

Speaker 4:
[25:21] No, no, no, they didn't and they weren't doing that well until he changed to a back three either and has brought the likes of Tanaka back into the team as well. And I think you saw last night that, you know, physically he can be sort of muscled off the ball when I think it was Sinesse who sent through for for Krupi's first goal. But yeah, I think they've done well. I think what Leeds will now, I mean, everybody's happy because they look like they're staying up. They're in a semi-final of an FA Cup. But I think when the dust settles at the end of the season, they'll look back at how Sheffield United were in their second season as a back three. You know, it sort of, it just blows my mind that it actually has surprised every single team the way that Leeds play. You know, I think what are the analysts doing, watching how they play and not being able to counter it. I think that teams will be better at dealing with Leeds' back three, back five next season. But obviously that's something in the future that everybody's very happy at the moment.

Speaker 2:
[26:21] How do you counter it? Asking for, you know, the tactically unaware.

Speaker 4:
[26:25] I think the best example of how to play against Leeds was Arsenal when they came to to to Elm Road and played against them. And they went up against them, but also passed it very, very well. I just think teams just get thinking, oh, hang on a minute, we've got to try and win the duels. And you're not going to beat Leeds at their own game. You have to sort of be better at connecting passes. But I think that teams will be better at that next season. But I think Leeds fans at the moment are like, who cares?

Speaker 2:
[26:54] Every single game with a team down there, and I know Leeds are pretty much safe before last night. Anyway, Barry, I just watch it through such a ridiculous Spurs lens, and I watch that long staff volley going through about 20 players going, you know, if Javi Simmons is hitting that, it's bouncing off and going out. Like this is, you know.

Speaker 4:
[27:10] VAR could have given at least one penalty to Bournemouth. And then they obviously were unlucky with the offside. So I was looking at it thinking, God, if I was watching this and I was Forest Spurs or West Ham, I would have been like, hang on a minute, why are you not giving penalties? Because the only problem with Bournemouth is that they cannot just finish, they just don't do enough to win games, like on a consistent basis. They draw all the time because they just don't have enough. So there was always that risk that that would happen. But obviously if VAR would have gone their way, there would have been sort of two, three, three up by then and away from Leeds.

Speaker 2:
[27:42] Yeah, Senetti hitting the bar as well, didn't he, later on for two, one. And then you're right, that offside is just, come on, VAR, that's just not what it's meant for, is it, for goodness sake? That'll do for part two. Part three, we'll look ahead to the FA Cup semifinals and the Premier League weekend. Welcome to part three of the Guardian Football Weekly. Barry, we've sold out New York already in just five days. How big is the Bowery ballroom? Is it just a capacity six? Is that what it is? Is that what happened?

Speaker 3:
[28:16] Well, I actually know the answer to this question because I did my due diligence, Max. I think it's just shy of 500 people, but I think that's standing.

Speaker 2:
[28:28] Thank you for selling out. What do we do now? Do we move to Madison Square Garden?

Speaker 3:
[28:31] I suspect we either try and get the Bowery for another couple of nights, or move to the Garden, yeah.

Speaker 2:
[28:39] Yeah, a residency at the Bowery. Here we go. Anyway, thanks for buying our tickets. We look forward to coming. Don't resell them for a million dollars. That's not the Guardian's vibe, people. So the FA Cup semifinals, we sort of touched on Chelsea leads, but how do you see it, Max?

Speaker 3:
[28:54] My view is almost identical to Lucy's. I couldn't see any other winner than Leeds, but now I think Chelsea's players will gamble about with the gay abandon of Cavs who've just been let out of the barn at springtime. I'd be honest, I want Leeds to win. I hope they do. And at least they don't have to worry about, they can devote all their focus to this. They don't have to worry about staying up because they presumably have enough points.

Speaker 2:
[29:26] Yeah, actually Jordan, they're the only side Leeds who really are sort of, can really throw everything at the FA Cup, City have a title race, Southampton are still going for automatic promotion, although the result they drew with Bristol City, which means they'll be pretty lucky, but they've been on an absolutely incredible run. Do we want a Leeds Southampton final? Is that the dream final?

