transcript

Speaker 1:
[00:21] Hello again, and welcome back to another episode of Not For Everyone, a podcast hosted by a hater and a lover, a podcast hosted by two scientists who are not scientists, never have been, never will be, a podcast hosted by me, Jess, and the love of my life, Caroline, and podcast that has a pretty big announcement today, which is that we are taking a break. We're taking a break. Caroline, just say it with me. We're taking a break.

Speaker 2:
[00:56] We're taking a break.

Speaker 1:
[01:00] We're taking a break, and we have things to say about it, and I'm just trying to think where to start. We have never taken a significant break. The podcast has been going for three and a half years or so, and we've taken, like, a week or two off for Christmas. We've alternated weeks by doing solo episodes so that one of us could have a break while the other one still worked. So we've been going hard at this for a while, and I think, you know, it's not our main thing. We both have full-time jobs, so that alone is, like, a lot of time, energy. I personally, I think it's been clear, have been talking about being burnt out for the last few months, and so that's one of the inputs into this. But I also think we have been realizing over the last few months that we're not having as much fun with it anymore. And that was, like, the whole point. That was, like, the whole reason to start it, especially since it's, like, a side hobby thing for us. Like, if we're not having fun with the hobby, then what, why? Why? And so the two of us talked about it over the last couple of weeks, and I think we were both feeling it and, like, afraid to be the one to say it. And Caroline sent me a voice memo. She's usually the first one to say the truth. And I was like, yeah, I relate to, I agree, we're aligned. I relate, like, I'm tired, I'm not having fun. And I wish I was, but I'm not. Yeah, and we could talk about more of the why, but let me just stop and see what you want to add so far.

Speaker 2:
[02:53] Yeah, I don't even know what to say. Been thinking so much about what to say in this episode. I would know we both have. We've been, like, talking about, like, how do we talk about this? And it feels, like, impossible that we will, like, capture it correctly or, like, be able to, like, properly do right by, like, the people who've supported us and, like, like, for many years and, like, been a really great part of this podcast and, like, do right by the parts that have been great and, like, do right by, like, your and my relationship to each other and also say things that are, like, honest here. And I also know that, like, whatever explanation we give in this episode for taking a break and, yeah, for context, we're thinking of, like, several months, like, maybe six months while we, like, take time to kind of, like, collect ourselves and realign or figure out, like, what we're doing here. I know that, like, whatever we say in this episode is, like, the reason will be taken as, like, the whole reason or the finite reason or, like, the, this is the set in stone reason and the reasons feel like it's been impossible thinking how to, like, what is correct to say here over the last couple of weeks because it just feels like I can't capture every aspect of it while also, like, expressing the gratitude I have for, like, the three and a half years of doing this together and of having, like, the audience that we have had and the support we have had while also, like, capturing the things that are, like, I'm struggling with. And in a way, I feel like, for me at least, the reason that it's, like, hard to hold my anxiety about trying to, like, caption the reason here in this episode is, like, why I need the pause. I felt, like, very a part of it. Part for me is that I think I felt, like, very unsure and very anxious for, like, years here about how, like, what is the proper way to show up. I think I've, like, struggled with that maybe longer, it sounds like, than Jess has. Probably, I would guess because I was already, like, had been, like, doing content longer before, and I already have, like, damage from doing it and, like, self-doubt and maybe self-doubt in a way, in a way almost sometimes that I think just that you don't have. Like, some, I think that maybe in a way you have, like, a sense of self that I, like, I'm very fragile. I'm very weak. And, and it's just been, like, many years of, like, in and out of, like, being unsure of, like, what is the right way to show up. And, and then, like, together as a team, Jess and I, I don't know if I should be talking to you or talking to the audience, but, like, you and I have gone through so many different, like, iterations and strategies of, like, what we think this podcast is for and what we think the content is for and, like, who we're trying to serve. Um, like, I feel like we're, like, trying to figure it out and we've tried a lot of different things, which may be interesting to share with listeners. I know we talked about sharing some of our thinking and where it landed us, but I think ultimately it's two things for me. Number one, I feel like I'm not sure what I should be doing on the podcast. I'm not sure who it should be serving or how I should be serving or what my purpose should be, and I do really believe in having clear purpose with content. Even listeners sometimes have commented like, you could do episodes about this or you could come on and do this. I think there's a lot of things we could do, but I personally just, I don't know, sometimes I think about when other people say like, oh, I really want to, kids sometimes are like, oh, I really want to have a YouTube channel, but what should I make it about? And I'm like, oh, don't. I personally don't believe that you should just make a YouTube channel because you want to have a YouTube channel. I think you should make a YouTube channel because there's something you want to say, or there's this thing you really love, or there are these people you really want to connect with. And I think that's how I feel about content generally. And I think I started here, we started here with a pretty clear idea of what we thought our purpose was, and then we've pivoted a few times, and I don't know anymore, and I don't feel certain who and how we should be serving. And then I think ultimately, I don't think that's a good way to make a podcast. I don't think it's just like, well, we could make a podcast. We can make a podcast about a lot of things, but I think I do want to have more clarity on purpose and mission. And I think if you don't have those things, then it does start getting disappointing for people, or messy for people, or messy for us. And I'm, yeah. And I think it's been affecting me. And I don't think I'm up to the challenge right now of being affected in the way that it's, yeah.

