transcript

Speaker 1:
[00:00] Hey, Russillo listeners, you can find every episode on Apple Podcasts and Spotify. Prime members can listen ad free on Amazon Music. The Ryen Russillo Show is presented by DraftKings. All hoops for you today. I'll recap the three games last night. The biggest storylines, you got James Edwards, who covers the Knicks and the NBA in general for the Athletic and some Pistons thoughts from his years covering Cade, first entering the league. And we've got Anthony Slater on Denver and Minnesota, as Minnesota is even that series and the future of Steve Kerr. Will he still be the Warriors head coach next year? And that and life advice. The NBA playoffs are in full swing, and the intensity isn't letting up. And with DraftKings Sportsbook, an official sports betting partner of the NBA, your winnings get a boost every single day, all playoffs long. Bet player props, bet live, from the opening tip of the final possession, every bucket, every dime, every clutch takeover matters. And DraftKings Sportsbook keeps boosting you all the way through. All DraftKings customers can enjoy a profit boost every single day throughout the playoffs. Download the DraftKings Sportsbook app now. Use the code Ryan to claim your profit boost. That's code Ryan, R-Y-E-N to get a boost every day of the NBA playoffs. In partnership with DraftKings, the crowd is yours.

Speaker 2:
[01:28] Gambling problem? Call 1-800-GAMBLER or 1-800-MY-RESET. New York call 877-8HOPENY or text HOPENY. Connecticut call 888-789-7777 or visit ccpg.org. On behalf of Boothill Casino in Kansas, wager tax pass-through may apply in Illinois. 21 and over in most states, void in Ontario. Restrictions apply. One profit boost per customer per day. NBA playoffs bets only. Bet restrictions apply and vary when offered. Max bet and boost vary. Boost only applies to winnings and expires at the end of the last NBA game each day. See terms at sportsbook.draftkings.com/promos.

Speaker 1:
[02:00] We start today with reaction to the three playoff games that we had last night. A bunch of stories to tell, some great basketball, but the headline, don't worry, we'll get to Scoot Henderson here and we're going to build the Scoot. It's LeBron and the Lakers. He has been phenomenal. He's in complete control and game two, Kevin Durant comes back, you're like, all right, they'll probably split this one here. No. And LeBron was clearly the better player for a night in comparison to Durant. We'll get to Durant's night here, but the Lakers shooting continues to be ridiculous. Fifty-three percent from three in game one, forty-six percent in game two. I figured LeBron would score because the shots are going to be available. There's no Luka, there's no Reeves. He's going to get 20 shots up, so he'll have the points, but it's so much more than the points. You could even argue he didn't even shoot it necessarily great last night, starting with the free throw line a little bit, but he's getting to the line constantly. He had a play and this kind of like stood out to me and how Durant is struggling with any of this contact off the ball. But there was a play where J. Sean Tate comes in, he's a rabble rouser and he's going to like mess with LeBron coming off of the screen and it's a bit of an armbar. Granted, if somebody is getting physical with LeBron, he's going to show you this because he's likely going to get the call on top of everything else. LeBron just had this moment like, get your fucking hands off of me, man. And he's so much stronger than most of these dudes, too, where it was like, yeah, you're not going to do this to me. And he got clear of it. Durant should watch that clip, by the way. He had a play where Jabari comes out on him. Jabari is a big dude, pretty good defender. LeBron went right past him. Tara Eason gets a chance. He beasted Tara Eason. Something I've noticed with Tara Eason, with his length and defensive stuff and athleticism and all that, the slight of frame thing, there are a lot of plays that I've seen this year defensively. If you get him going backwards, like you can just go through him. And there was even another play towards the very end of the game. It's 97-92, 55 seconds left in the game. And LeBron was so smart in what he did. Tarri Easton's on him, passed the three-point line. We're at the top, right? So it's at the very top of the key. But Smart is on the left side, he's got the ball. And it's like, hey, we're gonna run some clock, right? And Easton relaxes, because he's like, oh, these guys are gonna relax. I'll just kind of like stand up, not get into a stance, not pay attention. Smart knows exactly what LeBron's gonna do. LeBron reads what Easton is doing. And LeBron just kind of like pretends he's gonna chill out and then cuts back door. And Smart leads him perfectly. LeBron makes the bucket. It's 99, 92, and the game is over. So you have LeBron out there. If you want to double him, no problem. You want to double Durant, problem. But he swings at the Rui, who's been really competitive in these two games. He and Smart, I mean, it's really what you're seeing here, at least in the first two games of this series, is that Marcus Smart and LeBron are smarter than every other player that Houston has out there. And you add in Kennard's scoring. So really, honestly, like, whatever I thought LeBron was capable of, he figured, okay, with the time off and the playoffs will matter and all these kinds of things, I just think he's been brilliant for two games here. What else do we have? So we gave you the numbers, the splits from three. Let's take a look at Luke Kennard's splits as well, while we're on the shooting numbers from this. Luke is now 65% from the floor, 73% from three in the first two games. Another number that I was looking at in Synergy this morning, the last four seconds of a shot clock, what's the efficiency of these two teams? Usually not a very efficient shot, right? Last four seconds of the shot clock. Anything normally over one point per shot is a nice number. So you'll look at teams in transition. Those numbers will be higher. There's all sorts of different ways you can sort it, where one point will look really good somewhere and then another time it's like not that great. You're never at one point in the last four second shots. So Houston on 14 attempts in game one, 0.5 points per shot. The Lakers on 13 attempts in game one, 1.6. That's a ridiculous number. Game two, Houston, 15 attempts. Last four seconds of the shot clock, 0.2 points per shot. Lakers on 21 attempts, 0.8. Game one, Houston was 38% from the floor. Game two, they were 24% from three. It was actually 21% through three quarters. So things got better, believe it or not. Shungun started three of 11. He closed six of nine, had a couple easy ones there late. Tarii Isen, more like Tarii Missen. He was two for nine. He misses everything. He was missing everything. And then I know he had a three and then another make there a little bit later. The KD off the ball stuff is bad. He can't get free. You just get into him and it's like, ah, it's gonna suck. He's got to work harder on getting away from this stuff. Now when he's doubled and he talked about it last night, I was reading his post game going, hey, they do something different where when they switch it, they stay with the two. Here's the thing. Like when I watched Houston in March, I was like, why are you having to bring the ball up dribbling right into a double team, 35 feet away from the hoop? Like, who's that helping? And then it's unfortunately, this Houston roster, you're surrounded like with a bunch of maybes, but the maybes are starting to become like, no, like we know Jabari can't dribble. He's a nice player. But if you're doubled and throwing it to him, eh, if you're doubled and throwing it to Tarii Isen, I don't know, if you're throwing it to a man, all right, but a man, you know, everybody's going to play him to go downhill. They're never going to respect his shot. So half of the options are kind of cut off. And then there was one play there, maybe two where Durant was facing a hard double and then he throws it to Shungun and Shungun's passing. And if he likes the matchup, especially if Aitin is part of the double team wherever the center is, then he should have a size advantage with his skills being able to score there. But that wasn't really working out because he was missing a lot of those shots. And then there was something in April that I noticed, especially as Reed had been playing more and more, is that it at least felt like Reed Shepard was some kind of outlet for Durant against these double teams. And I thought they were doing a much better job with getting Durant in a better position to start his offense as opposed to just going like, hey, here's the double team, buddy, deal with it. And, you know, it wasn't all just Durant bringing it up. It was probably less of the double teams, but he was double team the entire time. And it's like, you guys already went through this shit in March, and it looked like you kind of fixed it. But I guess Reed is done now. And I think he may is a terrific coach. But the lack of knowing what they want to do against these Durant double teams and having it completely clog them up. And, you know, again, this is on the players part of it's like, all right, Tari, you can make more shots. But Shungun could have gotten off to a better start. But there was a play in the second quarter. I knew it as soon as I had seen it. As soon as it happened, I was like, uh-oh. There's a play in the second quarter where Reed Shepard is assigned to Marcus Smart. And Reed fucks it up. And I know what he's trying to do, but it was still bad. Like he messed it up. He thought he was going to like switch the cut to the cutter off the ball. So he kind of like went back to the paint and then turned back around. And Smart is in the slot, 4-3. He hits it. And then I've seen this timeout all season long. I'm pissed off at Reed Shepard timeout where Imae calls timeout and Reed messed it up. But again, I could see what he was doing. And then it just looked bad because you're kind of like the little guy out there turning your head going, what the hell am I supposed to do? And then of course, the three point shot is made. Imae, the scolding timeout, looks at Reed. Who knows what he said. And then he was done with him. I mean, I know he played him a little bit in the third quarter, but Reed played 36 minutes in game one. He played 11 minutes last night. He played 14 seconds in the fourth quarter. So fine, you don't like his defense. Do you like the Aaron Holliday, ISO creators? Do you like the Jay Sean Tate shots? Do you like Tari Eason and Jabari not really be able to do anything with the ball? There's not four minutes in there through these double teams of like, hey, maybe we just give Reed the green light because tour with Kevin the entire time. So I'll be curious to see what happens there. I would hope, and I'm sure there are more than just the one defensive assignment thing with Reed for them to make that kind of decision. You know, I will defer to the guys that were coaching in the actual game. But as soon as I saw that and then that timeout, I'm like, okay, like we'll see how much more Reed Shepherd we get. We did not get to see much. So if you're a Reed Shepherd fan who bought a ticket to that game, you can't blame load management on that one. And you're left after two games just going like, wait, is LeBron actually like right now peak, like peak 41 year old version of LeBron better than Kevin Durant? Like this isn't supposed to happen. When Katie came back, they were supposed to fix it. Reeves and Luca are not playing in the series. And Houston is down 2-0. Boston, I hope some of you listen to me. Because the thing I talked about on Monday, on that, look, Philly's out manned here. It's gonna be really tough. No one's picking Philly. No one thinks they can win this series. But there is something I noticed in the drop coverage of the highball screen against the guards that seems to be kind of right there for you if you're Philadelphia. And I had mentioned that Maxey seemed like there was a play in the first game, in the second half, where it's like, okay, so when we set a highball screen with our center, their center, it's not come up with the screener and then drop, show and then drop, they don't even move. They just stay down there because you're so afraid of the speed of Maxey and Edgecombe, which I completely understand in Missoula. It worked. It worked in game one. So I can't tell if I should be more on Philly's case for not going, hey, do you realize this thing that is right there, wide open threes off a high ball screen for Maxey of all people? Like he can just dribble to whichever side he wants, and there's not going to be anyone contesting these threes. Or that Missoula stayed in it for the entire night until he didn't, which we'll get to. So it was there. It was there and Philly pulls this one out. VJ Max combined for 11 of 22 on threes. They did, after getting torched with this version of a defensive plan, again, they're probably like, well, look, it worked in game one. They didn't even do anything about it. It's like, OK, so what are we going to do? Sit here for two hours and watch it happen. Philly clearly figured it out and nothing is going to change. They did change it. They brought Cade up after it was like, hey, we have to do something different here. And the whole reason they're going with this defense is Cade came up. Max, he went right past him and missed the layup. Offensive rebound, everybody's scrambling. So another two points for Philadelphia. But this is a little weird because I was like, why did it take so long for Philly to figure it out? Why did it take bosses so long? So just like, if they loved it, then they wouldn't have trade it, change it to that one time. But their argument would be, well, yeah, good one, dickhead. We did change it. And then you already saw what happened. Maybe some variety would all, because we'll see what happens in game three. Are they going to do it again? Because you were just basically telling two terrific guards, Maxi, one of the best scores in the league. All you have to do is pick a side and your three is going to be wide open. So I don't know if that means Boston will try something or Tatum has to play against a big. You can get into some pre-switching stuff or it's like, well, let's not have, let's make sure the center stays back and we'll have a wing run with the screener and then stay into the play and figure out on some sort of switch to contest some of these shots. I imagine that that's something that's going to happen, but that was just too easy. It was too easy. So you can sit there and talk about Boston missing threes, which they did. When Boston misses this many threes, it's never like you go, wait, this team's good. It's going to be so weird. If they were to have a disappointing playoff, I don't think they're going to lose to Philadelphia, but they're going to have a disappointing playoff exit. Then you go, is this like a weird championship team? You get bounced by the Knicks and then, but this is all, we're letting the negativity, or at least I am the negativity of looking at this thing that I don't know. It's clearly a flaw with their combination of centers. Is it a fatal flaw? Fatal flaw in regards to like, can they get out of the East with something like this? Or is it just that, hey, we're playing like this because Maxey and Vijay are incredible, and they're so fast, you don't want to ask a center to do that, it's a complete waste of time. So, I don't know what the adjustment will be, but I imagine they're not just going to go, hey, for two hours and 15 minutes, you guys just get to take practice threes the entire time. And just shout out to Vijay Edgecombe, who started his career in Boston with 34 points in his first NBA game ever. I felt like even though the shot totals are there in the first half of the box score in game one, just didn't feel like he was much of a priority in that offense, and clearly he was a priority in game two. I mean, he is just reeks of confidence. Like he had one play that he made, and then he kind of they caught him on camera. He looked back at somebody and he winked like this dude is so comfortable out there, even as a rookie. And we're seeing a lot of this stuff from young players throughout college. Hoops and the NBA as well. One other thing with Boston in the offense again, 13 of 50 on 3, so 26%. So I just think if you're doing, hey, Boston shot variance, that's why they lost. I think there's a little bit more to it. And there are just a lot of possessions of Boston offensively, even though it's working. I mean, Jaylen went off last night, but starting from a stop, starting your offensive movement from a stop drives me fucking crazy. It's just easier to defend. Everybody gets to get ready, and you're holding the ball and you're stopped, and that's where you're starting all of your offensive decisions from. And Tatum and Brown are so incredibly gifted. They're so good that it kind of works. But I also think it just doesn't really stress the defense all that much. But whatever, whatever. We're even in the series. I almost never think anybody's going to sweep because I just think there's times where teams like, oh my God, we're so much better than these guys. You know, come back and play with that intensity. But I don't think you would expect Boston to just let Vijay and Maxey walk into that many wide open threes because it was there in game one and they took advantage of it in game two. Portland evens the series in San Antonio for two reasons. One is Wemba Nyama played 12 minutes left with what looked like a really bad fall. And in the concussion protocol, 8.57 in the second quarter, it was, that was rough. I mean, he was having a hard time getting up. He was kind of like even stumbling as he was trying to sit up a little bit. So hopefully there's a quicker turn around because Portland now has gone completely like full mode small guy on him. And it was Kamara. I think Denny even got him for possession, but I don't know if that was by design. And then there was a ton of Drew Holiday on him a little bit later. And on this specific play, when Wemba Nyama fell down, Drew was right up underneath them. And look, as much as I like Wemba Nyama, he scares the shit out of me because I think he falls down the entire game. And when you're younger and you fall down that much, like, okay, and you just bounce right back up. So we don't have to worry about it right now. But on that play where, and he had one, he had one in game one when he was like mad and it was really fun to see him be a little pissed off and just go, give me the ball, like I'm taking over here. And he got a little carried away and kind of fell down. But when he has this guy, which is, you know, he can be six, three, six, four, but this dude is like in Wemby's hip. And it can probably mess with him a little bit because it's just like, what's this thing underneath me? Most basketball players are like more torso to torso, even in a mismatch. And in this case, it feels like his entire torso is over a player who's getting down at a defensive stance. And so that leads to some of these collisions that he has. And once he's out of the game, and I actually, I think it took Portland maybe a little bit too long to be like, hey, Wemby and Yama is not in there. And Cornett's terrific as a backup, but it was like, hey, all right, now we have this thing that we are gonna be able to cook with here and it's attack. The other reason Portland won this game is the birth of Scoot Henderson. So, I don't have any kids, I think everybody knows that. So there's just certain young guys out there. I can't, I kind of joked that Curry will be the last guy I ever really care about. You know, I'd want him to win, and if he were to lose, I'd be upset about it. Curry will probably be the last, to be honest with you. I don't know at this stage of my life, like if Ant were to lose in the NBA finals, would I be bummed out for a day? That seems weird. But I've been bummed out about Scoot, for Scoot, because coming out of the draft, incredibly high on him, was very excited because I thought he had, as I like to say about some players every now and then some motherfucker in him. And one of my favorite things about Scoot was that, actually in that Wemba Nyama exhibition game, he seemed to be like the one dude was like, I don't care. I don't care about any of this stuff. Like I'm Scoot Henderson. And then he has a disastrous rookie year, statistically like some terrible stuff. Remember, we were talking to Jalen Suggs, who was just looked like he wasn't going to play in the league after his rookie year. We asked him about it and then even asked about Scoot. I'll admit, I even reached out to somebody I was like, hey, what's the story with our guy here? And I was told Scoot is going to be good. Don't worry about it. He's going to be really good. And I'm like, well, of course, you guys think he's going to be really good. Like you have to think he's going to be really good. And then the second year did get better and there were some ups and downs, but it definitely looked better. And then he gets hurt. And as Portland's starting to put some things together with this team, there wasn't even a time when like, all right, so they acquired Drew. Do I have to worry about Caleb Love taking my guy's minutes when Scoot's back from this leg injury that took forever? Well, Portland starts putting together a better season. Scoot doesn't come back until February 6th. He shoots 24% from three, under 40% overall. He had a bunch of double digit scoring games and that was terrific. But then something happened and in March and April, he kind of lit it up from a shooting standpoint. 41% from three, then 39%. And last night, he goes for 31 points. And he was, even on the broadcast, it was so great to hear Toreko and Reggie Miller, like, well, they've got to, Scoot's got to bail him out here. I'm like, they're talking about my guy. And like, Scoot has to solve the problem now. He was so good last night. And it wasn't just cause he made every single shot. He had a stretch of defensive plays early on where it looked a little bit like Jalen Suggs in game one against the Pistons. They're like, this dude is everywhere right now. Another part that I kind of glossed over here, but like when I was watching the Scoot stuff, what I loved is that he didn't have any assists last night. He had a score. Our guy had to get it done. He doesn't want to be like a 20 shot attempt guy. He wants to get the ball. And even if it's the outlet to him and so many of these young guards, especially with this kind of profile in the high school and the recruiting and like, oh, this guy could be like the number one pick, which is what the conversation was about Scoot. Normally those guys are not willing to give up the ball once they're getting the ball in transition. And he's always looking to get the ball up ahead. And he's playing off of Drew. And then sometimes he's on. He was torching some guys with some moves. Then he just started feeling himself so much that he was just floating. And he had his coming out party, which I hope is real because I'm also willing to admit that if he has a two for 12 here, I'm not going to be necessarily shocked. But it's been tough. It's been tough for Scoot believers because for those of you who do not live online, I'll tell you how it works real quick. You like a player in the draft. That player doesn't play well and everyone starts giving you shit while also now having a vested interest and rooting for the demise of this player that this podcaster who I don't even know seem to really like. And so that's what's been going on for three years. So even when Scoot was lighting it up in March and April, and I'm watching those games and that's that type of year, or I should say the time of year where you're like, how much of this is real? It's like being a realtor before the housing crisis, oh, six, it's like, is it you? Are you really good? Or is it all of the circumstances around you? And so I didn't really want to sit here and like, I thought Scoot looked better. We had Haberstrow on. I'm like, he looks bigger. He looks actually a little bit quicker. There's just something to him. I, you know what I love about Scoot? His hair tells me he only cares about ball. I love his hair. I don't know if that means anything to any of you, but it does to me. I look at that, that Dewey's got caught. I'm like, that just is a guy who wakes up and thinks ball. And when somebody asks him like, when did you know you had it? And he was like, when I woke up. So a big night for the Scoot believers and hopefully the start of many converts. You hear it all the time in sports. You get out what you put in. If you're eating right, training right and doing all the little things, you're gonna perform better. Everybody knows that. It's the exact same dynamic with your car. You might just pull up, fill up and go, not thinking about what you're actually putting into it, but it turns out it matters a lot. Shelby Power Nitro Plus is designed to help remove up to 100% of performance robbing deposits from your engine. So instead of your car working through all that buildup, it's actually able to perform the way it's supposed to on the road. And that's where you feel it. More power when you need it and more performance every time you drive. If you're putting better fuel in, you're going to get a better drive out of it. Shelby Power Nitro Plus premium gasoline, more power, more performance. In gasoline, direct injection engine fuel injectors with continuous use of Shelby Power Nitro Plus premium gasoline compared to lower octane fuels. Actual effects and benefits may vary according to vehicle type, driving conditions and driving style. See shell.us/more for more details. We'll spend some time in the East here with our guy James Edwards of The Athletic who covers the NBA. He's on the Knicks Hawks series. And he's also covered the Pistons in the past too as well. So it's good to see you, man. Thanks for doing this.

