transcript

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Speaker 2:
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Speaker 1:
[03:57] I'm Claire Fallon, and I'm Emma Gray.

Speaker 2:
[03:59] And this is Love to See It, an obsessively detailed podcast about the romance we see on screen. From reality dating shows like The Bachelor, to classic rom-coms and other pop culture that makes us laugh, cry, and curse the patriarchy.

Speaker 1:
[04:14] We can't live with these stories and we can't live without them, but we can break down every juicy detail and unpack all the weird messages on screen romance sends us about love, sex, and dating.

Speaker 2:
[04:38] Welcome to Love to See It, a podcast about leaving your boyfriend, even if it takes going on national TV to do it.

Speaker 1:
[04:44] We're not saying it's always a good idea to leave your boyfriend, but frankly, if you're on Temptation Island, it's probably always a good idea.

Speaker 2:
[04:52] We are finishing our recap of the latest season of Temptation Island today, and episodes five to nine were action-packed, so we're gonna try not to go too long, but much to discuss.

Speaker 1:
[05:04] A little housekeeping before we get into it. If you missed our recap of episodes one through four of this season of Temptation Island, just scroll back in your feed. You will find them there. Also, a little reminder that we moved rich text over to Patreon. Our latest episode was about the kickoff of The Valley Season Three, particularly the themes of post-partum intimacy we've seen bubbling up. And also, we discussed our little outing to see Whitney Levitt of Secret Lives of Mormon Wives on Broadway as Roxy Hart in Chicago. So you can find that conversation and more at patreon.com/richtext.

Speaker 2:
[05:42] So let's dive in to our 14 pages of notes, which was us cutting it down. Well, to be fair, it's five episodes. OK, it was a lot. And Temptation Island, episode five, picks up in the middle of the women's second bonfire. Cheyenne has just seen Jack cheating with one of the women in the house, and she's freaking out. She's like, is this real life? And Mark finally gets her to come back to the bonfire so that he can tell her she's allowed to feel pain. And she's like, no, no, I've moved on to anger. I'm angry now.

Speaker 1:
[06:14] And I support her.

Speaker 2:
[06:17] She says that she's always giving Jack everything. She makes him feel like he's worth more than he is, and he's a fucking loser and a bum who will never be anything. And she says, presumably to Carter, enjoy your 30 seconds of nothing. Little parting gift for Jack.

Speaker 1:
[06:33] Mark keeps trying to point out to her that like, maybe you hate him. Like maybe it's not just about the infidelity.

Speaker 2:
[06:41] Right. He's like, I can't help but notice that you're not saying he betrayed me and it hurts. You're saying that he's a loser who's not worth anything and he's a bum. Like is this maybe related to your anxieties about him as a provider figure? Cheyenne is not ready to dig into this yet. She's crying, she says she hates him, and Kayleigh says, no, you don't. And Cheyenne is like, no, I fucking hate him. And Kayleigh says, oh, I thought you said you need him. You hate him. We all hate him.

Speaker 1:
[07:12] To be clear, we all hate him and his hair and his stupid little hat. Oh, I'm sorry. Is that just us? That's what I hate about Jack.

Speaker 2:
[07:19] Yeah, she should be talking more about how he has bad hair. Sydney sees Mikey on the Ariel Silks date that he had with India, and talking about how he and India are so different from each other and that might make them more compatible. And Sydney is beaming.

Speaker 1:
[07:33] She's thrilled. She's like, oh, great. Does he like someone else? I love that for him.

Speaker 2:
[07:38] Yeah.

Speaker 1:
[07:38] Because I'm done.

Speaker 2:
[07:41] She's like, I wish I could have been enough for him, but that's okay because I know I am enough and I wish him the best. And Mark says, well, you know, usually when people react this way, I try to call them out, but you actually seem lighter and happier and like you're over this. So good for you.

Speaker 1:
[07:58] Mark realizes at this point that he's going to have to pivot in his advice to just like supporting Sydney in her new relationship and encouraging Mikey to keep doing self-exploration.

Speaker 2:
[08:09] Yeah. Kaylee sees Summit flirting with Jesenia and at the end of the game, they played some sort of game where at the end, Summit was the loser and so he had to kiss someone. We know that he just like kissed one of the guys on the cheek. But the clip cuts off with him leaning over toward Jesenia, which is really sneaky. As we have discussed, if he kissed Jesenia, they would have shown it. They're not in the habit of cutting off the worst piece of information. And Kayleigh actually kind of seems to clock this.

Speaker 1:
[08:42] I was impressed. She's very calmly is like, well, I don't really know what to do with this information because I can't tell if he was pretending to kiss someone or if he actually kissed her. But she seems to believe that he didn't because like us, she knows they would have shown it.

Speaker 2:
[09:01] So she's like, why would he pretend to kiss someone? Like what's going on here? I really have no idea. She's almost like to the editing team or the production team. She's like, what are you doing? Give me more, please. But she always ends up kind of saying the same thing, which is she doesn't feel like he's thinking of her. It looks like he's just having fun. I get a little bit frustrated sometimes when Kaylee has this reaction because I'm like, well, Kaylee, they're not going to show the moment where he's sitting there saying, here's everything I appreciate about Kaylee and I really hope that he can do some inner work so I can be with her. They're going to show the part where he's playing a sexy drinking game.

Speaker 1:
[09:39] Right. Also, you are having fun at various moments in the house. That's actually okay.

Speaker 2:
[09:45] I think that the issue is that actually, they're not giving her much to work with. She's like, well, I guess my reaction is that it doesn't feel like he's thinking about me and he's just having fun because that is what's happening in the clip.

Speaker 1:
[09:58] Yeah. The only clips we see of Summit are him just being like, whoo, in a game or a party.

Speaker 2:
[10:03] She has more to work with when we see a clip of him where he's like, she hates me and I don't know why and it's so unfair because I am a prince of a man and I guess she just hates that I'm nice to people. The men returned to their villa where they're acting brave in the face of profound heartbreak because their women were speaking to other men. Sydney, to be fair, did say that she's dating another guy and that's tough for Mikey.

Speaker 1:
[10:30] It is tough for Mikey. We were discussing earlier before we started taping that we feel bad that we don't have more sympathy for Mikey because we can acknowledge that this must be rough and yet, we're so happy to see Sydney exiting her relationship.

Speaker 2:
[10:45] He is having the nightmare Temptation Island scenario in many respects, but I support Sydney. Meanwhile, back at the women's house, Chris has made a list of affirmations for Kayleigh to repeat, which I found absolutely hysterical. Just imagine needing a 27-year-old hunk named Chris with a K to make you a list of affirmations to repeat, to feel good about yourself.

Speaker 1:
[11:12] I'm just obsessed with the way that the single men just step in as like capital N nice guys slash pseudo-therapists. They're like, my job is to do crafts, crafts and therapy for these women and tell them, you are the prize over and over and over again. And the women, the single women are like, it's my job to get this mediocre dude into the Temptation Haven.

Speaker 2:
[11:39] Yeah, when they know what the job brief is. So Kayleigh is reading these affirmations and it's like, I am deserving of love. I am the prize. And I'm like, yes, Chris, this is digging deep here. And Kayleigh admits that Summit has made her feel bad about herself a lot. And like maybe she's too much or not enough in certain ways. She says once he left her crying in a room at a party because he wanted to go hang out with his friends. And then she could see him like dancing with them through the window. And I was like, wow, I need a full backstory here. Why were you beside yourself in his room to begin with? Like what's going on?

Speaker 1:
[12:15] We need more context.

Speaker 2:
[12:17] But she does say that it felt sociopathic to her to have that reaction to his girlfriend being so upset, to be more focused on having fun with his friends. And it does seem like not a very mature, empathetic reaction. Meanwhile, Summit is complaining that he's never talked down on Kaylee or tried to change her, but she doesn't like who he is. He says, I don't want to be with someone like that. I don't think that what they're saying about each other is as different as Summit thinks. They're both saying, I want to be with someone who meets my needs better. And she's not saying I don't like anything about Summit inherently. She's saying, I want Summit to make an effort to treat me better.

Speaker 1:
[12:55] And he's like, how dare she?

Speaker 2:
[12:56] He's like, that's not who I am. I'm not someone who makes an effort to treat my partner well. Why would you want to change me into someone who takes his partner out to dinner sometimes?

Speaker 1:
[13:05] But Julianne is there to be like, you're so right.

Speaker 2:
[13:09] Yeah, she's like, oh, it's so sad that she wants to change you into someone who cares for her. Mikey thinks Sidney brought him here to play him. He's crying to the Temptresses that she was at his sister's wedding two weeks ago. She sat up front next to his mom and he cries and cries, and the women are like, that's not a you thing. That's all on her. That's her character.

Speaker 1:
[13:30] I hate that these Temptresses are put in the position to be like, you're amazing. You've done nothing wrong. I'm like, you know this man's a fool. You know it.

Speaker 2:
[13:41] That is something that kept coming to mind during this set of episodes as we were watching. It's just, I know that both the men and the women have these Temptors there to build them up and to remind them of what they're really looking for in a relationship and to show them qualities that they might want in a partner. But it just feels so structurally different and bad to have a group of scantily clad hot women whose only job is to flatter and soothe male egos and to say, your girlfriend is a bitch, she's the problem. It feels different because it is different, because we live under patriarchy. It's already the case that women are heavily socialized to do PR for men. Do PR for them and to compete for men by dragging other women down and to compete to be like, I'm the one who's going to treat you the best. I'm going to be like your personal servant and like emotional support animal. That's not structurally the case for men.

Speaker 1:
[14:47] Right. With the single men, there's like a subversion happening. They're like, I'm here to listen to you. I'm here to just be your emotional support and not try to extract anything from you. That unfortunately is a change from the way that men and women, straight men and women are socialized to interact with each other.

Speaker 2:
[15:08] The way that it's different for the men in relationships, interacting with these women, the change that it really offers them is a freedom from the baggage that they have created in their relationships by cheating on and mistreating their partners.

Speaker 1:
[15:20] It's so amazing. These women are so nice to me, and they don't even expect anything from me. Yeah, right. Exactly.

Speaker 2:
[15:29] She's not mad at me all the time because I'm not trustworthy. Well, yeah, because you've never cheated on her. You're not in a relationship with her. Meanwhile, Jack is complaining about Cheyenne saying she didn't need him anymore and she's happier without him. He seems to really think that if she doesn't need him, that means she's saying that she doesn't want to be with him anymore. I wish that were the case.

Speaker 1:
[15:55] I know.

Speaker 2:
[15:55] But it's actually okay for your partner not to need you. It's not an insult to you if your partner doesn't need you.

Speaker 1:
[16:02] You actually should be like, oh, that's good. That's actually evidence that maybe the codependent dynamic that we've developed is lessening.

Speaker 2:
[16:10] Honestly, wouldn't she be happier without you if what you're doing right now is making out with Carter on camera where you know she's going to see it?

Speaker 1:
[16:22] Jack doesn't want to be with her. Right.

Speaker 2:
[16:24] You're upset that she said, maybe I can be okay without Jack and what did she see you doing? Sucking face with a 22-year-old. Why should anyone feel fucking bad for you? They slump at all, sympathize with me, pity me. Why do you deserve pity? Do you know what your girlfriends have been seeing? I'm so over these men. Cheyenne is also over it. She decides that it's time to make a scene and the Temptation Haven has arrived, so she immediately takes Preston, the hunk she's zeroing in on. She takes him to the Haven and we can hear them kissing, and then Preston says, you good, and there's a long sort of snuffily pause and then she says, I'm great. I was like, is she crying or are they just rolling around making snuffily noises? I really can't tell.

Speaker 1:
[17:12] Hard to tell.

Speaker 2:
[17:13] She's great. Jack, when he sees the red light go off, seems almost amused. He's like, that's my girlfriend. I could put money on it. I was like, oh, so you do know what she saw because you know that she's going to want revenge. One thousand percent. Mikey also seems convinced that it's Sidney. I'm like, Jack and Cheyenne have that exact relationship that can be a huge issue on Temptation Island, where they already use cheating and the threat of cheating as a weapon in their relationship.

Speaker 1:
[17:44] Right. So that just continues.

Speaker 2:
[17:46] Right. Once they have a way to immediately send a message or to be seen on camera, hooking up with someone else, that only fuels their dynamic, where they're like, oh, you kissed a guy? I'm going to fuck a girl. Oh, you fucked a girl? If we don't work out, I'm going to fuck all your friends.

Speaker 1:
[18:01] These two people so badly need to be separated from each other.

Speaker 2:
[18:05] Yeah. Jack knows. Jack knows that's their dynamic. He's like, that's my girlfriend. It's hilarious actually because I already have a new girl here to hook up with and it's fine. There are more dates that are mostly pretty boring. Summit has sampled Jusenia, his mysterious, beautifully butted option. But now he's back to Julianne, the blonde girl he's been dating. And I just continue to not like the way that Summit talks about different kinds of women and to categorize them. I hate it. More on that later. They go surfing and he bitches that Kaylee doesn't like how outgoing he is. He's sacrificing so much to be with her. And he says, why are you dating me if I'm such a shitty boyfriend? He loves that this woman he just met is stoked on who he is and not trying to change him.

Speaker 1:
[18:53] All the men do this.

Speaker 2:
[18:55] Yeah.

Speaker 1:
[18:55] I'm like, yes, have you seen High Fidelity? You are projecting zero needs onto this idea of a woman in front of you.

Speaker 2:
[19:03] Right.

Speaker 1:
[19:03] Because you're not in a relationship with her.

Speaker 2:
[19:06] You're like, wow, it's been two dates and she's not trying to change me as a person. I should be with her instead. I bet that will continue forever. Scarlett takes Bradley to paint their genitals as flowers and just talk about how easy their conversation is and stuff. They keep saying this, but I don't like, it's one of those bachelor style things where they talk about how easy their conversation is and how deep it is, but you don't see anything else that they say to each other.

