transcript

Speaker 1:
[00:00] Hi, everybody. This is Kimberly.

Speaker 2:
[00:02] And this is Katie.

Speaker 1:
[00:03] And you're listening to A Date With Dateline. We have a great episode for you today, but first of all, big announcement about last week's episode.

Speaker 2:
[00:17] I see that it's gotten some attention.

Speaker 1:
[00:21] The wrath that we have faced from the Marvel nerds.

Speaker 2:
[00:26] First of all.

Speaker 1:
[00:26] And I say nerds lovingly, I am a nerd as well.

Speaker 2:
[00:29] No, from the Marvel absolutists, from people that know Marvel.

Speaker 1:
[00:33] The Marvel canon people, the canonists. I don't know if that's a word. Obviously only saw the reel that Adam made where you were telling me the story of Thanos and Tony Stark.

Speaker 2:
[00:47] Fetus and Fitu.

Speaker 1:
[00:48] That you revealed at the end of the episode, you completely made up as a joke.

Speaker 2:
[00:53] Yeah, that's great.

Speaker 1:
[00:53] A belated April Fool's Day joke. No one heard that part. So they were really mad. And some of their attacks were very personal from some bros, Marvel bros. If you were mean, you got blocked. And if you were just called us stupid, that was nice enough. And I just let it go. Cause we also are stupid. We think we're stupid. It's fine.

Speaker 2:
[01:15] It's absolutely fine. Cause I did have to say, I thought that I was like, oh, these are getting kind of mean. But I think I am now growing as a person cause I was cracking up because seriously, the amount of this chick has no idea what she's talking about made me howl. Because I know, and it doesn't really matter to me cause I know that I made it up. They don't know that I made it up. So just something about it brings me the ultimate joy and that this is the only time I will ever be a troll. I trolled you. I was an internet troll.

Speaker 1:
[01:54] I believe we rage baited people unintentionally and I'm here for it.

Speaker 2:
[01:59] How great is that?

Speaker 1:
[02:00] It's gotten our most views to date.

Speaker 2:
[02:04] I also-

Speaker 1:
[02:05] So that's fine.

Speaker 2:
[02:06] It kind of makes me laugh. I'm like, if this is the one time that I get called a troll, that's great.

Speaker 1:
[02:12] Yeah. Bring it on. If it helps us monetize our platform more, that's great.

Speaker 2:
[02:18] I thought it was so funny. The level of, oh my gosh, Katie got me and then, oh my gosh, then I heard the end. I had to Google it, et cetera, versus the memes-

Speaker 1:
[02:30] Women be stupid. Yeah.

Speaker 2:
[02:31] The memes of just the face of like what the F was, I'm delighted. I'm so sorry, sorry, not sorry, to people who thought it that that was real and kudos to Adam for some great graphics. It's really funny.

Speaker 1:
[02:47] Yeah. Listen to the full episode next time. That's your lesson. We did it.

Speaker 2:
[02:54] We're the rage baiters.

Speaker 1:
[02:55] I don't like that. I don't like that.

Speaker 2:
[02:57] We did it one time and it was glorious.

Speaker 1:
[02:59] Yeah. Never again.

Speaker 2:
[03:02] Never again.

Speaker 1:
[03:02] Maybe again.

Speaker 2:
[03:02] Maybe again.

Speaker 1:
[03:03] Maybe we'll keep doing it. Maybe everything will be fake from now on. We're just going to make up entire episodes of Dateline. We're not even going to go off the episode anymore.

Speaker 2:
[03:10] Parts of this episode seemed fake.

Speaker 1:
[03:12] So thank you everybody. And she knew she was making it up. It was a joke.

Speaker 2:
[03:18] Yeah.

Speaker 1:
[03:18] So this episode is called Deadly Swagger and it is Season 34, Episode 37 on Peacock. April 17th, 2026 is when it came out. We apologize that we are a day late. Katie had to go out of town and we are sorry. Life happens.

Speaker 2:
[03:37] Thank you for waiting.

Speaker 1:
[03:38] It's hosted by Keith, our on fire, Lien King, who's cursing up a storm and having a great time in this episode.

Speaker 2:
[03:50] Yeah, truly.

Speaker 1:
[03:51] Hi Keith.

Speaker 2:
[03:52] Hi Keith.

Speaker 1:
[03:53] Does it make you uncomfortable when I stroke his prayer candle?

Speaker 2:
[03:58] Yeah.

Speaker 1:
[03:58] I thought it might.

Speaker 2:
[04:00] Using the word.

Speaker 1:
[04:00] I thought it might. And I did it. I rage mated you.

Speaker 2:
[04:03] Okay. Now, now I've created a monster and I'm concerned.

Speaker 1:
[04:08] So this episode takes place in Lake Tahoe. A setting so sublime, Mark Twain wrote, to breathe the same air as the angels, you must go to Tahoe. Now, for new listeners of our podcast, this will mean nothing to you. But for OG listeners of our podcast from when we started nine years ago, I was shooketh. We used to get Mark Twain references almost every week. It felt like so much so that we put it on our Dateline bingo cards, Mark Twain reference or the Alamo, because it was either the Alamo or Mark Twain that we were getting mentioned. We haven't had it in like five or six years, but it's back.

Speaker 2:
[04:52] Worth the wait.

Speaker 1:
[04:53] Yeah.

Speaker 2:
[04:54] I was really excited because it was so unexpected. Yes, exactly.

Speaker 1:
[04:56] Because I had almost forgotten about it, because I took it off our bingo cards a long time ago.

Speaker 2:
[05:00] I know. It was just sublime.

Speaker 1:
[05:03] It was so sublime that Mark Twain wrote to breathe the same air as the angels must go to hell. In 2021, a 911 call comes in and there's just moaning, not like the moan on the Dateline intro, the sensual, sensual, ah.

Speaker 2:
[05:23] We heard it the first time.

Speaker 1:
[05:25] If you haven't heard it, you'll never unhear it. It's bad moaning on the 911 call.

Speaker 2:
[05:31] Yeah.

Speaker 1:
[05:32] It's from the beautiful home, this cabin, but it's like a cabin mansion, a canton in Tahoe.

Speaker 2:
[05:42] A chalet?

Speaker 1:
[05:43] A chalet. It's like a chalet.

Speaker 2:
[05:44] It is a chalet.

Speaker 1:
[05:45] Okay, great. It's of Gary Spore and Wendy Wood. EMTs arrive. There's some dogs that are agitated, which made me very agitated because I don't like when there's dogs involved. There is the owner of the home, Gary, dead on the couch. He's been shot. A blood trail leads to the bedroom where the agitated dogs keep going to. I was like, please don't let the dogs be hurt. The EMTs find Wendy in the bathroom covered in blood, but she's still alive. She's the one who called 911. She's airlifted to a hospital. Detective Daniel Meyer gets the call in the middle of the night. It was supposed to be his day off, which is again why I'm not a detective. Could I be a cold case detective because there's less of a rush and I could still take my days off and work regular hours because cold case is not going anywhere.

Speaker 2:
[06:41] I think you could be a PI.

Speaker 1:
[06:43] Oh, that's my own time.

Speaker 2:
[06:45] And you take whatever case is. You don't have to take every case if this is not for you.

Speaker 1:
[06:50] I'll do it on Monday. Tonight I'm diamond painting.

Speaker 2:
[06:53] Correct.

Speaker 1:
[06:53] That's what I would say. The crafty PI.

Speaker 2:
[06:56] That sounds like there's a market for that. I like that.

Speaker 1:
[06:58] So Keith asks the detective about it and he says, oh, my wife is used to it and we just work 24-7 and we don't sleep until we're finished with the case. There's no sign of a forced entry. It looked eerily normal besides the personal destruction to Gary and Wendy, which I've never heard it phrased like that and it was horrible.

Speaker 2:
[07:18] That's really awful.

Speaker 1:
[07:19] Keith says the fear spread at the speed of news around the wealth encrusted shores of Lake Tahoe. Not a Tony enclave, but wealth encrusted. They're crusty with wealth.

Speaker 2:
[07:34] Just crinkled up dollar bills.

Speaker 1:
[07:36] I'll also have been watching Honey Boo Boo again because it makes me feel happy. And she's always talking about her crusty neck. Malma June is, not Honey Boo Boo. She always had a crusty neck and they always joke about it.

Speaker 2:
[07:48] Are you re-watching? You're not.

Speaker 1:
[07:50] Yes. No, this is like original. Back when we didn't know how terrible the family was and everything was fine. And they were just at the Redneck Games diving in mud.

Speaker 2:
[08:00] The whole family isn't terrible. We're not doing a swath of negativity across the whole family. Some members are rough.

Speaker 1:
[08:06] The neck crust was terrible, though. And she had forklift foot. Back when they talked about the forklift foot a lot.

Speaker 2:
[08:13] Anybody that talks about neck crust, it's a hard visual.

Speaker 1:
[08:17] Yeah. So when Keith said, wealth encrusted shores, that's all I can think of.

Speaker 2:
[08:21] You thought of ripples of, yeah, okay.