Speaker 1:
[08:57] I mean, I agree that it hasn't been affecting me in the same way for as long as you, but that has caught up to me in the last couple of months. And whatever it is about me, where I think I'm quicker to say like, yeah, I don't have to put myself through this. Like, I think you've talked about like, enduring to a fault, right? Like, that you've sometimes endured to a fault with different things that aren't making you feel good. And I think I have done that too, but I feel like I've, I've come to this place and I think a lot of it is like growth that I've actually had from the podcast and from our conversations. Like I, I'm like a, a different version of myself than when we started in a way that I'm really proud of.

Speaker 2:
[09:51] I agree.

Speaker 1:
[09:51] And for both of us, I really agree with that. I really agree. Like I think that we, I think everything we've talked about here has like shaped me for the better and learning from you has shaped me for the better. And anyway, I'm just at a point where like, I'm much more able to quickly say that something's not working and like kind of set a boundary for myself. And so as soon as you voiced like, I've been feeling this way for a while, I was like, maybe I haven't been feeling that for as long, but yeah, even the taste of it that I'm getting, like recently, I agree. And I don't, I'm not in a space right now to endure it, if I ever want to endure it. This battle of like, what is energizing for us to come and talk about with each other every single week and to feel like there's purpose in putting it out into the world. And also like the Venn diagram of that with what people are gonna like and respond to and want more of. And like, I feel like at the beginning, we had that a little more clear, or at least our purpose felt clear. And then the people who liked it came and stayed and it resonated for a while. But I also think a lot of that was like us sharing personally about ourselves. Like the audience didn't know me at all. So I had tons that I could share. And even for you, they knew you from YouTube, but there's so much more behind what you show in an edited YouTube video that you were like excited about or interested in, curious about sharing in a more open free form, like conversational forum with another person. And so for both of us, I think it was like, we are comfortable sharing about ourselves more than the average person, you know, like on a platform, that kind of intrigues us. And we feel like we have something to say from those experiences that we've had. And it'll be interesting to like see how each of us share some of those experiences and beliefs and opinions and values and how we differ and how we talk about that and navigate it together. And like, that was kind of, I think, the purpose at the beginning. And then you get to a point where it's like, okay, this has been working for a while, but like, I feel like I've said everything about my personal life that I am comfortable saying. And so then it's like, okay, well, what do we do? I still have like good advice and, you know, opinions that I think are interesting and worth talking about. And views on the world that I think are worth sharing. And so let's try to get more of that out there. Let's try to maybe like respond to listeners and give more advice based on our experience and based on what we know as unprofessional people who are just like kind of showing up as whole humans and hopefully friends, and let's like do it that way. And so for a while, we pivoted from like personal sharing to more like listener based, let's get hot take inputs, let's get what it does. Let's think about like, what are the deep dive episodes, like dating episode, career episode, family episode, like let's do it that way. And I think that worked for a while.