Speaker 1:
[19:33] That's kind of like the Scarlett and Cole whole thing is just both of them talking about depth and like we see none of it.

Speaker 2:
[19:40] Right. And I can't tell if that's the edit or if Scarlett thinks that having bachelor style conversations about how deepness is important is depth. It's frustrating. Jack takes Carter on a sort of like faux camping, campfire date. It's their fourth date and things are getting serious. And in true Jack fashion.

Speaker 1:
[20:04] That's why he has to exit.

Speaker 2:
[20:06] Right. He's like, it's getting serious. So let's definitely make this serious and then I'll fuck someone else. Like that's the progression. He asks where she sees herself in five years relationship wise. And she says that she literally never thinks about the future or planning in relationships at all.

Speaker 1:
[20:24] I mean, she's basically a child and this is perfect for Jack. He's like, I did it. I did it. I found the one woman who has no needs or expectations.

Speaker 2:
[20:34] He's like, same girl. This is great. When she said this, I had that kind of like vertigo sort of experience that you have when you find out that other people live in such a, they have such a different interior life that you never even imagined how different it could be. Remember finding out that some men would just go on planes without anything to do and they'll call it raw dogging the flight. You're just like, oh my God, what? How? That's how I felt when she said that. I felt a little bit nauseous, but she's 22. Maybe within the next five years, she'll start thinking slightly about the future. Cole and his house confidant, Lexi, make chocolates and talk about his growth over the course of the show. He's learning to express his emotions. And this is the level of Cole getting into depth that we see is where he's like, what if I was able to identify my own feelings and then say them as words? And it's great that he's growing, but that is something that most people learn as small children.

Speaker 1:
[21:31] I mean, they're like almost 30.

Speaker 2:
[21:33] Yeah.

Speaker 1:
[21:34] It's not great.

Speaker 2:
[21:35] That's not to knock his growth, but I think it does give me a little bit of understanding of where things might be with Scarlett, which still confuses me a lot at times. But I'm like, it does seem like it might be tough to have certain conversations if your partner is just now in this intensive setting starting to explore verbalizing his emotions.

Speaker 1:
[21:53] Exactly. We see Kaylee and Chris go to a spa and talk about how she overthinks everything and can't be spontaneous. And she says she's not happy and it made her feel disconnected from Summit, who is happy. And this continues to come up. Kaylee is sort of realizing that she has been unhappy in herself and that that has alongside Summit's failings, that has been impacting her relationships.

Speaker 2:
[22:19] Right. It clearly makes her feel bad about herself, like why can't I be happy? And it also makes her feel like how can I be feeling true intimacy with someone when we're feeling so different? And so there's just a disconnect there. Sydney and Xavier see a sensual embodiment coach for them choreographed cuddling and it gets pretty hot and heavy.

Speaker 1:
[22:40] I love them.

Speaker 2:
[22:41] I love them too. I thought that this activity was so funny where they're just like, let's not even do tantric yoga. Let's just go straight for someone who will say, hey, sit on his lap. Great.

Speaker 1:
[22:52] And then grind around.

Speaker 2:
[22:54] Grind. Yeah. Circles, grind in circles.

Speaker 1:
[22:57] This is about emotional connection. On that note, we're going to take a quick break. And when we get back, we will get into the next round of parties and bonfires.

Speaker 2:
[23:17] And we're back, so it's time for a fun game. The women and the women's villa play Dare or Shot. And it's pretty PG. Kayleigh refuses to give a cheek kiss because she's resisting, but Bradley agrees to kiss Scarlett's toe, very X-rated. At the men's villa, they are playing Kinky Kings Cup. I was like, oh, I'm old. I haven't thought of Kings Cup in at least a decade.

Speaker 1:
[23:42] I know, I forgot about Kings Cup. At least it's a game we know.

Speaker 2:
[23:46] True, yeah. That makes me feel young.

Speaker 1:
[23:49] Yeah, maybe we're youthful.

Speaker 2:
[23:52] I remember whenever I used to visit my younger brother at college, and I'm only three years older than him, there was always a whole new spate of popular drinking games that I had never heard of. I was like, I'm 23, all my life is out of the loop.

Speaker 1:
[24:03] Kings Cup is a classic though, if you get to make new rules.

Speaker 2:
[24:06] That's true, and this is the Kinky version. The last card is for the last person to drink to take someone into the haven, so not it, but with drinking. Jack doesn't even try because he really wants just any prompt to take Carter to the haven.

Speaker 1:
[24:21] He wants to do revenge.

Speaker 2:
[24:22] Yeah. He's like, sure, I'll make Cheyenne upset. Cheyenne, however, is fast asleep when the alarm goes off. Cyd comes to tell her in the morning when she wakes up, and Cheyenne is really sad.

Speaker 1:
[24:34] She knows it's Jack.

Speaker 2:
[24:36] Yeah. Again, they know that this is their cycle. They both are like, here's what happens. He cheats, he knows I'll see it. Now, I'm going to cheat. I know he's going to see the light, and then I know what he's going to do. And Cheyenne says she wishes she never came. And Cyd tells her, why? So this could keep happening, and you'd be fine with it? That's not good. And then she offers to get day drunk with her.

Speaker 1:
[24:59] Yeah. Cydney sees what needs to happen, which is that this is the only way that Cheyenne would ever leave this relationship.

Speaker 2:
[25:06] Well, and this is why it's very easy to root for Cydney, too. Because she is so present and there for everyone else in the house.

Speaker 1:
[25:14] I love her.

Speaker 2:
[25:15] She just seems very grounded in what she wants and is looking for, and what she wants for the other women, and she's just the best friend. They're all just lucky to have her in these moments because she's always there. The next day, Cole is also going through it. He cries and tells Mikey that he feels like Scarlett doesn't have his back and doesn't care. They have so much to give, and their girlfriends don't even see it.

Speaker 1:
[25:40] Do you?

Speaker 2:
[25:42] I don't know. They're both going through it, and I feel bad for their pain. Cole in particular seems really sick with anxiety. He's like, I can't eat, I can't sleep, I just feel sick all the time. And that is a really awful way to live. And I really, really feel for him. I don't know if Mikey has a lot to offer Sydney, for sure. I'll just put that out there.

Speaker 1:
[26:08] I'm sorry, I don't know that either of them have much to offer.

Speaker 2:
[26:12] Yeah.

Speaker 1:
[26:12] I'm so sorry. I do feel bad for their pain, especially Cole's.

Speaker 2:
[26:17] Yeah. But Cole is very much just like, why doesn't my love and devotion matter? Like, why isn't that enough?

Speaker 1:
[26:24] But then it's like every time something specific comes out, it's like I went to the track to meet a girl. Like, I don't know. My empathy is limited.

Speaker 2:
[26:33] Party night, the Women's Villa has a foam party, and it's the touchiest they have gotten. You know, they're all in swimsuits, in the suds. And so there's a lot of grabbing and riding on each other with their fingers. And they play another dare game. Xavier has dared to lick Sidney's earlobe and neck, and he does.

Speaker 1:
[26:52] And he enjoys it.

Speaker 2:
[26:54] Shy and Preston go back to the Haven in the middle of the men's party, and they end up in her bedroom together. It definitely seems like they're 100 percent doing it under the covers.

Speaker 1:
[27:04] At bare minimum, there's some aggressive dry humping happening.

Speaker 2:
[27:08] There's something very rhythmic and whole body happening in there. And she tells the camera that she can't wait for Jack to see. I would love for Shyann to free herself of using cheating as a weapon against Jack.

Speaker 1:
[27:21] I know. I keep having to remind myself that she is only 23 years old.

Speaker 2:
[27:25] Yeah. And Jack is a complete fuckboy, like, un-serious child. But like, Shyann also has a lot of growing up to do. And seeing her in this cycle with Jack, it really seems like it brings out a very unpleasant side of her that I would love to see her put in the past.

Speaker 1:
[27:44] I know. I'm very interested to see where she's at when we check in with her at this upcoming reunion.

Speaker 2:
[27:50] Yeah. The men's villa has a costume party with like a sexy dancing competition or something. The phone party looked way more fun. Mikey sees India shaking her ass in a really skimpy costume, and then he and Summit do a confessional to brag about how they saw the temptation and they resisted the temptation, and that's what this is all about.

Speaker 1:
[28:09] Oh, is this like the anything but clothes party?

Speaker 2:
[28:12] Oh, maybe.

Speaker 1:
[28:13] Yeah. They're just wearing like, caution tape.

Speaker 2:
[28:16] Or like, I think Summit is wearing like a kilt made of cards or something. Like, I don't know.

Speaker 1:
[28:22] Mikey just went with like a toga with like a sheet, like a sheet toga.

Speaker 2:
[28:27] I like, yeah, I'm like, it's a costume party to me, but it is, yes. It was clearly an anything but clothes party, yes. And a lot of the Temptresses, of course, just used it as a reason to be wearing almost nothing because they know, they know their job. After the red light goes off, Jack, who has been hanging out with Jessenia all of a sudden, asks her if she'd go in the Haven with him. And even Jessenia is pretty shocked.

Speaker 1:
[28:52] She's like, wait, what?

Speaker 2:
[28:54] She's like, Jack, that is so messy. Jess went in there yesterday with someone else, but she goes and I hope that it's because she wanted to. But this is also a moment where I felt this like achy power dynamic of like all of these young women who are being sort of made sexually available to these guys. Like do you ever see a tempter, a temptress turn down a hookup on this show? Like it just felt very, she was like, I shouldn't do that. It feels weird. You've been pursuing someone else. But like he's asking me to, so I'm going.

Speaker 1:
[29:26] Yeah. I mean, she continues to hook up with him. So she does. I'm assuming she's at least like attracted to him.

Speaker 2:
[29:33] Right. And I'm not. So for that reason, I was less grossed out by it, but I still in this moment was just like, it just feels like such a gross power dynamic to have all these men be like, these are my on demand hook up.

Speaker 1:
[29:46] Oh yeah. They're like, these are my concubines.

Speaker 2:
[29:49] I'm tapping you today. I'm walking up and down the line of women and I'm tapping you today. And she's like, okay, inside the haven, you can hear kissing noises. He says he needs her to sleep in his bed tonight, and she tells him to button his pants and also that she's wearing a bra. So I will say the two things that we like hear her say are like, close on, close on. But also he asks if she's attracted to him and she says yes. So that's nice for her. In the morning after this situation, Jack realizes that he has to apologize to Carter.

Speaker 1:
[30:25] Oh, God. This was crazy.

Speaker 2:
[30:28] He's like, I cheated on my cheating partner with a new cheating partner.

Speaker 1:
[30:33] He's like, I just realized I was scared. Shut the fuck up, Jack. What? You're not scared.

Speaker 2:
[30:40] He's growing so much. He's learning.

Speaker 1:
[30:43] This is growth. He's so open to this experience. And Carter's like, you know what, Jack, you are a victim and I feel bad for you because you haven't been the main character of your own life. Put yourself first for once. This is Jack's new narrative now. Cheyenne has been holding him back and now he needs to really be himself. And himself is hooking up with a bunch of different women and not communicating with them about the terms of the relationship.

Speaker 2:
[31:12] Imagine telling a woman who's a serial cheater that the issue is that you haven't, you've been kept in a box and you're not allowed to be the main character of your own life. Like the things that we say to men.

Speaker 1:
[31:22] I really think that Jack knows he's the main character.

Speaker 2:
[31:26] Yeah. Just know what he's really, he's, he is bothered by the fact that he has been in the doghouse. He's like, I shouldn't have to be in the doghouse for doing something wrong. That's not fair to me. I should get to do something wrong and then there are no consequences.

Speaker 1:
[31:39] And Carter's like, don't worry, I'll give that to you.

Speaker 2:
[31:41] I wonder if on some level, because Carter before was kind of like, I'm feeling such a connection, like it's too bad he has a girlfriend, like I really, and after this, we don't see that anymore. And I wonder if there's a part of Carter that's just like, as with like India and Mikey, where there's a bit of an-

Speaker 1:
[31:55] Like he's not a serious person, so like whatever, I'm not trying to date this guy. Go forth, Jack, hook up with anyone.

Speaker 2:
[32:01] Right, the emotions turn off a bit. You're like, well, never mind, I don't care anymore, so do whatever is best for you, sweetie. I love that for you. I do think it would be a bad idea to jump into a relationship with Jack on Temptation Island, so great decision by Carter.

Speaker 1:
[32:17] Yeah, happy for Carter for yourself.

Speaker 2:
[32:19] Meanwhile, Sydney and Xavier's relationship is progressing. He pulls her aside and kisses her, and it's their first kiss. She tells the camera she could see herself leaving with him. So with that, it's bonfire night again, and this time after watching a clip, they have the option to see more, so they have a little more control over what they get to see.

Speaker 1:
[32:40] I admit I was annoyed by the people who didn't see the second clip. I was like, I want to know what the second clip was.

Speaker 2:
[32:48] Lab rats, stop making decisions. You will push the lever and dispense the pellet so I can see what happens.

Speaker 1:
[32:55] Why am I not the main character of this show?

Speaker 2:
[32:59] I'm always the main character of the show. Jack sees Cheyenne going into the Haven with Preston and the kissing noises, and his response is, finally. Because as we know from last week, he was really hoping that Cheyenne was cheating so that he would look like less of a douche nozzle. And she's unfortunately giving him exactly what he wants. And he's like, it hurts.

Speaker 1:
[33:21] It doesn't.

Speaker 2:
[33:23] But he's glad they needed to get out of their toxic cycle. I don't believe that it hurts. I think he knows he's supposed to say that, but he's relieved because she is giving him an excuse to keep fucking around.