Speaker 1:
[08:24] I don't think that's the picture he was trying to paint, but that's what I got. So we meet the local reporter, Mark it off your bingo cards. She says, murder is very rare there in Lake Tahoe. Sometimes people fall to their death while hiking or have a boating accident, but Andrea Canning mostly hosts those episodes. So Gary and Wendy owned a coffee shop, sorry, copy shop. I kept thinking they were saying coffee shop and I got very excited because I thought how much fun it would be to own a coffee shop. And then it was actually a copy shop, like paper copies. The copy house, and again, I thought it was the coffee house. They were beloved by their employees. Now this is back in the 90s and I don't know why we spend so much time on this copy house that they owned in the 90s, but we do. So we're meeting the ladies that worked there back in the 90s.

Speaker 2:
[09:17] I think we're spending so much time on those ladies because they're kind of delightful.

Speaker 1:
[09:21] They are. No, they are.

Speaker 2:
[09:22] I'm glad they got as much airtime as they did. I was like, yeah, these gals are great.

Speaker 1:
[09:26] I liked the ladies. I'm also enjoying all the 90s photos that we're seeing of Wendy and Gary, even though this crime happened in 2021. We're seeing mostly old photos of them from the 90s. The ladies loved that Wendy went by her own last name in the 90s. She didn't take Gary's last name. They thought Gary was super handsome. He drove to Porsche. They had Riz basically as a couple.

Speaker 2:
[09:52] Rich Riz.

Speaker 1:
[09:53] Yeah, Rich Riz. They were generous with their employees. They gave them perfumes and steak dinners, weekends at their ski house.

Speaker 2:
[10:01] Slash chalet.

Speaker 1:
[10:02] Their chalet. They had two daughters, Erin and Adrian, who had everything they could want growing up. And Keith says they could afford to be generous because they were rich. Keith usually would do some flowery language there, but he's just not... They were rich.

Speaker 2:
[10:18] These are rich people.

Speaker 1:
[10:20] So they were now retired in 2021. They loved skiing and boating with their grandkids because Erin had kids. Erin lived in nearby Reno with her husband, who was a former Major League Baseball player, and Erin herself was an equestrian. Adrian lived three hours away with her boyfriend. However, it seemed like a picture perfect family. It wasn't. The daughters had tension, and Wendy had a strong personality and fought with her daughters, and also with the neighbors of Lake Tahoe, we meet a local prosecutor who says that she was involved in 22 lawsuits.

Speaker 2:
[11:00] This is very strange because normally this would equal a bad boss, right?

Speaker 1:
[11:06] Right.

Speaker 2:
[11:07] Yeah.

Speaker 1:
[11:07] I think that's why we spent so much time at the copy house, is to paint a good picture because we are about to paint a not so great picture, and Wendy is one of our victims, so we want to be nicer. Dateline usually likes to stay very positive about the victims. They lit up a room. They were so generous. They loved life, not they sued everyone in Lake Tahoe.

Speaker 2:
[11:31] We also focus a lot on Wendy and not so much on Gary.

Speaker 1:
[11:35] Well, Wendy had the stronger of the personality. But Gary was no shrinking violet. He got involved in some of these scuffles. Yeah, that's true. So 22 lawsuits, Wendy was involved in both as the one suing and the one being sued. And Keith says, Good Lord. Good Lord.

Speaker 2:
[11:54] Accurate.

Speaker 1:
[11:55] Clutched his pearls. Gary would back up his wife's disputes. So they're thinking, this is a ton of suspects now. Did someone go after them for these fights that they were having? It was a targeted attack. It wasn't a burglary. There was even a diamond tennis bracelet on the floor next to Wendy that wasn't taken. At least have the decency to stage a burglary. And then we can break it apart and say, it looks like a stage burglary. But at least give us that. This person didn't even try to make it look like a burglary. No. So then Keith says, What a difference a bit of tech can make. Those little front door cameras. Common as clover now. Common as clover. This is the new cool as moose.

Speaker 2:
[12:44] Common as... I already get down.

Speaker 1:
[12:46] Which was also a new phrase to us when Keith said it years ago. We learned so much from him.

Speaker 2:
[12:51] Common as clover now.

Speaker 1:
[12:53] Is it a Canadian phrase?

Speaker 2:
[12:54] No, I think he just made it up. I don't think that's a phrase.

Speaker 1:
[12:59] Really?

Speaker 2:
[12:59] Let us know if that's an actual phrase.

Speaker 1:
[13:00] Cool as moose was an actual phrase.

Speaker 2:
[13:03] Right. But common as clover, I think, is just him making an analogy.

Speaker 1:
[13:07] Okay.

Speaker 2:
[13:08] I think. But I could be wrong. Please let us know.

Speaker 1:
[13:11] And this could be us rage baiting everybody by pretending we've never heard. We should do that more often. I've never heard of that expression, early bird catches the worm.

Speaker 2:
[13:21] I thought you were doing it with the... What was it? It was something on the nose. And you pretended like you had never heard that it was on the nose.

Speaker 1:
[13:31] No, that was just me being dumb, probably.

Speaker 2:
[13:34] That's a shame.

Speaker 1:
[13:35] No, it was Twitch made my nose twitch.

Speaker 2:
[13:37] Made my nose twitch. That was it.

Speaker 1:
[13:38] Yeah, I had never heard that before. Dennis started saying that a lot.

Speaker 2:
[13:42] That's wild.

Speaker 1:
[13:43] I legitimately had never heard that. So the detectives watched the footage from the camera that's outside the garage. They see Aaron pull up with the grandkids during the day. Gary comes home in his Audi, blue. That's how Keith says things, Audi, blue. The family walk down to the lake together. Then shortly after, after the family goes to the lake, so no one's home, they see a man running up the street and it's summertime, so it's hot out but he's wearing full sweats and a hoodie, and a face mask and a backpack. He goes into the house through the garage because they can hear the garage door lifting on the outdoor camera. Thirty minutes later, the family returns to the lake, goes inside where this masked intruder is waiting. Later that evening, Erin and the grandkids leave, and an hour later, there's five gunshots that you can hear on the outdoor camera. And then the man walks away into the darkness. So he had hid in the house for several hours without them knowing, and they think he was hiding in this little hidden cupboard under the stairs. It's perfect for Harry Potter or a Frogger. Keith says to the detective, I mean, you knew a lot. You knew the whole damn crime, and yet you knew nothing. Strange. He said, damn.

Speaker 2:
[15:06] He said, damn.

Speaker 1:
[15:07] Damn. First he said, good Lord. And then he said, damn. They released the footage of the walking man to the news, asking for usable leads. Keith says to the detective, this might scare the hell out of people in the affluent community here. He's just swearing left and right. He said, hell. He didn't say HE. Double Hockey Sticks.

Speaker 2:
[15:28] He's light cursing.

Speaker 1:
[15:30] They're more than we normally say on this podcast.

Speaker 2:
[15:33] We say hell on this podcast.

Speaker 1:
[15:34] I say HE. Double Hockey Sticks.

Speaker 2:
[15:36] And I usually edit that out because it sounds ridiculous, because it's ridiculous.

Speaker 1:
[15:41] See, and I do it for you. You should hear what I say on Pink Shade. I cuss, I talk about the most disgusting things on 90 Day Fiance on Pink Shade.

Speaker 2:
[15:52] I'm sure you do. Please check out Pink Shade. Mary Payne is a force of nature and incredible.

Speaker 1:
[15:57] So the detectives decide to follow the money and see where it goes. Follow the money and see where it goes.

Speaker 2:
[16:03] Where it ends up, nobody knows.

Speaker 1:
[16:06] Okay, that's not it.

Speaker 2:
[16:07] Could it be it?

Speaker 1:
[16:08] It gets close, but not really. Lin-Manuel could do so much better. So the daughters would split the $25 million estate. So they have the biggest motive. They willingly talk to the police, they want to help. Erin was obviously at the lake with her family and then she left with the grandkids. Her husband was out of town. Her husband's name is Dan Serafini and he had pitched for several teams in the major leagues, the twins for one of them. My dad knew who he was. My dad knows who everyone is in baseball. He had opened a bar at one point and was now a miner. A miner. When Keith said miner, I thought A, he played in the miner leagues now, or B, he had Benjamin Buttoned himself and was now a toddler. But he was actually a miner in a mine, mining.

Speaker 2:
[17:07] Yes.

Speaker 1:
[17:08] That was the last thing that was on my mind.

Speaker 2:
[17:11] Seeing I have recently rewatched the Chernobyl mini-series for the 50th time. A miner was at the top of my mind.

Speaker 1:
[17:19] Oh, that's interesting.

Speaker 2:
[17:20] Because the miners are one of the funny parts. Maybe the only humorous part in the series, but it is very delightful. Still so delightful that I looked up the actor.

Speaker 1:
[17:31] Before their skin starts falling off, it's a laugh riot.

Speaker 2:
[17:35] We're not doing that part. Also, I looked up what actually happened to the miners and was surprised.

Speaker 1:
[17:42] They survived?

Speaker 2:
[17:42] A lot of them. For a long time.

Speaker 1:
[17:45] That's great.

Speaker 2:
[17:46] Isn't that good? Yeah, some good news.