Speaker 1:
[29:46] I don't really care who's in the final, but I think Leeds win this. I still think Leeds win. I thought Leeds before Rossini was fired were favourites. I totally understand what Lucy and Barry are saying about Rossini going. There will be a new lease of life amongst some of those Chelsea players. But I still think Leeds win this game. Chelsea are not good. They're just not good. And I think with Leeds having to, as you allude to there, having the kind of shackles of the relegation fight now off their ankles, I think they will go for this 100%. I'm looking forward to this game. I'm looking forward to this match a lot because there's obviously the historical rivalry between the two clubs and Leeds will see it as a once in a generation opportunity to get to a cup final. So I think Leeds win this.

Speaker 2:
[30:35] To the Premier League weekend then. So we talked about Arsenal and Newcastle a little bit. I mean, Newcastle do not have a good record at the Emirates. They've only scored one in their last nine visits, haven't won there for 13 games. If Arsenal win, they'll have done the double over Newcastle for the first time since 2020-21. And actually, Barry, you sort of think home to Newcastle is as good as it gets at this stage of the season?

Speaker 3:
[30:56] I think so. I'd be astonished if Arsenal don't win this game. Newcastle's last performance in defeat against Bournemouth, they were pathetic. Half the players weren't even trying. As you say, their record at the Emirates is dismal. They're on a run of eight defeats and 11 in the league. So Arsenal have to win this. And if they don't, then good luck.

Speaker 2:
[31:22] Yeah, we haven't actually mentioned the tragic death of Alex Manninger, who passed away last week in very tragic circumstances. He made 64 appearances for Arsenal between 97 and 2002, won the Premier League and the FA Cup, best remembered by Arsenal fans for the role he played during the run. To the double in 97-98, David Seaman says, when I think of Alex Manninger, he was a fantastic goalkeeper for us. He came in and deputised for me during a really critical time to help us win the double. He did amazingly well, was just a young lad when he broke into the first team. For a 20-year-old to come in and play for Arsenal the way he did was really special. I was out for quite a few games through injury, played 13 times, kept a clean sheet in that one-nil win against Manchester United, Old Trafford, and saved penalties in our quarter-final FA Cup win against West Ham. The fans loved him. I must admit, it was touch and go as to whether I would get back in the side. He was a massive player for Arsenal. And I mean, Jordan, presumably, that is true. He played a pivotal role for Arsenal in that time.

Speaker 1:
[32:20] I remember that season. He was pivotal. He was really important in that year, as you mentioned, Seaman missed quite a few games. I remember him being, I read some quotes actually, sorry, him being really well thought of in Italy. Some of the Italian teams and goalkeepers that have come out and speaking about him, talk about how fondly they remember him. He was well loved for his time there as well. Awful way to pass, very young as well.

Speaker 2:
[32:47] Yeah, Gigi Buffon wrote a beautiful message on his Instagram about it too. Our thoughts, of course, with everyone who knows Alex Manning. Back to the football, the bottom of the table then Barry, it's Wolves, Tottenham and West Ham, Everton. We keep saying for Spurs, this is must win, but this is must win, Barry.

Speaker 3:
[33:13] It is, and I think they probably will win, and I think that could be the spark they need to get their act together. If they don't win, they deserve to be relegated, quite frankly. Wolves are not a good team. They are capable of pulling a decent performance out of the bag every now and then. They have improved under Rob Edwards, but the bar was so low that they had to really. But if I will be massively surprised as far as don't win this game very comfortably.

Speaker 2:
[33:50] I won't. They've lost their last three away at Molenew. Wolves are unbeaten in their last six games against Spurs, for goodness sake. What do you reckon, Lucy?

Speaker 4:
[34:02] Well, there has been a difference. I mean, I was following the Brighton game. I was in Iceland doing the England Women's game, and with a Spurs fan who watched their reaction on the side of the pitch when that equalizer went in. But I actually felt, I mean, I'm not a Spurs fan, but I was just like, oh gosh, how would you look? You score to go 2-1 and then that happens. But I do think that there's more positives about the way that they're playing, and it's just about getting over the line, that is, I mean, it's nothing to do with anything tactical, anything like that, it's just mentality. And he looks like he's affecting that mentality, Deserby, and I think that that is key. That's the only thing that needs to be as strong as possible, but a nightmare for Spurs fans.

