transcript

Speaker 1:
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Speaker 2:
[01:16] And Jason, Emily, baby update. We are, she is as big as a head of cabbage.

Speaker 1:
[01:25] No, that's what you said last week.

Speaker 2:
[01:27] Oh, no, a head of lettuce. Last week was a cabbage, a head of lettuce. Sorry, I got my greens mixed up.

Speaker 1:
[01:33] I feel like cabbages get bigger.

Speaker 2:
[01:35] Yeah, not according to this app that I look at, that it arbitrarily assigns vegetables. I got my leafy greens wrong.

Speaker 1:
[01:44] Wait, I thought we were on a fruit one.

Speaker 2:
[01:47] Well, it changed. It went from, I think it's just produce.

Speaker 1:
[01:50] Oh, okay.

Speaker 2:
[01:51] So.

Speaker 1:
[01:51] Well, not a lot of updates. My midwife said that my pregnancy is perfectly textbook.

Speaker 2:
[02:00] Oh.

Speaker 1:
[02:00] I am a textbook pregnancy.

Speaker 2:
[02:03] Okay.

Speaker 1:
[02:03] Even like, so I gained five pounds from my last appointment. It was a month, a month past. And I was like, that feels like a lot to gain there.

Speaker 2:
[02:16] I mean, there's a baby and a placenta in there.

Speaker 1:
[02:19] Well, she said those weeks, like literally in the textbook, it's like, mother will probably gain five pounds between this week and this week.

Speaker 2:
[02:28] Look at you.

Speaker 1:
[02:29] So I was like, okay.

Speaker 2:
[02:31] Yeah.

Speaker 1:
[02:31] Well, I have been very active hiking four miles.

Speaker 2:
[02:35] You do a little too much. I worry about you.

Speaker 1:
[02:39] Sometimes I'm a little tuckered out by the end of the day and I'm like, dang it.

Speaker 2:
[02:43] Yeah. Yeah. No, you do too much. I'm like, let me carry that for you. And you're like, no, no, I got it. I got it. And it's like, you know, a 50 pound bag of something. I don't know.

Speaker 1:
[02:55] I don't have a 50 pound bag of anything.

Speaker 2:
[02:57] But yeah, but it's like, yeah. And it's just like, what are you doing? I'm afraid the baby's going to pop out or something because you're like, is that how it works? Is that why they don't want a pregnant woman to strain?

Speaker 1:
[03:09] I don't know why they don't want a pregnant woman to strain. This would actually be a really good podcast episode where we talk about like how pregnancy has changed because I don't feel like people baby pregnant people as much as they used to.

Speaker 2:
[03:20] No. Well, yeah, I guess not.

Speaker 1:
[03:22] You know?

Speaker 2:
[03:23] Yeah.

Speaker 1:
[03:23] So.

Speaker 2:
[03:24] Well, women did used to be weak.

Speaker 1:
[03:28] Did they?

Speaker 2:
[03:29] Yeah. They used to be strong.

Speaker 1:
[03:30] Perceived.

Speaker 2:
[03:31] There was like warrior women, you know, like in ancient times, they were like, you know, the Xena Princess Warrior people.

Speaker 1:
[03:38] Xena?

Speaker 2:
[03:38] Yeah.

Speaker 1:
[03:39] Yeah.

Speaker 2:
[03:39] Yeah. And then then like the 1800s came around and then women were weak all of a sudden.

Speaker 1:
[03:45] But not actually because they're like, have you read Little House in the Big Woods? Pa's just walking through the woods, not doing anything.

Speaker 2:
[03:54] This is a debate.

Speaker 1:
[03:55] Ma is churning butter and coloring it yellow with her carrot shavings.

Speaker 2:
[04:00] Yeah, she's doing a lot. Okay.

Speaker 1:
[04:01] Okay, but she was doing a lot. Like she was working a lot.

Speaker 2:
[04:05] So that is an interesting thing about your reading of Little House in the Big Woods. You actually resent Pa.

Speaker 1:
[04:12] So deeply.

Speaker 2:
[04:13] Let's hear about your resentment towards Pa.

Speaker 1:
[04:15] Pa's just like chilling.

Speaker 2:
[04:18] No, no. He's providing meat, protein for the family.

Speaker 1:
[04:22] Yeah, I get it. Checking his traps for 12 hours in a day.

Speaker 2:
[04:27] You think Pa was like dilly dallying, just like enjoying the woods?

Speaker 1:
[04:31] Yeah, like who doesn't love a snowy walk through the woods? Every day. There's a poem about it for 12 hours.

Speaker 2:
[04:39] There's a poem about it?

Speaker 1:
[04:41] Like stopping by a snowy...

Speaker 2:
[04:43] Is that Robert Frost?

Speaker 1:
[04:44] Yeah.

Speaker 2:
[04:45] Probably.

Speaker 1:
[04:45] You got the one.

Speaker 2:
[04:46] I chose the road less traveled by or what?

Speaker 1:
[04:50] Yeah, you know.

Speaker 2:
[04:50] Not that one.

Speaker 1:
[04:51] No, no, no, no. You know the snowy...

Speaker 2:
[04:52] But you think Pa was just like, I am out of this house. Them women.

Speaker 1:
[04:57] Yeah, I mean, he's just like...

Speaker 2:
[04:59] Too much estrogen in the home, right?

Speaker 1:
[05:01] What? And then like they got a bear or something. Did they get a bear?

Speaker 2:
[05:06] I mean, if Pa gets a bear, he's earned his right to walk through the woods.

Speaker 1:
[05:10] And like they just throw it in the shed and it's frozen out there. So, they don't really have to do much to it. And they just like honk off pieces to eat. But you know Ma is doing all work there. Pa did have to work in the garden. Like, okay.

Speaker 2:
[05:28] I've never seen such Pa hatred. This is crazy.

Speaker 1:
[05:31] I mean, it's just like, okay, Ma has the three girls at home. Pa comes home, plays his fiddle. He gets like all the adoration. And it's like, dude's just playing a fiddle and Ma's over there doing all the housework.

Speaker 2:
[05:48] Yeah. So Pa is living the life that men just do as hobbies now. So like, walking the woods, hunting, playing a fiddle, gardening a little bit, doesn't do much else. Those are hobbies. Those are like, I want to be an outdoor guy.

Speaker 1:
[06:10] Yeah.

Speaker 2:
[06:10] That's what I do.

Speaker 1:
[06:11] Exactly. And that's like...

Speaker 2:
[06:13] What kind of hobbies are you into?

Speaker 1:
[06:14] I don't know.

Speaker 2:
[06:15] Hunting, drapes in through the woods, fiddling.

Speaker 1:
[06:18] Yeah.

Speaker 2:
[06:20] That was Pa's life. He had it made.

Speaker 1:
[06:22] Yeah. And then like the girls would sit on his lap and like, tell us a story.

Speaker 2:
[06:29] Nope, not till Christmas time.

Speaker 1:
[06:30] Yeah, pretty much. Yeah, Ma's like making things. OK, I think Pa did make her a shelf or something.

Speaker 2:
[06:37] Oh, good. I mean, it's better than I can do. I can't make a shelf.

Speaker 1:
[06:43] I really struggled through that book, though. Like, all right, Pa. OK, you like earn some like every night reading it.

Speaker 2:
[06:52] I mean, it took me like a week, just a little couple of reading passages and you're like, is Pa really doing this?

Speaker 1:
[07:02] I would just read it to you. OK, Pa.

Speaker 2:
[07:05] Yeah. Anyway, I disagree. I disagree a little bit. Pregnancy, but well, Pa didn't have to bear a child either.

Speaker 1:
[07:16] Yeah.

Speaker 2:
[07:16] Yeah. He's probably checking his traps when his daughters were born.

Speaker 1:
[07:20] I don't know if I read that.

Speaker 2:
[07:22] Didn't he have like a dad not too far away who did the same thing?

Speaker 1:
[07:26] Yeah.

Speaker 2:
[07:27] Checked traps.

Speaker 1:
[07:28] Yeah.

Speaker 2:
[07:28] He go and they built houses and stuff.

Speaker 1:
[07:31] They did go over to their house for a maple-serping party.

Speaker 2:
[07:36] Oh, that's cool.

Speaker 1:
[07:37] Yeah. All that.

Speaker 2:
[07:37] Sounds like the life.

Speaker 1:
[07:39] That's fun.

Speaker 2:
[07:40] Yeah. So, okay.

Speaker 1:
[07:42] I need to keep reading. I just read the one.

Speaker 2:
[07:45] Well, maybe things get a little tougher with Pa.

Speaker 1:
[07:47] Maybe so.

Speaker 2:
[07:48] You know, I don't know. I've only seen the show.

Speaker 1:
[07:51] I've never seen the show.

Speaker 2:
[07:53] What?

Speaker 1:
[07:53] I have never seen the show.