Speaker 2:
[13:27] I think also because like once, yeah, like I think we started sharing a lot personally, and then there just began to be natural places, I think in a healthy way that we, it didn't feel appropriate to share. Like when we started the podcast, I was dating, you know, I, it wasn't, I didn't have like one, one intimate relationship and a person to like protect. And even, you know, just in talking about dating, there were people who were affected. And I, I like learned pretty quickly, I shouldn't really be talking about dating. That was a big deal. And then, you know, there's things with family that I wanted to express and share, but then like they're also known. And at a certain point that didn't feel very appropriate or fair. And yeah, so then it felt like, okay, well, we know some of our most popular episodes have always been the ones like kind of giving more retrospective advice to like things we've already passed through phases, maybe breakups or starting your career or dating or things that were, it's kind of more in the rear view, so it doesn't feel as exposed and personal. And it seemed like people really value those. Those are always our biggest episodes. And so, yeah, we tried to lean into that for a while. That was our like explicit thinking with that. And go on.

Speaker 1:
[14:56] And I feel like we know that was like helpful additional context. And I think we both, Caroline more vocally and me in my own head, were like got annoyed with ourselves at some point after like a year of doing it that way.

Speaker 2:
[15:12] Of giving advice.

Speaker 1:
[15:13] Of giving advice. Like I'm sick of hearing myself drone on thinking I know what these people should do. And obviously we try to show up to it with awareness that we don't know shit, like humility about like, we're just talking and doing our best and sharing what was worked for us. And, but it just got to a point where it's like, oh, there's, there's, I don't know. I don't feel good giving advice every week. I don't like listening to myself do that. It's like, I'm annoyed with myself, even if other people, I think the audience was kind of liking it, but I didn't envision that as like how I would spend week after week on this podcast when we first started. It's like never been my intention to be an advice column. So I don't know if you have more to add about that.

Speaker 2:
[16:02] Oh, yeah. Giving advice trigger triggers my self-hatred so strongly. Like, I mean, I guess this is a ridiculous say, but like I all at once think that like on the topics we choose, we chose to give advice on. It's not all things. I don't think I have good advice on all things. We've skipped things that we're like, I don't know what to do with that. Or like I'm actively struggling with that thing. But for the areas that we've like felt confident enough to like share a perspective on, I actually feel like pretty confident about like your and my advice in those areas. That's why we chose those specific areas and not others. I think we have good advice and also, it triggers my self-hatred so hard to hear myself giving advice or like thinking I know anything about someone else's life or like telling them what to do. It's like ironically in my private life, like in my personal growth, I am one of the biggest things I'm working on is like not trying to influence other people's life, is not trying to tell people how to live or what to do or speak with judgment or like direction and like to like help people. If I do anything, it's like to help people navigate life on their own, not to be telling them what to do, unless they specifically ask, but it's like it's so at odds with. It makes me feel, it really makes me hate myself. It's a very, very weird feeling for me, but that feels hard and then it also feels so self-serious that I think we are both craving like, all right, we can't just be an advice podcast, even if people like that or value that to some degree, it does get very heavy, it's very self-serious, it can feel very self-important. It doesn't make me like myself. Maybe we can use listener write-ins more, it's like a jumping off point, a conversation starter, and we can like maybe talk about that, but we can spiral into tangents, we can talk about things that do come back to us and feel personal again and connected, but like maybe, yeah, take tangents off of that so it's not just advice, but it can be personal again. And I feel like that's like where we pivoted, that was like our third pivot maybe.

Speaker 1:
[18:28] And it felt risky. Like I think it felt for a little while more energizing to us of like, oh, okay, like we can touch on the advice stuff that's been resonating with the audience, but we can also veer off into like exploring stuff about ourselves or telling this other story and moving on from the conversation or whatever. And it felt like we could do both, like, okay, maybe this idea makes it so we can do both. We can do the advice that we have noticed that the audience likes a lot, and we can do more of the banter and self-exploration and self-sharing and whatever in like a guided way, like a more structured way.

Speaker 2:
[19:14] Yeah.