Speaker 1:
[33:34] Correct.

Speaker 2:
[33:35] Jack asked her the second clip, and it's Preston and Cheyenne in bed, and Cheyenne's saying, you're like giant. This really sets off the man. Cole is like, fuck this chick, dude.

Speaker 1:
[33:46] Ew.

Speaker 2:
[33:47] Jack has been hooking up with other girls all week, and they're cheering him on.

Speaker 1:
[33:51] These men are so intent on branding Cheyenne like the most evil harpy on this earth.

Speaker 2:
[34:00] Yeah. It's crazy. They're watching Jack's out of control sexual promiscuity front and center, and their reaction is still like Cheyenne's a slut, Cheyenne's a harpy, Cheyenne drove you to this, Cheyenne crushed your spirit. You're seeing what she's been putting up with, and you're still like this 23-year-old woman is the problem.

Speaker 1:
[34:20] This is why my sympathy for Cole is limited.

Speaker 2:
[34:23] Yeah. Listen, bros before hos. Jack says that he's a very forgiving person, and if Cheyenne could forgive him, maybe they could find their way back to each other.

Speaker 1:
[34:32] This is all just lip service. He does not want to be in this relationship, and she admits multiple times. But he does this thing repeatedly where he's like, but who knows what could happen? Maybe one day we'll grow.

Speaker 2:
[34:44] What he wants, I think, out of this experience, like in his maybe most idealistic mind, is that she will fuck up enough that she won't have the moral high ground in their relationship anymore.

Speaker 1:
[34:59] That is true.

Speaker 2:
[35:00] Like, I think there's a part of him that's like, well, maybe once she's also cheated a bunch, we can restart this as equals without the part where she's mad at me all the time. And I don't think that he understands that she's always going to blame him for getting their relationship to this point. Cole sees Scarlett talking to Bradley about energy and how Cole doesn't care about it like she does, and Bradley licking her toe. Cole says that he knows that she's obsessed with energy. He seems to have no idea what she's talking about, and frankly, neither do I, but that's why I don't date people who are obsessed with energy. And he's also like, I know I check every box for her except having a fiery feeling and that hurts. And it's like, yeah, that seems pretty important. The second clip is Scarlett hanging out with Bradley at the phone party and telling Scarlett that he sees her and she doesn't have to settle. And Cole doesn't like the word settle. Couldn't possibly be settling to be with Cole because he brings so many high-value qualities to the relationship. Cole also says that Scarlett will talk about masculine energy and say that he doesn't have it.

Speaker 1:
[36:05] It's a scourge. It's everywhere. It is infected straight dating.

Speaker 2:
[36:10] I was like, Scarlett, no. I don't think that you need, like look at Bradley. Does Bradley have more masculine energy than Cole? I don't think so.

Speaker 1:
[36:19] No, you just enjoy hanging out with him more. And like that's a totally valid thing to feel.

Speaker 2:
[36:24] It also can become this crutch, I think, to instead of saying like here are specific things that I need in our relationship that we're not aligning on, you can say, well, like I need you to just be a man. Why can't you be like a man? Men do the things that make me as a woman feel good and safe, and you're not doing those things, so you're not a man. But I think it is probably what I get the sense more and more in the relationship is that she wants someone who naturally understands the kind of dynamic that she wants and she doesn't have to give instructions or direct to get those outcomes. Cole is a direction follower in the relationship. He's like, Tony, lay out for me.

Speaker 1:
[36:59] I followed the rules, give me my reward.

Speaker 2:
[37:02] I think she interprets that as he's not leading, he's not giving masculinity. But I think that it's enough to say, I don't want to be in a relationship with someone where they can't meet my needs with some initiative and some self-direction, and where I have to give them a to-do list to meet my needs.

Speaker 1:
[37:18] They're just a terrible match.

Speaker 2:
[37:20] I agree. Mark says that true masculinity is encouraged to be truly vulnerable, and that's so true, Mark, but does Cole have that either? I don't think he does.

Speaker 1:
[37:29] No.

Speaker 2:
[37:31] Summit sees Kaylee getting affirmations from Chris, and saying that Summit makes her feel like she's too much and not enough, and also the whole story about him leaving her crying while he danced with friends and calling it sociopathic. Summit is like, well, we're both very unsure about this relationship, and I'm not sure if I'm ready to be tied down, because I want to squeeze all the juice out of life, but he doesn't want to see the second clip for some reason. Summit, give me my content.

Speaker 1:
[37:59] Rude.

Speaker 2:
[37:59] Mikey sees Sydney and Xavier doing their sensual connection workshop and their kiss, and he yells, what the fuck? Then he's like, wow, my life is going to be different, and that's okay in his way that he says things, but he doesn't think it's okay. Then he starts to cry.

Speaker 1:
[38:14] As he does.

Speaker 2:
[38:16] He does. I really tried to fight my impulse to just be pissed off. I do think that Mikey shows some growth over the course of this season, but it's very hard for me to move past the very quick initial association I made between him going into floods of tears and him saying all these manipulative and untrue things about Sydney and their relationship, self-victimizing, and it's okay to cry. I do think that he works more on remaining emotionally present and accountable.

Speaker 1:
[38:44] Yeah, and I do think that's growth.

Speaker 2:
[38:46] I have that association still.

Speaker 1:
[38:48] I agree with Mark that he needs to do that growth separate from Sydney.

Speaker 2:
[38:53] Yes. In the second clip, Mikey sees them at the phone party and the neck-licking, and he is like, that hurts. She was just at my sister's wedding. She told my mom that she loved me. I don't know if he should have brought her to sit in the front row of his sister's wedding two weeks before they went on a show called Temptation Island. That was a choice.

Speaker 1:
[39:11] Well, he's like, but I'm in control.

Speaker 2:
[39:14] Right.

Speaker 1:
[39:15] So, yeah.

Speaker 2:
[39:16] He asked Mark if it's time to shut the door, and Mark says it's not that simple. She's experiencing a real connection, but he shouldn't shut the door. He should keep doing the work and show up to the final bonfire as a different person. But afterward, Mikey feels ready to move on. He's like, she doesn't care about me. It is what it is. Summit is really wounded, that he was called a sociopath. He says, I'm very endearing and caring, and I treat her like a princess. I do so much to try to make her happy and it doesn't work. I love that he says that he's very endearing. I think he meant to say more that he's caring, another way of saying caring, but it's a way of saying, people love me. I'm so endearing to people.

Speaker 1:
[39:55] No, I'm obsessed with this. It's very funny to describe yourself as endearing.

Speaker 2:
[40:00] I'm so endearing. Everyone feels endeared to me whenever we meet. She's been describing over and over again all the ways that she does not feel treated like a princess in very specific detail. When she says those things, you're like, she hates who I am as a person.

Speaker 1:
[40:15] What is instead- Because who I am is endearing.

Speaker 2:
[40:17] Someone who treats people like a princess.

Speaker 1:
[40:19] Yeah. How dare you?

Speaker 2:
[40:21] Jack feels like, wow, I felt really bad when I cheated, but Chey doesn't seem to feel bad.

Speaker 1:
[40:26] Jack, evidence not found.

Speaker 2:
[40:28] I haven't seen you feeling bad about cheating on anyone except Carter. You felt a little bad about that. He's so desperate to feel like he's better than Cheyenne.

Speaker 1:
[40:39] Yeah, that is his journey. Journey to the higher moral ground.

Speaker 2:
[40:43] The women are next and Cheyenne is ready to see Jack cheat some more. She says he's capable of it all. Kayleigh goes first. She mostly sees Summit complaining that she should just go find the perfect boyfriend instead of trying to change him. She says she's heard all of this before and he's still not learning anything. And you can tell they just had this conversation where she's like, I wish that you acted like you cared about me or like you took me out more or did X, Y, and Z. And he's like, well, why don't you just go find the perfect boyfriend then? So fun. In the second clip, she sees him doing his dumb sexy dance at the costume party and grinning at the temptress's twerking. And she says, disrespectful. It makes her feel worthless.

Speaker 1:
[41:26] I don't actually think that's the disrespectful thing he's done.

Speaker 2:
[41:29] I know. This felt a little unfair to me. I was like, this is a moment where he's at a party where women are dancing and he's smiling and that seems okay to me.

Speaker 1:
[41:38] Yeah. What do you want him to do?

Speaker 2:
[41:40] Kayleigh has barely done anything and so we haven't seen much of this, but we see it when they raid each other's villas. I think they both hold each other to a standard of decorum and straight-laceness that is unrealistic.

Speaker 1:
[41:54] Unrealistic and unfair.

Speaker 2:
[41:56] She says, I'm going to have a lot of questions for that boy when I see him. And I did call him boy for a reason. He is kind of a boy. He's a weird blend of boy and 44-year-old man.

Speaker 1:
[42:09] It's so odd.

Speaker 2:
[42:11] It's like meeting a 44-year-old man and you're like, this man never grew up all the way. That's what he's like when he's 25. Shy sees Jack asking Jacenia to the Haven, and she applauds mockingly and says, that's Jack. She says, she's glad he's showing the world who he is. And then Mark does something she doesn't expect. He says, so who's Cheyenne? And she's like, I don't know.

Speaker 1:
[42:35] And that's the problem here.

Speaker 2:
[42:37] Someone who's fun, even without Jack.

Speaker 1:
[42:39] And that's why Cheyenne needs to free herself from like this relationship and probably any other relationships for a little while.

Speaker 2:
[42:47] Yeah. And that was sometimes Mark really nails it. In this moment, Cheyenne desperately needs a nudge to focus on who she is rather than framing herself as a foil to Jack who sucks. She refuses the second clip because it would hurt too much. She's like, I don't want to ever see him again. I've seen enough.

Speaker 1:
[43:05] Rude to us, but okay, fair enough.

Speaker 2:
[43:08] Sydney sees Mikey dancing with India at the costume party and then yapping with Summit about how you have to see temptation to resist it and he resisted. At this point, I kind of wondered if Sydney is maybe getting a little bit thrown by the fact that he actually has not gone further.

Speaker 1:
[43:27] Yeah, I think she expected, she was like, okay, he's done, so I'm done, but he wasn't really done. And part of it might be that he's like trying to be good in the relationship. The other part might be that none of the single women take him seriously as a person, so he doesn't really have the opportunity.

Speaker 2:
[43:46] I think it's probably a little bit of both, but I do wonder if Sydney expected this to go a certain way where she would look like completely valid and instead, I'm sure there are questions around like, well, he actually stuck to their agreement and she didn't.

Speaker 1:
[44:06] She didn't. Right. Exactly. Mark asks if she was subconsciously looking for a reason to leave, and she says, no, I think she was.

Speaker 2:
[44:15] I think she was.

Speaker 1:
[44:16] I mean, and I think that's fair.

Speaker 2:
[44:18] She was so done with him. Like the fact that she saw a little bit of his usual, like, flirty, self-aggrandizing behavior, and immediately was like, oh, this is not the man I want. Well, that's the man he is.

Speaker 1:
[44:32] Right.

Speaker 2:
[44:32] Like, that clearly wasn't new. And so it does feel like she just saw it in the setting and was like, Eww. Yeah, eww. Like, the way that he acts is not serious and I'm over it. Like, that doesn't seem like someone who was really hoping that he would grow.

Speaker 1:
[44:50] And I'm sure it wasn't like conscious, but I don't think it was conscious.

Speaker 2:
[44:55] But I think because part of it also, I think is the fact that she was around all these guys who were very intentionally showing up as quite emotionally open and ready to have serious conversations.

Speaker 1:
[45:05] She was like, wait, that's available? Great.

Speaker 2:
[45:09] She's like, why am I waiting around for this guy who's like, I could fuck around, fall in love with any of you. Like, I don't know. Like, I'm going to shoot my shot. Why am I doing that when I can have a serious conversation with a guitar playing hottie on a yacht? Why have I been doing this? She also refuses the second clip. Scarlett sees Cole telling Mikey that he has Scarlett's back, but he doesn't feel like she has his back or cares about him. He can't even eat. He's so torn up about this. Scarlett says that this shows the missing piece, which is still unclear to me from this clip.

Speaker 1:
[45:42] But it's missing.

Speaker 2:
[45:43] She says she wants to see if he can go deeper to the root of everything. She thinks maybe he can't, and that's the answer. I feel like her problems are similar to Summit and Kayleigh in a way. She wants him to talk less about how upset he is about all of this, and more about what he has done that has led to this. But it comes off differently because he just really seems like he's suffering, and not like he's being petty, the way that Summit often is.

Speaker 1:
[46:14] Yeah, I just think he's limited. Yeah, and I think they should break up.

Speaker 2:
[46:18] Yeah, I think he has a lot of growth to do, and I think it's also possible that there are other factors that are making their communication style so radically different, or their needs so radically different. But it's clear that there's such a huge disconnect that it's hard to even grasp what's going on sometimes. She says she's not sure whether you give up depth for someone that loves you with his whole being. Mark is like, well, do you want to go look for someone with both? You could find someone with both. She's like, yeah, but I don't want to have to go looking. Mark suggests that maybe that means she's also keeping at surface level. Mark asks what she wants and she says someone who can set her soul on fire, and she can't say if Cole can do that.

Speaker 1:
[47:00] Get out. It doesn't matter if either of you have done anything fundamentally wrong.

Speaker 2:
[47:06] He keeps trying to be like, do you really think that in 30 years, you're going to be good with this? With just, well, he really loves me, and we like some of the same hobbies.

Speaker 1:
[47:18] Oh, God. That's bleak.