Speaker 2:
[07:55] Did you know Netflix is creating a new Little House on the Prairie show?

Speaker 1:
[08:00] They're going to add some weird stuff, like things always do.

Speaker 2:
[08:04] I hear Pa is black, but the rest of them aren't. I don't know why.

Speaker 1:
[08:09] That's a weird way to go. That's not the trick.

Speaker 2:
[08:11] I mean, it's Netflix. They just kind of change things. It's like, hey, it doesn't matter. It's whoever wants to be whoever, which is fine. I mean, Shakespeare did it, but TV, nothing wrong with it.

Speaker 1:
[08:26] I'm just thinking Pa's going to check traps, but actually he's going to the saloon and all that.

Speaker 2:
[08:35] Oh, sure. Well, the 1970s show totally made up stuff. That was not the books at all.

Speaker 1:
[08:44] Oh, really? I haven't watched it.

Speaker 2:
[08:46] Michael Landon walking around with all their situations and whatnot, I doubt they were very true to the book. I mean, it's like, what, 11 seasons or something?

Speaker 1:
[08:55] Okay, I just need to finish reading them and then...

Speaker 2:
[08:57] The books are like children's books. It's like, how are we going to get 50 seasons of Little House on the Prairie out of this? All right, Ma's got to cut off a wound for an entire episode. So, okay. Well, anyway, I think there's a possibility that, I don't know, they did Anne with an E and I'm not so sure they did great with that.

Speaker 1:
[09:20] We quit watching it.

Speaker 2:
[09:21] Yeah, it was a little intense. It's like, it's not supposed to be intense.

Speaker 1:
[09:24] It wasn't right.

Speaker 2:
[09:25] It wasn't, it didn't fit.

Speaker 1:
[09:27] Right.

Speaker 2:
[09:27] Like, what's going on?

Speaker 1:
[09:28] Yeah.

Speaker 2:
[09:28] We got, what, did we get a season through it?

Speaker 1:
[09:31] No, I don't even think we did.

Speaker 2:
[09:33] Yeah, it's like, you don't really have to take Anne of Green Gables and make it like super serious.

Speaker 1:
[09:40] Yeah.

Speaker 2:
[09:41] And like modern culturally dramatic and it's like, sure, there's some drama. I mean, Matthew, poor Matthew.

Speaker 1:
[09:50] But the story stands on its own.

Speaker 2:
[09:53] Yeah. And it's written in humor, and I don't remember the show being funny, but the book's hilarious.

Speaker 1:
[09:59] Yeah.

Speaker 2:
[09:59] The way she speaks. I don't remember the, maybe they just didn't do the humor well, but I don't know. So I could see them actually doing like, we're going to go by the books, The Little House on the Prairie, but maybe that would be boring. It's like, so we're going to have 12 episodes. Pa's going to go through the woods and check his traps. Do you think it'll sell?

Speaker 1:
[10:21] Well, there's a story in the book that he tells the girls that he came up on a bear.

Speaker 2:
[10:26] That's a full episode.

Speaker 1:
[10:28] But it was actually a tree trunk.

Speaker 2:
[10:31] And the whole episode, and that's the twist at the end.

Speaker 1:
[10:34] Yeah. And he was like laughing because he thought it was a bear.

Speaker 2:
[10:40] Yeah.

Speaker 1:
[10:40] But it was a tree.

Speaker 2:
[10:42] Sounds about like Netflix.

Speaker 1:
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Speaker 2:
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Speaker 1:
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Speaker 2:
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Speaker 1:
[12:26] Something I love about them is that they keep you grounded, which allows your body to stay electrically connected to the earth while you walk with a copper grounding plug and conductive laces. Not to mention they use an organic cotton footbed.

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Speaker 2:
[13:11] That's earthrunners.com and use code RVC. Ugh, well, anyway, you had a, would you think, do you think you've had a rough pregnancy? I mean, you said textbook, but like, you went 16 weeks and you were going to, you felt like you were going to.

Speaker 1:
[13:26] Oh, being sick, yeah, that part was rough.

Speaker 2:
[13:29] Yeah.

Speaker 1:
[13:29] And then we, so we love our bed. Our bed is the best bed ever we have ever slept on.

Speaker 2:
[13:39] Yeah.

Speaker 1:
[13:39] But you can swap out the firmness. And I thought that I wanted it firmer for my back.

Speaker 2:
[13:47] Support in your bed, yeah.

Speaker 1:
[13:49] So Jason swapped out the, like, there are layers to it, and he put the firm one on for me.

Speaker 2:
[13:56] Yeah.

Speaker 1:
[13:56] And then my back was just, like, killing me.

Speaker 2:
[13:59] For weeks.

Speaker 1:
[14:00] For weeks. I was just like, why is my back hurting so bad? I don't understand.

Speaker 2:
[14:04] What is going on? I don't get why the back of your back hurts.

Speaker 1:
[14:06] Well, I thought it was just, like, a weird pregnancy thing. Like, I'm just 37 and pregnant, and, like, this is it now.

Speaker 2:
[14:13] Yeah.

Speaker 1:
[14:13] And then you swapped it to softer, and now it's like, I feel great. That's awesome.

Speaker 2:
[14:19] No, that's crazy.

Speaker 1:
[14:20] Really annoying.

Speaker 2:
[14:21] Yeah.

Speaker 1:
[14:21] So, no, I wouldn't say it's been hard. Like, I feel like I have less energy.

Speaker 2:
[14:27] I don't think that's the pregnancy. I think that's just having kids that are, like, eight and six and just completely wild.

Speaker 1:
[14:35] No, it's the pregnancy.

Speaker 2:
[14:36] Well, then am I just having some empathy exhaustion? Because I'm, like, walking up the hill with you, like, just tired.

Speaker 1:
[14:44] Our neighborhood is very hilly. There are, like, some extreme hills.

Speaker 2:
[14:49] Yeah.

Speaker 1:
[14:49] What degree do you think they are?

Speaker 2:
[14:52] Solid degrees.

Speaker 1:
[14:54] Solid.

Speaker 2:
[14:54] I'm going 10. That's, like, you know, you have your grades or whatever. Like, they go, the steep ones are like six or something on those highways.

Speaker 1:
[15:05] It's very, our hills are intense.

Speaker 2:
[15:07] I bet we momentarily get a seven.

Speaker 1:
[15:10] So walking up that when I'm carrying the extra weight and stuff and blood flow, like my blood volume is just maybe doubled or something.

Speaker 2:
[15:23] Is it doubled?

Speaker 1:
[15:24] It's something crazy like that.

Speaker 2:
[15:25] That's nuts.

Speaker 1:
[15:26] So I'm just like, oh, by the time we get up to the top of the hills. But I'm OK.

Speaker 2:
[15:32] Pregnancy is so cool.

Speaker 1:
[15:33] It's so cool.

Speaker 2:
[15:34] It's so cool. What's like going on?

Speaker 1:
[15:36] Yeah, I've already... One thing that is different is I've been having the Braxton Hicks contractions, which is like the practice contractions.

Speaker 2:
[15:44] Really?

Speaker 1:
[15:44] But I'm early.

Speaker 2:
[15:46] Yeah, I was going to say, is that supposed to happen?

Speaker 1:
[15:48] Just entering my third trimester.

Speaker 2:
[15:50] Yeah. Have you entered it yet?

Speaker 1:
[15:52] Yeah.

Speaker 2:
[15:53] We didn't celebrate?

Speaker 1:
[15:55] In it.

Speaker 2:
[15:55] Oh.

Speaker 1:
[15:56] The last third.

Speaker 2:
[15:58] That makes me... Whoa.

Speaker 1:
[15:59] Yeah, it's a little...

Speaker 2:
[16:00] Whoa. Whoa. That's crazy. Well...

Speaker 1:
[16:05] I feel like it has flown by.

Speaker 2:
[16:06] It has.

Speaker 1:
[16:07] So.

Speaker 2:
[16:07] Probably because you have a book due.

Speaker 1:
[16:10] The first 16 weeks did not. No. But then...

Speaker 2:
[16:14] Well, yeah, when you're just constantly throwing up, why would it fly by?

Speaker 1:
[16:17] Yeah.

Speaker 2:
[16:18] You know, that's not how the brain works. Well, our kids were asking us...

Speaker 1:
[16:21] I can't believe you just said that, Jason. We have people sensitive. We use pop corn. Oh, pop corn.

Speaker 2:
[16:27] We're popping corn all week. So, our kids were kind of asking us the other night at dinner, I think, whether or not we would have more than this next one. And we're kind of like, no, but your answer has always been, maybe if we... We might adopt. You never know. We're not necessarily planning to, but we might adopt.

Speaker 1:
[16:49] Yeah, that's what I said. I've always wanted to adopt. And our six-year-old, I forget, he just turned six.