Speaker 2:
[34:49] Yeah, Routier missed a chance for Brighton against Chelsea, you know, and it was a much easier chance than the one he scored against Spurs. I was like, for goodness sake, he ballooned it like 100 miles over the bar. I was like, come on, balloon that one over the bar, you bastard. Anyway.

Speaker 4:
[35:04] That's what he normally does.

Speaker 2:
[35:08] Meanwhile, Jordan, West Ham host Everton. They're two points above Tottenham. That is not an easy game. Everton are still pushing for Europe.

Speaker 1:
[35:16] No, it's not. Everton have to share the embarrassment that I've heard Barry acknowledge in that I had Everton to go down this season in my bottom three, and our preseason predictions. So yeah, they've massively proved me wrong, and they are still pushing for Europe. That's a genuine possibility for them. So no, West Ham can't think that Everton are in that kind of mid-table comfort, because they'll be pushing for sure. I think West Ham are in a good place, or good-ish place at the moment. I think at this point now, if you're West Ham in your forest, you're thinking just get points, even draws. I think you want to just stay ahead of Spurs. Just get a point. They can get a point against Everton. I think they'll see that as positive.

Speaker 2:
[36:01] Before we get on to that forest game, Karen Brady stepped down from her role as vice chair of West Ham on Tuesday. West Ham's joint chair, Daniel Kratinsky, praised her work, saying her contribution to West Ham's growth, such as the long-term contract for London Stadium. Shareholder's transition and the British record transfer of Declan Rice has been absolutely essential and not always fully appreciated. David Sullivan, who worked with Brady when he owned Birmingham City as well, called her an exceptional leader and a key figure in the club's development. Not, Barry, the same reaction from many West Ham fans. It has to be said.

Speaker 3:
[36:34] No, the vast majority of them seem to be delighted to see the back of the West Ham United fan advisory board who said her legacy is deeply damaging. But she has had a long career, which she began as a very young woman in a largely male industry. So she probably deserves some credit for that. Some of the abuse she's taken from West Ham fans has been, I think, well beyond the pale. But I wouldn't be a huge fan of her work. She has been the subject of some fawning tributes in the media, which have surprised me a bit. I've never met her. I don't know what she's like. But she's getting all the credit for the sale of Declan Rice. But he was sold for what someone was willing to pay for him because he's a very good footballer. She doesn't seem to be getting any of the blame for the huge number of overpriced flops that West Ham have bought during her reign. I don't know how responsible she was for them. Presume she had to sign them off at some stage. I think she viewed the move to the London Stadium as a triumph. West Ham fans don't like that stadium. It's not a nice place to watch football because it's not a football stadium. It's an athletic stadium. It's a soulless bowl in the middle of nowhere. She's gone and West Ham fans are very happy she's gone.

Speaker 2:
[38:04] Yeah, I guess Lucy, you can be a pioneer as she definitely has been. As Barry said, very young as well when she started being a real pioneer for women in the men's game and at the same time not have made every decision right, not necessarily be viewed totally favorably. These two things are both possible, right?

Speaker 4:
[38:23] Yeah. I mean, I can't possibly begin to imagine some of the hassle that she's had over the years with fans and people that she works with. The thing that stood out with this for me is the timing. I think it wasn't just her that's left. I think there's two or three others have left at a similar time. So that, I think the story about why it's happened at the time it's happened will come out very, very soon. I don't know what it is, but I don't think there's a coincidence to her going now. Why didn't she not leave at the end of the season, etc. I do think that there's more to the story than that.

Speaker 2:
[38:59] Okay. Forrest plays Sunderland on Friday night as we've mentioned. They've got this semi-final against Aston Villa, it probably, Barry, one win enough? Is it one win enough? I mean, I think you might need a higher points to stay up. It might be a bad season to be bad.

Speaker 3:
[39:16] Well, I mean, the thing is, I've been wondering, everyone's saying, oh, Leeds are safe. They have 40 points. But it just takes one team below them to go on a remarkable run for them not to be safe. And 40 points may not be enough. It probably will be, but it may not be. I thought Sunderland would have switched off after the beat Spurs, but they gave Villa a right good game last weekend. That could have gone either way. So I'm not sure what to expect from Sunderland. I can't call that one, to be honest. I don't know what version of Sunderland is going to turn up.