Speaker 3:
[25:39] Good to see you too. I'm honored to get the call to be on the show. First of all, long time fan. First time joiner. But I was telling your producer, I thought we had beef like seven years ago. Let me see if you remember this. It was either your show or you and Bill on a pod. And you just went apeshit on some Pistons reporter. Or somebody you thought was a Pistons reporter. It wasn't me? Okay. And everybody was hitting me up. I was like, is it you? I don't think I've ever said anything bad about Ryan. I've always enjoyed all the stuff he's done. But people were hitting me up. And they were like, is it you? I'm like, I don't think so. Then I was checking old tweets.

Speaker 1:
[26:24] No, I know immediately who you're talking about. I'm not going to say his name. He crossed a line in a way that was so ridiculous that I'll say something if I ever see him. How's that? Good for you. Yeah, because it was like, my dad was upset. So it was really aggressive. So don't worry, man. All right.

Speaker 3:
[26:50] I was always, it was a mystery in Pistons world for a long time.

Speaker 1:
[26:55] Yeah. We'll have to catch up on that. I hadn't thought about that forever. All right. Well, all right. Set the tone here early. I love it.

Speaker 3:
[27:04] You have a great memory.

Speaker 1:
[27:06] Well, that was an easy one to remember.

Speaker 3:
[27:08] It sounds like it was a little more harsh than I had actually thought it was. So I could understand why you remember.

Speaker 1:
[27:14] Yeah. It got to the point it had nothing to do with basketball, nothing. It wasn't like, hey, I like a player, you don't like a player. Let's fight. It was it was it was nasty, man. It was really nasty. So anyway, you move on, though. But yeah, that would say that doesn't happen that often. So it was an easy one to remember. Let's let's get into this series here, because I'll lay the framework of kind of like what I thought. And that is like, I think we like New York better because of the talent. Although we look at that Atlanta five going, man, they put up some really nice numbers once they brought in CJ. And I kind of love that CJ's have in these moments, too. Just a reminder, like, man, this guy is still so good. But so far, the bench part of it felt like that's just going to be this this thing that continues with Atlanta and New York developing, what I think is a deeper bench here this season with Mike Brown in. What do you think shifted in game two?

Speaker 3:
[28:12] There's a couple of things, but I'm going to go a little surface level here. I don't think anybody that's honest with themselves and watch this Knicks team for the past six months, was surprised by the result in game two. This is a team, and I've talked about it a ton. The highs have been very high. The lows have been very low. And there are just times when this team gets in its own way. Sometimes it's on the defensive end. They've been a good turnover team in totality throughout the regular season. But there were a lot of games late, maybe that last month, where you saw like 16 turnover game, 18 turnover game here and there. And then there's times when you just like they figure something out and then they go away from it. Whether that's involving Catlate or the two-man game with him and Brunson. There's just something about this team that when they show you something, they sink in and then a game or two later, it could be as quick as that. They make you just realize that this is a group that is super talented, but something just doesn't click. And in game two specifically, the fourth quarters have been egregious even in game one. But I just think defensively, the way that Atlanta played was awesome. They were showing and blitzing a little bit on Jalen, and Okongwu was dipping back right into the meeting, Josh Hart basically right at the free throw line, mucking up those drives. Cat, when he's not involved in the action, just standing in the dunker spot. And there was that play where Kaminga blocked Brunson, and Kaminga was on Cat at that time. It's like, well, Cat's just sitting there in the dunker spot. It's just making it easy as Jalen's trying to go left, and he just basically didn't move. The spacing was bad, and Kaminga is there for an easy block. So I think with Mike Brown, the one thing he really wanted to do with this team, and I agree with him, his ideology with it, is not always calling plays and playing a read and react feel offense. I do think that in most cases, and he comes from Golden State, where Kerr is obviously synonymous with that type of offense, I do think it makes you more unpredictable. With that said, you have to have the players with the know all to be able to execute something like that consistently, and I've wondered if the Knicks, I think they have a lot of very smart players on this team. I think there are some though that when you're asking them to do things based on feel, that it can get a little ugly. And I thought that's been some of the issues in the fourth quarter, specifically in game two.

Speaker 1:
[30:51] You did a really good job in kind of hammering in on the substitution patterns here, because it's something that I always look at. And then it'll be funny when the coach after the words says like, oh, that wasn't that big of an issue. It's like, yeah, except you never went back to that pattern the rest of the series. So clearly you didn't like the results. But let's let's talk about the start of that second quarter for the Knicks and then also the combined minutes there with Cat and Brunson off the floor at the same time.

Speaker 3:
[31:18] Yeah, it's it's it is something that Mike did the last two or three weeks of the regular season, maybe even four. Like I want to say that it felt like longer than people thought. I thought it was more like the last month or so of the regular season. And yes, there was some positive results there, but they played a lot of bad teams in that stretch. They had the seven game win streak in March against all tanking teams. And then you question like, okay, I understand why you're doing in the regular season. And I think Mike has done a tremendous job of giving guys opportunities, empowering a lot of players on the bench, like the reincarnation of Jordan Clarkson has been awesome. Working Deuce McBride back in from injury. Landry Shamit, for most of the year, was really good. There was some Mohammed Diwara stuff that was really intriguing. But you're like, okay, this is just regular season just trying to keep guys' minutes down and just trying to experiment. I was like, there's no way he does that in the playoffs. He did. In game one, on paper, it worked. I think they were a plus one in the minutes that Catten Brunson didn't play. Is that winning? Is that positive? Yes, right? But it's the playoffs. You want to minimize risk as much as possible. Then in game two, it just did not work. That was a lineup, I believe it was Shamit McBride, OG, Mitch, and Clarkson. That is just a lineup that doesn't have any natural ball handlers. Landry Shamit's a win. Deuce McBride, I know he's a little undersized. He's a win. OG, tremendous player. Ball handling and playmaking is not what we love OG and know before. Then Jordan Clarkson, they don't really use him as a ball handler. So you're playing this Atlanta team who's very intense defensively, especially on the ball, and you're out there with no ball handlers. It's not a surprise that it was a recipe for disaster. He had to immediately bring Jose in as a nine-point lead win away in four minutes and he hadn't played Jose. Basically, Jose had been on the rotation at the end of the regular season and in game one. So to me, there were some people I was having conversations with. They were like, they were only minus seven in those minutes. Well, think about it like this. They played non-Cat Brunson minutes for 11 minutes, basically a whole quarter. So if you make that in 48 minutes, that's minus 28, right? And what do you hear coaches say all the time to players? You have to value every possession. You have to, this is why you don't turn the ball over. Every possession matters. Well, I think we have to hold coaches accountable that every minute, every rotation, every logical thing with the game should matter. And I think you, like I said, you maximize the risk when you don't have one of your two best players out on the floor. And it was just a situation where the Knicks have, like that lineup has no ball handling. And the Hawks just really just got really aggressive on the ball. There was just nowhere that the Hawks, that the Knicks guards could go. And that lead went away very quick. And yes, they missed a lot of free throws. Yes, they had a lot of turnovers. But think if they were able to build on that nine point lead there, like we're not having this conversation either. And again, it's about minimizing risk, I think, as a coach in the playoffs.