Speaker 2:
[16:57] Yeah, I know. I just want to say he's five.

Speaker 1:
[17:00] He was... He got mad.

Speaker 2:
[17:02] Very upset.

Speaker 1:
[17:03] He was like, no.

Speaker 2:
[17:05] We will not be adopting.

Speaker 1:
[17:07] We will never adopt. That would never happen.

Speaker 2:
[17:10] And we're like, when did we make our child anti-adoption?

Speaker 1:
[17:14] Yeah, it was so weird.

Speaker 2:
[17:15] Adoption's great. What are you talking about?

Speaker 1:
[17:18] Grandpa was adopted. We will not adopt. And so we're like, okay, we can talk about it in a few years. It's okay.

Speaker 2:
[17:28] Chill. We will not talk about it.

Speaker 1:
[17:30] This is not happening.

Speaker 2:
[17:32] Yeah.

Speaker 1:
[17:32] Yeah. So then we're like, what's up, buddy? Like, what is the deal? Why are you so against that? And he thought we meant we would put our child up for adoption if we had more that we would-

Speaker 2:
[17:48] If we have more than three, you have to go.

Speaker 1:
[17:50] Not him.

Speaker 2:
[17:52] One of them.

Speaker 1:
[17:52] No, I think he was thinking the baby, like whatever the baby was.

Speaker 2:
[17:57] We have another one we have to give her up.

Speaker 1:
[17:58] We just give him up for adoption.

Speaker 2:
[18:00] Yeah. Well, he's standing up for- Can you imagine for like the solid three or four minutes where we're having this conversation and we're just, it's fine.

Speaker 1:
[18:10] We would probably adopt.

Speaker 2:
[18:12] People give up their baby for adoption to have a fourth all the time. You know, he's just like hearing this and like, I'm gonna lose my sister to adoption. Like, this is crazy. And like, no, buddy, I felt really sad for it. As soon as we told him, like, no, we would take in a child for our own. He's like, oh, you can see his whole body just relaxed. It kind of just melted into the floor. It was like that. I felt really bad for him.

Speaker 1:
[18:43] It was really precious.

Speaker 2:
[18:45] Yeah. Well, anyway, we will not be giving up our children anytime soon, though sometimes I want to.

Speaker 1:
[18:54] Yeah, I think I sent that in a text the other day. I was like, we can keep one.

Speaker 2:
[18:58] You know, Alder's version of adoption might not be so bad this moment. Anyway, I had this topic sort of about relationship investment, like viewing relationships as an investment.

Speaker 1:
[19:17] You kind of thought of this because of your recent loss. Whoa, whoa.

Speaker 2:
[19:24] I mean, I didn't plan to necessarily get into that. Oh, no, it's fine. I don't know. Okay, so first of all, we have to, yeah, I sort of. We kind of have to like, some caveats and clarification, some quid pro quo.

Speaker 1:
[19:43] Quid pro quo?

Speaker 2:
[19:44] What does that mean?

Speaker 1:
[19:45] It's like tit for tat kind of thing.

Speaker 2:
[19:49] What? Well, yeah. All right.

Speaker 1:
[19:54] This is not a quid pro quo situation. And if you're investing in relationships that way, you're doing it wrong.

Speaker 2:
[20:00] Quid pro quo.

Speaker 1:
[20:01] For sure.

Speaker 2:
[20:03] I just felt like the genie said that in the Aladdin, and maybe he didn't.

Speaker 1:
[20:08] Well, yeah, probably like, I'll give you this if you give me that.

Speaker 2:
[20:12] Yeah.

Speaker 1:
[20:12] He might have said that.

Speaker 2:
[20:13] Yeah. Wish for a, you get the wish. Okay.

Speaker 1:
[20:16] Yeah.

Speaker 2:
[20:17] I don't know a lot of things.

Speaker 1:
[20:21] Me either.

Speaker 2:
[20:22] You knew that one and I didn't.

Speaker 1:
[20:24] That's the first time ever.

Speaker 2:
[20:26] I feel slightly embarrassed, but I'm owning it.

Speaker 1:
[20:28] No, don't be embarrassed.

Speaker 2:
[20:29] No, I'm owning it. It's fine.

Speaker 1:
[20:31] What? No, I will never forget that Reddit thread that you told me about like five years ago, or whenever we started the podcast, and someone was like...

Speaker 2:
[20:40] Two years?

Speaker 1:
[20:41] It feels like five years. We're just so close to you guys. We... Someone was like, she clearly just believes whatever and isn't very good at researching or something like that. Like, she's an idiot. So that's what people view me as. So if you have this one moment of not knowing...

Speaker 2:
[21:06] Yeah. Well, in those Reddit threads, I'm just the idiot's husband when I'm mentioned, so... I'm just kidding. Thanks for taking the brunt of that, babe.

Speaker 1:
[21:16] Yeah.

Speaker 2:
[21:17] What it's not, viewing relationships as investments, it's not what can I get from people, okay? That's not what we're trying to say. It's more like, where am I placing my time, my energy, my attention, and what is that producing over time? Not necessarily for yourself, but for yourself and for others.

Speaker 1:
[21:46] And the relationship.

Speaker 2:
[21:48] Right. Right.

Speaker 1:
[21:50] But yeah, that is kind of tricky to talk about, because I was going to compare it to investing money.

Speaker 2:
[21:55] Right. But that's kind of for you and for people.

Speaker 1:
[21:59] It could be for your kids, so that's sort of, if you're talking about investing in relationships in your children, then...

Speaker 2:
[22:07] Right. Well, that works for the children, but it doesn't necessarily work in friendships or other family relationships, because your inheritance is not necessarily going to those people.

Speaker 1:
[22:20] Yeah, but those like feelings of friendship grow because of the investment.

Speaker 2:
[22:26] Right. Well, the investment...

Speaker 1:
[22:27] And sometimes it's hard.

Speaker 2:
[22:29] But you are... Everything is an investment. Everything you do that takes your time and your energy and your attention, it is an investment. Everything you do, and that goes for... And it's... All of you out there, I'm with you on this, okay? That goes for scrolling on your phone. That is a... If you think about it, that's a time investment. And so there are...

Speaker 1:
[22:54] Is it an investment or is it a spend?

Speaker 2:
[22:56] Here's the thing. There are depreciating assets, and there are appreciating assets. You invest in a car, and it depreciates.

Speaker 1:
[23:08] Yeah, we were just talking about this to our kids, because we won a minivan, and...

Speaker 2:
[23:13] Sounds like you said, we won a minivan.

Speaker 1:
[23:15] We won.

Speaker 2:
[23:15] That would be great.

Speaker 1:
[23:16] We did? We won a minivan?

Speaker 2:
[23:19] We won the prices right?

Speaker 1:
[23:21] We want a minivan. Yeah.

Speaker 2:
[23:24] I mean...

Speaker 1:
[23:25] I mean, yeah, does anybody really want...

Speaker 2:
[23:27] A minivan is preferred in our coming situation. It's not like, dude, when I get older, I hope I get a minivan.

Speaker 1:
[23:36] Well, our eight-year-old is like that. He thinks a minivan is the epitome of wealth. He's like, wow, those people must be rich. They have a minivan, and the doors slide.

Speaker 2:
[23:50] With a button.

Speaker 1:
[23:51] Yeah. They're like...

Speaker 2:
[23:52] Which, let's be honest, for those of us who had the sliding doors that you had to yank on the thing, that is a luxury.

Speaker 1:
[23:59] It is.

Speaker 2:
[24:00] It is a luxury.

Speaker 1:
[24:00] The button. I remember the button coming out.

Speaker 2:
[24:03] I never had a button.

Speaker 1:
[24:04] I didn't in my childhood, but my parents... I have younger brothers. They got the button.

Speaker 2:
[24:09] Oh, they got the button?

Speaker 1:
[24:10] Yeah.

Speaker 2:
[24:11] Your parents had a minivan with your little brothers?

Speaker 1:
[24:13] Uh-huh.

Speaker 2:
[24:14] Wow.

Speaker 1:
[24:14] And they even barely had to pull the door handle and it would open on its own. You know, it wasn't like a...

Speaker 2:
[24:20] Yeah, I know that. Yes, I know about that. Pull.

Speaker 1:
[24:21] It was like a prompt.

Speaker 2:
[24:23] No. So ours was more like you had to pull on the door and then hope that it wasn't rusty and that the belt was still connected.

Speaker 1:
[24:30] Right. Yeah.

Speaker 2:
[24:31] And it always had this terrible noise associated.

Speaker 1:
[24:33] And there's only one side that it slid open.

Speaker 2:
[24:36] And right, exactly.

Speaker 1:
[24:38] It was in double sliding.

Speaker 2:
[24:39] You had the small bench seat and then the big bench seat in the back. And then if you didn't close it right, you had to wrench it back open and then slam it, slide. You remember that?