Speaker 1:
[17:48] That's good news.

Speaker 2:
[17:48] Yeah, you're welcome.

Speaker 1:
[17:49] So he worked in a gold mine. Gold mine. It's very hard to say gold mine and not add a D at the end.

Speaker 2:
[17:59] Good job.

Speaker 1:
[17:59] He's operating heavy equipment. He is working three and a half hours outside of Reno. His phone records show he was in Crescent Valley, Nevada, which is where he lives in a trailer when he's at the mine site.

Speaker 2:
[18:13] We're going to need to talk about the mining site.

Speaker 1:
[18:15] Trailers.

Speaker 2:
[18:16] The video that we're being shown.

Speaker 1:
[18:18] Go for it.

Speaker 2:
[18:18] I'm so sorry. Are they mining for methamphetamine?

Speaker 1:
[18:21] Because that is a breaking bad trailer park.

Speaker 2:
[18:26] When they said, this is where he spends time at the trailer, I went, okay. Where is this?

Speaker 1:
[18:35] Crescent Valley, Nevada. Three and a half hours outside of Reno. Cool.

Speaker 2:
[18:40] Follow the money and see where it goes.

Speaker 1:
[18:42] I feel like that desert is just littered with syringes and cigarette butts.

Speaker 2:
[18:46] How many of those trailers blow up on a monthly basis? They spontaneously implode.

Speaker 1:
[18:51] Three or four.

Speaker 2:
[18:52] There was a gas leak. Sorry, they don't have Southern accents, but something's cooking.

Speaker 1:
[18:56] Adrienne was at work. She's the other daughter. Her boyfriend, Taylor, is a felon. He had confessed at one point to robbing a bank. I'm sure Wendy and Gary loved their daughter dating this guy. He had robbed a bank with a gun, and when he did so, he had been covered head to toe, and had a ski mask on and was carrying a backpack, so very similar to the masked man on the video. But it's not him. He has an alibi.

Speaker 2:
[19:27] That also doesn't work anymore. Why are people robbing banks? You're not going to get any money now.

Speaker 1:
[19:33] Because of the die packs?

Speaker 2:
[19:35] Well, they have all sorts of stuff.

Speaker 1:
[19:37] The tracking devices and the cameras and the...

Speaker 2:
[19:40] Yeah, I don't know. It seems ridiculous.

Speaker 1:
[19:42] There was an episode of American Dad where they actually came up with, like, the perfect way to rob a bank. And it was actually made sense.

Speaker 2:
[19:50] I was like...

Speaker 1:
[19:51] It was a very elaborate Oceans 11-type plan. That's what you need. You can't just go in guns-a-blazing. You need an Oceans 11-type plan.

Speaker 2:
[20:00] Where someone sleeps in the vault overnight type thing.

Speaker 1:
[20:03] Exactly. Exactly. Two weeks after the shooting, Wendy wakes up. And the way people are talking about her in this episode, no one in Tahoe was happy about it. Keith said a lot of the people in Tahoe knew Wendy. Perhaps for all the wrong reasons. And then a number of people joked that the suspect list would be pages, pages, pages long. Wendy was disliked in the community, it sounds like.

Speaker 2:
[20:28] That's rough.

Speaker 1:
[20:29] Yeah. So the family lawyer figured Wendy had to be the target of this, because she was so disliked. And he figured she must have pissed off somebody. He says there were two ways to do things, Wendy's way and Wendy's way. And Keith chuckles at that. When she wakes up at the hospital, she's kind of confused. She first says it was Rick the Water Guy, and then she passes out. So they look into this Rick the Water Guy issue. He owned a water well that was on Wendy's property, and Wendy had issues with that. They had easement fights going on. And if you think that Wendy was the only antagonist in the house, you'd be wrong, because Gary sent Rick the Water Guy an email saying, Wendy has a permit to carry a gun, and she'll use it if needed. This is an episode of Fear Thy Neighbor.

Speaker 2:
[21:23] You're threatening your wife using her gun. This also feels like it could be a warning email, like, my wife-

Speaker 1:
[21:30] Help me?

Speaker 2:
[21:32] Well, my wife gets really mad about these sort of things, and she's gotten herself a gun now, so maybe you want to rethink this, because she's going to use it. I don't think that was the gist, but it is funny that he didn't directly threaten. He threatened a third-party hurting hip. That's very funny.

Speaker 1:
[21:51] Also, I would assume that this well had always been there.

Speaker 2:
[21:54] Yes.

Speaker 1:
[21:54] This is a long-running dispute when they got the property. It was already there, so-

Speaker 2:
[22:00] These are like mineral rights type things, where you've got stuff under the surface that you own what's on top, but you don't own what's down below.

Speaker 1:
[22:09] So they are able to rule out Rick the Water Guy by comparing him to the man on camera, the masked man. I'm assuming Rick has like a limp or something because Wendy shot him in the foot one time, but it's not him. So then Wendy, in her confused state, says it must have been Dave the Fisherman. She's just like every village people. It's just like there's a construction worker she's mad at. There's a indigenous person that she's mad at. There's a plumber that she's mad at.

Speaker 2:
[22:39] She's got beef all over town.

Speaker 1:
[22:40] Beef all over town. So one day she was out paddle boarding. Dave the Fisherman had minnow traps out in the lake. He sees her on her paddle board pulling up his traps. Keith asked the prosecutor, now why would she do that? The prosecutor laughs and says, Keith, I have no idea and I wasn't mad about it. Normally I don't love when a suspect, a murder suspect, says Josh, Keith, Andrea, Dennis, Blaine. That's not true.

Speaker 2:
[23:18] There's another group of people you also don't like when they say it, defense attorneys.

Speaker 1:
[23:22] Defense attorneys, when they have a bogus defense excuse.

Speaker 2:
[23:27] When it's condescending. It's used usually in a condescending way or just way too familiar.

Speaker 1:
[23:33] But this prosecutor, his eyes are twinkling, as he's telling this story, to Keith, it was said with love.

Speaker 2:
[23:40] A hundred percent.

Speaker 1:
[23:41] This story gets worse though. Dave, the fisherman, rose out in his boat to where Wendy is paddle boarding and confronts her about pulling up his traps. And she hits him in the head with her paddle and caused injury to his head. The cops are called. She is charged with assault with a deadly weapon. She ends up pleading no contest. She gets probation and she has to stay away from Dave, the fisherman.

Speaker 2:
[24:08] Why is Wendy so violent?

Speaker 1:
[24:09] Is she on roids? What's happening? This is so out of touch with the generous employer that we heard about at the copy house.

Speaker 2:
[24:18] Something's happened.

Speaker 1:
[24:19] Wendy, you changed, girl. So this thing with Dave happened three years earlier. And Keith says to the detective, Well, this seems like it might have legs. And the detective says it did have legs. However, Dave has an alibi, so no more legs.

Speaker 2:
[24:37] So legless.

Speaker 1:
[24:38] They briefly think that maybe Gary was the target. He had a federal case against him involving narcotics from years before, but it had been settled. We know nothing else about this.

Speaker 2:
[24:54] Say more about this. This is what we want to know about.

Speaker 1:
[24:57] Was he mueling? Was he selling? Was he stealing?

Speaker 2:
[25:02] Was he involved in those trailers?

Speaker 1:
[25:04] Was he with the cartel? The detective says, if it is involved with this case from years before, this opens up so many new possibilities of suspects. And Keith says, oh, Lord, yeah. So this is our second Lord.

Speaker 2:
[25:22] He's just doing this. He doesn't care.

Speaker 1:
[25:24] He doesn't care anymore. He just says whatever.

Speaker 2:
[25:27] That's great.

Speaker 1:
[25:27] Oh, Lord. Our sponsors are good. That's what I have to say to all of you. And you need to check them out.

Speaker 2:
[25:34] Thank you so much to our sponsors. Okay. Back to the case.

Speaker 1:
[25:38] So the detectives go back over the family's alibis. Like Aaron's husband, the son-in-law, Dan, the ex-ball player. The night before the murder, Dan had stayed at a hotel in Elko, Nevada. He's on camera there, going into the hotel. But something odd, as Keith says, happens. A woman checks out for Dan, and then checks herself into the same room. And her name is Samantha Scott. Dan's phone records show that he talked to Samantha the morning of the murder. So a detective drives to her apartment to talk to her, and right away he sees the outside of her apartment is an Audi, comma, blue, sitting outside.

Speaker 2:
[26:24] Okay.

Speaker 1:
[26:26] And he realizes that's Gary's car. Why does she have Gary's car shortly after he was murdered? So they talk to Samantha. They're doing their technique of asking open-ended questions. Do you know why we're here? Which I hate that sort of question. It's like when an older relative is asking, do you know how old I am? Guess how old I am. That's the worst. I don't want to guess.

Speaker 2:
[26:49] Who asked that question?

Speaker 1:
[26:50] Older relatives at every Botmitzvah I've ever been at.

Speaker 2:
[26:55] Do you know how old I am?

Speaker 1:
[26:57] Guess how old I am. How old do you think I am?

Speaker 2:
[26:59] And do you just always guess 35?