Speaker 1:
[34:34] What was Brown's explanation for that timeout at 2.43 when they were in transition?

Speaker 3:
[34:39] Well, his explanation was he thought that they had several bad possessions in a row and they wanted to get a good one. And if I'm not mistaken, they didn't get a good one out of the timeout, but he felt like they needed to draw something up and get a good possession because the last few hadn't gone well.

Speaker 1:
[34:55] Yeah, that was, I had no issue with the no timeout at the end because I think sometimes you're doing with the defense a huge favor, letting them set their inbound defense and the number of teams that just end up burning a timeout just because they came out of a timeout and the other team was set up really well based on the other stuff. I need to do more positive like Atlanta stuff here because it's, like I said, that starting five put together a really nice run. When I was looking at the minutes stuff with lineups and I was touching on it, I think yesterday, I forget if it was Monday or Tuesday because we're going to have a lineup in every day, but it's a plus 20 which is kind of crazy in comparison to New York's five over the course of the season. The second most used line up in the NBA is like a plus two. So you're like, is there going to be anything there? Because sometimes those numbers tell you something and sometimes it's just like, oh, remember I thought that that was important and it was completely irrelevant, the entire thing, but I think late, they're going to look to attack Brunson. The irony of this series is that it looks like they all want to attack CJ as much as they can. But what I love about CJ is just rising the moment on the road, gets into it up with Alvarado, is feeling it from the crowd and if anything, I think that fuels somebody that's been around as long as he has. I know it's easy to forget some of his Portland runs, but this isn't a guy that's in the playoffs for the first time here either. I'm just curious what your observations were about Atlanta conference-wise and how they were able to respond and look to CJ who's out of that group. Granted, Nas had minutes as well, but out of that group to find a way to save them in these tough playoff possessions.

Speaker 3:
[36:35] Man, I think that people have referenced that dust up him and Jose had. To my knowledge, they're friends. They played together in New Orleans. But I feel like to me, it showed the rest of Atlanta, like CJ doing that, like we're not afraid to be here. And you mentioned like CJ in Portland. We all remember that. But there was some purgatory years from between then and now. And I think we just forget, one, when it comes to this whole villain arc thing, CJ's sarcasm and like the way, just his level, what he likes in his comedy is hilarious. Like when it, like the, the Jennifer stuff, just his kind of deadpan, like smart ass comedy. Like it's the perfect, it shows one, like he's not afraid too. It just shows kind of the stoicness he has. And we never, I've always thought this, but it's really coming to light now. When we talk about guys who have like some of the best handles in the NBA, CJ's name never comes up. CJ has some of the best handles and it's been that way for his in and outs, his has he's off the cross. Like there were a couple of times he had guys jumping in wrong directions late in that stretch, just because how nasty his handle is. Can get to the midi, great touch in the floater. That Atlanta team is young. I think we're really seeing it with Jalen Johnson. Josh Hart has just really kind of stripped his pride. It's taken a long time for Jalen to even get into the paint with the ball in the half court because of how physical Josh Hart has been with him. Nikhil has not been as good as he was at the end of the regular season. To be fair, the dude was shooting like 50% from three on eight attempts a game.

Speaker 1:
[38:09] Those shots are tougher for him. I feel like somebody is in his grill every single catch.

Speaker 3:
[38:14] Mikel has done a good job. Yeah. Yeah. Mikel has done a good job for all the kind of crap he's gotten. The Knicks defensively outside of those stretches in the fourth have been really good. It's just CJ, we forget, he is one of the premier scorers in this league. You could say what you want about the defense and then him and Dane together. That's why it didn't work. You can't have two guys who are that bad defensively. CJ has for a long time been an elite scorer in this league. He's had big moments. He's at a point in his career, and I think the Hawks in general where it's like, we have nothing to lose here. Nobody expects us to win this game. The Knicks aren't just playing with the pressure of like, we should win this. We're in New York at the Garden. We have to win this game. They fired their coach after making the Eastern Conference Finals last year. There's a world where this looks differently, and it's just the impact of, like, I don't think they're thinking about this in the middle of the game, but like going into the playoffs, if we lose, like, this guy that's been my teammate over here to the left, is he my teammate again? This is a different level of pressure that New York is facing. And then Atlanta's playing free, and CJ playing free is, I think, what we're seeing. And it's been really from a basketball perspective, from a basketball fan standpoint, what he's doing is, it's fun, man. He's a very fun player to watch play the game when he's cooking.

Speaker 1:
[39:34] Do you think Dyson Daniels getting put on the shelf here to close this game is something that we may see Quinn Snyder go to again?

Speaker 3:
[39:45] I think you have to try it again, right? Like, I'm not going to sit here and say, I believe Jonathan Kamenka is going to play like he did in game two again. We've seen Jonathan Kamenka have good performances, and then we've seen Jonathan Kamenka, the version that Steve Kerr didn't want to play.

Speaker 1:
[40:01] Yeah, the game one version. I killed him after game one, and he had 19 in his defense. I was like, oh, yeah. All right, here we go. I mean, 12 minutes. He gave him all 12 in the fourth.

Speaker 3:
[40:13] It was a tremendous performance by him. His physicalness with Kat. There were time people keep saying like, Kat, we got to get Kat involved. Well, there was a play where they were trying to get the post up for Kat late in the game. Kamenka basically fronted them, pushed them out to the Hawks' bench. Just nothing he could do with it. There was a play where Mike Brown is screaming for Kat to go set a screen on Jalen Brunson. It's like, again, I know that's not what you're asking right now, but there's just some stuff with the Knicks that's still confusing. But when it comes to Kamenka and Daniels, you have to give Kamenka another shot. Daniels loved the defense. Maybe you start games to try to just, I don't know, be aggressive and get steals and get easy points early. But if it's tight late, at least Kamenka has a little more wiggle, in the half court. I trust his three-point shot more than Daniels' is, even though I don't trust either one's. Daniels is strong, but Kamenka is a little bit bigger, and there's just more of a... Daniels is clinically good defensively. Kamenka can be just like a shit stir good defensively. That makes sense. Just kind of annoy you. First, if you're going to put them on cat, I think that's a good way to go. So certainly, I think it's something Quinn's going to try again. I think at the very least, you have to see how it goes.

Speaker 1:
[41:29] So the cat numbers in the fourth, and I'm with you, like sometimes you look at a game versus the box score and you're like, oh, they got away from this guy. It's like, well, the guy kind of took himself out of the game here a little bit. But the problem is when you're only taking two shots and we know this with bigs, then it means the rest of it suffers. And I'd say defensively, you know, he has not been the target that we traditionally expect with CAC because their preference is still to start with trying to attack Brunson, which is, you know, it's kind of like a lot of teams that go, okay, which one of these two defenders are we going to want to go at? So I don't know that that's shown up. But when they're doubling Brunson as hard as they are to close the game, which is not unexpected, you're not going to do it for an entire game. And I'll look at things in the fourth quarter. It's like, okay, this now, now we're playing. Now we know what they really want to do. Is there something to Cat either getting more involved or them being predetermined off of some of these doubles where they know it's like bringing Cat up from a different position where he's not an outlet based on desperation? He's he's the option.

Speaker 3:
[42:33] That's a great question. I think the easiest thing, easiest fix, I don't know if it's a fix. So the one thing I want to see that I think is easiest to do with the Knicks did in game two was because of Kong, they they went back. They had spent a lot of time of a Kong one cat, but late in that game, they put a Kong one heart coming on on cat. So they did a lot of spend a lot of time doing putting Josh Hart in the action where he's setting the screen so that Jalen can get a Kong Wu. And I thought, again, a Kong will did a great job of retreating as Nikhil got around or whoever was guarding him got around. Just because cats being guarded by a wing, which that's the book, right? Everybody knows that's what you do. I don't think that means you just you still can't put him in the action like either Jalen is going to go one on one with Kaminga, which let's see what happens or they're going to switch and cats going to be on Nikhil Alexander Walker. Let's see what happens. Cat is I think Nikhil is a great defender. He gets so low in his stance to that if cats trying to dribble from the three point line, that could be an issue. But like, let's find out. Like, I don't think just because a Kong Wu is guarding a part, that means you can't put cat in the action. And if you're not going to put cat in the action, I think you should at least use him as a floor spacer. We talk about that play where Kaminga had the block. It was because cats just standing in the dunker spot right outside the paint. Kaminga is right by the rim. So I think they need to fix some of the spacing stuff. And if you're not going to involve cat, at least make him put him in a spot where he's a threat. And listen, I think again, it's everybody's to blame for why there's games when cats not involved. There's should Mike Brown call more plays to get him involved? Sure. Like is the freelance stuff always the way to go? No. Is Jalen, can Jalen do a better job of hitting him in the pockets and being alert and finding him in those situations? Sure. Can cat do a better job of like knowing when to roll and when to pop? Because he struggles with that sometimes he gets caught in the middle. He also is like the self-proclaimed greatest big man, three point shooter and doesn't want to shoot threes. He'd rather pump, fake and drive. So when cat drives, there's the possibility of an offensive foul or a turnover or again, somebody who can defend him making life difficult and he doesn't get a foul. I just think it's a combination of all these things. There are times it looks good. There are times it looks bad. They just it's so weird because it's something that we've tried to put our finger on just covering this team all year. And it's just so random that you can't really you just whatever happens happens with this group when it comes to the cat and Brunson and Mike Brown calling play stuff.

Speaker 1:
[45:12] It's really weird. Are they in trouble?

Speaker 3:
[45:18] I don't trouble. That's a great question. Are they in trouble? I picked the Knicks in six and I did that because following this team all year round, covering them. You just knew there were going to be two blunders where the Knicks I didn't think it would be like they missed 10 free throws and have 14 turnovers and these weird substitution patterns. I thought they would lose like a three point variance game, which they still might in Atlanta. Role players shoot better at home than on the road. That's just like statistically proven. I'll say this. The Knicks have not played great for two games. The Hawks have not played great for two games. And Jalen Johnson has been a non-factor in the series is one to one. If there's a world where Jalen Johnson can find some rhythm, it's a crapshoot. That's why I said six. I don't want to say trouble. I think the Knicks are more talented and that will show out. I've been kind of unimpressed with the Hawks half court offense, and that's primarily because Nikhil hasn't been what we saw. Mikael has done good there. Josh has done tremendous on Jalen Johnson. It's like when CJ is out, the half court offense doesn't look great, and I think that could come back to bite them. I just can't imagine that the Knicks are going to continue to allow Jalen to be on an island by himself in the fourth quarters. So trouble, no, I think they win the series, but there's nothing that's changed my mind that thinks this is going to go less than six. So could that be trouble? I guess, yeah.

Speaker 1:
[46:46] Yeah, it's been good. It's been fun, and I'm with you on the Jalen Johnson. I thought he woke up a little bit with his aggressiveness, and there's some stuff there that you're like, okay, maybe for these guys that are going through it the first time, took VJ Edgecombe a game. He's been around as long as Jalen Johnson, but that's one of the things that I'll look for. It's like, hey, you can still be aggressive, man. I know this is all new to you and everything. Okay, who did you pick to win the East? What's the better prediction? Ask you before the season or before the playoff started? Because I know we all have ones that were... You're kind of like, I said this in October, but so give me your Pistons prediction timeline.

Speaker 3:
[47:27] My before the season was the Knicks. My playoff prediction was Boston.

Speaker 1:
[47:34] Okay. After game one. Go ahead, go ahead.

Speaker 3:
[47:39] I was going to just say Boston just continues to do the Boston thing. Last night was just the most...

Speaker 1:
[47:45] It really was.

Speaker 3:
[47:46] Being in the building for... It was basically the same thing. They didn't have as big a lead, but game one and game two against New York, it's like when this team doesn't hit threes, it's ugly. Tatum inside the arc, I just really question him. Like, is he able to score for himself when he has to put the ball down? It just doesn't always look great. Derek White just forgetting how to shoot. I still think Boston, but anybody in the East could win.

Speaker 1:
[48:11] It's so weird. It is, and that might be the lesson in all of this, because I think Cleveland, if you have a B level, Harden throughout all of this, which I know is assuming a lot, but that's the point, and I'm sure Toronto's outmatched here, but you look through this East, and I think even after a couple of games, I've got to have more of an open mind about what is possible here with maybe four different teams. So what was your reaction then to this Orlando team that we've been constantly frustrated on this podcast because we think they're so good, and yet they're a game from not even being in the playoffs, and then they get game one. So what kind of, I would say, what does that result like the impact on your thoughts?