Speaker 1:
[24:52] I remember that. We did have a big gray van with the built-in TV and the captain's chair.

Speaker 2:
[24:59] Oh, like an Astro van type of thing?

Speaker 1:
[25:01] I don't know if that was...

Speaker 2:
[25:02] One of those, though.

Speaker 1:
[25:03] Yeah, one of like the big...

Speaker 2:
[25:04] Where the captain's chair swivel?

Speaker 1:
[25:06] Yeah. Whoa. I don't remember how long we had that. It wasn't very long. It was so cushy. But those van doors opened like car doors, but they were too small. It's like French doors.

Speaker 2:
[25:16] It stresses me out just having an SUV with our back doors and they open. It stresses me out. Sliding doors.

Speaker 1:
[25:24] The kids are crazy.

Speaker 2:
[25:24] Whoever thought of the sliding door for a vehicle is a genius.

Speaker 1:
[25:27] Genius.

Speaker 2:
[25:28] Genius.

Speaker 1:
[25:29] Okay, anyway, we want a minivan, and our eight-year-old can't understand that we're like looking around because we're gonna trade in the SUV, and we're looking for a deal, and like our SUV has depreciated, and so we have to pay extra in order to get a used minivan. So anyway, we were discussing appreciation and depreciation. It's a really good opportunity for him to understand.

Speaker 2:
[25:57] I've been wheeling and dealing with the car guys, with the kids, with me, and it's been a little stressful for them.

Speaker 1:
[26:05] So we had a moment where Jason walked away from a deal, and our kid...

Speaker 2:
[26:11] It was a strategy.

Speaker 1:
[26:12] He lost it, though. He was like so upset.

Speaker 2:
[26:16] He thought that this was the only van in the world.

Speaker 1:
[26:17] That was the only van like that in the world.

Speaker 2:
[26:20] That had those sliding doors and the seats that fell back for tailgating or something.

Speaker 1:
[26:27] He had a really rough day.

Speaker 2:
[26:28] Here's my favorite part about that story. Were you about to tell this?

Speaker 1:
[26:31] No, go ahead.

Speaker 2:
[26:32] Okay, but I'm at a different place, at a different van, car dealer.

Speaker 1:
[26:40] I love that you're taking the kids, where am I in all this? I don't even remember.

Speaker 2:
[26:44] You were doing things. I don't know. Important things. Well, I'm taking the kids haggling over this used van.

Speaker 1:
[26:55] You said, can we get it down to 13?

Speaker 2:
[26:58] Yeah. No, I said, can we get it down to 10?

Speaker 1:
[27:00] Oh.

Speaker 2:
[27:01] And the guy's like, no, I don't think we're going to be that. And Oakes immediately says, how about 12? And I'm like, what are you doing? I'm like under my breath, what are you doing, kid? But I was also so proud of him, because I'm like, this kid's haggling. Immediately the guy's like, I like you, but it's because there was more money. He's like, okay, okay.

Speaker 1:
[27:24] We're walking.

Speaker 2:
[27:25] We walked away from that one too. Yeah, I don't know if we're going to get a good deal on a van or not.

Speaker 1:
[27:31] We're just going to live with our decision to get an SUV with a third row seat.

Speaker 2:
[27:36] I think two weeks with a baby in a third row seat and an SUV, we're going to be like, I don't care how much a van costs.

Speaker 1:
[27:43] The baby isn't going to be in the third row.

Speaker 2:
[27:46] The kid's messing with the seats and then closing the seat on the baby, whatever. It's going to be annoying.

Speaker 1:
[27:52] I don't know why we did that.

Speaker 2:
[27:54] I don't think at the time we were thinking about a third kid, we're like, this is life. Life is perfect. Enter kid three.

Speaker 1:
[28:02] We need a van.

Speaker 2:
[28:06] Life is no longer perfect. We need to get a van. Now it's perfect. Then we can adopt one of our children away.

Speaker 1:
[28:13] That will be perfect again.

Speaker 2:
[28:16] Well, I'm not going to go back to an SUV until some graduations and moving in marriage happens.

Speaker 1:
[28:21] Yeah.

Speaker 2:
[28:21] It's like, okay, then we'll know.

Speaker 1:
[28:24] Whatever van we end up with, which we're looking at Honda Odyssey's. If you have a Honda Odyssey for sale, let us know, but also how you feel about it. It was so funny on my way to Forest Friends on Friday. There were three Honda Odysseys in my Forest Friends group.

Speaker 2:
[28:43] Oh, wow.

Speaker 1:
[28:44] In front of me.

Speaker 2:
[28:45] Wow.

Speaker 1:
[28:45] I was coveting a little.

Speaker 2:
[28:47] It's like, were they all like different colors?

Speaker 1:
[28:50] One was white. Yeah. One was white. One was beige. No, two were beige-ish, you know. Okay.

Speaker 2:
[28:59] Thank you for that.

Speaker 1:
[29:00] Yeah.

Speaker 2:
[29:01] It took some thought to... Nobody ever gets the red. You don't really see... Some blues.

Speaker 1:
[29:06] You see some blues. You almost got the blue.

Speaker 2:
[29:07] That was... Well, couldn't make a deal.

Speaker 1:
[29:10] Yeah.

Speaker 2:
[29:10] I walked away.

Speaker 1:
[29:12] Blue isn't my favorite. It was a light blue.

Speaker 2:
[29:15] Yeah.

Speaker 1:
[29:16] I feel like it gets dated quickly. White seems like a...

Speaker 2:
[29:20] Vans get dated quickly. Just buy a van, it's dated.

Speaker 1:
[29:25] Yeah.

Speaker 2:
[29:26] It's fine. It is what it is. You have a van. Everyone knows about what your life looks like. Up out. You get a van, it's like, okay, yeah, we know. It's chaos, and they're doing things. They're traveling with a bunch of people.

Speaker 1:
[29:42] I will say, we have not allowed the children to have any snacks in the car.

Speaker 2:
[29:48] It's been hard.

Speaker 1:
[29:51] Since we got our car cleaned professionally.

Speaker 2:
[29:55] We did, yeah. And they use good stuff. They use good chemicals, apparently.

Speaker 1:
[30:03] And anyway, no, I loved it.

Speaker 2:
[30:06] Yeah.

Speaker 1:
[30:07] We can be type A. We just have to be.

Speaker 2:
[30:10] It's crazy.

Speaker 1:
[30:11] Mean.

Speaker 2:
[30:12] Well, not mean.

Speaker 1:
[30:13] No, you can't have a snack in it.

Speaker 2:
[30:14] No, we just literally, if they have food, it's like we're standing outside the car. It's like, either put it in your mouth or put it in this basket, you know.

Speaker 1:
[30:24] Oaks loves to eat seaweed. And he just like, like ran and grabbed a pack of seaweed when we were headed out the door. And I was like, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah.

Speaker 2:
[30:35] That stuff gets everywhere.

Speaker 1:
[30:37] I know.

Speaker 2:
[30:37] Just flakes off. And yeah.

Speaker 1:
[30:39] It's crazy.

Speaker 2:
[30:40] Probably full of microplastics.

Speaker 1:
[30:42] Yeah, I think about that.

Speaker 2:
[30:43] From the ocean.

Speaker 1:
[30:44] Yeah.

Speaker 2:
[30:44] You know, even if it is organic, it's like, well, is that organic plastic bottles that are in it? I don't think so. There was a study done, over 200 families. I'm not sure what the study was, but the idea, and you read up on this a little bit, was that, I believe, was it kids who, like...

Speaker 1:
[31:10] Have a close relationship with their parents as adults.

Speaker 2:
[31:13] Okay, that was the goal, to see kind of a number there. Did you see any conclusions on that? Whereas other than, we have a list of the conclusions that they came up with. Is it just, there was no 45% of children who...

Speaker 1:
[31:30] I can't remember.

Speaker 2:
[31:31] I don't think it's like that. It's more like these are the things you need to have in your home if you want your children to be close to you when they are adults. Right, okay. And I found this list very interesting.

Speaker 1:
[31:50] This is the investment into...

Speaker 2:
[31:52] This is for children in particular. There are other parts to this.

Speaker 1:
[31:57] Yeah, and I'm sure in other relationships these apply.

Speaker 2:
[32:01] Sure, sure. Well, we can talk about friendship before we jump into this.

Speaker 1:
[32:06] Okay.

Speaker 2:
[32:07] Friendship is a little tough. But we sort of talked about this for me on my perspective a little bit in that I do look at life as an investment. And so I don't want to say that in terms of like I'm looking at everything mathematically. That's not what I mean. What I mean is...

Speaker 1:
[32:28] Where do you want to invest your time? Because you only have so much when you're not working or whatever. So like in your free time, you want to spend it with your wife and kids.

Speaker 2:
[32:39] Who are my number one and two to invest my time.