Speaker 2:
[47:20] The Temptation Haven is now gone, and Mark tells them instead, they will have the option of recording a 30-second video message for their partners, and then we see all of the messages. Summit's message to Kayleigh, and they go down to a little rock by the water and open a wooden case and take out a tablet. I love when they do that. It's like a tablet in a bottle. Summit's message to Kayleigh is, baby girl, I love and miss you beyond words. And he tells her that the clips he's seen during the bonfire have made it nearly unbearable. He has never spoken of her poorly, and that's why it hurts to see the way that she speaks about him. He's worried she's not proud of the man he is. He doesn't care about the past, just their future. And Kayleigh is disappointed. She's like, well, he's saying the past is the past. Does he fully realize that his words have left scars that remain? That's not just all in the past.

Speaker 1:
[48:11] She wants him to be like, here is my plan to improve our relationship. And he is not giving that to her. In Kayleigh's message to Summit, she tells him that she's been seriously taking this time to reflect. And she hopes that he'll see that change. But this isn't just about resisting temptation. It's about digging deeper to make things work. And she has not seen that from him. She feels like she's just fighting so much harder for the relationship than he is. Like she has to prove herself over and over again. And she starts to cry and says she needs to see more from him. And Summit seems to feel good about this. He's like, okay.

Speaker 2:
[48:48] Summit is thrilled.

Speaker 1:
[48:49] He's like, amazing. She just laid out what I need to do. Right.

Speaker 2:
[48:53] I was like kind of baffled by this. Because I was like, it seems like she is always laying out what you need to do. And you're like, why do you hate who I am as a man?

Speaker 1:
[49:03] Now he's ready to receive it, Claire.

Speaker 2:
[49:05] Right. Finally, she lays out. I was like, oh no, I see it now. It's a to-do list. It's a map. It's a procedure. Perfect. I'll just do this. And then if we are happy with it at the end, we'll get a wiener dog and we'll move in together. And if we don't, then we won't get a wiener dog and move in together. But if we do, we'll get the wiener dog. And it keeps going on about the wiener dog. Like they've really discussed specifically getting a dog.

Speaker 1:
[49:28] I mean, they clearly have.

Speaker 2:
[49:32] Scarlett's message to Cole opens by saying that she says everything with love.

Speaker 1:
[49:37] And that's when I knew it was going to be brutal.

Speaker 2:
[49:40] She says she wishes they hadn't set such strict boundaries. He's been hyper fixating on not cheating and is missing the bigger picture, the opportunity for growth. She feels let down that he hasn't done inner work to find that depth. They can't leave as a couple if they haven't both changed as people. And Cole is really hurt by this message. He hoped it would be more heartfelt, more about missing him. He's a good guy. He treats her well. He brings a lot to the table. What else is he supposed to do? They clearly viewed the purpose of these messages differently because his message to Scarlett is mostly about all the things he misses about her. He calls her his most precious angel. He says there's been so much depth and growth in this process, he can't wait to show her. He's seen things in the bonfire that have caused him pain and confusion. Men are always like, I've seen things that have caused me pain and confusion. It's like they talked about it together. And he misses her scent and touch and being in the kitchen together, like listening to Shania Twain.

Speaker 1:
[50:35] And this breaks Scarlett.

Speaker 2:
[50:37] Yeah. She starts sobbing. She says he obviously still really wants this. Meanwhile, I've realized what is truly missing.

Speaker 1:
[50:44] Oh, it's brutal.

Speaker 2:
[50:46] This relationship is over.

Speaker 1:
[50:48] It should be.

Speaker 2:
[50:50] Cole heads inside and tells Summit that it's unfair that she's upset with him for not opening up, because if the roles had been reversed, she might have been mad at him for opening up. It's always me taking accountability and saying Cole did this, Cole lied.

Speaker 1:
[51:01] Well, did you?

Speaker 2:
[51:03] Right. That's the thing. It seems like you've been lying to her.

Speaker 1:
[51:06] He's like, I'm always having to take accountability for all the times I've lied.

Speaker 2:
[51:11] Right.

Speaker 1:
[51:11] It's so hard.

Speaker 2:
[51:13] Has she lied about going to the racetrack to meet a guy who slid into her DMs and we're just not hearing about that?

Speaker 1:
[51:19] Have you considered that you would not have to take accountability for the lies if you didn't lie?

Speaker 2:
[51:26] You also might not feel the need to lie if you weren't always doing things that were so shady. You literally don't need to meet a girl from your DMs. I can count the number of times I've met someone based off of a DM on one finger and it was professional in nature.

Speaker 1:
[51:43] Yeah, that's not weird, Claire.

Speaker 2:
[51:46] Right. He still hasn't really reckoned with the deeper problem. He's very concerned at this point, I think, with I'm going to resist temptation and I'm going to be transparent. But he will go on to like betray her trust and then be like, but it'll be okay because I'll tell her about it.

Speaker 1:
[52:05] Yeah. He's like, no, the lesson is, I can continue to do fucked up things, but I'll tell her about it. It's like, right, cool.

Speaker 2:
[52:16] I do think that he has one valid point here, which is like she has kind of shifted the stated goal, and I see that she believes that he would get more out of this, and so would she if they focus less on not hooking up with someone and more on affirmatively exploring other things they might want in a relationship. That can be a very productive thing to do on this show. If you are on Temptation Island, you might as well do that. But it's also the case that she probably would have been really mad if he started developing a romantic type relationship with a woman for the purpose of opening up. And you can see him being like, well...

Speaker 1:
[52:56] I'm damned if I do, damned if I don't in this. I think she is struggling to articulate the things she actually wants, which is like, she's like, yeah, the goalposts have shifted. Neither of us are cheating on the other one. So we need to have done some other kind of growth. And he's like, well, I thought the point was not to cheat.

Speaker 2:
[53:16] Right. And I, yeah, and it does seem like maybe it seems more manageable to him to spend a few weeks just like truly hyper-focusing on not, like while he's being filmed, not doing anything untrustworthy. And he's actually-

Speaker 1:
[53:30] He fails, Claire.

Speaker 2:
[53:33] He eventually does fail. He's trying to go deeper. He's trying to shift the goalposts. But yeah, like it's not turning him into the man that she actually wants to be with.

Speaker 1:
[53:43] Because she wants a different man.

Speaker 2:
[53:44] She wants a different man. Mikey's video to Sydney says that he is been in hell. He's confused and in pain from what he's seen of her journey. He's tried to work on himself and his emotional growth for her and for himself, and to keep the main thing the main thing. He says he loves her today and he'll love her more tomorrow. Sydney is unmoved. She says she's heard these things before and there's no more moving past things. He's just not the man for her.

Speaker 1:
[54:08] She's over it.

Speaker 2:
[54:10] Sydney's video to Mikey opens with her saying they came here with problems they thought could be fixed. She says it's time for her to focus on herself to make the main thing the main thing.

Speaker 1:
[54:19] They're all making the main thing the main thing.

Speaker 2:
[54:21] This is like a couple thing for them clearly. To Bachelor Nation viewers, it's a Sam McKinney thing. But this is clearly something between them. She says she's never been that for herself, the main thing. And now she knows what she deserves. She says the bare maximum is actually the bare minimum. I don't understand what that means. What is a bare maximum?

Speaker 1:
[54:44] It's just a little way to be like, I deserve more.

Speaker 2:
[54:47] I deserve more. She's made herself smaller so he can shine and she's not doing that anymore. She wishes him the same clarity. Mikey is upset and in tears after this. He can't believe there is a chance to leave without her. I'm like, Mikey, that was a breakup speech. It's done.

Speaker 1:
[55:03] He's not clocking it.

Speaker 2:
[55:04] And he's like, I didn't want to come here. And it is sort of like, it's sad, it's hard. He has to sort of watch her moving on from him and into a new relationship when that's not what he expected.

Speaker 1:
[55:16] That sucks.

Speaker 2:
[55:17] It sucks. And it's not what she told him was going to be on the table, and that sucks. Also, if his thought is, we should have just stayed home and I would still have my girlfriend, clearly this relationship was making her so unhappy and unfulfilled that she was desperate to leave. So I don't know if that would be the right outcome either. Jack's message to Shy opens with him saying he misses her with all his heart. He says he's hurt her in the past and recently, and they've hurt each other, but it's something they can overcome. He tells her they both deserve better. At this point, Shy starts laughing in disbelief.

Speaker 1:
[55:53] He's just so manipulative because he doesn't want them to overcome it. Like, I don't believe him.

Speaker 2:
[55:59] Yeah.

Speaker 1:
[55:59] I think he just wants to look good.

Speaker 2:
[56:02] Yeah. I don't believe he misses her. I don't believe that he's hurt by what she's done. I don't believe he wants to overcome it. No. He says he's been emotionally unavailable and wants to fix it, and he's in support of whatever she chooses. He loves her in this life and the next, and he forgives her for everything.

Speaker 1:
[56:21] He's like, I'm so magnanimous. I forgive you.

Speaker 2:
[56:25] Isn't this something, I think it was Grant on last season of Temptation Island, pulled this too. It's always the most inveterate, determined, shitty cheaters who make a big show out of forgiving their partners.

Speaker 1:
[56:40] Yeah, because they're like, I need everyone to know how good I am.

Speaker 2:
[56:44] Right, and it makes it appear to others more like a mutual dynamic, and it's true that there is a mutual dynamic that has developed between them, but his behavior is above and beyond that. It was this whole cycle on the show started because of his behavior. He is the one who has escalated by getting involved with people. And then to sit there and be like, well, I forgive you, they're just both in this together. Fuck off, man. It's such a tell for a guy who actually isn't capable of taking accountability for his behavior.

Speaker 1:
[57:17] Well, that's the thing.

Speaker 2:
[57:18] He's like, the important thing is that I see your accountability and I absolve you, and we don't have to worry about me. Like, you know, Shia's gobsmacked. She's like, you forgive me? What the fuck do you forgive me for? You cheated on me first. But Jack's attitude-

Speaker 1:
[57:33] We love his clarity, Cheyenne.

Speaker 2:
[57:35] Yes. Jack's attitude is very like, he literally says at some point, like two wrongs don't make a right. And it's like, again, that's not something that the person who started it gets to say. She says this is proof she's outgrown Jack because it didn't give her the emotions she expected. It did make me happy to see her laughing instead of getting emotionally drawn in by this. She goes back to the villa and tells everyone, could you have tried to manipulate me any harder?

Speaker 1:
[58:02] Thank you. You're seeing it.

Speaker 2:
[58:04] Shy did not send him a message because she doesn't give a fuck. Jack says that this made his heart sink to his balls. Why are you trying to make me think about your balls? Like everything he says is just so gross to me. Like he sat there and he was like, where did it make my heart sink to? Definitely my balls. India and Christelle tell him that Shy took away his personality and put it in a box.

Speaker 1:
[58:28] I hate this so much. Stop indulging this man.

Speaker 2:
[58:31] Like, and how do they know? Like they just met him. They just met him. And now he's like, yeah, now I can really show out. Show what? Like is his personality fucking different women every night? Like I feel like that's the main decision. That's the true him.

Speaker 1:
[58:47] He's free. And these women love that for him.

Speaker 2:
[58:51] They just want him to be free. On that note, we're going to take a quick break when we get back the end of this season of Temptation Island.

Speaker 1:
[59:06] And we are back. So next, we get something that we haven't seen before.

Speaker 2:
[59:12] Is this new? I was like, I don't think I've seen this before, but I have a terrible memory.

Speaker 1:
[59:16] Yeah, I don't know because I've only watched the rebooted version of Temptation Island. I think we watched one or two seasons on USA, and then this-

Speaker 2:
[59:25] Yeah, the first reboot a few years ago.

Speaker 1:
[59:29] And then the Netflix version. So I don't know if this is something that they've done before and we just haven't seen it. That's totally possible. But in the seasons, I've watched, I have not seen this before. They send the coupled people over on a field trip to their partner's villas to like, snoop around, suss out the vibes.

Speaker 2:
[59:47] Yeah, Mark is like, you know, you can like catch a vibe. I'm like, yeah, the vibe is from the people there, but none of the people are there. So what is it?

Speaker 1:
[59:55] No, they have photo booths, Claire.

Speaker 2:
[59:56] It's an invitation to snoop around is what it is. And to like rifle through each other's drawers. I found this so violating and uncomfortable to watch. Like it kind of felt like they were sent on show sanctioned panty raids. I was like, you're just going through each other's shit. Like it's, it's not a help. That's the thing about this show is they'll be like, oh, it's all about growth and therapy and like boundaries and exploring what you want.

Speaker 1:
[60:19] Go look through your partner's stuff.

Speaker 2:
[60:22] They are like sending them off on a mission to violate their partner's privacy.

Speaker 1:
[60:26] The point is like behave really badly. And unsurprisingly, the men behave worse than the women.

Speaker 2:
[60:33] The men walk around the women's villa. They go through all the drawers. Mikey finds a photo of Sydney kissing Xavier. Jack finds photos of Shy kissing Preston, which she quite obviously left out all over her bedside table. And he has the gall to be pissed.

Speaker 1:
[60:49] Like the men all get so petty. They're like, I'm stealing this photo.

Speaker 2:
[60:53] Yeah, they take the photos as like evidence. Cole finds Scarlett's diary.

Speaker 1:
[60:58] Which is like in a closet, in a zipped bag. It is not out on the bedside table.

Speaker 2:
[61:03] And he tries to get Summit to like tell him to read it.

Speaker 1:
[61:07] And Summit is like, I mean, I'm going to go to the other room. I wouldn't.

Speaker 2:
[61:11] He's like, I don't know, man. I wouldn't want to, but that's between you guys. Anyway, bye, I'm going to go over here. And Cole's like, please tell me, tell me what to do. Should I read it? I'm just going to read it. Cole reads it and his impression is that Scarlett thinks they're over and Cole sucks and she thinks about hooking up with Bradley. Yeah, I mean, you made this choice and now you feel bad.