Speaker 3:
[49:02] I don't think it's, I'm saying anything profound here, but I think people seeing it play out makes you wonder how this series could go. The Pistons punk a lot of teams. I think we all, as people who have watched Orlando, knew that Orlando may stink. They might miss every shot they take. They're not going to get physically punked. The fact that they played two good games going into the first round of the playoff, well, two games, like they got to get the rust off in high pressure situations, as the Pistons wait to find out who they play, one, and then a day and a half later, play Orlando, that's not the type of team that I would want to play when you have no, when you're still lacking in playoff experience like Detroit is and Orlando's ability to just be physical with them. And to me, that really showed itself. But yeah, the physicality that Orlando plays with, Detroit's not going to shy away from that. And I have thoughts on that series. There's some stuff I want to see Detroit do differently. Just as an observer, I think it would make life pretty easy for them. But yeah, I mean, Orlando has talented players. It's just, can they make shots? Can the offense look fluid? And again, it's, Paulo seems to rise in the playoffs too. I know we all give Paulo a lot of crap, but he's been pretty good in his few postseason experiences.

Speaker 1:
[50:27] We're defenders, although the regular season, it was tougher to defend.

Speaker 3:
[50:32] Who was?

Speaker 1:
[50:33] I mean, Orlando likely is due for an offensive performance that reminds you of why. You're like, oh, aren't they already looking for a new coach? Like, there's a really ugly... I'd ask you this, like, and I'm putting you on the spot because I know there's not another answer. I can't remember how many 60-win teams there have ever been that aren't sure of what the rotation is.

Speaker 3:
[50:53] Yeah, no, that's a that's a serious question, and it's... You can't play 11 guys in the playoffs. The whole thing with a SAR not closing, every... And I'm not the biggest advanced stats guy, but I factor it into all... I consider it strongly. All of the offensive numbers suggest that they're better when a SAR is on the floor. But yet, JB doesn't do it. And then, the other thing that's really weird to me, and I'm not around now and I haven't checked in on this, and I know Isaiah Stewart had a calf injury to end the year. But 19 minutes for him in game one is too low for me. Like, this is a guy that if he had got to the 65 game mark, and I had a vote and I know other people that he would have probably been on one of the all defensive teams this year. There was the plays at the end when he came in, where he forced a steal on Paolo, blocked Suggs at the rim. This is a very much like, I'm going to try to match up Isaiah Stewart with Paolo as much as I can. That is a guy that is built in a lab to stop a guy like that. Like 19 minutes for Isaiah Stewart is just too low. And especially when he has the ability to hit open three. If Durin starts game too well, I would like to see a significant amount of like Durin, Stewart, Harris, Cade, Assar or Cade, Duncan. Like I think defensively that line up can do a lot. And like I said, I think 19 minutes for Stewart in that series specifically is too low. He's the perfect guy to put on Paolo.

Speaker 1:
[52:29] He's perfect too in the sense that he's going to be so excited to fight with him. I think Paolo, when he's at his best, it's these reminders of like physically, there's just not many people like this. I'm not comparing him to LeBron, but it's a bit LeBron-y. I don't know why I just came up with that considering his son's name, but it's this downhill like, oh, there's nothing I can do. Even if Stewart hits him and fouls him 10 times and gets called for five, you wonder if Paolo would just get sick of it. Sometimes these guys just get sick. We saw it last night with Durant against the Lakers. He's like, ugh. There's just a different level of intensity that you have to have. And we can talk about the difference between the regular season and the playoffs, but sometimes it's as simple as just, are you going to work extra hard to get free? Because everything off the ball right now is legal. You can do whatever you want. And you can see certain players going like, oh, this is like, I have to actually fight back to get free. And it's like, yeah, you got to fight back. Now granted, Powell, it's not like they're running him off a bunch of curls and all that kind of stuff with some of these other guys. But I love that idea for Detroit. I think just the group that you mentioned, because of all that size and all that defense, you're just like, okay, does that mean everybody has a foot in the paint against Cade? No one like the spacing is terrible, which I think is what JB's been battling all year long and why they brought in a third order and why they're trying to figure out, is there any spacing group here to make it a little bit easier on Cade? And you're talking about another Orlando team that can probably match a lot of the positional size with Detroit that few other teams can't.

Speaker 3:
[54:15] Yeah. No, and I think that's a great point. That's the part where people had questions about Detroit is just the lack of rotations you can put out there where you have good shooting and still keep the identity that you have defensively. Like, yeah, you could throw out a Cade, Duncan Robinson, Herter, Tobias Harris, Durin lineup. But that's defensively not going to be what...

Speaker 1:
[54:36] You know he doesn't want to do it, right?

Speaker 3:
[54:38] Yeah, and he doesn't want to do it. And he shouldn't. They won 60 games. I understand people's concerns. And the playoffs are a different beast. But they found a way to win 60 games whenever, like, Cade doesn't have a running mate. Still won 60 games and he was MVP. Like, the thing that to me that they need to lean into is they were bad defensively in game one. That can't happen. And some of it was them, the players. Some of it was JB not having Asar on the floor. I just think, listen, the spacing is going to be what it is. That's the flaw with this team. They decided at the deadline that they weren't ready to make a huge move. They wanted to see what this team can do. And they'll probably address the roster, how it looks and all that stuff this summer. But even if, okay, you give Duren, let's see how Duren comes out in game two. If he doesn't have it again, you know what? Isaiah Stewart, Tobias Harris, Herter, Thompson, Cade or throw Duncan in there, you'll be okay. You'll be okay. I think you could put Tobias on Wendell Carter Jr. and you live with that. Then you put Isaiah on Paulo and you live with that. You put Asar on Franz or maybe you try, I don't know how much they try to asar on Paulo. Maybe that I'm trying to remember off the top of my head.

Speaker 1:
[55:58] I don't feel like I saw that a lot. I mean, it was primarily Harris, right?

Speaker 3:
[56:02] That's how I felt too, right? Maybe then you put Asar on Franz or Asar on Suggs and then put Cade on Franz. I just think that the Durin aspect is obviously a big thing. He had a tremendous year, all NBA. But there are still things defensively that you want from him that you don't always get. And when he has it, he has it. They need to decide early on if this is a game where Durin has it, and they have to immediately go to Isaiah Stewart if not, because Isaiah can handle obviously the physicality. He's one of the best rim protectors in basketball. He guards well in space. And I just think he gives you a little more optionality. So they're going to have to make tough calls early in that game unless, again, Orlando, like you said, forgets what offense looks like and dribbles a ball off their feet and build houses in downtown Detroit with their shots.

Speaker 1:
[56:56] It's going to happen. But it just, you know, the scary thing for a Detroit fan is just, hey, I thought this team sucked. And it's like, well, they don't. Like, this isn't a talent thing. This is not a talent thing. There's another world where these teams are supposed to be next to each other in the standings. But that has not worked out. Let me finish with this. Because you had covered Cade and in the beginning, there was a lot of like, hey, I thought this guy was good. And I remember defending it because I was like, all right, I can't believe he's not finishing at the rim at a higher efficiency level because of his size and his handle. Like, how can this guy not have that part of it? Well, that was solved. It took a little bit longer than people ever expected it was going to take. But can you share with us a better read on him? Because he's not super talkative. He is one of the stars of this league. When I did my top 10 thing, I don't know if there was one GM or head coach that didn't mention Cade. Maybe one of the 13 people that I had talked to. So this is somebody that's maybe at worst the 10th, 9th best player and then where he's going. But any insight to helping us understand more about what this guy is about?

Speaker 3:
[58:09] When people ask me about Cade and I say this about Jalen Brunson too, the best way to describe those two guys is you can tell they were raised right. Like the way that they treat people, the way that they talk to people, the peripheral people, just very down to earth normal human beings. And I think that's why people rally around these guys. Because there's a level of being able to connect with everybody in the room, everybody in the organization, and finding value in having relationships. And Cade came into a situation where it's very clear he's the man. And I don't think people know just how confident Cade is, but also so self aware. Like there's a story, I don't know if you remember this, but it basically took the Pistons until the day before the draft or the morning of the draft to decide that Cade was going to be the number one pick. There was a lot of love for Evan Mobley in that building. There was some love for Jalen Green. And I remember, I've heard a story about Cade when he went on his visit to Detroit. He's like, he asked them, he's like, why am I not the number one pick? And it's like, there's this level of confidence, but also him understanding that, and he appreciated that Detroit is doing its due diligence too. Because this is such a consequential moment in the franchise's career, or franchise's history, having this number one pick after years of being bad, he also understands, but he's also so confident that he's going to be the guy to turn it around. He didn't want to go to Houston. He's from Texas. He wanted the, he's told me many times, I wanted the responsibility that comes with being the number one pick. When he gets there to Detroit, I don't know if people remember this either, I think he missed his first 23s in his NBA career. I think he started 0 for 20. And you go and you talk to him and he's like, you know what, like, it's taken to me a little bit to get used to the NBA three-point line. Like it's a little bit more of a hike. Getting used to the physicality. He's like, but I'm going to figure it out. And then you go into the next year where he has the, he basically missed all of his second season with the shin thing. So now he's watching and he's observing. And the dude came back yoked. Like if people go look at photos from Cade's rookie year, he was really skinny. And I think that goes back to what you were saying about being able to finish now. Like his shoulders are much broader. I think he's even grown, like his brother's like 6'10, 6'9. I think Cade could grow another inch or two. But he came back from that leg thing, upper body, much more defined. And then the third year is the terrible year where the team has 14 wins. And just the honesty and the level of humility that he had during that. I remember there was this game during the 28-game losing streak in Toronto. And we're in the locker room. And this was-

Speaker 1:
[61:17] It's the best 28-game losing streak team I've ever seen, by the way.

Speaker 3:
[61:23] It's like 80% of that team is still- Well, not 80, 60% is still playing.

Speaker 1:
[61:27] If teams were playing them like it was game seven during the streak at the end because it was like, we don't want to be the team they beat.

Speaker 3:
[61:36] The infamous Kyle Kuzma tweet. Yeah, we don't want to be that team. And all right, so they're in Toronto. And again, I think this is just the best way to describe Cade's mentality as a player. They had spent the games leading up to that loss in Toronto saying, we're right there, like we're not a bad team. We're just got to like, we're young, we got to close this out. And they were bad that night in Toronto. I'm like, Cade, I asked him a question. I was like, Cade, you guys keep saying, like, you're right there. You're not a bad team. Like, but at what point are you a bad team? He's like, we're bad. He's like, just like plain and simple, we're bad. And we need to figure out how to not be bad. And I always appreciate that type of player and that type of person willing to just, like, call a spade a spade, because to me, they're not afraid of being in moments that make them look vulnerable. And I think because of that, that between him and Isaiah Stewart, the two guys who I think laid the foundation for this team we see today, I keep rambling, I was part of the reason Isaiah, people remember Isaiah Stewart was a reach at 16, undersized center, played a zone in college, couldn't shoot the three. One of the reasons that he was drafted was because the front office knew what was coming. They didn't know 28 game losing streak, but they knew they're going to be bad. They wanted to draft players who they thought could make it out of the end of this stronger. And some of those players could not, we're talking about Killian Hayes was obviously not a good pick. They traded Siddiq Bay. But that group and the mentality of those two guys specifically, I think is the reason you see Detroit is where it's at today. Just the humility to acknowledge that when things were bad, they were bad, but also not being okay with things being bad. And I think Cade just has a level of maturity, a level of humility that materializes into the court. Because the relationships, right? He's gonna make the right read. He's not selfish. He's gonna make the right read. He's gonna defend because Asar Thompson's defending, Isaiah Stewart's defending, Jalen Durin's defending. I just think that he just carries himself well as a person. And that stuff, to me, I'll always take those guys on the court. I don't know if I answered your question, or if that's what you were looking for, but just trying to get some insight into how the Pistons and Cade got here.

Speaker 1:
[64:05] We're pro-rambling on this podcast. We loved it, and we're now more educated.

Speaker 3:
[64:11] It made no sense.

Speaker 1:
[64:12] And look, I mean, I know the game won, you're the one seed, you lose at home, the history here and how frustrating it was, but there's a layer of positivity. It's like, oh yeah, but he's clearly the best player in this series. He was fantastic. If they ever, a little too early to do the rebuild for the Pistons when they're looking at trying to get out of the East, but if they ever had a real, not just a dude who scores points, but like a real dude who can score and create on his own with a little bit of size. And now I'm basically thinking of like four players in the league. But if there was ever like a real dude next to him, because they've tried it with Schroeder, they've tried it with Laverte. I don't even know if Laverte counts in this. Jenkins is honestly like kind of that guy in that Schroeder role in the past. And it's just, and he's been an awesome story, but however this season ends for the Pistons, clearly that's something where they would start looking around going, you know, do we do a four draft pick thing for a Bane type guy? And just say, screw it, because we're gonna be good. Because Cade is so good, we're gonna be good here for a little while. So maybe we're trading four picks in a swap that are gonna be in the 20s and the swap doesn't even happen. Yeah.

Speaker 3:
[65:23] I think they're at that point too. And they have to decide.

Speaker 1:
[65:26] I don't want to do that right now when they're down one game. Yeah. What do they need to do this summer? Yeah. But look, keep up the great work. I can't believe we never had you on before. This was awesome and we'll have you on again. So thanks, James.