Speaker 1:
[32:43] Right. So you're less motivated to invest in friendships.

Speaker 2:
[32:48] Yes.

Speaker 1:
[32:49] Because of the time factor, but you could really benefit from it.

Speaker 2:
[32:54] Right. Friendships are definitely something worth investing in. But a new friendship takes time. It's hard because it's like investing in that new company. It's like we don't know if it's going to do good.

Speaker 1:
[33:07] Yeah.

Speaker 2:
[33:07] And then you invest too long, and then it just blows up in two years. That was a bad investment.

Speaker 1:
[33:15] Yeah. Yeah, that has happened.

Speaker 2:
[33:18] Has that ever happened to you? It hasn't happened to me because I've never invested in anyone that long, except my wife and children. No, I need to invest in friends. I want to. I hate saying that. I know it sounds cold and calculated. That's weird, and it's not what I mean. I need to spend time with other guys at some point.

Speaker 1:
[33:40] Yeah, it's good. It's healthy.

Speaker 2:
[33:41] At some point.

Speaker 1:
[33:41] It's a good thing.

Speaker 2:
[33:42] I'm kind of just waiting for my kids to grow up and be their friends. It's like, oh yeah, you want to go hang out? Yeah, dad.

Speaker 1:
[33:49] No, you have a few cool dad friends around.

Speaker 2:
[33:52] Yeah, I do. They're very cool. Yeah, I like them. I don't talk to them that much.

Speaker 1:
[33:55] They're like birthday party friends so far.

Speaker 2:
[33:58] I see them at a lot of event things, but we haven't, you know.

Speaker 1:
[34:04] Got to take the next step.

Speaker 2:
[34:05] Yeah, summer. This summer. Unless I'm busy.

Speaker 1:
[34:12] They're all busy. That's the thing. They're all doing their own lives and their own kids and their own things, businesses and...

Speaker 2:
[34:19] I know. It's hard. And if it's not working out... Here's the other thing. If it's not like, this is great, it's like, how long are we going to do this?

Speaker 1:
[34:32] See, I've been in a few friendships like that, where it's like I kept meeting up and this was several years ago.

Speaker 2:
[34:41] Just to show anybody who's listening, it's not you.

Speaker 1:
[34:46] It's not you.

Speaker 2:
[34:47] Unless you're that one from several years ago.

Speaker 1:
[34:50] No, I don't think she's listening. And there's nothing wrong with her. It just wasn't like the best pairing, but neither of us had anyone else. So we just kept meeting anyway, and our kids got along, so that was good. They had somebody to play with, but personally, I didn't feel the spark in the friendship.

Speaker 2:
[35:17] It's kind of like you really need groceries, but all you have anywhere nearby is a 7-Eleven. So you go to the 7-Eleven and you eat.

Speaker 1:
[35:30] But you're also the 7-Eleven to them. You can feel it.

Speaker 2:
[35:33] Right, you guys are 7-Elevens to each other, but the grocery store is like an hour and a half away. And it's like, I can't do that every day, but the 7-Eleven's got some pretty good noodles.

Speaker 1:
[35:45] Right.

Speaker 2:
[35:45] Yeah.

Speaker 1:
[35:46] We've been there.

Speaker 2:
[35:47] Yeah, in Korea. That was our life for our first year in Korea.

Speaker 1:
[35:51] We didn't realize that there were real grocery stores out there because nobody would tell us.

Speaker 2:
[35:55] Listen, there's a language barrier.

Speaker 1:
[35:57] What do you want?

Speaker 2:
[35:58] I can't read that. And when I can, I can't tell that it says Lotte Mart.

Speaker 1:
[36:03] We ate a lot of cheesy ramen.

Speaker 2:
[36:06] What is a Lotte Mart supposed to even be?

Speaker 1:
[36:09] Yeah.

Speaker 2:
[36:09] It's giant, and you walk in, and it's finally, oh, there is food.

Speaker 1:
[36:13] Right, people.

Speaker 2:
[36:16] And it was an hour away, but, you know.

Speaker 1:
[36:18] It wasn't. Well, it was 40 minutes.

Speaker 2:
[36:20] It is. When you get lost on the bus system that you can't read.

Speaker 1:
[36:23] Yeah.

Speaker 2:
[36:24] Anyway, go ahead. So friend is a 7-Eleven. You met your friend at a 7-Eleven.

Speaker 1:
[36:30] I thought that was pretty great, but no. Yeah. So when you're just like you keep investing time and experiences and then it doesn't you don't feel anything in it and it's not going anywhere.

Speaker 2:
[36:47] Yeah.

Speaker 1:
[36:48] But she knew she was moving away.

Speaker 2:
[36:51] That also to the grocery store, that also, you know, plays in and then you're left with yourself your own 7-Eleven and but no, you are a grocery store.

Speaker 1:
[37:09] Thanks.

Speaker 2:
[37:09] Don't sell yourself short. You're no 7-Eleven.

Speaker 1:
[37:13] I appreciate that.

Speaker 2:
[37:14] I'm sorry. I'm not, okay. Faith as an investment. I'm really bad about this. Investing in my faith. I really am. Because the days just, it's like, we have this, I have this plan of like, you know, I'm gonna actually read my Bible this week. I'm gonna spend time in prayer. I'm going to like, you know, and then it's like, well, I wake up, I was tired, I spend a week working, and I'm just terrible at this.

Speaker 1:
[37:53] Yeah.

Speaker 2:
[37:53] I'm terrible at it.

Speaker 1:
[37:55] But I feel like, so I'm not very intentional about sitting down and having like this prayer time.

Speaker 2:
[38:04] Yeah.

Speaker 1:
[38:04] But I do pray a lot throughout the day.

Speaker 2:
[38:09] Yeah.

Speaker 1:
[38:09] But it's very disjointed and segmented, and like in the moment, and I'm not sure if it's honoring.

Speaker 2:
[38:16] Yeah.

Speaker 1:
[38:17] You know? Yeah. And it probably like you're supposed to pray with Thanksgiving. And I'm probably more like, can we get this? Give me, give me, give me.

Speaker 2:
[38:28] You know, to survive too.

Speaker 1:
[38:30] Yeah.

Speaker 2:
[38:31] I know you're writing about that in your book a little bit.

Speaker 1:
[38:34] Yeah.

Speaker 2:
[38:35] And it's just, yeah, where I've read, I got a little bit of a preview so far. But anyway, well, it's just like, yeah, in certain stages of life, prayer looks like, Lord, please get me through the day. Rather than I have this really long, wonderful devotion time before the kids wake up. And it's like, dude, I couldn't get up before the kids. They had to wake me up. They've been up for two hours. That's me. I'm joking. That's never happened. I'm sorry.

Speaker 1:
[39:12] It was a joke. I'm just joking.

Speaker 2:
[39:15] All right, families, if you want your kids to like you as an adult, the study says this, the first one. You have to let them know that their feelings matter. I struggle with this one quite a bit.

Speaker 1:
[39:34] Yeah, I don't struggle with that one.

Speaker 2:
[39:40] Well, I just feel like there's...

Speaker 1:
[39:42] Except when it comes to home school. I'm like, just do it.

Speaker 2:
[39:47] Yeah. You get a little bit of a fight in home school.

Speaker 1:
[39:50] The math.

Speaker 2:
[39:51] Math mostly.

Speaker 1:
[39:52] Question.

Speaker 2:
[39:53] Yeah.

Speaker 1:
[39:54] Why are you staring at your hand?

Speaker 2:
[39:56] His feelings matter.

Speaker 1:
[39:58] Does it, though, in math? No. In math? No. I don't think so.

Speaker 2:
[40:02] No. Feelings matter in math.

Speaker 1:
[40:03] No.

Speaker 2:
[40:04] No. Yeah. Sometimes I know my kids are doing this... I don't even know how to explain it. Manipulating, using high emotions. But I think that that's a little strong because I don't think they're always just sitting there manipulating. But I know that they don't necessarily feel what they're feeling.

Speaker 1:
[40:30] What they say they're feeling.

Speaker 2:
[40:32] What they say they're feeling.

Speaker 1:
[40:33] Okay. Like Alder has a cut on his knee, and it's like a pretty decent gash. But... And it didn't... Like he didn't cry when he got it. Yeah. The initial. And today, he busted it open while he was being disobedient about getting out of the car. And he didn't even realize that it was bleeding, but you were like, don't get blood on the seats. And then because we're trying to keep our car perfect, you know.

Speaker 2:
[41:02] If you're going to bleed, bleed outside the car.

Speaker 1:
[41:05] No, he was wanting to climb through to the front seat and go out the driver's side door. So it was like just anyway.

Speaker 2:
[41:12] Yeah.

Speaker 1:
[41:14] He didn't even realize it was bleeding. But when he realized it, he like got on the ground and he's like, I can't, I can't.