Speaker 1:
[19:14] But I think even then, I don't know, like it's very sensitive, like to bounce off of someone else's life experience, and a write-in that they've been vulnerable to share, like it's sensitive, and we don't, that tone is really hard to strike and get right to do both of those things. And so again, it felt like this isn't working. If we've tried all of these three different, you know, approaches, not to mention other approaches sprinkled in between of like just sillier episodes and hot takes and like talking about pop culture and doing things that are impersonal to anyone that are more just like, bippity bops. I don't think I could do that every single week. Like there's not always something to bippity bop about in pop culture that really gets me going like Taylor Frankie Paul, you know, which we've talked about like four times. So it just leaves me at least in a place where I'm like, I don't know where to go. And I don't think I can figure that out while doing it. Like, I think that's a big reason for wanting a long break. For me is, it's like I'm too close to it. And like we haven't stepped back. And plus everything else in life, I don't have a lot of space outside of the podcast to really think about the podcast. Like I'm doing work and I'm getting here like in between calls and I'm coming back. And so there's just not a lot of like creative space, like freedom and like time away from it to say like, oh, it might feel good to do this or we haven't tried this. Or actually even more than any of those tactical things. I want to return again to like, what's even the purpose to what you said originally, like before we get tactical about what the episodes should be and what's the format and is it advice or is it personal sharing or is it funny or is it something else? It's like, step back and think about what even is the goal. Because I think the goal has changed for both of us, but we don't quite know what it is. We just know it's not the same. There's goals for what we want to, there's like for me, there's two categories of goals. There's what we want to share and the space that we create on the podcast and the content. Then there's also the overarching, where do we even want this to go? Because at the beginning, I've been vocal and on my other podcast, Peaking, I've talked a lot about my dream at the beginning of this was, can we get it to a place where we've grown it and we can make a living off of it and I can leave my corporate job and do this thing that I love? And I don't know if I want that anymore and I've been realizing that over the last year or so. Like that was very clearly my personal dream outcome from this at the start. And I wouldn't have known if I wanted that or not, if I hadn't like tried and tested it and seen. So I'm so grateful to have had the opportunity to do this, to do it with you, to have an audience that's been stuck with us through all these different versions and like let us be ourselves at least most of the time. And also, like as we did that over the course of the three and a half years, I think at some point I started to realize like this is still, maybe there's still something here, but I don't actually know if I would want this to be my full time. And if I don't want it to be that, that's okay. But then what do I want it to be? And I haven't answered that question. And I don't have space to figure out the answer to that question. And that's part of what, in addition to like, what's the content, that's part of what I personally want to spend a lot of time figuring out is like, what's the overarching goal in terms of like my career aspirations or my like dream job, passion project, side hustle. But like, do I even want that anymore? Or is it something else? I don't know. And I've been kind of tossing that around in my head for at least the last, yeah, almost a year probably, like since last summer, I would say. I've been actively chewing on that question. And it's a hard question to answer because it involves letting go of what was once a dream. Even if it's right to let go of it. That's hard. So I can't do it while we're also showing up every week, tired and not sure what to do and kind of feeling like it's not as fun anymore. I can't figure it all out at the same time without a break.

Speaker 2:
[24:19] Is there more you feel comfortable saying about what changed for you that you're like, oh, I don't like the more you learned that you're like, oh, I don't know if I want this to be something I quit my job for and do full time. Maybe, I don't know if there's more you can say publicly.

Speaker 1:
[24:35] I think I've said it a little bit, but it's worth exploring, which is like, the way that you talked about how this has been hard for you for much longer than it has been for me. And a lot of that to do with the fact that your whole career is YouTube and is on the internet and is involved with like getting outside feedback and having to like tailor how you show up accordingly and it triggers your self-hatred. And I mean, you're amazingly talented at what you do. So I hope that never is a reason for you to stop. Like, I want to always be a person that's there to help you keep going and push through those moments because of how much I think what you do is so special. But at the same time, when I think about myself, like putting myself in that type of setup, or rather when I think about why you perceive me to be a little bit more like self-assured in this way, or like, you know, just like the sense of self that you perceive in me in this way, I think a lot of it does have to do with the fact that I have something totally separate from this going on, where if this doesn't work, I don't have the threat of the other thing not working because it's a corporate nine to five job where I make a paycheck and like they don't care. They don't care. They don't see the comments on my podcast. They don't know if it's successful or not. It's not relevant. And I think that having that as like an anchor is actually helpful in keeping me true to myself here. Which then begs the question of like, okay, if that's helpful for me, like, what then what am I doing here? Because initially what I was doing here was pursuing a different career path.