Speaker 1:
[27:01] You have to.

Speaker 2:
[27:02] Yes, you have to.

Speaker 1:
[27:03] Also, I live in Orange County, so it is hard to tell a lot of times.

Speaker 2:
[27:07] It is 100% hard to tell.

Speaker 1:
[27:09] I do think this is a good technique though. I bet it works if you're like, do you know why we're here? And you're like, about that guy I murdered yesterday? And they'll be like, no, we're here about a drug deal, but tell us more about this murder.

Speaker 2:
[27:23] I feel like it would work on the right person. It's a good technique.

Speaker 1:
[27:27] So she says, I'm assuming, I can assume. I mean, yeah. And they go, what do you think? And she says, something to do with my friend Aaron's parents? And they say, yes, what can you tell me about this? They're just the most open-ended questions ever. And she's like, I just don't know why I would be involved, but I'm happy to answer your questions if you ask me a specific question. She doesn't do well with open-ended questions, but it is flustering her. And that's the point. She tells them that she met Aaron. She was looking for a trainer who trains for equestrian triathlons. I had to look it up.

Speaker 2:
[28:13] Rich people stuff.

Speaker 1:
[28:14] Because I was picturing the horses swimming, and I knew that wasn't right.

Speaker 2:
[28:18] So horses are one of the events.

Speaker 1:
[28:20] They all involve horses.

Speaker 2:
[28:22] Oh, okay. Explain. What are they?

Speaker 1:
[28:24] The first is dressage, which I only know what it is because I remember Mitt Romney's wife did it.

Speaker 2:
[28:30] It's that fancy step.

Speaker 1:
[28:32] I still think it's dressing the horses in costume, but I think that's not right.

Speaker 2:
[28:36] I think dressage is what Snoop Dogg got very, very excited about at the Olympics because he thought the horse was crip walking and it was very funny. It was like a very viral clip. He was very into it.

Speaker 1:
[28:48] He gets excited about everything.

Speaker 2:
[28:49] He's really into the horses. Yeah.

Speaker 1:
[28:51] Dressage, athletic precise movements, horse ballet.

Speaker 2:
[28:57] It's horse dancing.

Speaker 1:
[28:58] So the next part of the triathlon is cross country, and then the third is show jumping.

Speaker 2:
[29:04] Is it all the same horse? Are you on the same horse the whole time, or do you switch horses depending on the event?

Speaker 1:
[29:09] I would guess you go with the horse that brought you there, as they say. So I would think it was one horse, but I don't know.

Speaker 2:
[29:17] So the horse wins the triathlon. The horse wins.

Speaker 1:
[29:21] But you get all the money in the endorsement deals, probably. But does the horse wind up on the box of Wheaties?

Speaker 2:
[29:26] Yes, I would hope so. Also, do you think that horses are just strictly a rich person hobby?

Speaker 1:
[29:33] Um, yeah.

Speaker 2:
[29:35] I think so, too.

Speaker 1:
[29:36] I think they have scholarships and things now in camps that try to include less affluent communities. But probably, yes.

Speaker 2:
[29:45] I don't feel like poor people have access to horses.

Speaker 1:
[29:48] I think they're trying to change that. Some communities are, but probably not. No, I would think it's definitely like sailing.

Speaker 2:
[29:58] Right. If somebody said that they did horseback riding as a kid or something like that, I would make certain assumptions, is what I'm saying.

Speaker 1:
[30:06] Well, there's the whole episode on Seinfeld about, I hated anyone who had a pony growing up. And then the woman dies shortly after that. And then Elaine feels responsible because she said she hated everyone who had a pony growing up. And this old lady had a pony growing up. And then she died the next day.

Speaker 2:
[30:24] I feel like that's common. I mean, I feel like it's them versus us, those that have ponies and those that don't.

Speaker 1:
[30:31] So they had met five years before. Erin was Samantha's horse trainer person. They ask about Erin's husband, Dan, who they sometimes call Danny. She says, I've known Erin for five years. I mean, therefore I've known him for five years. Don't give sarcasm to the detective. I don't even know if she was trying to be sarcastic. She's not that bright.

Speaker 2:
[30:59] She's not good at this. She's not good at thinking quick on her feet. That doesn't say that she's not intelligent. It just says, this particular thing, this is not your forte.

Speaker 1:
[31:09] So she tells them that the day of the murders, she was in Elko with Dan, and it was the first time they had hung out because, not because they were having an affair, but because he needed help buying a new Ford truck for Erin as a surprise gift. And she's a Ford salesman. Why does he need her help? No idea. And Samantha says, so we were going to go look for a truck, but I had just broken up with someone. So Dan invited me to go to a party to cheer me up. So we didn't actually go look for the truck after all.

Speaker 2:
[31:48] What party?

Speaker 1:
[31:49] They're these people, drugs.

Speaker 2:
[31:51] Yeah.

Speaker 1:
[31:52] Katie guesses drugs in every episode, and this actually might be the drugs episode.

Speaker 2:
[31:58] And they're also at a casino, right?

Speaker 1:
[32:00] Yeah. It's a casino hotel. Yeah.

Speaker 2:
[32:03] Okay.

Speaker 1:
[32:04] So they party, they slept at the hotel, but in the suite separately. She says, no sex. No, never. No sex. It's ex-baseball player, cute Dan. She laughs. And then when she wakes up at the hotel, Dan was gone, but she wanted to stay and spend the day at the hotel and enjoy the suite and live her best pretty woman lifestyle and jump on the bed in her bathrobe. So that's what she did. She says that she had the Audi because her sisters were in town and they had borrowed her car. So she was lent a dead man's car who lives like almost an hour away instead of just getting a rental.

Speaker 2:
[32:46] How soon after this?

Speaker 1:
[32:48] Shortly.

Speaker 2:
[32:49] Okay.

Speaker 1:
[32:50] So she was going to meet with her sisters who are in town later that day at their hotel. The detectives go to the hotel and they watch and they see Samantha join not her sisters at the hotel, but Erin and Dan. So she fully lied. Police asked Dan to come in again and he brings his lawyer this time. And they accused him of lying because he had said he was out partying with his coworkers that night and not with Samantha. And he keeps saying, well, that's my personal life. So I just didn't want to tell you, it's my personal life. They're detectives in a murder investigation. And if you weren't doing anything wrong, you say you weren't having an affair with her. Why do you care?

Speaker 2:
[33:31] He's never watched Dateline. He is never, he does not understand.

Speaker 1:
[33:34] So he says to the day of the murder, he was passed out in Crescent Valley in his trailer all day. He says he took two Vicodin, a shot of Nyquil Z, and two Tylenol PMs. It's like something a teenager would get stoned off of.

Speaker 2:
[33:53] It's also not true. That to him sounds light. So he's saying that.

Speaker 1:
[33:59] It's way worse.

Speaker 2:
[33:59] So whatever the other thing is, is very different.

Speaker 1:
[34:03] Black Tar Heroin.

Speaker 2:
[34:04] Those trailers tell me something different. And also, a shot of Nyquil Z?

Speaker 1:
[34:11] A shot of Nyquil.

Speaker 2:
[34:13] I've never heard that little weird sticky cup that comes at the end of the syrup bottle.

Speaker 1:
[34:18] Or did he pour it in a shot glass?

Speaker 2:
[34:20] Would you call it a shot? What would you call it?

Speaker 1:
[34:23] No, I'd just say a dose, a dose of Nyquil.

Speaker 2:
[34:27] Yeah. I took Nyquil and went to bed. Also, what's Nyquil Z?

Speaker 1:
[34:32] I don't know.

Speaker 2:
[34:33] All right.

Speaker 1:
[34:34] It's cool. So, his phone also was in Crescent Valley, so it seems to back him up. Months pass in the investigation. They bring Samantha back in. And she says she's very close with Erin and Dan. They were very close friends. There has been a recent flirtation with Dan since the murder. They always joke that the three of them are in a throuple and that Dan has two wives. Now she's saying that instead of jumping on the bed at the hotel suite that day, she left the hotel suite. She picked up Dan in Crescent Valley and they drove to Lake Tahoe. And the detective is like, what's that now? He's trying to contain himself and not act too excited. It's like, oh my God, she just placed Dan in Lake Tahoe.

Speaker 2:
[35:25] Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Speaker 1:
[35:26] She says she took Dan to downtown Lake Tahoe, where I don't know if they call it downtown, the shops area of Lake Tahoe, which is like four miles from the house. Waited in her car for hours for him to come back. He was apparently picking up some cocaine.

Speaker 2:
[35:46] Here we go.

Speaker 1:
[35:47] She gives Tag along, raise your standards girl. Like he's taken his time. He is making you wait for hours while he picks up cocaine.

Speaker 2:
[35:56] Did she go in the shops? Like what? You didn't just sit in the car.

Speaker 1:
[36:00] Maybe she shopped.

Speaker 2:
[36:01] Yeah. Get a muffin, get a coffee.

Speaker 1:
[36:03] So she insists that he did not have a gun that day and that she doesn't think he had anything to do with the shootings. It's a coincidence that they were there that day picking up cocaine. The detective at this point stops being polite and starts being real with Samantha. And he says, I don't buy that story whatsoever. You're in a lot of trouble, Missy.