Speaker 2:
[39:54] Elsewhere, Liverpool play Palace, Optic Supercomputers, says Liverpool's chance of a top-five finisher at 89%. Yeah, Champions League spot's pretty much confirmed, really, we think. Although, you know, someone could go on a great run. The same at the top as the bottom. I guess Palace might rest players ahead of their semi-final against Shakhtar in the Conference League. Fulham play Villa. Now, Villa have, in their latest accounting manoeuvre, have sold a warehouse to themselves for 55 million pounds. It's the warehouse, which is the club's matchday fan zone and entertainment venue. They've sold it to NSWE Holding Limited, a sister company, and have made a 36 million pound profit from the sale. The Premier League's largest beer hall on matchdays has a three and a half thousand capacity. Space for concerts and shows was converted from an old training facility. And soft launch in December.

Speaker 4:
[40:49] It is nice, it made the outside look really good, but yeah, maybe not that much nice.

Speaker 2:
[40:54] Fifty-five million, but there we are. It's a weighting ratification from the Premier League, which assesses transactions between clubs and associated parties, including sister companies and clubs within multi-club ownership groups. We're all just thinking, I wish I could just sell this shit back to myself for like fifty million pounds. I mean, I don't know who, how do I profit out of this?

Speaker 3:
[41:15] You can. You just set up Max Inc.

Speaker 2:
[41:20] Yeah, okay.

Speaker 3:
[41:21] And Max Inc. pays you a lot of money, but you're just moving money around, you're not actually making a profit.

Speaker 2:
[41:31] I suppose I don't have to, there's no PSR for me, is there? I don't think. Monday, Man United play Brentford in the EFL. But as you noticed, the championship clubs have rejected VAR next season. Your thoughts?

Speaker 3:
[41:45] I'm slightly disappointed because it looked, well, I think the championship will be better off without VAR. I think this was a version of VAR I think might have worked because it was going to be a referral thing. So, head coaches were going to be able to have, say, two reviews, which they could use at their discretion. And I think that's the way, if we accept that VAR is here to stay, which I think it is, I think that's the only way it's going to become workable. And that is the version they were going to have in the championship.

Speaker 4:
[42:19] I think that they had to pay for it, which probably was one of the reasons why they voted against it. Perhaps if it had come free and not much money, then they might not have voted that way, perhaps.

Speaker 2:
[42:34] I quite like the idea of how long do you get to cheat. That is a fun bit of cricket when they've got 15 seconds and Steve Smith is looking at Pat Cummins going, what do you reckon, should we review this or not? And you think, okay, have you got the manager? Because basically you just review any goal just on the off chance. But maybe you'd have to…

Speaker 3:
[42:54] But you only get if you waste it.

Speaker 2:
[42:55] Well, of course, yeah. So you're all looking around going, was there a handball in there somewhere? What do you reckon, Darren? Right, let's review it.

Speaker 3:
[43:03] But the thing is, I think managers would waste them. And then when some outraise the egregious decision is being against them, they have no review left. That would just be… That would add to the occasion.

Speaker 2:
[43:17] I'm thoroughly behind that over what we currently have. In the Champions League, it switched back in the top two after winning at Charlton, who are mathematically not safe but are basically safe. They need to lose both their games and Oxford win both theirs. Oxford lost to Wrexham on Tuesday. Millwall had gone second the night before. Coventry are champions after hammering Portsmouth. So, Ipswich have 79 from 43, Millwall 79 from 44, Southampton and Middlesbrough 76 from 44. Hull and Wrexham locked on 70 points. Wrexham ahead on goal difference at the moment. Blackburn confirmed their safety too as well last night. Well done, Michael O'Neill. They beat Sheffield United. Leicester's relegation was confirmed on Tuesday. In League One, Port Vale were relegated after losing to Cardiff. Stockport lost to Mansfield on Tuesday. Stevenage beat Barnsley. Luton won away at Rotherham and Plymouth could only draw at Bradford. So Stockport are fifth with a game in hand on their rivals. Luton are three behind Stevenage, who hold on to the last playoff spot. And on Tuesday, Cambridge United let in an injury time. Goal to Grimsby. We missed a penalty and then we lost 2-1. Oh God, the agony of it all. We are still in third. It's still in our hands. Salford play champions or want to be champions, Bromley this evening. Come on, Bromley. Big win for Tranmere over Cheltenham means there's four points between them and the drop zone at the bottom of League Two. This is unsurprising. An envoy to Donald Trump has asked FIFA to replace Iran with Italy in the upcoming World Cup. The Financial Times reported on Wednesday. I confirm I've suggested to Trump and Infantino that Italy replace Iran at the World Cup. I'm an Italian native and it would be a dream to see the Azuri in a US hosted tournament with four titles. They have the pedigree to justify inclusion, the US Special Envoy Paolo Zampoli told the FT.