Speaker 3:
[65:40] Hey man, long time fan again. Appreciate you having me in anytime.

Speaker 1:
[65:45] Tasty Trade has a suite of probability tools so you can make smarter picks for your portfolio and manage your money the way you want. You can trade stocks, options, futures and more all in one platform. Tasty Trade offers low commissions, including a $10 cap per leg on option trades so you can keep more of what you earn. The platform is packed with trading features like back testing, which lets you simulate your trading strategies using 10 plus years of data so you can test your ideas about potential Cinderella stocks. Active traders can use features like ladder trading mode, one-click trading and smart order tracking to manage their positions during crunch time. Get live stellar support from Tasty Trade's deep bench of experience trade desk reps during trading hours. You can search for relevant symbols that align with your investment interests and broaden your understanding of the market using AI powered search. You can earn a double commission rebate on your stock and ETF option trades up to $3,000 total for your first 30 days when you join Tasty Trade today. Visit tastytrade.com/barstooltoday to learn more. He is from ESPN now. He is Anthony Slater. He is covering the Nuggets and the Timberwolves. He also covered the Warriors for the Athletic Forever. So we'll get into the Steve Kerr stuff as well. But let's start in this series. I love this series. And I'll tell you, I don't know, 12, 14 minutes in the game too. I'm like, all right, this is this is not going to be a series. Like, why don't we take Minnesota seriously? I have my thoughts. I already shared them with with the audience here. What do you think changed so dramatically for them to come back from down 19 and then even the series?

Speaker 4:
[67:26] It's funny you say that because like, you know, and I know we're going to get to the other story I'm kind of covering at the time, which is like, you know, the Steve Kerr, will he, won't he? And, you know, the words are going to hold a press conference at some point in the next 10 days. Either he's coming back or he's not. And I'm sitting there in game too, like, oh, OK, I might have some time here. I might have a real buffer between rounds one and two, because, yeah, what were they up 19? Like you said, early second quarter. They even start the second quarter with Yogic on the bench on a five run. And it was like, oh, man, this is this is an avalanche right now. And then I believe it was 11. Oh, wolves right after that series flips. What changed? I mean, according to Jayden McDaniels, they just could score at any time they wanted against that Denver defense. Right. And we could maybe get to that quote.

Speaker 1:
[68:07] It wasn't necessarily wrong, man, in that game two stuff.

Speaker 4:
[68:11] It's what's interesting, but, man, you don't usually hear that after game two, which again, I think is why everybody, you know, there's more and more interest on this series because these teams, you know, I think it's coming to the surface. There's a there's a distaste between both sides. The coaches the other day, pregame, were kind of having a little bit of back and forth. But, you know, I think Edwards, I didn't know where it was going with him in the first quarter. He had like a move. He was kind of coming down a transition. It was a very small move. He grabs at his knee and, you know, you hear this, he's dealing with the runner's knee type issue that Steph dealt with, but, you know, it's not as severe. He's obviously way younger. But I just didn't know where his series was going. Then I thought he showed a lot of burst. He has a couple blocks in that game that were like leaping transition blocks. Obviously he scores 30. Go bear on Jokic down the stretch. Like, you know, Jokic went one of eight against him, including, I think, three stops in the final, like five minutes or so. In Minnesota, I just thought that was a really impressive response from Minnesota more than, like, you know, Denver, you know, letting go of the rope. Murray looked gassed, I thought, in the second half. I don't know what you saw.

Speaker 1:
[69:15] Murray did look gassed, I would agree. I think Gordon has stretches where he looks exhausted because of how hard he plays. And again, it's not like, you know, sometimes you're like, are you at full conditioning when you've had time off, or should you be better conditioned because you're not coming out of 70 plus games in six months? And sometimes I think those guys look a little bit fresher in the playoffs. I mean, you know, a whole Denver thing, but it's like, well, when they're at home, we're not thinking about them looking gassed, but it can certainly happen. There was a Gordon three on the left side in the second half where I was like, that's a tired person's three. Like he, I think he had Jaden on him, and you'd think he'd probably want to go like baseline and see if he can ride him back inside and finish. And I'm like, whenever you're tired and you're playing basketball, like you can just tell when somebody goes, I'm just so tired. I think I'll just take a three here. The Jokic stuff, there's two parts of it. I went back and looked at all the shot attempts, and I think some are misses, and I also think it's been Rudy. And I think Rudy was terrific against him just fighting, fighting before the catch. And once there's a catch, reaching and being disruptive. So all of the Rudy grades for him on Gobert, or excuse me, Rudy Gobert's numbers defensively against Jokic are terrific. I do think there's some Jokic misses, but then again, I'm like, hey, are these misses? Because it's also Rudy, because then Jokic had a drive late in game two, where you would have thought he would just go up with it. And then he just kind of threw it into a bit of a crowd. And there's been some turnover issues late with Jokic that again, for the world's best player, probably, you know, I'm going, all right, you know, you're going to have these all the time, even though he has the ball all the time. I'd expect him to have more of these makes. But this Rudy stuff for two games against him has been terrific.

Speaker 4:
[71:01] When I thought Jokic would look forward to this one on one matchup, even like the dunk he had late, which was really impressive. It almost was like Jokic usually I don't think would dunk that if he had if if he was like, this guy's not going to get to my shot. It almost felt like he had to sneak dunk it because he knew Gobert was there. It was almost like I know we got Gobert got dunked on, but I was like almost impressed that Jokic felt he had to go dunk. And then, you know, going back to the Gordon stuff, I mean, he's had these repetitive hamstring strains. And the other thing I just wonder is like, you know, how is he concerned about that? Right. What is it now? Three in the last couple of years. Obviously, it derailed his playoffs. And then you look at Peyton Watson, who I think you might see at some point in the series could that could end up being a monster X factor in the series. But their two best defensive wings, I just, you know, have had these repetitive hamstring injuries that I think, you know, when we retell Denver's story, if they if they don't go as far as they want here, I think that may be the thing that derails them. Because again, back to the McDaniels point, if they don't have those two out there disrupting things, they really are kind of a bad defensive team.

Speaker 1:
[72:04] I can't believe Jayden said it after game two, because it was like, why do you need? Why do you? I mean, thank you. But I can't imagine Finch and Mike and Norrie are like, awesome, man. Great. Because now they're just going to, the human natures are going to come out and be a little bit more focused.

Speaker 4:
[72:22] Oh, yeah. Yeah. No, I expect them to be flying around in game three. But yeah, to your point, I think the one thing about McDaniels and really the Wolves, which covering the series on both sides, they are media friendly in Minnesota and the star says really whatever he wants. He had an incredible press conference the other day. I think that filters down to the locker room where McDaniels just feels like he can say it.

Speaker 1:
[72:44] I want to stay on the Jokic part of this defense here. Because I would say five years ago when you're like, hey, you realize how special this Jokic player is? Then you would see some playoff stuff. I would even go back to the sons and four guy series, where you're like Chris Paul is just going to bring Jokic up, they're going to attack him. This is so bad defensively. I don't know that I can take this team seriously. And then boom, two years later, they're winning an NBA championship. And you basically with this great offense, you just need passable grades on defense, but they were not a passable grade this year defensively. And this is where that late season stuff, where you can look at and sort these numbers from, hey, look at this team, they figured all this stuff out. It's like, did they or did they just play a bunch of shitty teams? And granted, they beat San Antonio, they beat him twice. So it's not necessarily the same, but I'm wondering if there's any part of this from the Minnesota side that is like thrilled. They don't like that Jadon said it, but it's like, this is our point. If we put Jokic and more of this stuff, if Murray is the point of attack, I mean, Brunson and Cat catch all this shit because they don't have a ring. Is it actually worse with Murray and Jokic?

Speaker 4:
[73:58] Yeah, you know, clearly Minnesota feels a level of confidence against this team. Obviously two years ago, a slightly different Minnesota team, but they beat Denver in the playoffs. You know, Jokic is so smart defensively and he does have good hands. And I do think at times he can be disruptive in his own way. But yeah, like the targeted action and again, the lack of what I think is 100 percent full throttle Aaron Gordon, they don't have a ton of like protectors out there either, guys that are going to like scram switch out of it or whatever. So I think that part of the problem is, again, I just don't think they have some defensive ecosystem built around them either.

Speaker 1:
[74:41] Yeah, positionally, I think they always get away with like being smart. Like they could just go, we're okay, fine. Like there's not going to be the rim protection with Jokic, like there's going to be with other guys. But if you're always positioned in the right way, but it got really ugly, man. It got really ugly because it felt like Minnesota is going, we can't ever settle. Every dribble handoff was like, let's make sure Jokic is meeting us at the handoff. If we're doing this on this side, let's start with Murray and try to get Jokic and Murray isolated on the same side. So there, there may have been something there was, you know, and it's kind of like the Philly Boston series. You're like, there might be something here for you in Philadelphia. It's like, oh, I guess these threes are just going to be wide open. Maybe that's what it took Minnesota. It took them to play five bad quarters to wake up and go, we're going to have to change something here. And I think it also gets into the ant conversation because three minutes. I mean, when his knee buckles and he's grabbing, he's grimacing, I'm like, okay, so you were there, where is this guy health-wise? Because it didn't seem like it was a concern at all when I was wondering if he was going to finish the game early.

Speaker 4:
[75:44] Yeah, I mean, I'm on press row when you mentioned he's dribbling up in transition. And I think Yoko took a stab at the ball, and it was a very simple move, and then suddenly it's like, ooh, and like all the pressure, I was like, uh-oh, you know, it's like, uh-oh, did this series just really end, right? Before the first to the rim layups that are like, unlike anybody in the league. So he can clearly, I think the issue kind of turns on and off. It's one of those things. I think he feels fine through a majority of the game, but suddenly one movement will just shoot some pain. And obviously he's dealt with some swelling. Again, I view this through the lens of the Curry stuff I dealt with the last three months, which was this issue that popped up that where every time he worked out and if he felt some pain, he would swell the next day and there would be a ton of management. And again, having talked to Minnesota, they organizationally compare it a little bit to that situation, say it's a lessened version of it. But the thing I also hear from them is Edwards has never dealt with an injury in his life, a real injury. And this has been the first time he missed 11 of the last 14 games. He's not awarded, like you could tell how bad an issue is it, because he didn't push through it late in the season just to be award eligible. He really needed to rest that thing. And so they just say part of what he's dealing with is mental too, because he's just, he has the type of body and non-injury history where just even dealing with what, at this point, is like relatively minor thing. It's not structural, but it is bothering him, because I just think he's always felt so good physically, and he doesn't quite feel 100% right now. Even post-game, he's limping a little bit to the podium post-game, but it is clear he's going to play through it in the series, and we'll just see how much it impacts him.

Speaker 1:
[77:29] Watson coming back will be huge, though, and I look for that update every single day, because it just, I mean, whether it's just this series, but if you start mapping it out and have hopes for Denver going deep in the West, just Christian Brown assigned to everybody's best perimeter player is asking a lot of him, because it can't be Murray, it can't be Cam Johnson, Spencer Jones is better against bigger guys. I think Bruce Brown has a target on him now. Even if you're proud of his competitiveness, a hard away isn't exactly gonna lock anybody up out there. And so Brown just has all these minutes chasing all these different guys around, and not only Watson's improvement on the ball offensively and everything, but here we are, we're looking at where Denver was closing the season, where Minnesota was closing the season, going all right, it's 1-1, and now we're sitting here going, well, if they get Peyton Watson back, they should be fine. So that's probably my last question on the series is, where are you with Denver's chances now?

Speaker 4:
[78:24] I think there's things going on six or seven. I'd lean Denver because I just, I think Yokelts will have more success. Again, I do think Gobert has bothered him to a degree, but also like, you know, one of the air ball like two threes the other day, and like some of his shots are just missed in odd ways that I just don't think is necessarily going to continue. So I would have, I think I picked it nuggets in six prior to the series. I'd probably stick with that. I just trust the Denver over the course of a series a little bit more.

Speaker 1:
[78:55] Okay. Golden State covered it forever. Now you're a big national guy for his point of view. We know that you're assigned to the Kerr story. What is the Kerr story right now as we know it?

Speaker 4:
[79:06] Contemplation, true, genuine, like, I don't know from him. You know, and I talked to him before one of those Clippers games, I think before game 82 actually, you know, they played two in LA. And, you know, he said 50-50 to me. And again, I don't think any decision is ever truly 50-50. You're probably leaning one way or the other. But he felt that some postseason conversations between him and Joe Lake, of him and Mike Dunleavy, him and Steph Curry, which he had purposely held off on, about like organizational direction, where he was at in his life, where this franchise should go from here, whether a fuller reset is needed, whether like a tweaking and this, you know, Western Corps should move forward with him still in charge. He felt those conversations needed to be had, but he did not want to have them until exit interviews. Essentially, he wanted some time away from the daily grind to think about it. And that's what this time is. You know, they get eliminated Friday night. He reveals a lot of his thoughts to the public, which I think surprised a lot of people. Didn't necessarily surprise me because I knew he was going to take some time away and didn't know if he was coming back. He took the weekend away from the facility. Monday was more rotation players in there doing exit interview type stuff. Yesterday, we're talking on Wednesday afternoon. Tuesday was like assistant coaches, staffers. I would expect Wednesday, Thursday, Friday of this week, some of those bigger picture conversations into next week. I don't know if and when there will be some like Joe Lake and Mike Dunleavy, Steve Kerr pow wow in the facility where they officially decide yes or no. But I would say over the next 7 to 10 days, collectively, they're going to come to a pretty massive decision for the franchise, which is, does Steve Kerr remain head coach? If he doesn't, then the Warriors move on to the next part of their offseason, which is finding a head coach. If Steve Kerr does come back, they still have a lot of questions to answer this offseason, but it's less complicated if Kerr is back.