Speaker 2:
[36:27] Missy.

Speaker 1:
[36:27] He doesn't say Missy, but he does say you're in a lot of trouble. He, I don't buy that story. He sounds like a principal. She's not good at this.

Speaker 2:
[36:35] No, she's not.

Speaker 1:
[36:36] So she says, oh, I don't know. And then they say, did he tell you to turn your phone off when you were in Lake Tahoe? And she says, no, yes, he did tell me to turn my phone off. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. She's really bad at being interrogated. She's also really bad at turning her phone off because when he told her to turn her phone off so they couldn't be tracked, she just closed the screen off and not the phone off. Is she special?

Speaker 2:
[37:10] I know, I know, I know, I know. Now, remember what I said before that you could be bad at like answering open-ended. You could be bad at improvising.

Speaker 1:
[37:19] I do remember that.

Speaker 2:
[37:21] Now, more evidence has been presented that leads more towards your hypothesis that maybe she's not the sharpest knife in the drawer.

Speaker 1:
[37:31] Meanwhile, Wendy is working on her recovery. She's learning how to walk, she's learning how to speak again, and she gets so advanced that she is far more active than I will ever be. She's riding a bike, she's doing planks. Wow. Super impressive. I don't do that and I was not shot in the head. So what's my excuse? The detective talks to her every day, they become friends and it sounds like she needed a friend because everyone in Tahoe hated her. Wendy tells the detective, Erin and Dan were borrowing a lot of money from her and Gary. They were having constant money problems over the years. The very day of the shooting, they had given Erin a check for $90,000. Dan had opened this bar, but it had failed. They owed hundreds of thousands of dollars to Wendy and Gary. They would fight about it. They would be estranged for a while. They would cut them off. Then Wendy would cave and she would give them more money. This was like a constant ongoing battle. Wendy has also started to remember things about that night. Like maybe she had seen her son-in-law Dan in a hoodie, shooting Gary and then shooting her. But maybe she was not actually remembering this and maybe had just heard her family and friends suspicions, whispers, and that had influenced because her mind was confused.

Speaker 2:
[39:01] I was worried about that.

Speaker 1:
[39:02] She is suspicious enough to write Erin out of the will. Adrienne, the other daughter, is also very suspicious of her sister and Dan. Two years after the shooting, this is sad. Adrienne calls the detective and says, my mom killed herself and I blame you for it, because you didn't solve this case and she thought it was never going to be solved. The detective is almost crying on Dateline. He feels horrible and I think this is misplaced anger from Adrienne. So Adrienne files a wrongful death lawsuit against her sister and Dan. Meanwhile, Erin says that Adrienne manipulated Wendy into disinheriting her so that she could get the whole estate, and she files a lawsuit against Adrienne. So it's sister vs sister lawsuits. Money just tears families apart. Then detectives find on camera the day of the shooting in Tahoe near the house. Samantha walks to her car, and this is much closer than where she said she was. She said she was four miles away where the shops are. This was like a mile and a half away. She goes to her car, and then she sits in her car. She doesn't go shopping. She sits in her car and waits, and then after it gets dark, the dome light on the car comes on, and they think this is Dan getting in her car, and it lines up with him walking from the house to the car. So they arrest Dan and Samantha, and these are some good looking prison headshots. Samantha has gotten a full on makeover since the crime. She's gotten in shape. She has put on some makeup. She got out of her frumpy clothes. She dyed her hair dark, so she looks a lot like Erin. And it appears that Dan has a type, because now all of the throuple ladies look the same. She also didn't really look like she fit in the throuple before, and now it looks she's like hot like them. However, I will say Dan looks a lot rougher though. He is aged 15 years.

Speaker 2:
[41:06] What does that tell us?

Speaker 1:
[41:07] Shmugs.

Speaker 2:
[41:08] Thank you.

Speaker 1:
[41:09] If you want to feel better in your prison headshots, check out our sponsors. They will have you looking and feeling your best and living your very best life.

Speaker 2:
[41:19] Thank you so much to our sponsors. All right, back to the case.

Speaker 1:
[41:22] So they don't feel like they have enough evidence on Erin so she doesn't get arrested. It's just Dan and Samantha. Dan and Samantha sit in jail for 15 months. Now Samantha wants to talk. Fifteen months in jail has softened the connection to Dan. She says Dan did have a gun that day and a silencer. And they had even on the drive to Tahoe, they had stopped the car and he had tested out the gun and the silencer.

Speaker 2:
[41:55] What?

Speaker 1:
[41:56] After the shooting, she says he threw his gun and his backpack out the car. So they're somewhere they can't find him. She agrees to plead guilty to accessory after the fact and fully flip and testify against Dan. Dan goes on trial. For the prosecutor's opening statement, he walks to the podium and he says, I'll pay $20,000 to have them killed. Those are the words that Dan told his brother. So apparently, Dan had said to his brother, he wanted to have his in-laws killed. He says Dan hated his in-laws. They show the jury emails back and forth between Dan and Wendy, where they were fighting over this ranch that Wendy and Gary had bought for Dan and Erin. Dan wrote to Wendy, take the effing house, but if Gary ever says, F you to me again, I will knock him the F out.

Speaker 2:
[42:51] Whoa.

Speaker 1:
[42:52] Is he on Royds? Is he juicing? Because this doesn't seem like meth anger even.

Speaker 2:
[42:58] Yes, it is.

Speaker 1:
[43:00] It's meth anger.

Speaker 2:
[43:01] Absolutely.

Speaker 1:
[43:02] This is giving Dan Markell and Wendy Adelson son-in-law relationship.

Speaker 2:
[43:07] Why are you talking to your mother and father-in-law like that?

Speaker 1:
[43:11] Also, why can Gary not say F-U, but you're fully saying F-U to Wendy repeatedly?

Speaker 2:
[43:17] It's really weird.

Speaker 1:
[43:19] So prosecutors show footage of the masked man walking to the house. They point out his gait, his swagger. Some might say his deadly swagger, which is the name of this episode. The man has a slight limp. They show a side-by-side of this man walking into the house, and Dan walking into the hotel the day before the shooting. And they point out how the walks are very similar. The left leg kind of goes out. Could be a baseball injury, could be a mining injury, could be a methamphetamine injury. The killer also knew the code to get into the garage, because there was no force entry. The killer entered a code and then went into the garage. Before he left, the killer put out a giant bag of dog food for the dogs, because he thought the bodies probably wouldn't be found for a few days, and he wanted the dogs to have food. Is it wrong that this kind of warmed my heart towards Dan? It is wrong.

Speaker 2:
[44:19] I don't know if that was Dan's idea.

Speaker 1:
[44:21] Maybe Gary was like about to feed the dogs, and that's why the bag was out.

Speaker 2:
[44:26] I don't...

Speaker 1:
[44:27] Was it Erin's idea? Because she liked the family dogs.

Speaker 2:
[44:31] Doesn't that make a little more sense? Then maybe Dan was a super animal guy, but that doesn't feel like that.

Speaker 1:
[44:38] It doesn't feel like that at all. Dan left his phone in his trailer in Nevada to give himself an alibi, but his phone never moved or was used during that time in Nevada. Pro tip, get someone to use your phone. Send some messages, do some internet surfing, watch some videos.

Speaker 2:
[44:59] That's true.

Speaker 1:
[45:00] It's common sense. I don't know how many times I've said it. No one's listening to me.

Speaker 2:
[45:04] No, they're not.

Speaker 1:
[45:05] Samantha takes the stand. She says that Dan confessed to her and had threatened to shoot her family if she told anyone. However, she kept having an affair with him because now she says they were having an affair, but it started after the murders and then he threatened her family and then she kept having an affair with him. He told her he was in love with her while they were both in jail and he was sending her kites, which are messages from one jail cell to another part of the jail, which we've seen a lot on Love After Lockup and 60 Days In.

Speaker 2:
[45:43] In the toilet?

Speaker 1:
[45:44] They do toilet sometimes, but sometimes they just pass, people pass each other things. How? Well, there's parts of the jail where there's a wall that connects so you can talk through it and be like, hey, my brother's in Cell Block D, can you get him a message? And there might even be, if you like walk the hall and you pass somebody who's in that, you could like hand them a little piece of paper. So sometimes it may be a physical kite. Sometimes they might talk to the toilet.

Speaker 2:
[46:10] You just yell into the toilet relationships.

Speaker 1:
[46:13] Hello, Ricola.

Speaker 2:
[46:16] I think you're very handsome. What? I think you're very handsome.

Speaker 1:
[46:21] What?

Speaker 2:
[46:21] You're hot. I'm hot. Are you hot? Yeah, it's gonna be. I don't know. I don't know how much you can hear.

Speaker 1:
[46:27] I really can't imagine it's a lot.

Speaker 2:
[46:30] Imagine the miscommunications that happen just over simple text messages. You can't tell tone and then imagine through a toilet.

Speaker 1:
[46:38] Also, how do you know which pipe goes to which other cell?

Speaker 2:
[46:41] They could just say they were someone else. You could be talking to Charles Manson.