Speaker 1:
[61:31] And that's why you should not read your partner's journal. Also, this doesn't seem like a show specific journal. It's a journal that she has that is like a sacred space in their home.

Speaker 2:
[61:42] Yeah.

Speaker 1:
[61:43] This is bad.

Speaker 2:
[61:44] Right. No, this really sucked. And like sometimes you violate your partner's privacy and then you at least find like a smoking gun where you can be like, well, good thing I snooped because now I know that you've been like cheating on me or whatever. He didn't even find that. He just found her like working through her thoughts and feelings about this. And he's like, well, at least I got clarity. He feels a little bit of, I don't know if remorse is the right word. He feels bad.

Speaker 1:
[62:08] He knows it was wrong and he knows it was on camera.

Speaker 2:
[62:11] So Summit is mad that Kaylee has been in a photo booth with four guys. There's a picture of her taking a photo with them, like a group photo.

Speaker 1:
[62:20] This pissed me off so hard. He literally rips the photo in half and says, in my mind, she's this cute, adorable, classy lady. Ew. Ew.

Speaker 2:
[62:32] Again, the way that he thinks about women is like, she's a classy type of woman.

Speaker 1:
[62:38] She's the Madonna.

Speaker 2:
[62:39] Exactly. And Jusenia is-

Speaker 1:
[62:41] Is the whore. The spicy whore.

Speaker 2:
[62:44] And Julianne, I guess, is like-

Speaker 1:
[62:47] Just a girl.

Speaker 2:
[62:47] The witty girl next door type. Like it puts them into these boxes and he's like-

Speaker 1:
[62:53] It's really gross.

Speaker 2:
[62:55] Kaylee isn't supposed to have fun with the guys in the house. Like I'm having fun with the girls at my house. She's supposed to be classy and cute.

Speaker 1:
[63:04] She's literally just in a photograph.

Speaker 2:
[63:06] She's in a photo. They're not doing anything inappropriate in a photo.

Speaker 1:
[63:11] Like no one's grabbing her breast in this photo.

Speaker 2:
[63:13] It's like he's saying it's not cute or classy for her to be near other men. Like we're verging on like my girlfriend should have no male friends territory here with this kind of attitude.

Speaker 1:
[63:23] I really hated this.

Speaker 2:
[63:24] The men take a photo in the photo booth of themselves flipping off the camera and leave it for the women to find. Meanwhile, in the men's villa, the women are also rifling through. Shai takes Jack's cologne. She's like, he's gone through the whole bottle. This man has been drenching himself.

Speaker 1:
[63:39] Oh God, you just know, you just know he is.

Speaker 2:
[63:44] That man is covered in product from head to toe. She's like, I'm going to spray the rest out. Don't listen. Think of the other ladies. I'm sure he needs at least a little bit of cologne. Kaylee tells Summit's room, I love you. I miss you. Two of these women have already given up on their shitty boyfriends. It's actually less depressing overall, in part because of that.

Speaker 1:
[64:06] They're just having a good time. They're like, wow, our villa has much better vibes. Let's take some cute photos of ourselves and put them on the wall.

Speaker 2:
[64:14] Yeah.

Speaker 1:
[64:15] They don't rip any photos, they don't steal any photos. They don't really care.

Speaker 2:
[64:20] Right. The women come back and Kaylee's photo booth photos are all ripped. She's like, why would he do that? That's just me and my friends. What's wrong with that? Cheyenne Preston's photos are all gone, Sid's favorite photo with Xavier and some others are gone. Scarlet sees that her journal was gone through and she's livid. She's like, we have explicit rules about him not going through my journal. It's also sad that you even have to have that. If my partner has a journal, the assumption is that I'm not supposed to look through the journal.

Speaker 1:
[64:47] Well, yeah. Again, that's violating.

Speaker 2:
[64:51] Meanwhile, the men return and find that the women took a few sexy photos and they're like, this is war.

Speaker 1:
[64:58] But also seems like maybe they were less petty than us.

Speaker 2:
[65:02] Yeah, which they were. And also the Temptresses are like, you know what? They look hot. Good for them. So there are some more dates. As always, the dates are the most boring part.

Speaker 1:
[65:14] I literally don't care about the dates.

Speaker 2:
[65:16] The summit takes Julianne on a Vespa date and he tells us there's not one thing he would change or ask her to work on, which feels petty.

Speaker 1:
[65:22] Well, he doesn't know her, so again.

Speaker 2:
[65:26] Like you were immediately obsessed with Kayleigh and now you have a long list for her. He tells her that hanging out with her makes him happy. Shy takes Preston for a massage and tells him that she no longer sees Jack as a good person. He's not. Yeah, no, she's correct. They discuss possibly continuing to see each other after this because they're getting more serious. Mikey takes India for coconut drinks by the sea and talks about how she makes it easy for him to go beyond the surface. He shares with her that he's the only big personality in the family. I'm like, yeah, there's not room for another. You take up so much space. He says, well, except for my dad, but he's a lawyer, so you can turn it on and off as we all know about lawyers. India seems so over it. She just is nodding and smiling.

Speaker 1:
[66:10] She's like, I'm obsessed with India on this show because she is just always like, yes, I will literally listen to you. Spout off, Mikey.

Speaker 2:
[66:20] India has figured out a very similar thing to Sidney, but it's not a problem because she's not going to have to deal with him for long, which is like, he's going to take up all the air in the room, and my role is to just sort of sit here and nod and smile, and it will make him feel amazing.

Speaker 1:
[66:35] Exactly.

Speaker 2:
[66:36] Make yourself small. Sidney and Xavier sit by the waves and talk about how Mikey has never given her what she needs, and Xavier showed her that she could leave that cycle of hoping he would change. They end up making out by the water, and he spins her around. Jack takes Jessenia for a fondue and hot tub experience, so he can get a different look at things from someone else, which seems to mostly entail making out. He's like, I want a different perspective.

Speaker 1:
[67:04] I need to come at this from a different vantage point, like the vantage point of slapping your ass.

Speaker 2:
[67:11] Right.

Speaker 1:
[67:12] What will I learn? Probably so much about myself.

Speaker 2:
[67:15] I think I'm going to learn a lot more if I make out the different girl and that's going to give me emotional growth.

Speaker 1:
[67:21] Also, I was really laughing because Carter and Jesenia look very similar.

Speaker 2:
[67:25] No, they do. Actually, the first time that he invites Jesenia to the Haven, I was like, there they go again. Then when she said, you were just here with someone else, I was like, what? I had to go back and I was like, oh no.

Speaker 1:
[67:37] That is a different woman.

Speaker 2:
[67:39] He's got a type and it doesn't look like Cheyenne, by the way. But yeah, they make out through the day. He invites her to sleep in his bed that night. They make out more, he slaps her ass, yawn. He's not digging deep or learning anything except that he deserves to make out with as many hot women as he can.

Speaker 1:
[67:53] He's the main character.

Speaker 2:
[67:55] Bonfire Night. This is what? The fourth Bonfire Night, I think.

Speaker 1:
[68:00] They all start to blend together, Claire.

Speaker 2:
[68:02] They do. The guys go first. Jack sees Cheyenne saying that she doesn't see him as a good person, and she's ready to explore things more with Preston and their kiss. He says it's what he expected. Now, he has the ultimate decision of what he's going to do moving forward, and he thinks they'll be able to mutually agree. I'm like, yeah, Jack ain't nothing mutual here. She just said that she doesn't even think you're a good person, and she wants to date Preston. It's like, oh, yeah, you can't fire me. I quit. We're mutually agreeing that my employment is over. He also says that she hasn't always talked highly about him, and he's realized it's not normal. I think it is normal if you behave like Jack for your partner.

Speaker 1:
[68:45] What is there to say about you that's positive?

Speaker 2:
[68:48] Right. He does say he wants to see her, hug her, say he's sorry, and give her support.

Speaker 1:
[68:55] He always throws this in just so he can be like, I'm a good person.

Speaker 2:
[68:59] Oh, it's sad because she's always treated me badly, and I don't deserve that, but I do want to be there for her because I'm a good. Sorry, Jack, what have you been up to the last weekend? Could you just fill me in real quick?

Speaker 1:
[69:13] He was digging deep into the crevices of a woman's ass. It was really hard, challenging emotional work.

Speaker 2:
[69:22] Listen, there's nothing malicious about that, okay? He's exploring his interest in asses. Mikey sees Sid talking to Xavier about not settling, and they also made up a secret handshake on their date or a special handshake, and then they kiss by the water. Mikey says that he's, quote, given that girl everything. He says, Sid texted his mom and said that Mikey gives her the world and he supports her to the fullest. This is a slap in the face. His mom, she also told his mom something about how she was so grateful to have such a godly man in her life or something.

Speaker 1:
[69:59] Oh, yeah.

Speaker 2:
[70:00] I'm sorry, this all just sounds like stuff that you would say to your boyfriend's mom. What are you going to say? Your son has a lot of work to do.

Speaker 1:
[70:09] I'm not sure if he's a good person.

Speaker 2:
[70:12] Thanks for trying, but he's lacking. No. She's like, oh, yes, your son's so wonderful. He gives me the world. I'm so grateful for him. Bullshit, bullshit, bullshit. That's what you say to your boyfriend's mom, except for me. I only say it because it's true. I love you, Nancy.

Speaker 1:
[70:29] Are you thinking about your son's future partners if they choose to date women? And they're just like, your son is amazing. And they go on TV and they're like, this guy sucks.

Speaker 2:
[70:39] Well, if my son behaved like this, I would expect no less.

Speaker 1:
[70:44] That's the thing. Yeah, you would be consistent. You have values.

Speaker 2:
[70:49] Accountability for all men. No, it's rough. She knew his family. They thought that it was going to work out between them. She wanted to build him up and instead she's realized that she can do a lot better and he can't, unfortunately, hold her to nice things that she said to his mom when they were dating. He keeps saying that she tricked him into coming here. She said it would help them and instead she's given a public display of her moving on. Yeah, it sucks for him.

Speaker 1:
[71:20] She didn't trick him. She didn't trick him. It does suck. It does suck to see her moving on publicly. I agree with that. I don't think she tricked him.

Speaker 2:
[71:28] I don't think she intentionally tricked him, but I do understand feeling like, wow, that happened so fast that she couldn't have really believed.

Speaker 1:
[71:35] Totally.

Speaker 2:
[71:36] That we were going to work out and that's hard. Mark tries to get him to consider that they came with a relationship that had problems and the unexpected happened. It may not have been her plan. Summit sees Kaylee talking about how she wants him to reflect and grow. She wants him to want to do acts of love without her asking, like taking her out to dinner, and she wants him to explain the future he sees with her. Even the other guys are like, nice one, bro. That was really good. She just laid out for you what she wants you to do, and it all seems pretty manageable. You can do that. Summit's like, can I? I don't know if I can do that.

Speaker 1:
[72:10] He's like, but maybe I don't want to, is the thing.

Speaker 2:
[72:13] Summit says he's not sure he can give it to her, but he wants to. Mark says that he thinks Summit wants to want to give it to her.

Speaker 1:
[72:21] I think Mark really is concerned that Summit is ill-equipped.

Speaker 2:
[72:27] I think Mark is right, that Summit has not shown at past bonfires and past conversations that he's had with the women, that he is ready to actually grow to a point where he's more focused on how that's her trying to change him. Summit is like, but I want to do those things, but then he goes back to the women and he's like, she's trying to change me and it's so fucked up. Summit says, well, I'm just not sure that I'm ready yet. It's only been a year. I want to ask her to slow down a little and Mark says, well, that's fine and she may not be okay slowing down and that's fine too. Honesty is what matters.

Speaker 1:
[73:00] He's like, just lay out what you want and then she can take it or leave it. Don't do this wishy washy bullshit. And he is correct about that. They are in their mid 20s. It is perfectly fine to say, I don't know that I can give you a commitment right now that it's like, this is definitely moving towards marriage, right? And she's allowed to say, well, that's not enough for me.

Speaker 2:
[73:20] Yeah. But you can't just stay in a relationship where you're both disappointing each other all the time and you can't talk about it.

Speaker 1:
[73:26] Correct.

Speaker 2:
[73:27] Cole sees, speaking of this dynamic, Cole sees Scarlett telling Bradley, she is realizing she doesn't feel fully seen. There isn't trust, there isn't depth. So does she stay or find something more aligned? Because she craves depth. Cole says he's not sure how to analyze this. He says he's felt so much pain during this process and he doesn't have the fear of being raw and honest anymore. Mark asks if he could tell Scarlett about that fear he's had because that would be emotional connection. Mark is like, have you considered expressing your feelings to Scarlett?

Speaker 1:
[73:58] He's like, what if I lead you towards an emotional connection?

Speaker 2:
[74:04] Oh, boy. He's really doing like remedial emotional literacy for these men. The women go next after this bonfire is the last night with the Tempters and the Temptresses, and soon it will be the final bonfire when they get to talk to their partners directly. So this is like the last of these bonfire nights. Cheyenne sees Jack saying that it's time for him to show out and the Temptress is telling him that Chey took away his personality and put it in a box. Whenever they say put it in a box, I know it's one clip, but it's just such a funny visual to me.

Speaker 1:
[74:36] It's hilarious.

Speaker 2:
[74:37] I keep his personality in a box under my bed. She also sees Jack tell Jessenia she's the best kisser in the house and slapping her ass. Chey points out that Jack couldn't even stick with the same girl on this show. She says she wonders why he dragged her along and didn't just end the relationship. And Mark points out that Cheyenne also stayed in the relationship when she had serious concerns. And when she saw him cheating, her reaction was that he's a loser. So maybe their issues were more about her feeling that he can't fulfill her needs and less his fidelity. And Chey admits that, yeah, she really thought that he would work harder and be more successful. And she has done more at a younger age than he has, and that really upsets her. And that does seem at least equally significant in their relationship as the cheating.