Speaker 2:
[26:52] Yeah.

Speaker 1:
[26:53] Yeah.

Speaker 2:
[26:54] Yeah, that makes sense.

Speaker 1:
[26:55] And so yeah, it's like, I don't have to be pursuing a different career path here. It could be a hobby. It could be a passion project. There's lots of configurations. I could leave my 9-to-5 corporate job and do more freelance, self-employed work, and then also do something like this. And I don't know how I feel about that, but that's a possibility. There's just a lot of ways I could set it up. But I do feel like I need for me to have a different thing, which you have a different thing, but it's so closely intertwined that it's the same thing. It's a different thing and it's the same thing. And I think that's just what I've connected the dots on recently, is like, I don't think I could... I think the self-assuredness that you see in me, I think I would crumble just the same if my setup was different, you know? I don't think that's a flaw in you. I think that's the environment.

Speaker 2:
[27:59] Could be a combo. Could be both. Or that. But, it's funny, yeah, I feel like even though we both have different jobs that support us outside this podcast, I think my reasons feel kind of similar. In a way, when I... To me, when we were starting the podcast, I think my original goals were a few. I was like, one, I wanted to have another... I wanted to add in a different work project or work energy with someone else. I didn't want to do anything else alone. I'm just alone all the time talking to a fucking camera. And I was like, I did not want to do a podcast alone or anything alone. I wanted to do it with someone who gives me energy. That's my princess, Jess. I wanted... And secondly, I wanted a place where I could feel less edited, less restricted than I do on my YouTube main channel. Where I could just kind of be more free-flowing. And thirdly, I thought it would be a good business idea to have a backup business, kind of. As like, well, YouTube will probably come to an end eventually. Might as well start building this other thing. Can kind of build them in tandem and maybe eventually the podcast will be the main thing. And I think now, three and a half years later, we know it's a really hard business. Like, we don't really make money from this business. I think it's better to think of it as a hobby. It's not really, it's not going to be something that replaces or like even break, like usually breaks even. And I, it has become, I think largely through my own fault, like a place where I actually feel more restricted than I do on my main channel. I feel more unsure of how to show up and I feel more like I'm struggling personally. And in my head, I think a lot more. So those are both gone. And then the one thing that has remained is that like, like I said to you, the hardest part of leading the podcast is like you, like you of those three things have been the thing that delivered. And that has been really special. And like our relationship has like, like I know we both like change as individuals and like our like friendship is like, it's been so special and unique, not only has it deepened, but it's like different than like anything I've done with anybody. And been like challenging in ways that like we push through together and like has been like really beautiful. And you've been obviously, you're like the best business partner I could think of. So like of those three things I went into, one one remains.

Speaker 1:
[31:03] But that's what I'll miss the most.

Speaker 2:
[31:06] Yeah, that's the part that makes me sad. Yeah. And scared.

Speaker 1:
[31:09] It's like obviously our friendship still exists. And like, I want to always invest in that. But it's really rare to have like a built in, hour long session with one of your friends every week. And so like, just the thought of like, we're not going to talk like that every week, especially when I think about the earlier days of the podcast, when we were sharing a lot more personally. And like, we were getting to know each other as adults, because we have a history, we have a lot of trust just from like, how long we've known each other. But we didn't know a lot about each other as adults and our adult lives. And like, that, I feel like we built such a foundation of, like, you really know me in a way that no one else does. And I think part of that too is navigating the behind the scenes harder things we've had to deal with, or like, navigating, trying to have a business together and like, strategy. And like, it's such a layered type of relationship that I don't have with anyone else, and I can't imagine having.

Speaker 2:
[32:29] I couldn't even explain to somebody else. I couldn't even like to explain all the, like what it's been like to figure it out together.

Speaker 1:
[32:37] Yeah, it's like really the biggest gift and the biggest thing I'll miss. And I hope that we find a way to do it again or do it more, but yeah, I just wanted to echo that. Like, I can't describe what our relationship is to me other than it's like one of one, you know?