Speaker 2:
[41:23] Also, I had told him to like clean up some of their outside toys and put it in the garage. So it's like, well, there's that added. He's like, their feelings absolutely do not matter in that situation.

Speaker 1:
[41:38] So it's a delicate balance.

Speaker 2:
[41:40] Yeah.

Speaker 1:
[41:40] And one of our children is very sensitive to everything and like hates change.

Speaker 2:
[41:47] Change. Yeah.

Speaker 1:
[41:48] Any kind of change.

Speaker 2:
[41:49] I'm surprised he wants a minivan.

Speaker 1:
[41:52] Until you like talk him into it and show him all of the pros.

Speaker 2:
[41:57] The tailgating seats. And now I can't even hardly keep an SUV.

Speaker 1:
[42:03] Yeah. Now like the SUV is the worst thing in the world.

Speaker 2:
[42:06] Worst car you've ever bought.

Speaker 1:
[42:08] Yeah. Every day. When are we getting a minivan? But so his feelings don't matter either.

Speaker 2:
[42:16] But it feels like it though. It's like, oh my goodness. We're going to try to get one.

Speaker 1:
[42:22] Let me be. Yeah. How do you like invest in that way?

Speaker 2:
[42:27] Yeah. Letting them know that we do in certainly most moments, especially when there's like actual things happening. But that's one of those things that you can't, it's not a blank. None of these are going to be a blanket. Like always, their feelings matter. My, not all of my feelings matter.

Speaker 1:
[42:46] Right. I don't want to do the dishes.

Speaker 2:
[42:48] Yeah. Not all of your feelings matter. I do think that. But no, that's just how it is. Not everybody's feelings matter. Everybody's feelings matter most of the time, not all the time.

Speaker 1:
[43:05] Right. We're irrational human beings, imperfect.

Speaker 2:
[43:09] Right. But we're trying to get our kids to like us as adults. So, all right, the next one is, choose connection over control. I do this perfectly.

Speaker 1:
[43:22] These are very hard. They're very hard to do because-

Speaker 2:
[43:25] They're hard at certain ages too.

Speaker 1:
[43:26] You expect obedience.

Speaker 2:
[43:29] Yes, but you're not asking for a lot. That's what the problem is.

Speaker 1:
[43:34] Okay.

Speaker 2:
[43:35] You're not asking for a lot. When we say we expect obedience, it's not like we're just, huh, you have to do this, child. You have to be this way. You have to be this. It's like, no, hey, could you pick up your pencil for me? You threw it on the ground when you left to go to the bathroom. Could you pick it up? No, and kick it across the room. Okay.

Speaker 1:
[43:56] That's not usually our fight, but-

Speaker 2:
[43:58] No, I'm just throwing-

Speaker 1:
[43:59] You're throwing out the most obtuse-

Speaker 2:
[44:03] Obtuse?

Speaker 1:
[44:04] Is obtuse not the right-

Speaker 2:
[44:06] I'm sorry. Excuse me. I didn't know I was dumb.

Speaker 1:
[44:10] Your friendship is a 7-11. Okay, Jason.

Speaker 2:
[44:15] Didn't know I was so obtuse.

Speaker 1:
[44:18] No. Now, it's more like- but I do think about this.

Speaker 2:
[44:22] Quit pro quo over here.

Speaker 1:
[44:23] We let our kids-

Speaker 2:
[44:25] Quit pro quo is obtuse.

Speaker 1:
[44:27] Our kids are kind of feral at home.

Speaker 2:
[44:30] Yeah.

Speaker 1:
[44:31] They can basically do what they want until we want them to do something.

Speaker 2:
[44:36] Right.

Speaker 1:
[44:37] So, just running around wild like-

Speaker 2:
[44:41] I mean, they're playing.

Speaker 1:
[44:42] Yeah, they're playing.

Speaker 2:
[44:43] Burning houses down across the road.

Speaker 1:
[44:46] It's not Lord of the Flies over here.

Speaker 2:
[44:47] But I will say, Oaks had his bow and arrow, and I walked out there and they were shooting it as far as they could. It's like, oh, it went to the rainbow driveway, which is like three houses down. So it shot his arrow, really? That's a little feral.

Speaker 1:
[45:03] Yeah.

Speaker 2:
[45:03] That was a little out of control.

Speaker 1:
[45:05] Well, I've always wondered why they struggle so much in stores. They really struggle.

Speaker 2:
[45:12] It's a big box.

Speaker 1:
[45:13] In stores. And I think it's just that they're so confined and having to walk through these fluorescent lit aisles. Why would I have to stand next to you? Yeah, when we never do that. The only time that they have to sit quietly is at church every week, and they do that great. They do that great.

Speaker 2:
[45:33] Yeah, it's because they don't go to school or they're homeschooled. That's part of it because there's not... I mean, you're in school. If you can't be in a structure, you are asked to leave. Yeah. That's it. If you can't sit down when you're supposed to, if you can't be quiet when you're supposed to, if you can't be in line.

Speaker 1:
[45:57] But there's still the ability to have connection with control, I think.

Speaker 2:
[46:03] Yeah. I'm not saying it's... Well, I doubt they're saying you never have control.

Speaker 1:
[46:08] Because boundaries are so important for children to feel safe and loved.

Speaker 2:
[46:13] I think what this is saying is don't be a control freak, instead connect with them.

Speaker 1:
[46:19] Yeah.

Speaker 2:
[46:21] But it seems easy to say, but it's easy to stray in to control freakiness. That sounds weird. But yeah. Give them a voice in their own life.

Speaker 1:
[46:36] Yeah, so that feels really common, especially in toddlerhood, letting them pick out their clothes and their jacket. And just giving them choices and...

Speaker 2:
[46:49] The only time I go against their choices is like they put on a completely filthy shirt or something. It's like, no, you can't wear that.

Speaker 1:
[46:59] I don't think they usually choose that. Well, this morning, that one had holes in it. No.

Speaker 2:
[47:04] They always do.

Speaker 1:
[47:05] It's not filthy. It's just...

Speaker 2:
[47:06] Stained.

Speaker 1:
[47:07] Yeah, stained or...

Speaker 2:
[47:08] If you have boys, I bet if half of their shirts are not stained with something, then I don't think you have boys.

Speaker 1:
[47:19] I think...

Speaker 2:
[47:20] They are messy.

Speaker 1:
[47:21] Yeah, but no, we don't give our kids a choice in food. We serve them. It is what it is. You're not getting something else.

Speaker 2:
[47:33] How do you feel about that? Because I see parents and there's nothing wrong with parents that do this, because it's their own strategy. It works for the life. I'm not going to judge them. But I think it was because of our life in Korea. And we've kind of talked about this before, but these kids eat something I wouldn't eat. They're eating fish head soup and stuff, and they're gagging, and they're eating it anyway, on their own volition. They're doing it on their own. I'm not having to tell them to eat it.

Speaker 1:
[48:04] Yeah. Well, they know that they're supposed to, because it's healthy for them.

Speaker 2:
[48:07] And it is what they are given to eat. And I understand that that's a cultural thing, but so everybody's doing that, and so that's what is expected.

Speaker 1:
[48:15] Well, not everybody's gagging. They just develop their palate.

Speaker 2:
[48:18] Sure.

Speaker 1:
[48:18] And when they're adults, they're like really versatile eaters and can eat anything, and they're super healthy people. Yes.

Speaker 2:
[48:24] Yeah, I'm not saying this wrong. I think, and I'm saying the reason, I think seeing that put us in a mind of, no, this is your dinner.

Speaker 1:
[48:34] You're gonna eat it.

Speaker 2:
[48:35] This is what you eat.

Speaker 1:
[48:36] You don't have to like it.

Speaker 2:
[48:38] Yeah. And if you're full, you can stop. But you, this is where your feelings don't matter because you're lying to me about being full.

Speaker 1:
[48:47] Well, that, like Alder hates eggs, he says.

Speaker 2:
[48:50] He's always like, I made him scrambled eggs this morning.

Speaker 1:
[48:54] Yeah, this morning.

Speaker 2:
[48:55] And you know what I did? I said, these are the kind of eggs you actually like. Oh, really? Yeah. Okay. And I gave him some scrambled eggs. I always give him eggs in like some kind of a, you know.

Speaker 1:
[49:08] Breakfast burrito thing.

Speaker 2:
[49:09] Breakfast burrito. And he's like, oh, the egg. He gets to the egg and he's like, ugh. I'm like, I barely put any in there. But I'm like, these are the kind of eggs you actually like. These are scrambled eggs.

Speaker 1:
[49:20] And there's straight eggs on the plate.

Speaker 2:
[49:22] Yeah. And he's like, okay. And he ate them.

Speaker 1:
[49:24] All of them.