Speaker 3:
[45:00] I'm slightly confused by this. Is it he wants Italy to replace Iran if Iran decide not to play, or he wants Italy just to replace Iran and Iran don't get any say in the matter?

Speaker 2:
[45:14] I suppose alphabetically they're close, aren't they? Iran had said earlier in April, it would only decide on the national team's participation in the World Cup once it received a response from FIFA over the relocation of their matches from the US to Mexico. But FIFA have already given out their peace prize, haven't they?

Speaker 4:
[45:30] I'm supposed to be doing one of their games, actually. I'm supposed to be doing one of Iran's games in the World Cup, so I'm looking forward to who I'm actually going to be commentating on instead if it's not Iran.

Speaker 2:
[45:39] Hopefully, it is all sorted in Iran can play in the World Cup that they qualified for. I need to apologize for my called Steve Potter. I should have done this in the Leicester bit, who is a board member of the Fox's Trust, he came on Talksport, made a nice interview, and then he said at the end, I've got a bone to pick with you. I was the first ever vasectomy, and then I wasn't in The Guardian book. So Steve, I do apologize. I didn't put all the vasectomies together in the book, and you started us off on this merry way, and accept our apologies. Edward writes with some relish, subject Barney correction, correction. Hello there. Imagine the pedant was wrong. Well, the stadium might always be on the right of the train when facing the direction of travel. If you're sat in a rear-facing seat, it will be on your left. Although, Edward, I hate to pedant, the pedant, the pedant. I think Barney said, the train driver said, to your right is the Etihad. We have to presume the driver is not in a rear-facing seat. I've had loads of lovely emails. So we've got a few minutes, so I'm going to do them. Kieran says, hi Max and all, emailing in from Nova Scotia, Canada, as a longtime Spurs sufferer. You have my sympathies. Looking forward to seeing if we can do it on a cold rainy night in Stoke next season. My fiance Abigail and I are tying the knot next month in May. I've been a listener to the pod since the Max Rushden era began. Thank you for giving its rightful name. Following from the Socoray and glory days, I work in football and the pod has always been a great companion. While I drive from field to field over the years for training and matches, my partner Abigail has also always been aware of the pod as I play it while doing the cooking or chores around the house. Her favorite moments are when we get in the car and my Bluetooth connects, usually either to the dulcet tones of Barry or one of Max's wonderfully articulated anecdotes. I don't know if I have any of them. This is always followed by her saying, turn off this annoying soccer talk, sometimes followed with what can only be described as a terrible Tom Hardy in legend impression. I know from those moments on that nothing would piss her off more than to hear the one and only Barry Glendenning wishing her a happy wedding day, and I can't think of a better way to kick off this lifelong journey. I'll be headed to Dublin in a couple of weeks for my stag do. Would love any recommendation from Barry. Tell Baz his next pints of Nova Scotia Guinness are on me, if he ever finds himself back visiting family. Cheers. That is from Ciaran, and he's marrying Abigail.

Speaker 3:
[47:53] Well, as Ciaran knows, I was lucky enough to visit Nova Scotia during the summer. My sister lives there. If the wedding's in Halifax, very picturesque setting. He could take some lovely wedding photos down on the pier down there. And I wonder if his work takes him to Halifax Wanderers, which is the local team who sadly weren't playing at home when I was over. I wish Abigail and Ciaran every happiness in their very long marriage. I reckon this one will last.

Speaker 2:
[48:27] Oh, interesting. Daniel says, My friend Kevin is the town crier for the city of Toowoomba in Queensland. He frequently wins national and international championships for the loudest cry, something anyone who's played five aside with him can attest. In a colourful life, he was formerly UK DJ of the year and ground announcer for Cambridge United Football Club. There's a picture of him. I remember him. He's currently back in the UK tending to his mum, Mary, who is well into her nineties and had a fall recently. In between caring for her, he's been supporting his lifelong club, Oldham, in their tumultuous push for promotion. Anyway, best wishes from Max and Barry to Kevin and Mary would lift their spirits to no end. Many thanks for considering. Good luck to you both. Hello, Kevin. Thanks for giving me half time scores in the nineties.