Speaker 1:
[81:02] So they would have him back if he wants to return, correct?

Speaker 4:
[81:07] We reported it, me and Ramona Shelburne in Our Story Monday. It's not as simple as just like, hey, Steve, tell us yes or no. Okay, yes. Let's just keep riding this out. They want some philosophical changes, some offensive stuff, maybe some staffing tweaks. The other thing I repeatedly heard, particularly from ownership side, Joe's side, is they want a hungry Steve Kerr. They want a refreshed Steve Kerr ready to, and their talk of like, hey, don't just sign a one-year deal where it's a ride it off, it's nostalgia, I'm doing this out of loyalty to Stefan Draymond. There's going to be quotes all year about, we're a fading dynasty, and they want to get back to trying to squeeze out every win in the regular season. There was some frustration from management about the start of this year before the Butler injury. They were 13 and 15. They lost a lot of stuff late in games. They're losing some of the analytical stuff, like the possession battles, and they just want Steve Kerr to guide this. I think at the end of the day, they would still like Steve back from a management in the locker room face to the franchise thing. But they want to talk to him about if he's about, basically if he's mentally ready to coach in almost like a young way, like one of those younger, fresher, analytically driven minds.

Speaker 1:
[82:32] Sure, I get it, but to me, sometimes this stuff is like, or Pajemski led the team in minutes with 2300. He played almost 500 more minutes than Draymond, so he's the only player to play over 2000 minutes. Top minutes, guys, we run through, it's Pajemski, it's Green, it's Moody, it's Guy Santos and Will Richard. Those are your top five minutes, guys. Steph plays 1300 minutes this year in 43 games. Then it's Pat Spencer. Butler plays 1100 minutes. And then it's quit and post. And I mean, I could keep going on and on and on, 22 different players on this team. So they can want different approaches and all this kind of stuff. Like I think the front office has done an amazing job with those players that are rotational or could be rotational players. The stuff that this front office has done on the margins, I'd say the development with some of these players, like it didn't work out with Kaminga. I'm sick of talking about it. I know no one is more sick of talking about it than you are. So we'll just keep it moving. Moody is okay. He's had some moments.

Speaker 4:
[83:30] All the next year basically.

Speaker 1:
[83:31] Almost.

Speaker 4:
[83:32] Stopped the majority.

Speaker 1:
[83:33] But on the development part of it, but then when I look at like Yee, when I look at like Post, had he been healthy? They have a bunch of decisions to make, but I mean, Przingus barely plays this year. Horford, I thought was terrific late, but this was not some roster that a head coach messed up, is my point with Steve. So, I don't know that ownership can ever help themselves. Hey, maybe we change an assistant, maybe we change up our philosophy. And sure, there's plenty of things that could be changed and maybe it optimizes, but this was, I think, an actual, like pretty remarkable coaching job. Considering-

Speaker 4:
[84:13] The last two months, for sure. The last two months, like post-agress.

Speaker 1:
[84:15] The nights I'm watching, and it's like, Yee Santos is our ISO option here, tied at 96. And I'm just like, Jesus, how are they even in these games?

Speaker 4:
[84:25] So, you know, and I guess even the bigger picture question then is like, is that the type of team Steve Kerr, at his age, you know, considering the other things in life he can do, wants to coach the next couple of years, because there's not, you know, maybe there's a big fish trade that they're able to execute in July that they don't know for sure they're able to execute. Right now, right, we're talking Yannis Kawhi that changes the equation, but very likely, it's going to be a similar type team next year. How available is Steph going to be over the course of an 82 game season? Where is Draymond Green at? Jimmy Butler, you might see in January, February, coming off an ACL at age 37. Al Horford is going to be 40, you know, he might come back on a player option. Like, it's going to be a lot of young guys. Yeah, sure, they'll probably get a lottery pick in here. Maybe it's the 11th pick. They got a 9% chance of jumping into the top four. That could change their outlook to a degree. But also, that could be a very important developmental piece for them next year. That might be one of the most important parts of the roster. It is probably going to be a play-in level, maybe below type team, unless they swing something surprising this summer. And beyond the fact that I would agree, I think the last two months, Steve really did do a good job with that type of roster. At his age, in this situation, does Steve want to come back to coach that type of team? Because I don't think, and I don't think not many people in the building think he's going to be coaching a championship contender next year.

Speaker 1:
[85:47] Having said all these things and the limited options that they have, and this is what is supposed to happen, and really this group, it's not the way a competitor thinks, but when it's all said and done and their years are moved from this, they should be going, thank God we got that one in 22. Because normally you don't even get the one, if you win your first one in 15, and then you win a couple more, the 22 one doesn't happen unless you're Tim Duncan, right? So, this is what is supposed to happen and yet there's these conversations about these teams like, oh, well, what can they do? It reminds me a little bit of Kobe at the end where it was like, well, nobody's going to want it more than Kobe. It's like, well, Kobe can want everything anyone has ever wanted. It doesn't matter. The team isn't good enough. I know everybody said a million times like Steph, he's just, and this is what makes him great. He's the greatest teammate in the player empowerment era. He not only was one of the greatest players, but he was the best star because he understood all the bullshit doesn't really mean anything and it just makes everybody else's jobs harder around me. But if this is what we're looking at here and mapping out the next couple of years, why would Steph want to end his career this way?

Speaker 4:
[86:58] Because he is very protective of the one franchise legacy. He's obviously incredibly settled with The Warriors. It's the only franchise he's ever known, the Bay Area, all that family, school systems, everything. It's just who he is. Think about his quotes the other night. As Steve Kerr is talking about maybe walking off in that type of situation, he says a few things. He wants to play a few more years. He's open to contract extension talks with The Warriors this summer. Then he had a long quote which we put at the end of our story, which I thought was pretty fascinating, basically about the next few years being resetting the foundation. Within that quote, he said something like, we don't have to always just say championship, championship, championship. It can be about just playing good basketball, being competitive on a more of a nightly basis. He's not as obsessed with getting five as like, he's a competitor and he fought his way back this year and tried to muscle them through the play-in because he loves the stage and sure, I think in his ideal mind, he'd win the title and then walk off to the sunset. But also if you're him, are you at age 38 going to completely uproot your life and go try to boost the Hornets championship chances because you're that obsessed with five? Or it's okay to write off like Dirk, write off, even like Kobe. I understand that those last couple of Kobe years were, from a competitive standpoint, probably weren't easy on a day-to-day basis for Kobe. But I don't think we look back at Kobe's career and like, wow, what was he thinking staying with the Lakers in the last three years? I think it feels like a very complete Laker legacy for Kobe. And I think everything I've heard from Steph is he wants that. He wants to be Duncan, Dirk, Kobe.

Speaker 1:
[88:45] Yeah, and I totally understand. I guess I just. We're not used to it anymore.

Speaker 4:
[88:52] Would it be better?

Speaker 1:
[88:53] I just think he was so good. He was so good in some of these games to close to. And I'm like, God, he is now maybe it's because he was a little fresher missing that much time, but man, he was good again. So go ahead.

Speaker 4:
[89:05] And I mean, I think, look, if he was suddenly like Wemby's point guard for a couple of years in San Antonio or, you know, name your team where you just like obviously he could boost a ton of teams, put them on the Rockets or something as basically their shooter. But it's also like, I don't know, is that...

Speaker 1:
[89:22] He may probably bench him in the fourth quarter for missing a defense of the sun.

Speaker 4:
[89:27] Oh, what a reshepard play like 10 minutes.

Speaker 1:
[89:30] 11. Yeah.

Speaker 4:
[89:31] Oh, there you go. Yeah, I don't know. Like, is it? You want to see him on the playoff stage? And I think there is like obviously some disappointment that like you saw the Steph Curry game against the Clippers and it was so invigorating, I think, to the viewing public to kind of get that one night picture back into him and Draymond, right? The way Draymond defended in the fourth. And I think there's a desire to see that. But I don't know that, I don't know that the public would love to watch a year of Steph Curry in a Red Rockets jersey or something like that.

Speaker 1:
[89:59] I don't want that. I don't necessarily want that. I just hate like how often the play ends with like, oh, I don't get to watch him for another week. And that's selfish. That's completely selfish. And that's it. And that's not important to the Steph calculus on his next move. Enjoy game three, man. And thanks for stopping by today.

Speaker 4:
[90:21] Yep.

Speaker 1:
[90:23] When Kyle first heard about Lucy Pouches being a sponsor, he didn't even ask if I wanted to do it. He said, yeah, for the show. That's how excited he is about the flavor and the form-fitting pouch. Lucy is the obvious choice for the true nicotine pouch connoisseurs. That's why they're the official nicotine pouch partner of Barstool Sports. Every other pouch is the same. Lucy Breakers are the only ones doing it differently to give you the longest lasting flavor in pouches. Lucy pouches go up to 12-milligram strength and have a unique shape that feels great. Lucy is in stores nationwide now, or get Lucy delivered to you ASAP on apps like DoorDash and GoPuff. Lucy is the only pouch that delivers long-lasting, on-demand flavor. Find a store near you at lucy.co. slash stores or get it shipped with 20% off your first order at lucy.co/ryenusing the code Ryen. Lucy products are only for adults of legal age and every customer is age verified. Warning, this product contains nicotine. Nicotine is an addictive chemical.

Speaker 5:
[91:25] You want details?

Speaker 6:
[91:26] Buy. I drive a Ferrari, 355 Cabriolet. What's up?

Speaker 5:
[91:32] I have a ridiculous house in the South Fork.

Speaker 3:
[91:35] I have every toy you could possibly imagine.

Speaker 6:
[91:37] And best of all, kids, I am liquid.

Speaker 3:
[91:41] So now you know what's possible.

Speaker 6:
[91:43] Let me tell you what's required.

Speaker 1:
[91:44] Life advice, lifeadviceRR at gmail.com. Couple of good ones for you today, but quick revelation, James. I hear we do have an actor friend that's doing some high-profile stuff. Ceruti just completely murphed here on the show.

Speaker 5:
[92:05] No, no, no, no. Yeah, I forgot how this even came up like a while ago.

Speaker 1:
[92:11] Wasn't that long ago. We just said, do you have a friend who's an actor? And you said, that was it.

Speaker 5:
[92:15] Yeah, I do. I legitimately do. And we were texting or whatever. I think he was like, hey, his brother texted me and was like, hey, thanks for the shout out in the pod. And I didn't even know they buried the lead. He's in euphoria. Shout out to my guy, Joe Shambrello. Great dude. Very handsome guy. And he got to kick it with Jacob Elordi. So I guess I need to start watching euphoria. I don't watch it. My wife watches it. She was really interested in what Elordi was like as a person. Sounds like he's an awesome dude. But maybe that's the show. I mean, Kyle's seen it, but you and I haven't. So maybe that's the show.

Speaker 6:
[92:45] I haven't seen the new season. No, I have not. But I think we're like three episodes in.

Speaker 1:
[92:50] I feel too old to be talking about that show with people.

Speaker 6:
[92:54] Yeah, it could be really uncomfortable. I mean, definitely could.

Speaker 5:
[92:59] I have like I've been downstairs, you know, usually I'll go up and like play video games, do whatever, anything, watch games. If my wife's watching downstairs, I'll come downstairs, grab a snack. And I'm like, what the heck is going on in the show? Like everyone's yelling at each other. Like there's so much drama. People are doing drugs. I'm like, I don't remember high school being like this. But I don't know.

Speaker 1:
[93:19] What's his name again?

Speaker 6:
[93:20] Not even for a captain.

Speaker 5:
[93:21] Joe Shambrello. Great dude.

Speaker 1:
[93:23] There's a character named Ali Muhammad.

Speaker 6:
[93:29] Dude is probably a more common name than you think.

Speaker 1:
[93:32] True, but TV show.

Speaker 6:
[93:37] Did you get any submissions? Do you get any submissions for our show? You told me Mobland, but I'm pretty sure you and I already breezed through that, right, Ryan?

Speaker 1:
[93:46] Well, this isn't him.

Speaker 5:
[93:49] I'll just send it to you.

Speaker 1:
[93:50] Oh wait, now I see him. Yeah. This guy's got a chiseled look.

Speaker 5:
[93:56] Crazy.

Speaker 1:
[93:58] You went to high school with this guy?

Speaker 4:
[93:59] Yep.

Speaker 5:
[94:00] Yeah, we played sports together.

Speaker 1:
[94:03] Are you like friend's friend, core guy or?

Speaker 5:
[94:06] Not a core guy, but like was, yeah, like, you know.

Speaker 4:
[94:08] Was he cool with you?

Speaker 5:
[94:09] He got to LA and yeah, yeah, he was cooler than me. He's a cool dude.

Speaker 1:
[94:14] King of the school?

Speaker 5:
[94:15] He's not really, you know, it's funny. He didn't really act in high school and he was like, you know, he played hoops. He's a basketball player. It's funny. I think I remember he was like, you know, we went to a pretty bad.

Speaker 6:
[94:25] Wasn't on punt return though, right?

Speaker 5:
[94:27] No, I didn't. That's right.

Speaker 6:
[94:28] So I mean, who really was the guy?