Speaker 2:
[49:25] Loved them. He's like, I really like those eggs, dada. And I said, those are the eggs I put in the burrito, kid. Your feelings don't matter. Well, he was surprised. So maybe he'll start liking the burritos now. Now, this next one, I think a lot of people aren't good at, that I am actually surprised that I'm pretty decent at.

Speaker 1:
[49:53] Okay.

Speaker 2:
[49:53] And you don't actually ever have to do it.

Speaker 1:
[49:55] What?

Speaker 2:
[49:56] Own your mistakes.

Speaker 1:
[49:58] That's not true. I do. I do all the time. The other day, this is like a terrible thing that I'm going to admit.

Speaker 2:
[50:06] You're going to admit this. I know what you're going to admit. And you're going to admit this?

Speaker 1:
[50:10] I am.

Speaker 2:
[50:10] This is crazy. This is not a good way to keep your kids liking you in their adulthood.

Speaker 1:
[50:14] This is not a good way at all.

Speaker 2:
[50:17] This is drama.

Speaker 1:
[50:17] Our kids were struggling in paying attention in math. It's like such a fight always.

Speaker 2:
[50:27] Are you surprised, though? We, math, math.

Speaker 1:
[50:31] I know, but it's not that they can't do it. And it's not that it's even hard for them. Oh, well, it was because I couldn't do it. They understand it. They're just griping about it and not doing it, sitting there.

Speaker 2:
[50:43] Yeah.

Speaker 1:
[50:44] Anyway, so my older son was doing like an assessment page to make sure that he understood. And he's like not even trying at all. And I was like, if you're not going to do it, then you're just going to have to go to school. And he was, I'm not going to go to school. You know, he got whatever. And then he sat there and wasn't doing it. And so I picked up my phone and I said, call the school. They were both freaking out. They both lost it. I mean, call the school, call the school. Like, that's so traumatizing.

Speaker 2:
[51:33] They're like, it's like, what view do they have of school? We did not set out to teach them that school is basically like a prison place or something. They're adopting me to school.

Speaker 1:
[51:50] But they were losing it. And I had, like, I walked away because I was trying not to laugh, which is really bad. But then I, you know, I had to later apologize and be like, listen, I shouldn't have done that. I shouldn't have told you I would take you to school. I shouldn't have said that. It was a weak moment.

Speaker 2:
[52:09] Can you imagine their therapy sessions?

Speaker 1:
[52:11] Like, my mom said she was going to send me to school.

Speaker 2:
[52:15] She said, we'd have to go to school. The therapist was like, what?

Speaker 1:
[52:21] They were losing it. Have you heard about school? You heard them, right?

Speaker 2:
[52:25] Upstairs.

Speaker 1:
[52:26] You were upstairs. You came down and you were like, what is going on?

Speaker 2:
[52:29] What in the world? I told them they were going to school. Oh, okay.

Speaker 1:
[52:33] Well, it's funny because I didn't even tell Alder he was going to school. It still looks, but Alder was just as upset, grabbing my arm trying to get my phone out of my hand. Yeah.

Speaker 2:
[52:44] Call the school.

Speaker 1:
[52:45] Call the school. What school would you like?

Speaker 2:
[52:51] What are your parenting fails? Well, I said I'm good at it. I think I am because I recognize I'm really trying to own my mistakes. I'm conscious. It's one thing I'm very conscious. I'm not as conscious about the first ones nearly as much as I should be, but I'm very conscious about, I think it's very important to apologize to your kids when you've done something wrong. You're mirroring, you're not mirroring, you're setting an example that hopefully they mirror, and you're showing them like, listen, I'm not perfect. You're not perfect. We all make mistakes. I shouldn't have tried to threaten you with school. That is one area where I'm pretty honed in.

Speaker 1:
[53:47] You've had a lot of practice.

Speaker 2:
[53:48] I've had a lot of practice, so much. It's like if I didn't know my mistakes, I would just be a complete jerk.

Speaker 1:
[53:57] I've had to do it a lot more in this pregnancy. I'm like, wait, I don't have nearly the patience that I normally have.

Speaker 2:
[54:04] I wouldn't either, growing a human.

Speaker 1:
[54:08] But no, it's not that. It's something different. It's just like, yeah, my hormones are just crazy and I can't. I just don't have the patience that I once had.

Speaker 2:
[54:17] Wouldn't it be great?

Speaker 1:
[54:18] And I get angry.

Speaker 2:
[54:19] Everyone, just to have, well, I shouldn't say this. Most of the audience are women. Just to have this excuse of this obscure thing called hormones that nobody understands. It's like, it's my hormones.

Speaker 1:
[54:31] I'm growing. I have no patience. I'm growing.

Speaker 2:
[54:35] That's what I said. You're like, no, it's my hormones.

Speaker 1:
[54:38] Well, yeah, because I'm growing a person.

Speaker 2:
[54:39] I know.

Speaker 1:
[54:40] That's what I was saying.

Speaker 2:
[54:41] That's what I was saying.

Speaker 1:
[54:42] Okay.

Speaker 2:
[54:43] Should have just gone with my first thing.

Speaker 1:
[54:45] Yeah, that's it.

Speaker 2:
[54:46] All right. Quality time together is a daily habit.

Speaker 1:
[54:51] That seems pretty no brainer.

Speaker 2:
[54:54] Yeah.

Speaker 1:
[54:54] But then it's hard to fit it in because it's so easy to be like, no, we have to do this, no, we have to do that.

Speaker 2:
[55:01] I think a lot of times we mistake what quality time is because-

Speaker 1:
[55:04] Yeah, we always read books at night.

Speaker 2:
[55:06] Right.

Speaker 1:
[55:06] And that is quality time.

Speaker 2:
[55:08] Yeah.

Speaker 1:
[55:09] But I don't really consider quality time.

Speaker 2:
[55:13] Honestly, sometimes just being there and present and in the same room together is quality time. I mean, you're not necessarily insurrecting-

Speaker 1:
[55:21] I think if you're not looking at screens, yeah. But if screens enter the picture, that's just time.

Speaker 2:
[55:27] I think you could be reading a book, and they could be reading a book in your together.

Speaker 1:
[55:32] I feel like you need to be doing something similar.

Speaker 2:
[55:35] I'm saying that that can count.

Speaker 1:
[55:37] Like sharing a meal together for sure.

Speaker 2:
[55:40] Yeah.

Speaker 1:
[55:41] But-

Speaker 2:
[55:41] Playing, obviously, reading to each other. We read The Hobbit this year. And those are my favorite times, by the fire, reading The Hobbit to the kids. I felt like that was quality time.

Speaker 1:
[55:52] Yeah. We're reading The Sign of the Beaver now. I think I already said that.

Speaker 2:
[55:55] Yeah.

Speaker 1:
[55:56] For the book club.

Speaker 2:
[55:58] Yeah.

Speaker 1:
[55:59] Still in it. Yeah.

Speaker 2:
[56:02] I haven't been with you on this one.

Speaker 1:
[56:03] Yeah.

Speaker 2:
[56:04] I've been waiting around for the sequel to Little Britches. I want to hear that one.

Speaker 1:
[56:09] You weren't there.

Speaker 2:
[56:10] This bit, I heard about it, a lot of it.

Speaker 1:
[56:14] No.

Speaker 2:
[56:14] The second book.

Speaker 1:
[56:15] Yeah. We've already read most of it.

Speaker 2:
[56:18] Really?

Speaker 1:
[56:18] Yeah.

Speaker 2:
[56:19] Oh.

Speaker 1:
[56:20] We didn't finish it, but it's not as good.

Speaker 2:
[56:23] Guess I need to show up more.

Speaker 1:
[56:26] You missed it.

Speaker 2:
[56:28] Let them be themselves without judgment. I mean, are we saying we agree or disagree because this was a study and they're like, they proved it.

Speaker 1:
[56:41] Yeah. Well, yeah.

Speaker 2:
[56:44] Yeah.

Speaker 1:
[56:44] Yeah. Their personality bends, but I think sometimes like...

Speaker 2:
[56:50] Well, there's a difference between correction and judgment.

Speaker 1:
[56:53] Sure. But sometimes our kids are weird as our kids, right?

Speaker 2:
[57:01] Yeah.

Speaker 1:
[57:02] And I have tried to tell my kids when we're in a social situation, and they're acting very homeschooled or something, and I'm like, tone it down a little.

Speaker 2:
[57:14] Tone down the home. Can you dial back the home school by about 10? I'm like, being so weird.

Speaker 1:
[57:20] I hope they know I'm not judging them, but I am trying to help them be a little more socially appropriate.

Speaker 2:
[57:29] Yeah, a lot of these are a little bit like, don't be a parent so much. It's like, but you have to teach them.

Speaker 1:
[57:36] Yeah, you have to teach them. Yeah. I can, I've met people.

Speaker 2:
[57:41] It's a balance.

