transcript

Speaker 1:
[00:02] Welcome to Fast Feast Repeat Intermittent Fasting For Life. I'm Gin Stephens, author of the New York Times bestseller Fast Feast Repeat.

Speaker 2:
[00:10] And I'm Sheri Bullock, longtime intermittent faster and health and wellness advocate. Please keep in mind that this podcast is for educational and motivational purposes only, and is not intended to provide medical or diagnostic advice. Gin and I are not doctors, so make sure to check with your trusted healthcare professionals before making changes, especially when it comes to any medical treatments or medications.

Speaker 1:
[00:33] Whether you're new to intermittent fasting or an experienced intermittent faster, tune in each week to get inspired, to learn, and to have some fun along the way. Hi, everybody. We are so glad you're here today. Welcome to this week's episode of the Fast Feast Repeat Intermittent Fasting For Life podcast. How are you doing today, Sheri?

Speaker 2:
[00:55] I am doing fine. How are you doing?

Speaker 1:
[00:59] I am fantastic. I have an interesting update.

Speaker 2:
[01:02] Share or share?

Speaker 1:
[01:04] Well, you know how I haven't weighed since 2017? I got a scale and I weighed myself.

Speaker 2:
[01:10] Oh, you did?

Speaker 1:
[01:11] Yes, I did. Nine years of not knowing my weight.

Speaker 2:
[01:14] Wow.

Speaker 1:
[01:15] Yeah.

Speaker 2:
[01:16] And how did that make you feel?

Speaker 1:
[01:17] Not knowing it or weighing again?

Speaker 2:
[01:20] No, like weighing again. Did it make you nervous? Were you okay with it?

Speaker 1:
[01:24] A little bit. I was like, you know what? I feel like I don't have scale anxiety anymore. Like, cause when I did remember, I had never successfully maintained weight loss in my entire adult life. Long-term, I was always yo-yoing. And so when I weighed in, you know, when I weighed for the first year of maintenance, then I didn't weigh again for a year and I got on the scale and it was the same weight that it had been and I thought it should be lower. And then I was mad. That's when I throw away my scale. I've just been going by the fit of my clothes. And so, you know, I went on that cruise and I'm like, I feel like I'm up a little bit. You know, I've been having a little celebratory window with Chris situation. And I'm like, you know, I feel like I'm up at the higher end of my maintenance range. And so I feel like, I don't know, maybe five pounds. I'm just guessing in my head. I feel like I'm up maybe five pounds from where I really like to be. So it's like, I really just want to know. So I got a scale and my weight is, drum roll please, exactly five pounds higher than it was when I last weighed in 2017. Is that hilarious or what?

Speaker 2:
[02:29] I mean, I think you are very in tune with your body now.

Speaker 1:
[02:32] I am.

Speaker 2:
[02:33] And you've always been able to tell like, okay, I've been a little extra indulgent and you know, my jeans aren't fitting the right way. I need to tighten things back up again. But yeah.

Speaker 1:
[02:44] I think that's my range. I think my range is when I, like the pivot point, like where I feel my best is that weight the last time I weighed right around 130 is where I feel my best. And I think that whenever I start getting around that 135, I'm like, all right, time to do something, tighten it back up. So I think that, and then maybe sometimes I end up in the 120s. I don't know, I haven't weighed. But I think my range is like that 125 to 135, up and down, pivoting around 130. So I'm like, all right, I'm just going to weigh now. I want to see what happens, I want to see what it does. So, but I don't have any nervousness about it.

Speaker 2:
[03:22] Good.

Speaker 1:
[03:22] Yeah. So anyway, that's really good. So I now know exactly what my smart BMI is, and my scale claims to measure all that stuff. Your visceral fat and all that, I don't know, bone density. How can it know that?

Speaker 2:
[03:35] Well, I mean, it depends. I've been reading a lot about these bioimpedant scales and stuff and the research on them. And yes, they fluctuate to a degree based off of, are you in the fed or fasted state?

Speaker 1:
[03:50] Right.

Speaker 2:
[03:51] How hydrated are you?

Speaker 1:
[03:52] Yep.

Speaker 2:
[03:53] But from what I've heard is that they are close enough that you can monitor trends.

Speaker 1:
[04:00] Yeah. That's what I've always thought.

Speaker 2:
[04:01] Just like our weight fluctuates from day to day and it's not static, your muscle mass, your bone mass, your visceral fat mass, your lean body mass, it's gonna shift from day to day. But if you're looking at a trend over time that you'd be able to see that.

Speaker 1:
[04:19] If it's going up or down.

Speaker 2:
[04:20] Right.