Speaker 2:
[33:04] Yeah. I agree. I think the part that made me like... Well, I did say this to you. I'll say on the podcast, something I realized in recent months is like my favorite parts of our conversation each week are before we press record. Because usually we sit down, we get on here, we get on Zoom together and we like say all the things that are on our mind, private things, messy things, ugly things, things that involve other people, that things that can't be aired, everything that's live and raw. And like, that's my favorite part of the conversation. And then we say, okay, enough of that, are you ready to hit record? And then we start the conversation that can be aired. And so on one hand, I'm like, I have that same fear of like, it's nice to have something on the calendar each week. And I think we're gonna have to work to like, make sure we keep it up. And also, I don't even know how to say it, but like, it feels like it's harder to have it on the podcast. And my hesitation around saying that is because I'm all at once trying to like, give listeners, the listeners who like, care and have been supportive, I'm like trying, I know we're both trying to like, give them a satisfactory like, understanding of like, why this is pausing right now, without, while also like, being grateful to them for the support they've given and like, they've done, no one's done anything wrong.

Speaker 1:
[34:39] Yeah.

Speaker 2:
[34:40] When I say like, it's hard to know how to show up on the podcast or it's hard for us to like, have our connection on the podcast after we have record, after we hit record, I think it's just, we're struggling with the reality of like, the internet and the reality of like, doing this bizarre thing that is like, sharing your thoughts, sharing your private thoughts. Like it's a weird thing to do. Yeah. So I'm like, it feels hard to know like.

Speaker 1:
[35:10] It feels hard to know the lines.

Speaker 2:
[35:12] Yes. And that's the whole thing. That's the whole issue. That's the whole reason we're pausing is like, it feels hard to know like how to say the thing that is true while also being, I don't know.

Speaker 1:
[35:25] Well, I think the thing that has united us this whole time is that we feel really strongly about saying the truth, like that we value honesty.

Speaker 2:
[35:38] Yeah.

Speaker 1:
[35:38] And I think that was part of what we anchored around when we started the podcast. And then over time, it feels like there's less space for that. Or like we have gotten in our heads about like, how honest can I really be? Or how much should I really share? And even if there's no change, like even if it's imagined, which I don't think it is, but even if it is, just that feeling alone, like sits in the back of our brains while we record. Where we're not able to show up as authentically and honestly as we want to, as we value, like as we meant to, as maybe we did previously. I think we still, we do our best to push ourselves through that, but it's scary. And I think that's like one of the biggest things to figure out in returning to the podcast. I feel like we're talking about it like it's over. And I don't know what it is. Like it's a long pause and we need to figure out what is next. And I hope there's more. And I think we just can't even fathom like what that is. So many things about how we started have changed. And in this new landscape of like who we are now, how much we've already shared up to this point, how many more people are paying attention now, the scale that your channel has gotten to over this time. Like all of these different aspects of it just make it like the landscape is different now. And I don't know what there's space for at this moment. I hope there's space for something from us together, but I can't even figure out what that is. So like it is a pause. And we think about six months is right to take a good chunk of time away. But if on the other side of that, like if we don't figure it out, it could be longer, it could be it.

Speaker 2:
[37:57] Yeah, we're aiming to do a check-in in six months, I think is what we decide.

Speaker 1:
[38:00] Yeah. So I just want to be clear about what they should expect. And unfortunately, I can't be that clear about it because we don't even know.

Speaker 2:
[38:08] I know.

Speaker 1:
[38:09] But.

Speaker 2:
[38:10] I can't even tell if people care. I'm like, I feel, this is why once again, I feel so in my head. I'm like, at one point I was like, oh, some people might be really upset. Some people have supported us for so long and love the podcast and are so good to us. And then at some point during this conversation, I was like, they're probably thinking we're so dramatic. And they're probably thinking like, how can they be so, like, they're grieving this and lala. And it's like, even in doing this, I have, there's so many voices and they all contradict each other and both of them make me hate me. And I don't, it's like, I even in like trying to talk about it, I feel like very, I'm in a very bad place in my head.

Speaker 1:
[38:50] Yeah.

Speaker 2:
[38:51] Yeah. So.

Speaker 1:
[38:52] It's a box. It's a box and we don't know where the walls are.

Speaker 2:
[38:55] I don't know if anyone cares or if people care so much and they're gonna be mad. It's like, how can I have no idea? How can I not know?