Speaker 5:
[94:30] He was like the guy, you know, our basketball team, like he was like the center and he was like six four. And it's like, all right, you probably know you're not going to be a good basketball team if your center is a six four guy. But no, Joe was a good athlete.

Speaker 1:
[94:38] What class are you guys in Southington? Because that's like a big school, isn't it?

Speaker 5:
[94:42] Yeah, we were the biggest thing. It was like double L.

Speaker 1:
[94:44] So double L? Is it still double L in Connecticut?

Speaker 5:
[94:47] I don't know, but yeah.

Speaker 1:
[94:49] Six four center? That must have sucked.

Speaker 5:
[94:52] Yeah, it probably wasn't awesome for him all the time. But hey, he's a worker, you know.

Speaker 1:
[94:57] Some of those shows are just nasty is all I'm saying. Because I remember like going to a couple of high schools showcase things and it was like, the hell where are these guys from? They're like, oh, they're from New Britain.

Speaker 5:
[95:06] Like, oh, okay.

Speaker 1:
[95:07] Great. This is going to be fun. All right, well, shout out to Joe. Maybe we'll get him on the pod. But we don't watch you for you.

Speaker 5:
[95:15] Yet. Yet. He's been on other stuff. Check it out.

Speaker 1:
[95:19] Yeah, it looks like he's a boxer here. We had a couple show recommendations. I don't know if I trust anybody. I think I'm going to try to make it through leftovers again.

Speaker 5:
[95:30] Ah, in my top five favorite shows ever.

Speaker 6:
[95:32] Yeah, I'd say worth it. That was good.

Speaker 1:
[95:36] We got Windows Bay coming out on Apple here.

Speaker 6:
[95:40] I'll give that a go.

Speaker 1:
[95:41] In his production company, I went to the set. It was filmed outside of Boston. It was actually in a town I'd never even heard of. They brought me to a night shoot. The guy was on fire. He had a limp and he had to jump out of this window. I was able to listen to them with the stunt coordinators and the creator going like, do you think you'll land here? The guy's like, I think I have one jump in me because his leg was hurt from being burnt like a couple of days prior. So yeah, I got to watch them film that show. So we're going to be on Widows Bay or at least I'll be on Widows Bay. Maybe that's our show, April 29th on Apple TV.

Speaker 4:
[96:18] Fine with me.

Speaker 5:
[96:19] That's Matthew Rees too. I love Matthew Rees.

Speaker 1:
[96:24] All right. I'm in TBD. Get to some emails. Instagram posting is a 35-year-old man. Jim Stats, 35, six foot two, solid 250. Same in the shoulders as thighs. That's pretty good. No impressive Jim Stats, but do stay active. Run 15 to 20 miles a week. Lift in 110, 100 rep sets. Split for push, pull, leg, hybrid. That's all right. We got it, man. Herniated discs, took barbells, lift, took barbell lifts off the table. These guys said no impressive Jim Stats, then just listed a ton of impressive shit of like how hard this guy goes. Player comp, Chris Dudley. I should be better than I am, but no offensive skill set. Went physical under the hoop. I always miss an assignment or fuck it up. Chris Dudley was a bucket at Yale, by the way.

Speaker 5:
[97:18] At Yale.

Speaker 1:
[97:22] Really? We'll look it up.

Speaker 6:
[97:27] I believe you. I just wasn't expecting you to say that.

Speaker 5:
[97:29] Wasn't either.

Speaker 1:
[97:30] Yeah. 17 a game. Because I think I have this right. Dick Cuchin. What was there?

Speaker 5:
[97:41] Yeah.

Speaker 6:
[97:42] Come on.

Speaker 1:
[97:43] He replaced my guy, Tom Brennan. UVM's Tom Brennan. Tom started at Yale four years there. 13 and 13 was not enough. Then he went to UVM and went five and 23, three and 24 and six and 21 in his next three seasons. But that patience paid off. Patience paid off. Okay, we wanted to not talk about Tom Brennan for a long time, did I? No problem. Should I stop posting to Instagram now that I'm in my mid 30s and married? I spent most of my 20s single casually dating, traveling, largely just enjoying life. Naturally, I would post what I would consider to be an average amount for a socially aware guy, just enough to whet the whistle, but not enough to be obnoxious. Yeah, I like this guy already. I like the cut of his jib. Some of this, speaking of jibs, Ceruti's actor buddy, I got to close this page out. What a jock, these kids. All right. Some of this was conscious. It was an easy way to add value in a saturated online driven dating world. I traveled a ton, wanted to share that. However, I also shared important moments with friends and family without really thinking about it, just because that's what you do. Two years out of the game, happily married, and God willing, will be starting a family soon. I certainly don't post much anymore, but when I do, it's always my wife, dogs, friends, some adventure we've been on. Recently, I posted pictures from our wedding reception and honeymoon, and when going to tag my friends, I noticed zero of my married friends post my age post anymore. In fact, most have deleted their accounts. To be transparent, I don't keep Instagram on the phone. I download it to a post. That's no place for a married man to scroll. But do still like to share the highlights as a proud husband, uncle, friend, and hopefully soon to be dad. This made me suddenly insecure in asking myself things like, my brother and dad don't even have Instagram. Is this something a man should do? I feel like the transition from bachelor boyhood into husband manhood has been pretty reasonable to navigate. The things you should stop doing and things you should start doing have revealed themselves pretty seamlessly. But this one is tough to navigate. It's just fantastically written email. All those miles you're putting in every week. This guy, no wonder he's married. The guy is killing it. We'd love to hear your thoughts and any advice for a newish husband hoping to enter fatherhood soon.

Speaker 6:
[100:02] Sounds like you're ready for Facebook, dude, and Facebook only. I mean, this is exactly, this is the lane.

Speaker 5:
[100:10] I mean, I think Instagram kind of is.

Speaker 1:
[100:11] How come they only shoot the guys in the middle and then don't get the extra guys on the side?

Speaker 6:
[100:18] No, you're right. I think Instagram is the new Facebook for our people of our age.

Speaker 5:
[100:21] But like, you know, I've kind of been in this group. I mean, I recently posted for my daughter's first birthday. It's the first post I had in a while. I was like, hmm, what's the last time I posted? It was when my daughter was born. So I went, I literally a full year without posting anything. Yeah, I'll post in the stories here and there. Like, you know, I'll, I'll, you know, repost the like a clip from the show or something or I don't know. I don't like to do the thing like, hey, I'm in this cool place. Let me take a picture so everyone knows I'm in this cool place. Like, I think that's kind of like a little bit overplayed now. If you make it a little artsy and nice, I don't know, maybe put a little production value into it. I guess I see that, but as far as like posting to the feed, I don't see, I don't have any buddies that really post the feed anymore.

Speaker 6:
[100:59] I think a lot of times you hit a certain age and it's like kids and like, look at this big fucking fish I caught. Sorry for cursing. But I think that's like a genre of older dude.

Speaker 1:
[101:08] Do you have a new swearing policy on the pod?

Speaker 6:
[101:11] I keep forgetting what it is, but I just know it's probably frowned upon.

Speaker 1:
[101:14] You just didn't feel like that was a well-placed one.

Speaker 6:
[101:16] Yeah, and I think I'm like nine minutes in with my first one, so it's not the worst I've ever done. But yeah, I do think that's one of those genres where it's just like had our youngest one's seventh birthday party, went out to the lake last summer, look at this thing, 18 pounds. Well, that seems like a lot, but that's sort of like an older man update.

Speaker 1:
[101:37] That's worth posting a picture.

Speaker 6:
[101:37] That is worth posting, yeah. I'm not a fisherman.

Speaker 5:
[101:42] You're a big song poster though, Kyle. I've seen you, but I actually like that.

Speaker 6:
[101:46] That goes away though. You know what I mean? That's just-

Speaker 5:
[101:47] Right, the story stuff. I do like that because I just like to know what you're up to.

Speaker 6:
[101:51] Well, you could pretty much guess what I'm up to.

Speaker 5:
[101:53] But what the vibe is-

Speaker 6:
[101:54] You could pretty much guess.

Speaker 1:
[101:55] I love a Kyle Jukebox playlist being posted to social media. I retweet them all the time.

Speaker 5:
[102:00] It could pretty much be set. I love it.

Speaker 1:
[102:03] Because then you create old and then you decide after seven songs, you're going to just shake everybody by the collar.

Speaker 6:
[102:10] Yeah, because the one guy is like, oh, you're really piecing the old folks today? I'm like, you're right. I've done about eight or nine. When's the last time you guys heard Chameleon Air? Buckle up.

Speaker 1:
[102:21] Who wants to ride dirty up in this bitch? This guy. I don't really have much to offer this guy, so I don't know what to tell you.

Speaker 6:
[102:31] I don't think you should get old.

Speaker 1:
[102:33] Yeah, I don't think you should start getting weird about it, because I mean, other people just don't want to do it because you get older and you have other shit that's going on. But if you're traveling and you're doing stuff and you want to share that, think of it this way, if you went to Iceland and it was before social media and before everybody had a camera in their pocket, and you actually took real pictures and then people came over, like, hey, do you want to see the pictures of my trip to Iceland? That's a yes. That's a yes.

Speaker 6:
[102:57] That's mostly a yes, yeah.

Speaker 1:
[102:58] So back in the day, that's what we did. Let me grab the old shoebox, go through some of these pictures, then we hand them out. Hey, look, you're getting pictures of your kid? Well, you're just standing right over there. All right, so maybe we don't have to go through those pictures, because people do get sick of those after a little while. But I think there's something that's been lost in not having the physical pictures anymore, and that's what people used to do. When you did something really cool, part of it was people would say, hey, take pictures. I mean, I know they still kind of do it, but they want you to text them immediately. The process was you take the pictures, and then people that you cared about, and people that cared about what you were doing, when you did something really cool, they would want to see those pictures. If you feel like you're still doing some cool shit and you want to share it with people, I don't think you should be beating yourself up. You're running 20 miles a week, dude.

Speaker 6:
[103:42] Yeah, I think the threshold gets higher. When you're 16, like a four loco-fueled night, you just take a picture hanging outside next to a wheelbarrow, and that's something you put. But I think as you get older, obviously, that's part of it. Totally.

Speaker 1:
[103:55] Yeah.

Speaker 6:
[103:55] Shirt up, something like that.

Speaker 1:
[103:57] The middle finger thing has been like, it used to be so great.

Speaker 6:
[103:59] Tongue out, middle finger gross.

Speaker 5:
[104:01] I'm looking at one of those now in my feed a long time ago. Yeah. It was on the train to New York City. The caption is, out with the squad, hashtag blessed. And it is, it is.

Speaker 6:
[104:11] You hashtag blessed?

Speaker 5:
[104:13] My caption, Mike, that's actually.

Speaker 1:
[104:15] Your caption? That's your post?

Speaker 5:
[104:17] That was a screenshot of, I think, Snapchat. And then my caption was, we go hard.

Speaker 6:
[104:30] It's nice to know we're all the same dudes.

Speaker 5:
[104:35] I missed that content. I'll tell you that right now.

Speaker 6:
[104:38] But that's when you knew that was like had to be posted. And now you pretty much know what should have to be.

Speaker 5:
[104:43] I gotta send you guys this.

Speaker 1:
[104:44] Do you see how hard Steve and the guys went last night?

Speaker 6:
[104:47] Squad, squad goals.

Speaker 5:
[104:53] I did. That's the definition of Vegas can't handle us right now. And it's just like four dudes at MGM losing 400 bucks each.

Speaker 6:
[105:01] Losing all their fucking allotment.

Speaker 1:
[105:03] 400 bucks combined. Do you even remember what you did?

Speaker 6:
[105:13] I'm dying.

Speaker 1:
[105:13] I'm dying right now.

Speaker 5:
[105:15] Hold on. I gotta send it to you guys first. I think it was my birthday, which then got hijacked by another friend who didn't want to do some of the stuff. I don't know. I don't really. I'm not a big birthday guy. I don't really care. But this is the picture. Let me check the date on it. I think it was my birthday. Yeah. So shout out to the guys.

Speaker 1:
[105:34] Oh, my God. This is one of the best metal fingers ever.

Speaker 6:
[105:39] You know, the New Haven line there. What is that?

Speaker 5:
[105:41] That's from. Yeah, I think it's from New Haven. Yeah.

Speaker 6:
[105:43] Metro.

Speaker 1:
[105:44] Did you guys all go as Latinos? This night? What's going on here? This is a crazy picture.

Speaker 6:
[105:57] Dude, it's up still, huh? That's crazy.

Speaker 5:
[106:02] Wow. No, just for white dudes. I think that's a Coors Light, maybe.

Speaker 1:
[106:09] But yeah, are you sure about the four white dudes? What was the what was the theme?

Speaker 5:
[106:14] I don't know. That's just the time. It was 2015. You know, it's a different era.

Speaker 1:
[106:19] People had different styles. It looks like Socario 3.

Speaker 5:
[106:21] I had a bun. You had a lot of long hair, a couple bald guys, beanies. Yeah.

Speaker 6:
[106:27] Fucking hashtag blessed, dude. You fucking that's the cherry on top.

Speaker 1:
[106:32] That middle finger is strong. It's really good. It's a really good middle finger.

Speaker 5:
[106:37] I think I need to send this picture out today.

Speaker 6:
[106:39] My point was that was a no brainer. You know what your no brainers are now, you know, sonogram, whatever the thing is. You'll know.

Speaker 1:
[106:47] You probably don't want to do this now, buddy, if you're 35.