Speaker 1:
[04:21] That's what I've always read about bi OMP scales too. But everything looks really good. My muscle mass was good. My visceral fat is excellent. So I'm like, all righty. I got some data now. It really took me, I guess, that much time to heal from the scale brain. We always talk about diet brain, but the whole idea of being panicked, what the number might be. I'm like, really, am I just lying to myself? Do I not really know where I am? Am I higher than I think? Where am I? I have no idea. When I got on there and I saw that number, I'm like, oh, what have I been afraid of? I'm exactly where I thought I was. Anyway, so that gave me a lot of confidence in what I've been doing. I mean, I know my clothes and how they fit and all of that. Anyway, I'm now back to be in a daily wearer.

Speaker 2:
[05:07] Back in my weight washers days, and even when I first started IF, I still had that, I'll always weight every day. But I definitely was like, I was not able to look at it as objectively back then. It was like, oh my gosh, I really need to tighten things up today. Or, oh, I want to seal. I mean, like in some cases, it could be encouraging. It would be like, oh, well, the scale is up three pounds since the other day, and I have been really indulgent with beer and pizza, so I need to tighten things back up there. And so, in some ways, it was like a positive motivator, but then on other days, you're just like, oh, my gosh, I did everything right yesterday. Why isn't the scale down today?

Speaker 1:
[05:48] Right. Right.

Speaker 2:
[05:50] But it really wasn't until I started, I really was able to wrap my head around each individual way and doesn't really matter. It is what your trend is doing over time. That is what matters. And I think that's the same thing with fat mass, muscle mass, lean body mass, that sort of thing. Even just watching your bone mass, you know. Yes, mine fluctuates on my scale. But over the last five years, I can see that it's still right at the same range.

Speaker 1:
[06:20] Yeah. Well, it gave me great confidence to see that number. It was a little scary. It's like, oh gosh, what am I going to see? But that it was exactly where I thought it would be was kind of funny and very confirming. And it gives me confidence that I know my body and I know what works for me and what doesn't, and I know what I need to adjust, and I know when I'm being a little too loosey-goosey, and I know how to tighten up. So, anyway.

Speaker 2:
[06:47] Well, you know me, I'm like kind of competitive and I like games.

Speaker 1:
[06:50] Yeah.

Speaker 2:
[06:51] So, I play the game where before I ever get on a scale, I guess the number. I'll be like, has my ring fitting today? Yeah. What did I eat yesterday? Okay, I know I'm kind of inflamed. I bet the scale is going to say this, and then I get on it, just to see if I'm right. Usually, I'm pretty dead on because I kind of know how my body responds to different foods. If I wake up and I feel inflamed, if my rings are tight, I'll know, the scale is going to be up probably about four pounds today. So, yeah. Well, that's fun.

Speaker 1:
[07:22] It is fun.

Speaker 2:
[07:22] How's Chris doing?

Speaker 1:
[07:23] Chris is doing great. He's still slow and steady. Six-tenths of a pound a week. That is what he loses week in, week out. His weight will go up, his weight will go down. Today, he had a new low on his weight, but even then it will go up. His pattern is up and down and up and down. That's what mine was when I was trying to lose weight, and so back in the day. For me now, maybe I know I'm at the upper end of my maintenance range, so I'm tightening it up, but I don't feel like I'm like, now I have to lose weight. It's my range. I'm in it. I'm just going to get back to that middle part that feels a little better. But yeah, he's doing great. Still plugging along.

Speaker 2:
[08:07] Excellent. Well, the pictures I've seen of him recently, he's looking really good. I can see it really in his face a lot.

Speaker 1:
[08:14] Yes. Yeah. Yeah, and his clothing size is changing quickly. And I mean, the scale doesn't always, it's six-tenths of a pound. It doesn't seem like you would even notice a difference, but you do. That is the body recomposition in action. So anyway, well, I love it. Yeah.

Speaker 2:
[08:31] So I was going to share something.

Speaker 1:
[08:33] Okay.

Speaker 2:
[08:33] Well, I shared it with you.

Speaker 1:
[08:35] Okay.

Speaker 2:
[08:35] But I just find this so fascinating. I keep thinking about it. I'm becoming, you know, what is it? Why we get sick? Is that what the title of? Benjamin Bickman's.

Speaker 1:
[08:46] Yeah.