Speaker 1:
[46:45] Yeah. Wow. You're right. I want more documentaries about the whole kites.

Speaker 2:
[46:49] About toilet catfishing? I do too.

Speaker 1:
[46:51] Yes, toilet catfishing.

Speaker 2:
[46:53] I want to know. I really want to know.

Speaker 1:
[46:57] So he is trying to woo her while they are both in jail, which is obviously to keep her from not flipping on him. He really needs to send her some Matchbox 20 lyrics to really woo her, a la Brendan Banfield. I'm not crazy. I'm just a little unwell. I yell into this toilet to tell you how pretty you are.

Speaker 2:
[47:18] I would have been happy to forget that. Now I remember it. Please don't bring it up again. I need that to go out of my brain.

Speaker 1:
[47:25] I can't promise that.

Speaker 2:
[47:26] Please don't bring it up.

Speaker 1:
[47:27] I'm still in my rage baiting era, so no promises.

Speaker 2:
[47:31] Don't rage bait with Rob Thomas. That's mean. That's just mean.

Speaker 1:
[47:35] So Erin testifies she knew about her husband's sexual relationship with Samantha, but she was really only mad that there were feelings involved. She didn't care that they were sleeping together. She still sticks by Dan though and says Dan is innocent. It's not him on the tape. The defense says that the masked swaggerer is not built like Danny. It's not him. There's no forensic evidence in the house that shows that it's him. Also, why would he kill them when they were still giving him and Erin money all the time? He was not the beneficiary if they died, but his wife was.

Speaker 2:
[48:15] But Erin was.

Speaker 1:
[48:16] You think we're not smart, but this is common sense.

Speaker 2:
[48:20] They think we're not smart. That's insulting.

Speaker 1:
[48:23] It is. They say Samantha is lying to save herself. Overall, I would say, I find from the little I saw on the Dateline, I find the prosecutor a much more compelling speaker than the defense attorney because the shot they show of the defense attorney, he says, it's like, why would you kill the golden goose?

Speaker 2:
[48:42] That's not, that's terrible.

Speaker 1:
[48:44] It's like, you're 70 years old, why are you talking like a valley girl?

Speaker 2:
[48:48] Don't say like, don't do that.

Speaker 1:
[48:49] I don't like that. Keith says, he talks to three jurors, they are watching Dan to see his facial expressions during the trial, he doesn't show any, and they found that suspicious. Now we do know from Dateline, they are told to not show a lot of facial expressions.

Speaker 2:
[49:05] They are, and they're reprimanded for excessive ones sometimes by the judge.

Speaker 1:
[49:11] Yeah.

Speaker 2:
[49:11] I feel like also juries should be told that. Juries should be told that as part of their instructions when they come in. Now, if you are watching the defendant, know that they have been instructed to not show a lot of outward emotion.

Speaker 1:
[49:25] Everyone's reactions are different. We've seen that so many times, so you can't judge just by watching the defendant. You need to base it solely on the facts.

Speaker 2:
[49:33] On the evidence, yeah.

Speaker 1:
[49:35] Not their little facial reactions.

Speaker 2:
[49:37] And that being said, would you and I on a jury do that? I would say I would spend 60% of my time.

Speaker 1:
[49:45] That's what I do when I'm watching the show, so I don't see why I would do it, not do it when I'm on a jury.

Speaker 2:
[49:51] No one else should do it. Will we do it? Yes.

Speaker 1:
[49:54] Do as we say, not as we do. So Keith talks to these jury members who also say they became full-on investigators. They take screenshots and make comparisons of the killer walking and Dan walking to see if they're the same. Now, right away, I knew this was a problem. They should not be doing this. The prosecutor should be doing this for them, and this should be part of the evidence. They find him guilty. The detective starts crying again on Dateline because he's so happy, but it's not over yet. Oh, no. Dan hires a new attorney and Keith says, watch out. The new attorney is Barry Zimmerman.

Speaker 2:
[50:31] Who is not a watch out type. If you're saying watch out, I am thinking that this is like some young hot chat attorney. Like, this is, you know, Ali McBeal's team. This is something I cannot think of any more recent lawyer shows. It denotes something different than Mr. Zimmerman, Esquire.

Speaker 1:
[50:52] So, Mr. Zimmerman, he says that there was jury misconduct because they did that investigator work, because they got those screenshots. You're not supposed to do anything that could be called like an experiment.

Speaker 2:
[51:04] And then you're not supposed to talk about it on Dateline.

Speaker 1:
[51:07] You're not supposed to talk about it on Dateline. Also, he says that dance attorneys should have pushed back the trial when they found out that Samantha flipped and say that they need more time in light of that new revelation.

Speaker 2:
[51:19] That's correct too.

Speaker 1:
[51:20] They also should have let Dan testify.

Speaker 2:
[51:23] No, they should not.

Speaker 1:
[51:25] I disagree. It usually goes poorly. And Keith says to Barry, well, Dan's his own agent. Like he could have testified if he wanted to. And he said, well, they're pressuring him and giving him this advice. So he felt like he shouldn't. But that was bad advice. They also didn't call any defense witnesses at all.

Speaker 2:
[51:45] That's bad.

Speaker 1:
[51:46] And there were people that he thinks they should have called, including a neighbor at the trailer park. I would love to see this.

Speaker 2:
[51:53] Please.

Speaker 1:
[51:53] Does she have curlers in her hair and wears flip-flops?

Speaker 2:
[51:57] No, she's a gold miner, Kimberly.

Speaker 1:
[51:59] On her day off, she is testifying in a murder trial. What does she wear to court?

Speaker 2:
[52:05] What, dungarees, overalls? What do gold miners wear? We needed a lot more information on the mining.

Speaker 1:
[52:13] Well, there's that show Gold Mine, Gold Digger, Gold Rush. My dad watches that show, but they're usually like in other countries. We don't get to see these like messed out trailer parks, I don't think.

Speaker 2:
[52:25] Well, what's happening in Nevada? Is that real or is that a made up job? Is that like people just going out and being like, I'm going to find gold today, but they're on government land?

Speaker 1:
[52:35] No, I think it's real.

Speaker 2:
[52:36] It's through a company?

Speaker 1:
[52:37] Yeah. They buy the land and then they dig.

Speaker 2:
[52:41] For gold?

Speaker 1:
[52:42] Yeah.

Speaker 2:
[52:43] I know you want more information. We need to find out more.

Speaker 1:
[52:46] So this neighbor says that they saw Dan that day, and he was at the trailer park. There's also a secret, secret lover who apparently spent the day with Dan drinking a bunch of disgusting wine, she says.

Speaker 2:
[53:03] That feels accurate to me. The fact that she said disgusting wine, I was like, it was either, I think whatever that wine was, it was too warm. Cause that's what I think of when I think disgusting wine.

Speaker 1:
[53:15] Dan had told the detectives he was alone. So he either lied or the lover's lying or something's going on. He gets a hearing and will possibly get a new trial. He is aging terribly. He looks like a totally different person.

Speaker 2:
[53:31] He does.

Speaker 1:
[53:32] The defense reveals a voicemail from Wendy after the shooting that she leaves for Dan saying, Danny, I wanted to tell you, I've been doing this electric therapy and I have a vision of the shooter and it's not you.

Speaker 2:
[53:47] So she's doing EDMR, right?

Speaker 1:
[53:49] Something like that.

Speaker 2:
[53:50] This I have a lot of questions about. This is huge too because then she also kills herself after this kind of therapy. Like I just.

Speaker 1:
[54:01] You're thinking about the principal who all those students killed themselves after he hypnotized them.

Speaker 2:
[54:07] I am thinking if she was trying different kinds of therapies, I'm not saying that EDMR, I think that's helpful for a lot of people.

Speaker 1:
[54:14] Did she take ayahuasca?

Speaker 2:
[54:15] I'm saying what other kinds of therapies was she trying to figure this out? Just what was going on here? When you say when Adrienne killed herself, was the cause of death? Did she overdose on one of her medications? Like what happened and was it after something substantial? I don't know. I feel like this is another dateline within a dateline.

Speaker 1:
[54:36] I do think having your husband murdered in front of you, you being shot, and then you reaching the conclusion that your daughter had something to do with it and her husband could be very devastating.

Speaker 2:
[54:50] Of what we know of Wendy, at this point.

Speaker 1:
[54:54] It would just make her pissed off.

Speaker 2:
[54:56] Right. Again, we're told almost nothing about what her actual injuries were. Were we ever told where she was shot?

Speaker 1:
[55:04] In her head.

Speaker 2:
[55:05] But not where in her head. And then we're also like, and then they suggest the arms, but I don't, I don't know. So I'm just saying, I have questions about this whole thing. Something is making my nose twitch.

Speaker 1:
[55:18] So after she leaves this message for Danny though, she comes to the conclusion that it was him actually. And so then the prosecution plays the phone call with the detective, where she told him, I remember now and it's Danny. And they also say that Wendy was pretending she didn't think it was Dan and Erin, to keep her safe and to still stay in touch with them, stay in touch with the grandkids probably, figure out what's going on. She was pretending she didn't think it was them for a while. That could have been what that phone call was, or she could have at that time believed that it wasn't him.