Speaker 6:
[106:49] You'll know what's right.

Speaker 1:
[106:51] Although, I think maybe now I'd respect it. It'd be just kind of funny. It's like you already went through your middle finger phase and the guys start bringing it back.

Speaker 6:
[106:59] Just pull it out for old time's sake.

Speaker 1:
[107:01] There's just too many times where it's like, oh, look at this dork at Coachella. You can't be giving anybody the finger. No offense to the dorks that went to Coachella. I don't mean everybody because obviously some really cool people went to Coachella, but I don't know. Is this guy cool? Let's give him the middle finger. Yeah, he's a cool dude. All right. We'll let it slide then.

Speaker 6:
[107:25] Keep looking at it.

Speaker 1:
[107:27] My god.

Speaker 6:
[107:28] Dude, I just love that you have stuff from way back then. I might have to do a deep scroll. I don't know if I ever went back and see what you were up to back then. It's nice that you're still out there.

Speaker 5:
[107:35] There's a lot of weird stuff. There's a picture of, I'm looking at one of the pictures of Joan Hall the time he came into ESPN. That was a good one.

Speaker 6:
[107:41] Steve underscores Ceruti. Check him out.

Speaker 5:
[107:44] Yeah.

Speaker 1:
[107:46] I just want to clarify that dork Coachella thing.

Speaker 6:
[107:48] Yeah, you really have to keep.

Speaker 1:
[107:50] Yeah, you know, just because I don't want to sound like I know I'm not the coolest guy. I just there's certain there's certain guys I just don't think should be giving the middle finger in the picture.

Speaker 5:
[108:00] What's up with Coachella now, by the way? I've never been.

Speaker 1:
[108:03] I've never gone. I it's always like right around the playoffs. When I first first moved to LA., there was talk about a movement of like, hey, let's go do this. And then I started realizing I was like, I think I'm being asked to pay for everything. That's kind of early, you know, because it was like, hey, do you have a hook up for this? And I was like, yeah, I think I do. And it was like, do you think you could pull this off? And I'm like, well, let me make a call. And then I was like, that's going to be a playoffs. And then I was like, yeah, we need like this. And these are the numbers. And I'm like, wait a minute, am I? Are these people thinking I'm an asshole? Like, I was just going to pay for all this stuff. So I immediately lost interest. And then now I don't know, I'd be kind of...

Speaker 6:
[108:40] Yeah, I never been to a festival. I don't think I would go to one.

Speaker 1:
[108:44] I saw some footage from one in Bali that I was like, is that awesome or terrible? I don't think it's my scene.

Speaker 6:
[108:54] I've been seeing the Bali is fake creeping into my algorithm. It's like, this is what it's supposed to look like. I actually stayed here and there's snakes in my thing, and this is like a façade apartment. It's actually really shitty, but maybe that's just me. I've been seeing a lot of like, Bali's actually not as cool as you think on a budget.

Speaker 1:
[109:16] On a budget, sure. I've never been. I have some people that don't have to worry about budgets that have told me it's like the greatest place ever.

Speaker 6:
[109:21] Well, I'm sure of that, but before that, it was in my algorithm. It's like, dude, why aren't you just going to Bali? Look at how much everything costs. Look at this sick room. And then now I'm seeing like all those rooms are like fucking cardboard cutouts and look at what it buys you.

Speaker 5:
[109:35] Is Bali the place where they always advertise where you're just like in the water, your places are just like huts on the water and it's like a big U and is that what I'm talking about? Or is that the Maldives?

Speaker 1:
[109:44] I forget what you're talking about. I think some Maldives, almost certainly those ads, I know exactly what you're talking about because I've already looked it up. But you've already checked it out for a facility on the road. It might be both Ceruti. I just know for certainty. I know exactly the picture you're talking about. You walk by the picture and it's like a Delta ad and you're in the airport and you're making a connection and you're likely miserable and then you see this hut and you go, I want to do that. So I want to read this email. The guy with a caddy, the one guy with a caddy is the headline. Stats 56, 180, 205 bench, 335 squat, 146 half marathon, Strava verified. Six out of 10 war guns. All right, player comp, Herb Jones, great lockdown defense, scared to pull the trigger on open shots, streaky shooting in general. That could be honestly, I think when guys say streaky shooter, it just means it's the nicest possible way of saying I can't shoot. That's my guess. Not even sure that it's specific to this email. We're getting a lot of streaky shooters checking in lately. Seven of best frat bros from college and I are going to a nice golf resort for a buddy's trip this June. I don't know if he wants us to say where they're going or not. Yeah, he says we can say it. Stream song? Anyone? Ceruti?

Speaker 6:
[111:10] Stream song, are you saying?

Speaker 1:
[111:12] Yeah. We're all in our late 20s, gainfully employed in jobs for the degree everyone pursued. Wow. Guys, we're locked in early and executed the plan. We aren't struggling by any means. In a 10,000 foot view, you'd probably say we're crushing it. None of us came from any money either. All right. I'm going to get a bunch of go-getters out here. I'm debating.

Speaker 6:
[111:37] I don't know. I wonder. All nine of us, we all were in a frat and we're all doing awesome. None of us had a leg up. Some guys don't know that they're way better off.

Speaker 1:
[111:49] Kyle's going to have to see everyone's dads for one day.

Speaker 6:
[111:52] I'm just saying, there's some people in that middle upper class, they're like, we didn't have any money and it's like, man, come on.

Speaker 5:
[112:00] Anyway, do you think that's what I do?

Speaker 1:
[112:02] Kyle?

Speaker 6:
[112:04] No, I don't think so. But again, I got no proof. So I think it's just funny when there's a group of like eight, nine dudes that, you know, none of us, huh?

Speaker 1:
[112:13] There was a real shift, though, like six years ago, when it was like, you're successful and your family's successful. You piece of shit.

Speaker 6:
[112:22] Yeah, I know.

Speaker 5:
[112:22] You don't have to be poor. Yeah.

Speaker 1:
[112:25] Then it was like, how dare you? How dare you not have any students?

Speaker 6:
[112:28] Well, when I had guys coming over to my dad, when I had some guys come over to my dad's house, they were like, holy fuck, you're rich. And I was like, I don't think so. I was like, well, I've been over to your house. So I guess if we're, it's a matter of perspective, I guess so, you know?

Speaker 5:
[112:40] Levels.

Speaker 6:
[112:40] So it's just funny. And so now I don't go around being like, dude, we didn't have shit because that's what people will say. Well, because you drove past Wendy's with your dad and you had to eat at home doesn't mean that you weren't doing well.

Speaker 5:
[112:52] Anyway, this is a real sticky point for Kyle.

Speaker 6:
[112:57] No, it's just I thought it was funny. I just thought it was funny. It seems like it's a real thing where dudes are like playing down that there was like shit was pretty cool. We were younger.

Speaker 1:
[113:05] Is there a chance Kyle grew up richer than either Ceruti or I?

Speaker 6:
[113:10] Maybe. But again, you got to think the split household. You know, it was it was sick and then it was like hamburger helper. So I don't know.

Speaker 1:
[113:20] Student loans, Ceruti?

Speaker 6:
[113:21] No.

Speaker 5:
[113:22] I did. Yeah.

Speaker 1:
[113:24] Kyle, no student loans.

Speaker 6:
[113:25] No, dude. Potstamp. Reasonable rates.

Speaker 5:
[113:28] Right.

Speaker 1:
[113:29] Yeah. There's also something to be said about that. You guys, you went in state. I mean, I know no one who like the people that listen to the pod, but don't like me, are going to go, Martha's Vineyard, why are we even doing this exercise?

Speaker 6:
[113:40] Yeah, but you're right. That counts.

Speaker 1:
[113:42] Yeah, but I will tell you, the only time my father was doing well, I was already out of the picture.

Speaker 6:
[113:47] And then, you know, I feel like we might be doing it right now. So anyway, I'm just saying, you know, I like it.

Speaker 1:
[113:53] I like these exercises.

Speaker 6:
[113:55] Let's get back to the Cade seminar. All right.

Speaker 1:
[113:58] So the question here, and it's a very specific one, and I don't know the answer. I'm debating if there's a way I can get a Cade for just myself and not get ridiculed the entire trip. Part of it is that I don't want to expend all of the energy pushing my bag around in the middle of the summer. The other part is I personally think I suck at reading greens, and if a Cade can help me convert on even one more birdie around, it makes the experience that much more memorable for me. It does cost about one third of the round for the Cade, which I think is worthwhile. I offered to get the Cade for anyone else in the rest of the group, but they're all good with just riding in carts. Am I ruining the vibes by being the one guy walking instead of riding? It is as big of a douche move as it is in my mind. Massive. It's bad. And you're going to do the Cade?

Speaker 4:
[114:46] That's crazy.

Speaker 1:
[114:48] Yeah. Additional context, I'm a 10 handicap in the group. Ranges from low single digits to an 18. We're planning on playing five rounds over three days. Love the show. Thanks in advance for any advice. Let me just clarify. Am I ruining the vibes by being the only guy walking instead of riding? Is it as big of a douche move as it is in my mind, and he says, parenthesis, massive? Ceruti, you seem to have already answered this one.

Speaker 5:
[115:11] It just feels like you're taking this way. I know everyone's competitive and wants to get better. I just went on a golf trip with some guys in December. Some people are better than others, and yeah, obviously everyone wants to win, but there's no need to bring it. Yes, the caddy will help you. You'll probably be better, but at what cost? You have this extra caddy who's kind of hanging on one of your boys while you're doing this thing, while you're golfing, all trying to have a good time. It is a little bit weird if there's one random guy out there helping you out and you out alone. I just feel like you're taking this way too seriously.

Speaker 6:
[115:39] It's hilarious. Like, I was going to compare it to like, it would be like if you were the only guy walking when everyone else is in carts and he was like, I'm also doing that. So I was like, all right, well then, yeah, I think you are the problem.

Speaker 1:
[115:57] Well, there's a math thing here too. You're going to walk, so that means that, you know, the reason eight of you are going is two guys to a car and these are how the rounds are going to play out. And then, you're going to be walking or walking with a cart.

Speaker 6:
[116:09] One guy is going to pay for a full cart.

Speaker 1:
[116:11] Well, I'm not even talking about the money part of it, but just, I don't know, maybe you guys can correct me because you golf more than I do, but granted, when you're just paired up with randoms and everything, you kind of make it work. But when it's three guys in a cart and then one walker, there's a lot of times, depending on like what the course is like, and this chance is probably a really nice one, unless you're just nasty, you said you're a 10, so maybe it's not that big of a deal, but there's just gonna be moments where they're gonna be in the cart, feet up on the front of it, looking back at you, going like, all right, is he ready or like, hey, have them shoot. And then there's another part of it, it was eight guys who all went to college together, depending on what that Caddy's personality is like, what if you get some older uptight guy, and then that's kind of changing at least that dynamic, and then the dudes the next round are gonna be like, hey, we wanna make sure we're not paired up with you, we wanna just let it fly and tell old stories, and not be around a stranger for four hours. So I would say don't do this at all, because you are gonna be made fun of the entire time, and you'll get to the point where they don't even wanna make fun of you anymore, they're just pissed about you changing up the equation here.

Speaker 6:
[117:21] It is an interesting plot point though. Remember last summer when Doug brought a fucking Caddy? It's like a funny novelty thing.

Speaker 1:
[117:28] It is really funny that point.

Speaker 6:
[117:29] It is funny, but maybe for one of the rounds. Yeah, for one round maybe, maybe the last one. You know what, that'd be cool if you did it for the last one. If you're interested in it being funny, but it sounds like that's not even a part that you care about. It sounds like you're like, really wanna work on my game, I'm really bad at reading green, so I'm just gonna rent a guy for a couple days.

Speaker 1:
[117:52] Now these guys are young, so maybe it's fine in what I'm thinking about of a guy in a bag versus other people on the cart in your foursome, but Ceruti, wouldn't that be a thing, maybe depending on how the day plays out, that it would be just kind of mismatched?

Speaker 5:
[118:06] With the cart, you mean?

Speaker 1:
[118:08] Yeah, having...

Speaker 5:
[118:09] I usually pay for a cart, like the way you pay for the cart, like I think it's like a one-person fee, so it's not like somebody has to like double up on the fee.

Speaker 6:
[118:16] No, I'm just talking about like pay for half carts, and if you're like, anyway, it doesn't matter. It could be different, I think.

Speaker 1:
[118:22] These guys are doing great, I don't think they're worried about the money.

Speaker 5:
[118:24] Yeah, as far as pace of play, I think it's less of an issue as you think it would be, but it's just a weird, like again, like if you're hanging out with your buddies and they want to just let it fly a little bit, and there's just kind of this unwanted rando, it'd be one thing if it was like one serious group and one not serious group and they all had caddies, but I just, it's cool. Then what you win at the end of this week, like just, and you had the caddies that make you feel better? Like, I don't know, do you go home?

Speaker 6:
[118:49] Sounds like yes.

Speaker 5:
[118:50] You win something, like I don't know what's the win long-term for you. Like if you make that extra birdie, it's more just about hanging out with your buddies, man.

Speaker 1:
[119:00] I think that solves it.

Speaker 6:
[119:02] Yeah.

Speaker 1:
[119:04] That'll do it for the show. Thanks to Tom. Thanks to Kevin. Thanks to Ceruti. Thanks to Kyle. The Ryen Russillo Show, Barstool Sports. We go hard.