Speaker 1:
[57:41] I have met people who their parents just let them be unapologetically themselves, and it's not always the best.

Speaker 2:
[57:49] Yeah, because you have to teach the way, there's social norms.

Speaker 1:
[57:56] Social norms.

Speaker 2:
[57:57] But I'm not saying like, but there's also this idea that like, we'll forget social norms, because society stinks. And it's like, well, okay, but you still live in a culture, and it's, yes, half the culture has gone down the toilet. I understand that, but it's like, you don't let your kid just belch or something as loud as they possibly can at a restaurant.

Speaker 1:
[58:23] Right.

Speaker 2:
[58:24] That's unapologetically them. It's like, well, I'm not going to allow you on my watch to grow up to be a jerk.

Speaker 1:
[58:30] Sure.

Speaker 2:
[58:31] You know what I mean?

Speaker 1:
[58:32] That's manners.

Speaker 2:
[58:33] I know, but that unapologetically them. Oh, that's Harry. He loves to burp.

Speaker 1:
[58:41] Yeah.

Speaker 2:
[58:41] It's like, no, Harry, stop burping.

Speaker 1:
[58:45] I don't think that's the same thing. But yeah. Yeah.

Speaker 2:
[58:50] Okay.

Speaker 1:
[58:50] Okay. Whatever. Yeah.

Speaker 2:
[58:52] It's quid pro quo. Whatever. That now means, you do you.

Speaker 1:
[59:00] Yeah.

Speaker 2:
[59:01] No.

Speaker 1:
[59:01] Thanks.

Speaker 2:
[59:01] Okay. Protect the relationship versus being right.

Speaker 1:
[59:09] Yeah. These all actually, what kind of study was this?

Speaker 2:
[59:12] I don't know, but it sounds like our kids aren't going to like us when we're older. New fear unlocked.

Speaker 1:
[59:21] Yeah. Personally, from what I observe in other relationships of adults who are very close to their parents and seeing it, I think what it boils down to is quality time and caring.

Speaker 2:
[59:39] I think that's one of the big ones.

Speaker 1:
[59:40] Caring.

Speaker 2:
[59:41] Giving them a voice.

Speaker 1:
[59:42] Giving them a voice.

Speaker 2:
[59:43] So all of these. Yeah.

Speaker 1:
[59:45] Okay.

Speaker 2:
[59:46] Some measure of all of these.

Speaker 1:
[59:48] Some measure.

Speaker 2:
[59:49] You can't take these and think all in. Right. They're all in on every one of these. You can't. It's some measure of all of these.

Speaker 1:
[59:59] Okay.

Speaker 2:
[60:00] And so, yeah. Yeah. Protect the relationship versus being right. Basically, don't be a jerk to your kids.

Speaker 1:
[60:10] Right. I mean, I was just telling you today.

Speaker 2:
[60:13] Yeah. I did miss the sequel to Little Britches, so I feel like...

Speaker 1:
[60:18] No. I was just telling you today what you interrupted Alder because he was trying to be empathetic to... Oaks. In a way. Where was I like, go outside! Yeah, you were like, just go!

Speaker 2:
[60:34] Just go!

Speaker 1:
[60:37] And I was like... Would you talk to a peer that way? Or would you talk to someone else's child that way? Not that I was trying to correct you, and it wasn't in front of the children, just so you know. But it made, like, I can see myself in you when you do things, and I'm like... And then I'm like, I did that! You know, like, I can see...

Speaker 2:
[61:04] Call the school!

Speaker 1:
[61:05] It's obviously easier to see someone else's flaws. Like, you don't have as much grace for someone else.

Speaker 2:
[61:12] Sure. I mean, I don't see any flaws...

Speaker 1:
[61:13] I don't know about your hormones.

Speaker 2:
[61:15] In you. I see no flaws in you. You are the perfect parent.

Speaker 1:
[61:20] Yeah, thanks.

Speaker 2:
[61:22] All right. Yeah. Well, you did mention earlier a story that kind of brought this on, just the thought of it. And it was about my grandma, just a little bit of reflection there. There's always a story that my grandma told me. And it was just always reminding me of that time I spent with her. My parents were, my dad was getting a transplant. And so I went to their house for an entire summer at five years old. And it was a glorious time. I had ice cream every night. I watched whatever movies I wanted. It was just, it was awesome. It was...

Speaker 1:
[62:02] And you guys really had a sweet time together.

Speaker 2:
[62:05] It was great. And over the years, and this is nothing against her, I think there were a lot of situations that were out of her control. I think there were a lot of things that I'll never know about. I don't know the relationships between my parents and them and how... I know there were...

Speaker 1:
[62:25] There was some complex feelings between your mom and her mother-in-law.

Speaker 2:
[62:30] Yeah.

Speaker 1:
[62:31] So which is a common thing.

Speaker 2:
[62:33] I have zero idea to what extent.

Speaker 1:
[62:36] Sure.

Speaker 2:
[62:36] I am not aware of any... I can't talk to any of them about it. They're all gone. But the thought came to me was that over the years, we always just went back to that time.

Speaker 1:
[62:51] That one time.

Speaker 2:
[62:52] That one summer.

Speaker 1:
[62:53] Right.

Speaker 2:
[62:54] When we would talk, she would always talk about, I just loved that time I had with you, that summer I spent with you. And one day, not that long ago, it just hit me. It's like, there have been 34 summers since that summer. 34. And we never did anything like that again. And so for 34 years, we keep coming back to that one thing. And I realized, I loved her, and I was close to her in certain ways. But I know, looking back, it wasn't the relationship that it could have been. Some of that was mine as an adult. I mean, I left, we left the family. We went everywhere. I understand that, but I mean, okay. Go back to five-year-old to 18-year-old, not much happened. And I would say this, I don't think it is a grandchild's responsibility to have a relationship with their grandparent. And it's not the parent. Now, the parents can facilitate it, and they can certainly be a stumbling block to that relationship. But at some point, the grandparents have to step in and say, hey, I'm going to spend time with my grandchildren. I'm going to take that effort.

Speaker 1:
[64:28] To make these memories.

Speaker 2:
[64:29] To make memories.

Speaker 1:
[64:31] Not just that one time or not just, yeah.

Speaker 2:
[64:34] Well, that's the thing. I want, like, between five-

Speaker 1:
[64:37] But it's the same with parents.

Speaker 2:
[64:38] It is, it is.

Speaker 1:
[64:40] You can't expect that your kids can live on a one week vacation where you're present.

Speaker 2:
[64:47] Yeah, you got to make memories in that. That's where it's so important to make traditions and-

Speaker 1:
[64:53] And the daily investments.

Speaker 2:
[64:55] Yeah.

Speaker 1:
[64:55] The daily time.

Speaker 2:
[64:56] Yeah.

Speaker 1:
[64:57] Even when you don't want to do it. You're so good at that, Jason. You are so good. The kids don't come- Oh, you are too. No, the kids don't come to me to play soccer, to practice. They come to you, and you're, like, in the middle of something, and you don't want to do it. You don't.

Speaker 2:
[65:14] Yeah.

Speaker 1:
[65:14] And you do it every time.

Speaker 2:
[65:16] Yeah. Well, I do feel that. They need it. They're reaching out. And how many times can you tell them no before they stop reaching out?

Speaker 1:
[65:29] Call the school.

Speaker 2:
[65:30] Call the school. I wanted to say that just as why this came up, and I don't want to, I'm not throwing-

Speaker 1:
[65:39] Bad-mouthing.

Speaker 2:
[65:39] I'm not bad-mouthing my grandma or anything like that.

Speaker 1:
[65:42] You guys also lived in different states for a lot of time.

Speaker 2:
[65:45] There's so much that could have-

Speaker 1:
[65:47] Right.

Speaker 2:
[65:48] Yeah.

Speaker 1:
[65:48] But still-

Speaker 2:
[65:50] I still feel like there was something-

Speaker 1:
[65:53] Missed.

Speaker 2:
[65:54] Missed because there wasn't more intentionality. And that's sad to me.

Speaker 1:
[66:01] Yeah.

Speaker 2:
[66:02] That's sad to me. And there's some of that on my end as an adult. Again, I can beat this to death all day, but it's not totally my responsibility as a grandchild. But whatever, that's a different conversation, I guess. But love your kids, do right by them, and hopefully you're all friends later on.

Speaker 1:
[66:31] Yeah. Check back, like how it worked out. Yeah, our investment. Was it a good one? Yeah.

Speaker 2:
[66:43] I know how people could invest in the podcast.

Speaker 1:
[66:48] It's free.

Speaker 2:
[66:48] Leave a review. You invest and we keep making them. You invest in that five-star review. We keep making podcasts. That's the investment and return right there. And this was a great episode. I don't care what you say. Thank you for listening to The Really Very Crunchy Podcast. We will see you next time.

Speaker 1:
[67:13] Have a good week.