Speaker 3:
[49:12] Sorry, can I just briefly go back to Ciaran from Nova Scotia. He asked for stag do advice in Dublin. Do not under any circumstances go drinking in the Temple Bar area of the city. It's overpriced. It's full of tourists. It's a tourist trap and most of the best pubs in Dublin are up around the Grafton Street area.

Speaker 2:
[49:36] Noted. Finally, Fraser writes, Dear Max Barry and the Football Weekly team, in 2024, I wrote to you to say thank you for all that you do on this podcast. I felt the need to as I had a progressive and unstoppable lung disease that was in a bit of a rush to progress and unstop itself. At the time, things weren't looking great. I likened it to seeing the board go up for added time. You read out my email on the Euro 2024 final podcast, became a bit of a therapy listen. By January this year, I'd reached the point of needing one to go in off my arse. When the phone rang, a donor match had been found and I was bundled off to hospital for a double lung transplant, which saved my life. Once I'd come round in hospital, enough to reengage with the world a little, I had a lot of Football Weeklys to catch up on during the lonely nights on the recovery ward. It was a reassuring anchor of comfort to hear your voices as much as it was deeply disorientating. I'd been put to sleep for several days after the transplant, which happened to cross the meaningful bit of the January transfer window. That plus a stroke I suffered during the surgery that temporarily affected my short-term memory and a couple of weeks of intensive care delirium left me with a severe case of the Barrys. Strand Larsen is where? Angel Gomez, Tammy Abraham at Villa. I would look at Bristol Rovers lineups and not recognize half the names on there. Am I actually dead? I'd wonder as I frantically Googled Tommy Lee brackets footballer. Eventually I was discharged to rebuild at home, which I'm pleased to say is going better than anyone expected. I'm a lucky, lucky boy. The other day I took my son now forward to the park of this plastic Paw Patrol football. I picked it up, tossed it in the air and gave one to rubble with everything I had. My boy watched his ball spiral higher than he'd seen a ball go before, and he pissed his little self laughing. He might never get into football, and sometimes I think that might be a more balanced life for him. But seeing him kick a ball around and join in with him properly for the first time, it's a start. I'm thankful to so many people, some I know and some I'll never know. When I last emailed, I thought it would be my only opportunity to say thanks, but now who knows, maybe a live show sometime. Until then, thank you once more for the light-footed chat keeps my spirits in a good place. To get another go at live really brings it to focus that it's just football and we might as well find it funny. All the best Fraser. Thank you Fraser. That's a beautiful email. And yeah, we-

Speaker 3:
[51:37] He's a very lucky man.

Speaker 2:
[51:39] Yeah.

Speaker 4:
[51:40] Yeah.

Speaker 3:
[51:41] It's amazing actually, because I thought raising, me personally raising 103,000 pounds for it on the street.

Speaker 2:
[51:50] I see, back to you, yes.

Speaker 3:
[51:51] Children's charity was remarkable.

Speaker 4:
[51:54] Well done Baz.

Speaker 3:
[51:55] I've single-handedly, well, no, with the help of others, saved a man's life as well.

Speaker 2:
[52:03] How did you save his life? He's not got your lungs.

Speaker 3:
[52:06] God, no one wants my lungs.

Speaker 2:
[52:09] I was going to say.

Speaker 3:
[52:12] I smoked for 30 years and said my lungs would be no use to anyone.

Speaker 2:
[52:19] He's looking through the magazine saying, would you like the Glendennings? He's gone actually up. I'll just go back if that's all right. Anyway, Fraser, we send you our love and good for you and all the best with your recovery and that will do for today. Thank you everybody. Thank you Jordan. Cheers mate. Thanks Lucy.

Speaker 4:
[52:34] Thank you.

Speaker 2:
[52:34] Cheers Baz.

Speaker 3:
[52:35] Thank you.

Speaker 2:
[52:35] Football Weekly is produced by Taya Papula. Our executive producer is Joel Grove. We will be back on Monday.

Speaker 1:
[52:50] This is The Guardian.