Speaker 2:
[56:00] At this point, I don't think that any Wendy testimony should come in.

Speaker 1:
[56:04] Yeah, it's all fraught with complications.

Speaker 2:
[56:08] Anything she's said, you have to build the case without it, and I think you can. I don't think you need it.

Speaker 1:
[56:13] So they say that the neighbor that says that they saw Dan that day has the date wrong, and they say that Dan told his secret lover to lie about spending the day with him. They also say if the defense had put them on the stand, they would have cross-examined them, and it would have revealed even more incriminating evidence about him.

Speaker 2:
[56:36] Schmucks.

Speaker 1:
[56:38] So it would have made him look even worse. Plus, just the secret lover's testimony alone shows that he had lied to the police repeatedly because he had said he was alone that day. From Pitchers Mound to jail cell, Keith says that he has fallen so far. Keith goes to talk to Dan behind prison glass. They're each on one side of the prison talking on the phones. We haven't seen one of these kind of interviews in a while. And the most memorable of Keith's is when he said he didn't give a sweet flying F and the world stopped spinning forever and we all lost our minds and we were never the same. The episode was a quiet place, I believe. And the man questioned Keith's journalistic integrity. He had no choice but to pop off.

Speaker 2:
[57:26] Not to be confused with the film.

Speaker 1:
[57:27] Right. Maybe it's called A Lonely Place. No, because that's the song. No, that's Hopeless Place. It was called In A Lonely Place or A Lonely Place.

Speaker 2:
[57:37] It was called A Lonely...

Speaker 1:
[57:38] Final answer.

Speaker 2:
[57:40] A Lonely Quiet Place colon Keith Says Bad Word.

Speaker 1:
[57:44] Yeah. Keith Says Sweet Flying F.

Speaker 2:
[57:47] Yeah.

Speaker 1:
[57:48] Dan says that he was failed by the justice system and they made stuff up about him. And he says his defense in the trial was not good. And the jurors didn't like his reaction in court, even though he was instructed to not have a reaction. And they didn't like his lifestyle. And he's not talking about the schmucks. He says that he and Erin live a certain lifestyle where they do their own thing when they're apart. As long as you don't bring drama home. Basically, an open marriage where he is allowed to sleep with other people when he is away for work because he would travel a lot. He broke the rules by being with Samantha because she was too close to home. She was friends with Erin, friends with everybody. Police told Samantha to lie, he says, because the police wanted to get him. So they knew she was lying. They made her lie, etc. Because they wanted to get at him. And he says, what happened that day was Samantha had come to the trailer. She had picked up $25,000 for an investment, cocaine. She had driven to Lake Tahoe without him, and he had stayed at his trailer. That's his story.

Speaker 2:
[59:05] Come on.

Speaker 1:
[59:06] $25,000.

Speaker 2:
[59:09] Come on.

Speaker 1:
[59:09] Is he building a store made out of cocaine?

Speaker 2:
[59:12] Correct.

Speaker 1:
[59:13] An igloo made out of bricks of cocaine.

Speaker 2:
[59:16] There's so many parts of this that we are not being told.

Speaker 1:
[59:19] I know. So Keith says, but you knew how to get into the garage. You knew about this secret hiding place in the house. And Dan says, how hard is it to walk through a garage door? Everyone knows how to get into a house.

Speaker 2:
[59:34] Dude.

Speaker 1:
[59:34] Excuse you. Do not be sarcastic to Keith, sir. I do not like that. Also, the garage door was closed. So not everyone knows how to magically open a garage door, a mechanical garage door.

Speaker 2:
[59:47] With a code on it. Didn't the garage have the code on it?

Speaker 1:
[59:51] Yes.

Speaker 2:
[59:52] Okay. Whatever.

Speaker 1:
[59:53] Everyone knows how to walk into a house.

Speaker 2:
[59:55] How did he know the code though?

Speaker 1:
[59:57] Aaron gave it to him. He visited the house. I'm sure the whole family knew the code. I'm sure it was somebody's birthday. Okay. Keith says, the masked man seems to walk like you. And Dan says, you're implicating me, and you need to stop it with these kind of questions. He's not being verbally aggressive, but what his words are. His words are aggressive, but he's trained himself to smile, kind of.

Speaker 2:
[60:25] Oh, I don't like that.

Speaker 1:
[60:26] It's like he's been trained that you come off threatening when you speak like this, so soften your tone. But his words continue to be threatening.

Speaker 2:
[60:37] I really don't like that. Ooh, that's unnerving.

Speaker 1:
[60:40] But he's saying it with a smile. You keep, you're already implicating me, and you need to stop it with these kind of questions. No. Keith says, well, this is a timed interview. We only are given a certain amount of time by the jail, so I have to be very challenging. Like, that's my job here. And he says his brother testified about what he said about wanting someone to kill them because his brother has it out for him because they had a falling out after their mom died. So much like what happened to Adrian and Erin, he and his brother had a falling out. It's like he causes destruction in families wherever he goes.

Speaker 2:
[61:21] Well, if you had a falling out after the mom died, then it was about money, because that's what happens.

Speaker 1:
[61:26] Yes. So he says, people want to believe that I did it because of the society we're living in. It's felt very like, I felt personally attacked.

Speaker 2:
[61:37] I have no time for that.

Speaker 1:
[61:38] I thought he was going to say something about Libs.

Speaker 2:
[61:41] It felt dangerously close, but it's fine.

Speaker 1:
[61:44] It felt like he has maybe been listening to some man podcast or something. I didn't know where he was going with this.

Speaker 2:
[61:50] Nowhere good. I felt it too. There was something in the way that it's not the same way that I say society. So I knew enough to know that.

Speaker 1:
[61:59] It was like, yeah, we were getting a little bit into his manifesto.

Speaker 2:
[62:04] And we don't want that.

Speaker 1:
[62:05] And he says, people want to believe that I did this because of the society we're living in. They want to believe that I'm a broke, washed up baseball player. I pay my own bills. My bills are paid. That's what she said on A Thousand Pound Sister. I pay my bills. My bills are paid.

Speaker 2:
[62:21] Does she?

Speaker 1:
[62:22] No, absolutely not.

Speaker 2:
[62:24] I knew it. If you're saying you pay your bills, that means your bills are paid.

Speaker 1:
[62:27] He says, I've been very successful and I'm proud of it. I didn't come from this great whatever, but I made something out of myself. The judge denies his petition for a new trial, which is great. At his sentencing, Adrian says, Dan and Erin treated our parents like a bottomless ATM. Why kill the golden goose? Because they got tired of asking. Then Adrian gives the detective a hug at the sentencing, and the detective cries again, third time talking about this because he had felt so badly because of what she had said. His wife and kids are there and Adrian goes over and hugs them because they gave up so much of their time with him so that he could work on this case. It's just very sweet. Erin files for divorce from Dan and she doesn't attend the sentencing, but she sends a letter saying he's a kind and generous person. She's still saying he's completely innocent. Samantha gets two years probation. Dan gets life in prison without parole. Lake Tahoe glimmers as it always has, deep and clear and unmoved by the dramas that gripped mere humans rounded Sylvan shore.

Speaker 2:
[63:42] Wealth encrusted shore.

Speaker 1:
[63:44] Wealth encrusted, Tony enclave shore. Thank you, Keith. So beautiful.

Speaker 2:
[63:50] So how heavily was Erin questioned in this?

Speaker 1:
[63:53] They just didn't have proof. The only proof they had was that she took the parents out to the lake with the grandkids while he was able to sneak into the house. But that doesn't prove that she knew he was gonna be there or knew he was gonna do that. That's just not proof. I don't know if she's involved. She very, very well could have been involved. I just don't know if they have proof. They might still be working on it.

Speaker 2:
[64:20] Just because she has not turned on him.

Speaker 1:
[64:23] She did file for divorce though.

Speaker 2:
[64:25] She did.

Speaker 1:
[64:26] He is still the father of her children, so maybe she doesn't want to admit that.

Speaker 2:
[64:31] That is a very good point. I didn't think about that. Did you watch his gait? Did you watch him walk?

Speaker 1:
[64:37] Yeah, to me the left leg turns out the same way in each of the, but I'm not an expert and I would guess that walking experts, like gait experts, I'm sure there are people that think it's junk science. They think everything's junk science now. Like anytime anyone mentions any, oh, we got a message from someone saying how irresponsible it is for Dateline to talk about lie detector tests because they're so junk sciency. And I'm like, they're not saying it with any commentary whatsoever.

Speaker 2:
[65:06] They're not. They're literally saying they used a thing.

Speaker 1:
[65:09] But they can't put it in trial.

Speaker 2:
[65:11] They're not allowed to use it.

Speaker 1:
[65:12] We all know this. I would wonder if there are experts on walking, like the same way there's experts in handwriting, and have them compare it. I bet they could put it into a program and have, like, you know.

Speaker 2:
[65:27] No, AI is doing enough. We don't need AI for this.

Speaker 1:
[65:30] But, you know, like an animated simulation and lay the walk on top of each other, maybe, and see if it's the same.