Speaker 1:
[75:26] Yeah, it's like she just doesn't respect him.

Speaker 2:
[75:29] That's the thing. Cheating is something that can ruin your respect for your partner, but so is the sense that you don't think they're hardworking, or you don't think that they have the kind of ambition you respect.

Speaker 1:
[75:38] I think she's like, look at this man just fucking around in every sense of the word.

Speaker 2:
[75:42] Right.

Speaker 1:
[75:43] I don't respect him. Maybe I don't even think he's a good person. And Mark is correct that she stayed in a relationship she wasn't happy in.

Speaker 2:
[75:53] Yeah.

Speaker 1:
[75:54] And now she's going to be free.

Speaker 2:
[75:55] Sydney sees Mikey telling India that he's more in tune with his emotions with her and she helped him grow. And she sees a clip of him saying that Sydney filled his head with love and other stuff and now his feelings are hurt. He cries while talking about how great of a personality he has. He feels tricked.

Speaker 1:
[76:13] I'm like, Summit is out here being like, I'm so endearing. Mikey is out here being like, my personality is incredible. Like, imagine having that level of confidence even in the midst of heartbreak.

Speaker 2:
[76:23] They're all on a journey of self acceptance, of radical self acceptance, self glorification even. That's what they're going to take away from this. Sydney reiterates her intention was to leave with Mikey, but she realized she wants more. Now she's moved on with Xavier and she sees that Mikey has shown growth and that's great, but she's moved on.

Speaker 1:
[76:44] She's over it.

Speaker 2:
[76:46] Yeah. She sees him growing and she's like, that's so great for him. I'm happy for him and his future partners. Kayleigh sees Summit on a date with Julianne, and Julianne says she'd be excited to meet Summit in the real world. And he says that makes him happy and she's awesome. Julianne is clearly doing a little bit of like fishing, like we could date in the real world.

Speaker 1:
[77:08] That's a thing. I do think she would like to date him, but I don't get the sense that Summit is really like indulging it.

Speaker 2:
[77:17] Right. Well, that was the point maybe in the whole show where I was like, Summit plans to leave with Kaylee. He definitely plans to leave with Kaylee because he is very consciously not even like, oh yeah, I'd love to meet you in the real world too.

Speaker 1:
[77:31] No, he's just like, oh, that makes me happy. You're so awesome.

Speaker 2:
[77:33] Yeah. Thank you. I appreciate that. Kaylee says that it looks like Julianne sees the amazing qualities that she sees, but Kaylee still wants to feel like the priority, Summit doesn't make her feel that way. Mark pushes her on this and says that she deserves to put herself as number one priority, and maybe what needs work is her relationship with herself. I get a little bit frustrated by this sometimes. It's good to push them to do the work on themselves because that's all they can really fully control, but also no amount of making yourself the priority can force your partner to make you a priority.

Speaker 1:
[78:06] Right. He's correct in a sense, which is that she clearly is grappling with things that she doesn't like about herself, and that is there is some work she can do there. But yeah, even doing that work, if Summit treats you like shit, that's not going to stop that from happening.

Speaker 2:
[78:27] He frames it almost as like, if you treat yourself like a priority, then he will see that he needs to treat you like a priority. He'll rise to meet that, and I don't know that that's necessarily true.

Speaker 1:
[78:37] Right.

Speaker 2:
[78:37] At the same time, it also seems true that she self-deprecates because she feels bad about herself, and that gives Summit an opening to criticize her, that she does have a lot of tough feelings that she's grappling with, and that she expects Summit to spend a lot of time managing those with her, and that's also a pressure on their relationship.

Speaker 1:
[78:55] Yeah, that can be a very tough dynamic if you are a person who constantly needs to be coddled by your partner. I do think that that's something that a lot of people experience, especially in their 20s, when they don't have a strong sense of self-developed, and you expect your partner to fill in those gaps. There is a value in doing that work on yourself.

Speaker 2:
[79:20] Right.

Speaker 1:
[79:20] But yeah, it's not going to guarantee any change in Summit's behavior.

Speaker 2:
[79:23] That doesn't magically mean that Summit is going to take her on dates, or that when she is having a hard time, that he's going to cancel his plans to be there for her. Scarlett sees Cole complaining about the video message she sent him, and saying he's been following the playbook. He feels like he's the one always taking accountability, and he lied because he had fear of hurting and losing Scarlett, and he no longer has that fear, so he'll be very transparent and raw with her.

Speaker 1:
[79:46] I love that he's like, I'm no longer afraid to lose you, so I'm just going to tell you about all the shitty things I do. At no point is he like, and therefore I'm going to stop doing stupid things out of insecurity.

Speaker 2:
[80:01] He works so hard to get to just the first thin layer of the problem here, which is like I shouldn't lie out of a fear of losing someone. A good relationship has to be built on honesty, even if that means risking losing someone that I love very much. Okay, next layer. Like let's dig a little deeper here.

Speaker 1:
[80:21] Let's go one step further.

Speaker 2:
[80:23] Right, why do I keep having things come up that I feel the need to lie about because they would hurt my partner? Again, I feel like I have to lie to my partner about things that I've done that would hurt him. Basically never, it doesn't really come up. Scarlett responds by saying, this isn't about temptation, it's about what she actually needs that she isn't getting. Mark points out that Cole has said he's afraid of Scarlett and that shows up in him not telling the truth and that makes Scarlett feel unsafe in the relationship. And she's like, yeah, it's a fear-based relationship. She says she's discovered that the things she values most in the relationship are what's missing.

Speaker 1:
[80:59] I mean, that is just a death knell.

Speaker 2:
[81:01] Yeah.

Speaker 1:
[81:02] Like that says it all. You cannot come back from that.

Speaker 2:
[81:06] Yeah, I know. He now has found one thing he can maybe fix, which is like, I lie because I'm afraid, so I'm not going to be afraid, and now the lying is fixed. But there is so much else broken in terms of their trust and intimacy. Right.

Speaker 1:
[81:19] She's like, we have no trust. We have no ability to communicate. We have no ability to have any deep conversations. Like, then what is your relationship?

Speaker 2:
[81:28] They clearly value different things.

Speaker 1:
[81:29] What are you even doing together?

Speaker 2:
[81:31] They both go on runs. Like, they clearly, their thing at the beginning was like, we have so much in common, which is crazy to remember. But it seems like they have a lot of shared hobbies and like lifestyle choices. But then when it comes to what they actually value in terms of intimacy and communication and like focus in life, they're polar opposites.

Speaker 1:
[81:50] So the men and women head back to their respective villas after the bonfires. And when the women return to their villa, the men have made them chocolate chip cookies. It's so wholesome. And since it's like their last night in the villas as a group, both houses do some like toasts to growth and friendship and all the good things. I was dying at Summits Toast, which is like so oddly paternalistic. He's like, wow, I just can't wait to see what all of you young ladies will do with your bright futures. Right.

Speaker 2:
[82:23] It's like your roommate's dad took you all out to dinner at college graduation.

Speaker 1:
[82:27] Yes, I was like, what the fuck is going on? I was like, you were just at an anything but clothes party with these women. Why are you speaking to them as if you're their friend's uncle?

Speaker 2:
[82:39] Yeah, or you're setting up a scholarship fund for them. Spiritually, this man is middle-aged and also 21 years old. It doesn't make sense. At the men's villa, Mikey sits down with Jusenia and India. They all have some closure conversations. He tells them that Sydney said fucking with him was settling, and he feels disrespected. He says, my brand new friends that don't owe me shit wouldn't do that to me.

Speaker 1:
[83:09] Well, exactly, Mikey. They aren't settling for you.

Speaker 2:
[83:14] Right.

Speaker 1:
[83:15] They get to leave. Right.

Speaker 2:
[83:18] I guarantee you, if India was in a relationship with you, she would feel like it was settling after one week.

Speaker 1:
[83:25] I was dying at this.

Speaker 2:
[83:29] This is a problem. Everyone deals with this. You develop baggage in your relationship, your partner gets fed up with some of your shit, and you're like, well, this new person doesn't see that. But I feel like the men on this show have this particular issue where they often come in having done some pretty fucked up stuff to their partners. Then their whole issue with their partner is why hasn't she forgotten about all of that stuff? This new person I've never done any fucked up stuff to, isn't mad at me about the fucked up stuff that I've done to her. But my girlfriend that I have done a bunch of fucked up stuff to, she is mad at me and that doesn't feel fair. Like, do you expect your girlfriend to be eternal sunshine of the spotless minded after every time you cheat?

Speaker 1:
[84:11] Like, yes, literally, yes.

Speaker 2:
[84:15] India tells the camera that Mikey's insecurities come from the way his girlfriend treats him.

Speaker 1:
[84:20] Okay, India.

Speaker 2:
[84:22] She hopes Mikey can find someone who makes him feel worthy.

Speaker 1:
[84:25] I was like, translation, it won't be her.

Speaker 2:
[84:27] It certainly won't. I'm sure that woman's out there.

Speaker 1:
[84:28] She's like, someone out there in that great big world.

Speaker 2:
[84:32] I think the fact that Mikey's whole persona was being like life of the party serial womanizer before Sydney indicates that his insecurities go a lot deeper. Than whatever he's heard from Sydney. Meanwhile, Sydney is telling Xavier that she never wanted to hurt Mikey, and Xavier reassures her that she isn't the bad guy, and they reaffirm that they want to continue something with each other.

Speaker 1:
[84:56] They're just adorable. Shy sits down with some of the guys and she's like, I fucking knew Jack would be out here hooking up with multiple women. She thinks he's just crashing out because he sees that she's moved on. Meanwhile, Jack is hopping back over to Carter to ask her for advice. He's like, what should I do going into the final bonfire? He does this thing where he tries to be like, I did do something a little wrong. He's like, I feel like the way I've moved in the house is a little fucked up. But he knows that Carter is the right person to go to because she is the chill girl.

Speaker 2:
[85:31] Carter is not going to hold him accountable.

Speaker 1:
[85:33] He knows that and he loves it. She's like, Jack, you're single. You've been so respectful. Evidence not found.

Speaker 2:
[85:41] I'm like, what would you consider disrespectful?

Speaker 1:
[85:45] Right.

Speaker 2:
[85:46] Genuinely, I want to know what she would consider disrespectful from this man. Jack says he does believe he's opened up to the fullest extent in this experience. And he has opened up in the way that you would open up to swinging or sexual relationships. But I don't know if we've seen any emotional opening up, except that he has decided that he deserves a woman who will put up with his shit and still treat him like he is a king. What does he bring to the table? He's not going to be faithful to you. He doesn't seem interested in having the job or making money outside of getting paid a little bit to go to clubs and party. He has terrible hair. He looks and behaves like a child who got all of his outfit from Hot Topic. What is he bringing to the table?

Speaker 1:
[86:36] I don't understand.

Speaker 2:
[86:37] And he's like, I've learned that I deserve to be treated like a prince.

Speaker 1:
[86:44] I think you came in believing that too. You learned nothing.

Speaker 2:
[86:48] I think his self mission this whole time was to get hopefully get Cheyenne to do enough fucked up stuff. Like literally he started cheating almost immediately. Part of me genuinely believes that that was intentional to get Cheyenne to retaliate so that she would look just as bad as him.

Speaker 1:
[87:03] Now she's in the mud with him.

Speaker 2:
[87:05] Right. I don't like this guy. He says he's emotionally attracted to Carter. Okay. I will say that I love that Carter continues to be like, you're doing great over there. Good for you.

Speaker 1:
[87:20] I know. I do think she's like, okay, whatever. She's like, I'm 22. I don't play him for the future. You're certainly not in it.

Speaker 2:
[87:28] I don't think about the future. I don't think about the past. In this moment, we're not kissing and that's fine with me. Coles main takeaway from the bonfire seems to be that Scarlett is moving on with Bradley. He also knows he has to tell her about reading her journal, and the single women advise him to tell her immediately and be upfront and say he regrets it. He says, well, I don't regret it.

Speaker 1:
[87:48] I was like, what? They're like, just say it immediately, just be upfront, be like, I regret it. He's like, well, no, to clarify, don't really regret it.

Speaker 2:
[87:57] I mean, I appreciate his honesty, I guess.

Speaker 1:
[88:00] But this is when I just started to be like, Cole, do you suck?

Speaker 2:
[88:04] Yeah, well, and this is, again, this is why he's still not understanding. I hate how she keeps talking about depth because it's often unclear to me exactly what she means, and I haven't seen her demonstrate very much of anything deep. But this must be so maddening, like what she wants is for him to stop violating her trust, and lying is only one piece of it, and confessing to her that he did something trust violating is not inherently a trustworthy behavior because you still did the trust violating thing. Right. He's like, finally, I'm not afraid to tell her the truth, and therefore, I'm no longer violating her trust, and this is great. No, you went through her journal.

Speaker 1:
[88:43] And you don't regret it.

Speaker 2:
[88:45] Right. That will make her feel like I appreciate, again, the honesty, but honestly, that suggests that you're not someone she should feel safe around. You feel fine about having violated her trust. Why wouldn't you do it again? That doesn't give any sense of safety or trust. Bradley kind of shoots his shot with Scarlett, but she doesn't really indulge it. She actually keeps kind of like cutting him off before he can fully get out what he's trying to say.

Speaker 1:
[89:12] Yeah, she's clearly not trying to date someone else.

Speaker 2:
[89:16] Right.

Speaker 1:
[89:17] They ultimately just like hug it out as friends.

Speaker 2:
[89:19] Another thing about Sid and Xavier that is really unusual on a show like this, and that I think makes their conversations different aside from how good their connection is, is that they live in the same metro area.

Speaker 1:
[89:31] Right.