Speaker 1:
[39:02] I don't really know either, but I will say this. I've talked about when my favorite podcast ended and like that was almost a year ago. No, it was probably over a year ago. I don't know. I still, I still miss it every day. And I still go back and listen to old episodes just for like comfort. And I don't want to be, have a big head and be like, people are gonna be obsessed with this podcast or people are obsessed with this podcast the same way I was obsessed with Nikki Glaser, a famous comedians podcast. But I get messages from people who really write the most, the most generous, kind, like appreciative, thoughtful notes to us. And whether that's five people or the whole audience or something in between, I'm talking to those people. Like I think those people are right here with us in terms of like the, the gravity of this, I guess. And yeah, I ran into, I texted you, I ran into a listener yesterday in Chicago and she was really sweet. She was like, I listened to your podcast, I just wanted to let you know. And I was like, I think I was weird. If you're out there, Rebecca, I think I was weird. I was like, I was like, we are recording this episode tomorrow about taking this break. And here I am meeting sweet Rebecca. And I don't know how to be, because she doesn't know yet. And I have this secret in my head. And I don't know the level of listener that she is.

Speaker 2:
[40:39] Yeah, yeah, yeah, that's a funny thing.

Speaker 1:
[40:40] You know, is she just being like, oh yeah, I just listened to it. Or is she being like, no, this means a lot to me and she's gonna be one of the ones that's really upset tomorrow. And she doesn't even know how upset she's gonna be. And I was like, I have to, thank you so much. Thank you, thank you.

Speaker 2:
[40:55] Thank you so much, I have to go.

Speaker 1:
[40:59] But that's part of this. And I think we need a break from that overthinking too. There's so many reasons why this came together. And we both were like, yes, this is the right decision. And I think we were really considered in how we approached it. And we've talked about it a lot. And it is the right decision, even though we cried. And even though we don't know what's next, like we know it's right at this time. And we appreciate you all for sticking with us and getting it now. And I hope to talk to you more soon. I don't know. Oh, I did want to do something else though.

Speaker 2:
[41:52] Okay.

Speaker 1:
[41:53] This is how I want to send us off.

Speaker 2:
[41:55] Okay.

Speaker 1:
[41:55] So picture, picture.

Speaker 2:
[41:59] Can I close my eyes?

Speaker 1:
[41:59] The episode of The Office, yeah.

Speaker 2:
[42:01] Okay.

Speaker 1:
[42:02] The episode of The Office in Season 2 or 3, when Michael is heartbroken about his breakup with Carol, she went to Sandals, Jamaica with somebody else or something. And he like, oh no, she went on a ski trip with somebody new and she like with her kids. And he Photoshopped himself into the photo because he was mourning their breakup. And somebody walked into his office while he was playing a song, 15 second clip of a song on repeat because he didn't want to buy the song on iTunes. So he was just playing this 15 seconds over and over again, and it's a song by James Blunt. And it goes, And then he plays it again, Touch My Heart and Touch My Soul.

Speaker 2:
[43:02] That's going to make me cry because you actually have an amazing James Blunt-esque voice.

Speaker 1:
[43:07] That's like one of my most thought of scenes from The Office ever. And when we were voice memo-ing about this decision, it just like came to my soul.

Speaker 2:
[43:17] That's what was playing. Yeah.

Speaker 1:
[43:18] And I wrote it down and I was like, this is what I'm going to sing to her. This is what I'm going to sing to her.

Speaker 2:
[43:24] Do a full verse without me interrupting.

Speaker 1:
[43:26] I don't know more than that because that's the 15 seconds that he plays.

Speaker 2:
[43:30] That's the whole song. That's the whole song.

Speaker 1:
[43:32] Goodbye My Lover. And Michael's kind of singing along to it very meekly and his eyes are watering. And I think Jim walks in. It's just, I think I'm going to watch that tonight. I recommend it to everyone. I'll put the episode of The Office that it is in the description.

Speaker 2:
[43:52] I'll call you tonight. We can watch some of it together.

Speaker 1:
[43:55] Cute. Let's do it. Okay. Love you.

Speaker 2:
[43:59] I love you. Good luck to us. We love you guys.