Speaker 2:
[65:38] I was more thinking about the portion of the video where he runs. It's the very beginning of the video we see him run by. Now, as a baseball player, I would think there would be an unbelievable amount of footage of him running to the mound.

Speaker 1:
[65:53] Yeah.

Speaker 2:
[65:54] Doing that little sort of, because it's not a full sprint. It's just like a jog. And I'm like, how close is that? That feels like that would be very easy. Why did he leave baseball? Did he age out or?

Speaker 1:
[66:06] I think he wasn't that great. And he even, I think, says to Keith, like, I didn't have a superstar career in the NBA.

Speaker 2:
[66:14] MLB.

Speaker 1:
[66:15] MLB.

Speaker 2:
[66:18] Your dad's gonna be mad.

Speaker 1:
[66:19] I just got my MBA in forgetting what sports are called. Got my master's and my business degree. And I'm gonna have an MD at the end of my name. I'm gonna have an MLB at the end of my name, because I know so much about sports.

Speaker 2:
[66:36] But don't you think that normally in a case like this, they would be going much more heavily after Erin, because she was the one that stood to inherit. It wasn't going to be directly. It was going to be to Erin and the children, not specifically to Dan, if there was an inheritance.

Speaker 1:
[66:52] He's the one who did it. We know it was a man that entered the house, and we know it wasn't her.

Speaker 2:
[66:58] Right, so it would only be conversations between the two of them. And honestly, the reason I think she's not involved is I think he would have flipped. If he could have saved himself a life sentence, I think he would have flipped on her and said this was her idea. And I'll help you get take her down. So I don't know if she was involved because I don't know. He doesn't seem like a stand up guy.

Speaker 1:
[67:19] No, that's true. I don't know if he would. Yeah, that's a good point.

Speaker 2:
[67:23] I think he would have flipped on her. So I went back and forth on it.

Speaker 1:
[67:26] That's a really good point.

Speaker 2:
[67:28] Just a quick title that I had. What about, I know we have hometown hero.

Speaker 1:
[67:34] That's a classic.

Speaker 2:
[67:35] Do we have home run hero?

Speaker 1:
[67:37] No, hometown hero is a phrase Dateline uses a lot. It's like pillar of the community.

Speaker 2:
[67:43] I was surprised we didn't get a home run hero in this. And so I preemptively did home run hell no. They worked on several levels because you said we can't say hell and Keith says hell in this episode. So that's it.

Speaker 1:
[68:00] I love it. Do you have any more?

Speaker 2:
[68:01] Yeah, also locking the gate. Because the gate and then also the prison gate and then his gate, his gate, the way he walked.

Speaker 1:
[68:11] Oh, his gate.

Speaker 2:
[68:12] Prison gate and the way he walked.

Speaker 1:
[68:14] Yeah, I got you.

Speaker 2:
[68:15] And then clang clang because it's prison time.

Speaker 1:
[68:18] Anything about meth?

Speaker 2:
[68:19] No, I came up with meth during this. No, I'm sure I'll have more, but the gold mining we're gonna need to, pardon the pun or don't pardon it, dig into that some more. I have a lot of questions about the mining and is that the work that takes him everywhere? So is he going to different, is he these people that is like sifting it in the trays with the water?

Speaker 1:
[68:41] No, he does the heavy equipment. That is on old timey mining that you're thinking of the gold rush. They use heavy equipment. They do sift once they dig. Yes, no, they still sift I think, but he does the heavy equipment, like the drilling. He'll probably sit on an excavator and do that sort of drilling.

Speaker 2:
[69:03] Didn't that happen? Okay, remember that Vegas episode that we had where it was a kind of, was he famous or he was wealthy?

Speaker 1:
[69:11] The rich guy who had the silver bars buried under the ground.

Speaker 2:
[69:15] Okay, thank you. That's where I kept getting confused.

Speaker 1:
[69:18] He had like an underground bunker where he had a bunch of silver bars.

Speaker 2:
[69:23] Yes. Did they ever find those?

Speaker 1:
[69:26] I don't know.

Speaker 2:
[69:27] I don't think they found them.

Speaker 1:
[69:28] I don't think they found them.

Speaker 2:
[69:30] There's buried treasure in Vegas, y'all.

Speaker 1:
[69:32] Go out to the desert. Nothing bad can happen.

Speaker 2:
[69:34] And apparently gold.

Speaker 1:
[69:36] There's gold in this them desert.

Speaker 2:
[69:38] It's so hot. Okay. I just... There's no AC at those trailers.

Speaker 1:
[69:42] No.

Speaker 2:
[69:43] I hope we show a lot of footage of the trailers so people understand what I'm talking about. It's not... And I'm not being mean about trailers. I'm saying this setup.

Speaker 1:
[69:52] It's literally on dirt piles trailers. And there's some, like, maybe cars that were at one point on fire.

Speaker 2:
[70:02] Yes.

Speaker 1:
[70:02] Right next to them.

Speaker 2:
[70:04] No one owns the land. The land is just there. It doesn't... It's interesting. It's a curious area.

Speaker 1:
[70:12] Yeah.

Speaker 2:
[70:12] Anyways, this case was great.

Speaker 1:
[70:15] It was great. Also great is our two listeners, Denise M and Jenna A, both from California. And they don't do math, I'm assuming.

Speaker 2:
[70:26] They don't do math or math? Math. Okay.

Speaker 1:
[70:28] Yeah. They might not do math either. Who does math nowadays?

Speaker 2:
[70:31] Who really does math?

Speaker 1:
[70:33] Yeah. Unless you're, like, a mathematician.

Speaker 2:
[70:35] No one really needs trigonometry. Don't come at me in the comments. Don't do it.

Speaker 1:
[70:40] We already pissed off the Marvel people. Now we're gonna piss off the mathematics people.

Speaker 2:
[70:45] I know. I don't want to mess up the math community too. I apologize.

Speaker 1:
[70:49] Denise and Jenna are smart enough to do math. They just choose not to because they have their phones.

Speaker 2:
[70:54] But they do listen to this podcast, which I don't know what that says, but it makes me say thank you.

Speaker 1:
[71:00] It means they're smart gals. They probably know about Marvel and knew that you were joking and did not leave us a mean comment.

Speaker 2:
[71:07] But do they know about gold mining in the Reno desert? And do they know common is clover? Have they heard that before? Or do they think that Keith was just doing a one-off analogy?

Speaker 1:
[71:21] Well, we could just Google it to find out.

Speaker 2:
[71:23] No, let's let them tell us.

Speaker 1:
[71:25] Okay, they'll tell us. But ladies, you are good as gold.

Speaker 2:
[71:29] Oh, you are.

Speaker 1:
[71:31] All that glitters is gold when it's Denise and Jenna and our listeners. Thank you so much. And if you want to support our show, check out our Patreon or our Supercast. If you want to support our show for free, there are so many ways you can do that. You can leave us a review on Apple Podcasts or Spotify saying something about Thanos. But say, love these ladies more than Thanos. I don't know. Five stars. And you can also follow us on Instagram at Date Dateline. And our YouTube channel, also free to subscribe to, is A Date With K&K. And we are posting full-length episodes with our faces. Be nice about our faces. Because what a time to be a lady with a face.

Speaker 2:
[72:20] What a time to have a face. Also, I did have one other title, but I think I've used it before. And it's all that glitters is meth. I feel like I've used it before. I think I've used it. So I didn't think I could use it here.

Speaker 1:
[72:35] By the way, this episode is for this jerk who keeps leaving comments on our Spotify about how it's not drugs, but Katie keeps guessing drugs. And when has it ever been drugs, Katie? First of all, she's joking. You obviously don't get a joke.

Speaker 2:
[72:53] Sometimes I'm joking. But no, it's sometimes, in what I see is that when things don't add up, there is a third something involved. And a lot of times that's drugs.

Speaker 1:
[73:06] And sometimes they just might not talk about it on the Dateline, but that doesn't mean that drugs aren't involved. And this episode, drugs were involved.

Speaker 2:
[73:13] This episode, we know.

Speaker 1:
[73:15] So boom, Donald, we got you.

Speaker 2:
[73:17] Donald?

Speaker 1:
[73:18] Donald.

Speaker 2:
[73:20] Sorry.

Speaker 1:
[73:23] Say it's drugs with that voice.

Speaker 2:
[73:26] No, I will not. Thank you, Donald, for your input. I appreciate it. But you're dead wrong. Sometimes it is. A lot of times it is. Yeah. Thanks everybody.

Speaker 1:
[73:38] Bye everybody.

Speaker 2:
[73:38] Take care of yourselves.

Speaker 1:
[73:40] Stay fresh, cheese bags. Bye.

Speaker 2:
[73:44] Be your own Mark Twain.

Speaker 1:
[73:46] Yes.

Speaker 2:
[73:47] I don't know what that means.

Speaker 1:
[73:48] Be your old gold mine.

Speaker 2:
[73:50] Yeah.

Speaker 1:
[73:51] Be mine, gold mine.

Speaker 2:
[73:53] Be mine, gold mine.

Speaker 1:
[73:55] Is that a song?

Speaker 2:
[73:57] It is now.