Speaker 2:
[89:32] I doubt that Bradley and Scarlett would have an easy time dating and hanging out after the show. He's trying to be like, I've developed feelings and she's like, yes, I love you too. It's great. Let's hug. The next morning, Summit calls his mom and tells her that he's really struggling and he starts crying. His mom encourages him to view this experience as a gift to him and Kaylee, because before you settle down, you should both be tempted beyond anybody's imagination to make sure. I was like, wow, it's great to get an insight into the mind of a parent who is happy their child is going on Temptation Island, because I feel like I would just be like, why are you there? Leave and come home. But she's like, you're both young, you don't have to commit to Kaylee for the rest of your life if you're questioning it. You should be sure before you make that kind of commitment. This all seems to help Summit clear his mind about his decision and he feels better.

Speaker 1:
[90:27] He's like, oh, I get to choose.

Speaker 2:
[90:29] Yeah.

Speaker 1:
[90:30] Either way.

Speaker 2:
[90:31] If I choose Kaylee, that means that I really see a forever with her, and if I don't, that's okay. The women say goodbye to the single men and they all get very weepy. These guys have proven to them that there are men who see women as people and ask them questions without expecting sex in return.

Speaker 1:
[90:48] I was like, the state of straightness is so broken, so bad. They're literally like, wow, it was so amazing to be in a space with a bunch of men who weren't trying to violate my mind, body, and spirit.

Speaker 2:
[91:02] Yeah, literally. You have to sit men down and be like, this is your task, this is your mission. Listen to the words they say, tell them that they're the prize. Do nice things for them. That's your job and they can do it. They rise to the occasion. Afterwards, the women reflect on how much they have evolved and grown as people. Sid says she realized that she was making herself smaller to put Mikey in the spotlight throughout their relationship. But now it's her time to shine. Meanwhile, the men send the single ladies off with a thank you, and Mikey tells them that they're beautiful and honorable, and he will always have their backs. Jack says he loves them all and he's about to cry. He does not seem like he's about to cry.

Speaker 1:
[91:48] I, oh my God. He kept doing this. He kept just being like, oh, I'm going to cry. I was like, there's no tears. This is the thing, the tears will never come.

Speaker 2:
[91:57] I feel like he has skated by showing zero genuine emotion. I'm realizing, like we see Mikey cry a lot. Sometimes that feels like kind of manipulative and over the top, but I actually do also think that it's a lack of emotional regulation and he's genuinely upset a lot of the time. We see Summit break down. We see Cole in an emotional state. I think that we basically never see Jack upset.

Speaker 1:
[92:23] No, he's just telling the camera that he is emotional. He's like, that hurts. I am going to cry.

Speaker 2:
[92:32] Yeah.

Speaker 1:
[92:33] He's not.

Speaker 2:
[92:34] I'm like actually just piecing this together now, but whenever we even see Shy doing something that might in theory upset him, he's just like, I get it. It's just about what I expected. No, it makes sense. It hurts. Sometimes he's literally smiling. Often he's smiling.

Speaker 1:
[92:49] If anyone is a sociopath on this show, it's there's something missing there.

Speaker 2:
[92:55] I'm telling you, there's something off. The men have a chat after the group goodbyes, and Summit says he thought the journey was about existing temptation, but it was about exploring temptation. They've all come out tougher. Not to give Summit any credit, but I do think that he is right, that if you are going to get anything out of this experience, which is made up not as a therapy, but instead to get footage of people doing clownish things and hurting each other on TV. But if you are going to get any growth out of this, it's probably because you use it to explore why you're not thriving in your relationship, what you might want from your partner.

Speaker 1:
[93:35] And whether you are able to.

Speaker 2:
[93:37] Right. Do you need different things from your partner? Do you need to bring different things to your relationship? You can sometimes explore those things by spending time with other people and getting to know yourself a bit better. Sure. I actually do think Summit kind of did that, and that is good.

Speaker 1:
[93:53] I mean, yeah, there is a reason that there's only one couple that is able to leave together.

Speaker 2:
[93:58] Do I like Summit? No. Do I like the way that he thinks about women? No. Do I like the way that he seems like both he's 45 and also 15 at the same time? Absolutely not. But I do think that he focused more on seeing what qualities he liked in other women, and what qualities he might need to have as a partner, rather than like, do I want to fuck someone and how quickly should I do it?

Speaker 1:
[94:21] Yeah. I think that's correct. I think we see that that opportunity for exploration can lead to different outcomes. Like with Summit, it ultimately leads to, oh, maybe I can be a better partner to Kayleigh. For Sydney, it leads to, oh, I was just in the completely wrong relationship, and there's someone else who's a better fit for me. And both of those, I think, are valid outcomes.

Speaker 2:
[94:42] Totally valid. Jack realized that he needed to stop focusing on pleasing somebody it wasn't going to work out with. He has to be himself and be genuine with his feelings, even with girls.

Speaker 1:
[94:52] Oh, give this man a fucking gold star. The feelings of, I want to go in the Temptation Haven with you.

Speaker 2:
[94:58] Right. The feeling that his dick is having. Literally. That is the only kind of feeling we see him have. Everyone gets ready for their final bonfires. Each couple is going to meet with Mark, and then each member of the couple will get a chance to speak uninterrupted, and then they will have a chance to converse, and then they will be asked to decide, do they want to leave the island with their original partner alone or with someone new? First up is Scarlett and Cole. Cole is ready to apologize and take accountability and tell Scarlett he read her journal. The old Cole may have not admitted to this, or would have made her ask him about it first.

Speaker 1:
[95:40] Cole. This is the lesson. I was honestly horrified.

Speaker 2:
[95:45] This is like elementary, like this is pre-K level accountability.

Speaker 1:
[95:51] Also, as she later points out, like this was on camera.

Speaker 2:
[95:54] Right. Exactly. And he still has had to steal himself to the point like this has been his whole focus. By the way, he still waits until quite far into their conversation.

Speaker 1:
[96:06] I know, the women were like, what you should do is bring it up immediately and also say you regret it. And he's like, I'll be doing neither of those things.

Speaker 2:
[96:14] Yeah, I'll get to it when I get to it. But his goal is to leave with Scarlett. And this is like his offering he's bringing her, like a mouse in his jaws or something.

Speaker 1:
[96:22] I did violate your trust in a really major way that we have explicitly spoken about before.

Speaker 2:
[96:28] Yeah.

Speaker 1:
[96:29] But I'm telling you.

Speaker 2:
[96:31] I told you didn't have to guess or badger me about it. Scarlett saw depth in communication in Bradley, the very thing she's missing with Cole. But she and Cole have a whole life together. They like live together and he's her best friend.

Speaker 1:
[96:46] I do think that's actually the main impediment of this relationship ending is they're just like, oh my God, it will be so annoying to unwind this relationship.

Speaker 2:
[96:53] They've only been together a year and a half. You can't like, this is why you can't move in together that quickly.

Speaker 1:
[96:58] No.

Speaker 2:
[96:59] Cole speaks first and says he saw Scarlett unwind their boundaries and form emotional connections. She took Bradley on multiple dates when they had decided not to take anyone on multiple dates. He felt like their roles were reversed where he was insecure, stressed out and felt unsafe. He had to reinvent himself as a result, but he knows he can make Scarlett feel safe by telling it to her straight. This was actually maybe the most angry I was at Cole, because he has all of the ingredients here in his own speech to understand how much he's been hurting Scarlett.

Speaker 1:
[97:35] I know.

Speaker 2:
[97:36] He's like, I've been feeling the way you have felt through our whole relationship, and it sucked so much, I almost didn't make it through. That was just a couple of weeks, dude. There's no acknowledgement still of the fact that she's been going through this all the time.

Speaker 1:
[97:49] I'm mad that you would do this to me.

Speaker 2:
[97:51] Right.

Speaker 1:
[97:51] Not like, oh, wow, I've been doing this to you for two years.

Speaker 2:
[97:55] Right. Our roles were reversed, I can't hack it, how could you do that to me? The end.

Speaker 1:
[98:01] How dare you go on multiple dates with Bradley? I was like, she didn't do anything with Bradley.

Speaker 2:
[98:06] I understand saying like, we set boundaries, I expect you to hold to those. I do understand that. But there is that missing piece of him saying, I also see how I must have hurt you, and how much suffering that must have caused that was invisible to me at the time when I broke those boundaries. He can't go there. Scarlett says she's sorry he's hurt, but she also says that they started this experience in a relationship with no trust or communication. Neither one of their journeys were about cheating, but there are some things that are missing in their relationship that she can't compromise on. Since being on Temptation Island, she feels like herself again, and she hasn't felt that way with him. It's time to converse, and he reiterates how hard this process has been for him, and he keeps focusing on Scarlett's connection with Bradley and how she'd feel if the roles were reversed. Scarlett is clearly frustrated. She's like, I never really crossed a boundary. I just realized that it was more beneficial for me to get close to someone that I was connecting with and to explore what I was getting from that connection. She says, you keep talking about accessing more depth within yourself, but I haven't seen that. And so, what does that mean to you? Do you know what emotional connections are? Harsh.

Speaker 1:
[99:15] She says she needs someone who she can just have deep conversations with and who is transparent with her without her having to ask for those things, which seems reasonable within a relationship. And Cole is like, I've done the work, and I am ready to leave this island knowing that I will never lie to you again. So here, I have to get something off my chest. I read your journal. I know it's sacred to you. And I swear I've never done it before. And Scarlett is like, well, I don't believe you now.

Speaker 2:
[99:46] Right.

Speaker 1:
[99:47] You invaded my privacy. You know that my journal is sacred. This shows how little trust there is in our relationship. And Cole is like, no, but give me my gold star.

Speaker 2:
[99:57] I told you about it. So that's a huge step. That's growth.

Speaker 1:
[100:01] She's like, yes, you were on camera.

Speaker 2:
[100:03] Yeah. I was going to find out. So I still don't feel confident that you would tell me that in the future. I also was just like, Cole, we started, instead of leading with this, you started by shaming Scarlett for all the ways that she broke your trust by, it seems like mostly just by taking one guy on multiple dates. And again, I understand saying we had a boundary and I feel that you broke it. That makes me feel like less trust. But you broke her trust in a really big way. And you're not only not really being that apologetic for it, you're actually like, this is actually a sign of how much I've grown. Because after I broke your trust, I told you about it. Like, Cole, do you see how different your standards, your standards are for her behavior versus you? You think that you are the one suffering from a double standard. But in fact, you expect much more trustworthiness from her clearly. And you think that if you behave in an untrustworthy way, but then you don't lie about it afterwards, that is actually trust building. That's not how it works.

Speaker 1:
[101:02] You didn't even have to beg me to tell you about it. I'm amazing.

Speaker 2:
[101:08] It's actually unbelievable. I was like, Cole, this would have been a great opportunity to show that you understand her emotions now that you have been in the position of having to question and wonder what your partner is up to, and you're sorry now.

Speaker 1:
[101:19] This final bonfire made me really, really deeply unimpressed with Cole. I was like, no, go fuck yourself. Like, you suck. So they have to make their final decisions, and Cole is like, I'd still like to leave the island with Scarlett. And Scarlett is like, well, after our conversation, I have actually gained clarity. I want to leave alone. I have to choose myself. And Cole is clearly crushed, and like, I get it. He's like, I, like, we literally live together. Like, what am I supposed to do?

Speaker 2:
[101:47] I guess you have to get married then.

Speaker 1:
[101:50] And Scarlett says she's hurting too. Well, they'll cross that bridge when they get there, but she has to leave alone. At this point, I was like, so they're just gonna get back together.

Speaker 2:
[102:00] I'm worried that they just get back together. It is hard to, like, break up when you live together, but it needs to happen.

Speaker 1:
[102:06] They need to break up. And Cole really freaked me out after Scarlett leaves.

Speaker 2:
[102:12] This was a lot.

Speaker 1:
[102:13] I hated this. He's so bitter. He's like, Scarlett didn't say how she's grown. Like, maybe she feels unsafe and insecure because of something from her childhood, not me. Like, he says, I couldn't have handled myself any better than I did. Really?

Speaker 2:
[102:30] He says, there's a deeper issue with her, man. It's something I can't fix. Then he says that no one will love her like he does. And then he gets in the car to drive away and he, like, smashes his water bottle against the car seat.

Speaker 1:
[102:43] Like, violently. It actually really freaked me out.

Speaker 2:
[102:46] Yeah, this really bothered me. And I have repeatedly said I have a soft spot for Cole. I think maybe there are some other potentially reasons why he has struggled with communicating and having that intuitive grasp of emotional communication. Like, I'm sympathetic to that and it's hard to probably be constantly baffled by what she wants if it's not natural to you. However, these are some really red flaggy things to say. Like, yes, I literally have been breaking her trust all over. I've lied to her for years. Like, I went through her journal just now. Like, but I think that she feels unsafe because of something from her childhood. Right, there's nothing more like issue.

Speaker 1:
[103:27] I can't even do anything about it.

Speaker 2:
[103:28] She's broken. She's broken. And that's why she doesn't trust me.

Speaker 1:
[103:32] And also, now I'm going to start like hitting things.

Speaker 2:
[103:35] Also, no one will love her like I do, buddy.

Speaker 1:
[103:39] No, no, no, no. No, no, no.

Speaker 2:
[103:42] Like, people say things when they're hurt and I'm not calling anyone anything, but that is out of the abuser textbook. Like, that's a red flaggy thing to say and it concerns me. Like, especially combined with all the other shit he's saying, which is like, he can't take accountability for the stuff that he's done to break her trust, but he blames her a great deal for hurting him, for not always being completely consistent. And he doesn't see how he has that effect on her. He thinks that means she's broken inside. He's blaming her childhood. Like he's smashing things.

Speaker 1:
[104:15] I hate this so fucking much. I can't even tell you how much.

Speaker 2:
[104:19] I really, yeah. He needs help, truly. Sydney and Mikey are up next. Mikey is ready for answers. Sid wants Mikey to understand where she's coming from. And Mikey speaks first. I feel like almost all the guys speak first for some reason. I was like, Mark, let a lady speak. Mikey says he wants to leave here with love and respects for the many decisions Sydney makes, but he's been miserable as hell. When they came in, she said 98 percent they'd leave together and the other 2 percent would be because of him. He stayed true to her the whole time, but he had to watch her fall in love with somebody else over the course of three weeks. He says, I thought you loved me for real. I might not be perfect, but you said I was yours. I think Mikey has never been dumped by someone he wasn't cheating on already.

Speaker 1:
[105:09] No, I think so. This is like a first for him.

Speaker 2:
[105:12] Yeah. He's like, this was all going to be in my control. I'm confused.

Speaker 1:
[105:16] I'm confused that you're a separate person.

Speaker 2:
[105:19] Right. You said sweet nothings to me and they turned out to not be something I could count on forever. That's something that I get to do to women, not the other way around. Sydney says, she realized that Mikey never put her first. She was making herself smaller so he could shine. She feels like Mikey loved the idea of her, but not her. She found strength within herself throughout this journey and grew a connection with someone else. But she never lied to Mikey. She did want to be with him. She realized she was settling. She says, I choose myself. Mikey says to her after this that he feels like his college self is dead. Temptation Island taught him how to communicate with Sydney and listen to her in order to understand.

Speaker 1:
[105:55] He's like, now that I'm 25, the self that I was at 21 is officially dead.

Speaker 2:
[106:00] Yeah, I've learned. Now I know how to listen. Sydney is like, too little, too late. We've never had a serious conversation before, and it's great that you can do this now, but that's a long time to not have a serious conversation. She says she knows he's hurting and that he's sorry, and she's sorry, but she can't keep going in this cycle. Mikey does seem to accept that things are over. I think she's said it many times on different occasions.

Speaker 1:
[106:28] Now it's penetrated. Mark is being generous to them. He's like, neither of you are wrong in this. Mikey, you've grown into a man during Temptation Island, and you're going to be okay on your own. It's okay. So they make their final decisions. Mikey decides to leave by himself even though he says he wants to be with Sydney. And Sydney is like, I will be leaving with Xavier.

Speaker 2:
[106:51] I respect that she's just like, she's not trying to hurt Mikey. She's not throwing it in his face, but she's just like, I'm also not going to lie or pussyfoot around it. Yeah. Mikey gets weepy one last time on his way out because he just wants to be loved. He hopes whoever Sydney ends up with looks at her, how he looked at her every day for this past year. She was his best friend and now she's gone. Fortunately, it seems like whenever he leaves the house, he meets three to five women he could easily fall in love with, so I think he's going to be okay. Afterwards, Mark brings Xavier out and he is thrilled to leave with Sydney. She admits that she's fallen in love with him and he says he's also in love with her.

Speaker 1:
[107:33] I'm rooting for them.

Speaker 2:
[107:34] They're still together. I think by the time people are hearing this, we may already know because we know we're taping the day before the part one of the reunion comes out and it will be a real womp-womp if they immediately broke up.

Speaker 1:
[107:48] But as of now, we're rooting for them. Sydney says she came in with her light dimmed, but she's walking out glowing. Cheyenne and Jack are up next and Jack is really ready to be the victim. He's like, I have nothing to apologize for. I will not be walked all over. Okay. But he does actually apologize first thing when he speaks.

Speaker 2:
[108:10] Because he has actually a lot to apologize for.

Speaker 1:
[108:13] Yeah. He's like, Chey, I'm sorry I put you through this. But he again is so intent on being magnanimous that he's like, I wouldn't take back our five years together for anything. I do love you. Cheyenne is like, well, I don't think that you thought about me one time through this experience. She's like, you know the reasons that you brought me to Temptation Island. You didn't follow through on any of them because it was to show fidelity. Yeah. She's clearly not as settled in her feelings of moving on from him. She's like, I don't know what I've done to you to make you do this to me. When you knew I could watch it back, you should have loved me enough to end the relationship if you were unhappy. She's like, I didn't want to come here. I knew that this is how it would end. She says, thank you for showing me who you truly are and showing me you can never be the man I deserve.

Speaker 2:
[109:06] I actually wonder if Jack's need to look like the hero is why he didn't end it.

Speaker 1:
[109:13] Yeah.

Speaker 2:
[109:14] He cheated and so he has to, if he also dumped her, that would just puncture his image too much.

Speaker 1:
[109:22] It's actually better for him if he can drag her down with him and then be like, you know what, I release you.

Speaker 2:
[109:28] Yeah.

Speaker 1:
[109:29] We both were unhappy. We've both hurt each other.

Speaker 2:
[109:32] We've both made mistakes. Did we talk on the podcast or just offline about how Grant, the previous guy who pulled this bullshit and was like cheated horrifically on his girlfriend on Temptation Island last season? Yeah. They went on another show. It was like the Mr. Beast show where they were paired and he betrayed her again in the game play and made the same speech. It was like, I finally forgive you and I forgive myself. She was like, how is he doing this again? He keeps finally forgiving me and for what? That's like Jack is constantly like, it's okay, Cheyenne, for what you've done to me. She's like, literally, what are you talking about? Mark encourages them both to remember how much they have meant to each other in the past. She's like, I've been in this conversation and Chey remembers, but more in a way that makes her mad. She's like, we were together the longest of everyone here, but you did me the dirtiest. I was standing 10 toes down for you until the second bonfire, which is the one where she first saw him getting physical with Carter. The one thing he told her he wouldn't do was be physical with someone else. Did he forget their two dogs, their life together, her nephews? He's like, no, I talked about them all the time. He points out that she was also unhappy in their relationship and they were both just too scared to admit it, which is true.

Speaker 1:
[110:56] This is the one good point that he makes. Mark is trying to get them to wrap it up on a nice note. He's like, maybe thank each other. Cheyenne admits, we've both been shitty at times, but we've also both been happy. She's really trying. She's like, time will heal us and hopefully when it does, we can, she never finishes the sentence.

Speaker 2:
[111:17] You can tell that she's like, maybe one day we can be friends. Then she's like, I don't want to be friends with him.

Speaker 1:
[111:22] She's like, I don't really know what else to say to this. A horrible person. So Jack is like, don't worry, hold my beer. I will pretend to cry again.

Speaker 2:
[111:29] He thanks her for being his backbone. I thought she took his personality and put it in a box, but she's also the only reason he can stand up straight. I don't understand their relationship. Once he grows into the man, he saw her talk about wanting, who knows what can happen.

Speaker 1:
[111:43] Jack, please, go away.

Speaker 2:
[111:45] Drop it, man. They both decide to leave the island alone, as they should. Kaylee and Summit go last. Kaylee admits that when she arrived at Temptation Island, the only place she was happy was with Summit, and that wasn't healthy, but she's learned she's enough. When they arrive at the bonfire, they are the only ones where they both seem happy to see each other.

Speaker 1:
[112:06] Oh, yeah. I was like, okay, so they're going to stay together. They at least like each other.

Speaker 2:
[112:11] I also thought they would stay together because they went last.

Speaker 1:
[112:14] Oh, well, yeah.

Speaker 2:
[112:15] If there's one couple that stays together, they're going to put them last. So we can end on a good note. Kayleigh goes first. She's the only woman who goes first. She says, this has been one of the most challenging but rewarding experiences of her life. She leaned on Summit for happiness and that wasn't fair, but she also has needs that don't always feel like they're being met. She doesn't feel like the priority, more like a chore he needs to get done. She's learned that she's a strong, beautiful, independent woman and she deserves to feel love for every piece of her. Summit says that the things Kaylee said about him hurt, but he also understands it. He says he's done having one foot in and one foot out of the relationship because she deserves the best. Then it's time to converse and he's like, did you make a physical connection with anyone? I'm like, Summit, they would show you.

Speaker 1:
[113:00] Yeah, he's like, I hate to be this person, I just have to ask. And she's like, no, did you? And he's like, no, like guys, yeah.

Speaker 2:
[113:09] Summit, they would not pass up the opportunity to catch the drama of one of you reacting to that, for anything. So she says she just made friends who taught her what she deserves in love. He's like, me neither. Kaylee asked about Julianne because she saw her in some of the clips. And Summit says she's just a very cool and amazing woman, but his experience with her was learning about himself. It was just a friendship. Kaylee says some days it feels like she wants their relationship to work more than he does. And they have a lot of work to do so that they both feel fulfilled in their relationship. He also asks if she thinks he's a sociopath.

Speaker 1:
[113:45] And she clearly has no memory that she ever said this. She's like, no, what?

Speaker 2:
[113:51] Yeah, he reminds her of the context and she's like, oh yeah, I think I just said that out of anger. I think also because it might, she says that his behavior in that moment was sociopathic.

Speaker 1:
[114:02] Right. It's not the same thing as being like, I truly think this man is a sociopath.

Speaker 2:
[114:07] I understand that it would feel that way to hear, but you would maybe remember thinking your partner was a sociopath and not necessarily saying like, that was a sociopathic thing to do.

Speaker 1:
[114:15] Right, she was being like kind of a little facetious, but like expressing that she was very hurt about this behavior.

Speaker 2:
[114:21] Right. And so, but it really stuck with him. He's like, maybe I'm a sociopath. I don't like that. And he admits that he did learn from her comment that he needs to show more empathy.

Speaker 1:
[114:32] Finally.

Speaker 2:
[114:34] He tells Kaylee that she's enough and she shouldn't change for anyone. She's everything that any guy on the planet would want. And she's delighted. She's finally seeing growth from Summit. So she chooses to leave with Summit and he chooses to leave with Kaylee. He's ready to commit and dive in headfirst. He's like, I love Kaylee so much. He gives her a collar, a dog collar, not for her. It's clear when you're watching it, but in the notes, it's like a collar.

Speaker 1:
[115:02] Yeah, I know that's fair. Kinky.

Speaker 2:
[115:06] He's like, I want to get a dog together. He also gives her a symbolic key because he wants to move in together. Because it gets the key to my heart.

Speaker 1:
[115:15] Both Summit and Kaylee are so, yeah. I did like that.

Speaker 2:
[115:19] He's like, I don't know.

Speaker 1:
[115:20] It's a key to an apartment that we will get together.

Speaker 2:
[115:24] Yeah.

Speaker 1:
[115:24] And both Summit and Kaylee are like truly shocked that Summit has decided to commit. They're like, wow, didn't think you had it in you. And he's like, same. I didn't think I did.

Speaker 2:
[115:35] It's like, I thought I'd die a bachelor. I'm like, you're 25, you still might. But I was like, I was cautiously optimistic. Summit has done a lot of turning things back around on her, like taking her valid critiques and being like, she just wants to change my free spiritedness. He arrived at this bonfire ready to be like, you're right, I can change, I should change, you deserve more for me.

Speaker 1:
[116:00] Right. I shouldn't be telling you, you need to change, you are enough, you are the prize.

Speaker 2:
[116:05] Right. She also came with something she's working on. They both came and are like something that I have a pattern of that was harming the relationship. I learned about and I'm working on that because you deserve it. If that is true and they are both genuinely committed to that, maybe they'll be very happy together.

Speaker 1:
[116:20] Yeah. With one happy ending, we're out on the season and a two-part reunion will be airing on The Vile Files on Wednesday and Friday, so we'll watch that and we'll check back in a little bit on the status of all of these people in our episode next week.

Speaker 2:
[116:38] But yeah, definitely we'll be. I'm exhausted already.

Speaker 1:
[116:42] Me too. I'm so tired. I'm also so tired from traveling. It really takes it out of you when you're almost 30 weeks pregnant.

Speaker 2:
[116:52] It's really messed up how going on vacation does not bring you back refreshed and in fact, you're more tired than ever. It's like at least I should be more prepared and instead I need a nap. But I am looking forward to getting some answers on what these ladies and gents are up to, and there's some more good reality TV news and gossip and also just new shows that we need to catch up on. So I think there's going to be a lot going on the next couple of months here on Love to See It. I'm getting excited.

Speaker 1:
[117:22] Me too. It's going to be a great time. And on that note, that is it for this episode of Love to See It with Emma and Claire. If you're watching this on YouTube, remember to like and subscribe to our channel.

Speaker 2:
[117:32] Love to See It is a presentation of Odyssey. The show is produced by us, Claire Fallon and Emma Gray. Our production assistant is Tatiana Kenney-Smith, who also edits our video. This episode's audio was edited by John Bihar. Our theme music is by Tamar Haviv, and our art is by Erin Nestor.

Speaker 1:
[117:47] If you like our show, remember to follow us, rate us five stars, leave a review, and of course, spread the word to all of your friends about Love to See It.

Speaker 2:
[117:55] If you want to get in touch, you can email us at clarentemmapod at gmail.com or send us a wooden box with an iPad inside with a very heartfelt message.

Speaker 1:
[118:04] You can also find us on TikTok at Love to See It pod and on Instagram at clarentemmapod. And you can find our newsletter Rich Text on Patreon at patreon.com/richtext. I'm also on blue sky at Emma Gray and on Instagram at Emma Lady Rose.

Speaker 2:
[118:19] And I'm at Claire E. Fallon. Special thanks to the team at Odyssey, Eric Donnelly, Peter Arriaga, Kate Rose, Mara Curran, Melissa Lester and Hilary Schiff.

Speaker 1:
[118:27] We'll be back soon. Claire, you know when you find the perfect item of clothing that suddenly just works for every situation?

Speaker 2:
[118:47] Yes.

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Speaker 2:
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Speaker 2:
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Speaker 1:
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