Speaker 2:
[08:46] I think it's called Why We Get Sick. It is. It's all about insulin. Okay. So I had a patient who was really, has been struggling with diverticulitis and they'll get over an episode and then they'll get it back again and they'll get it again. And this has been going on for the last several years. Well, just knowing what his lab work looked like, his body habitus, seeing what his blood glucose was when he came into the ER, I was like, this man is significantly insulin resistant. And it made me think, is there a connection between insulin resistance and diverticulitis? So I started doing some research and there absolutely is. A very strong correlation between insulin resistance and diverticulitis, even just so you can have diverticula, which is the condition of having little out pouches in your colon, but never have a flare up of diverticulitis, which is inflammation of it. Both, however, are correlated with insulin resistance. So to go down that same pathway, I'm in a healthcare Facebook group and somebody was asking if they've noticed a higher prevalence of preeclampsia in pregnant women. And all these women who work in labor and delivery and in like high risk maternity settings have said yes. You know, in their last 20 years or 30 years of working, that suddenly it's becoming very common. And I'm like, and everybody was like, why do you think that is? And they're all talking about this and that and nutritional deficiencies and ultra processed foods and lack of exercise. And I'm like, I wonder if it has anything to do with insulin resistance. Guess what? Yes, it does.

Speaker 1:
[10:32] It does. Yeah. And PCOS is also related to insulin levels. When I read Why We Get Sick, my big takeaway was having high levels of insulin is connected with so many things that you wouldn't even think, okay, we understand insulin resistance and visceral fat and weight and certain health conditions, but more than we thought, more than we realized. It's like literally get your insulin down, get your health back.

Speaker 2:
[10:58] Yeah, exactly. Exactly. So things started to click and one of them was we hear all the time that people have a lot of GI issues or they've been hospitalized for diverticulitis or abscesses in their abdomen, obstructions, that sort of thing. And so it immediately I was like, well, no wonder when they start fasting, they write in and they say, I haven't had a flare up of diverticulitis since I started fasting three years ago or whatever. And it's because they have healed their insulin resistance.

Speaker 1:
[11:31] Yep.

Speaker 2:
[11:31] So just more and more, just in my everyday, I've always said, I fast because I see how being sick when you get older and fighting off disease and being immobile really just diminishes people's quality of life. I don't want that. But more and more, I'm seeing that I fast not for weight loss, not so I can be a size six, so that I can have a healthy body inside and out. Because more and more, it's just becoming apparent that insulin resistance is the root of so many diseases.

Speaker 1:
[12:08] Yep. And that's why the clean fast is so important. And that is why drinking the diet sodas and having to have creamy coffee, because it makes you just emotionally happy in the morning and not wanting to fast clean, you're affecting your insulin levels with that. And so even if I could, knowing what I know about insulin now, if I could eat all day and not regain the weight, I still wouldn't do it.

Speaker 2:
[12:35] Right.

Speaker 1:
[12:36] It's more than the weight for me. It's so much more than the weight. And it's keeping my insulin low. I mean, my dad had type 2 diabetes. And I know that if I had not discovered, well, I mean, I didn't discover it, you know what I mean? If I had not begun intermittent fasting or found it for myself, I didn't invent it, I guess is what I'm saying. I discovered it, but I didn't invent it. If I had not started doing it, I would probably be obese and type 2 diabetic right now. Instead, I am right there in my maintenance range without having been on a scale since 2017. And not really having to stress about it either.

Speaker 2:
[13:12] Yeah. So many, I mean, just reasons to continue the lifestyle for life.

Speaker 1:
[13:18] Yeah. And the health benefits that we see are really amazing. The stories we hear in the community, the people that are members of the community that share how they're doing. And on the flip side, we have the people that struggle with the clean fast. And I really think that a lot of people still only have their weight as their why or their goal. And I agree, it feels really good to be in a slim body that feels like it can move through the world well. But I don't think you get there without healing the insulin resistance. And I don't think you heal the insulin resistance without making big changes that might feel uncomfortable.

Speaker 2:
[13:56] Right.

Speaker 1:
[13:56] Maybe the clean fast feels uncomfortable because you need that emotional hit from that creamy coffee that you're used to. But, you know, comfort doesn't keep you where you want to be. You got to be a little uncomfortable.

Speaker 2:
[14:11] Right. Right. Well, and, you know, some people I know struggle with this sort of anger. Like, it's not fair because my friend's skinny and she eats and drinks all day long. And she can have creamy coffees and she gets to eat breakfast, lunch and dinner. But her genetics may keep her thin. But you don't know what is going on metabolically with her.

Speaker 1:
[14:36] Well, it makes me think of Chad's aunt who had early onset Alzheimer's. And she was skinny as a rail. She barely ate, but she lived on candy bars and Coke. So she was never overweight. She was really, really skinny. But, you know, they call Alzheimer's type 3 diabetes. And it affects the brain. And so I bet her insulin response was not healthy at all, even though she was skinny.

Speaker 2:
[15:04] Right.

Speaker 1:
[15:05] Yeah.

Speaker 2:
[15:06] Yep. All right. Just so much to think about and be thankful for. All right. We have a celebration from Cindy from South Louisiana. She said, I love IF. I've been a listener for several weeks and was sort of following, but not really clean fasting. After realizing I wasn't really fasting, I switched to clean fasting about four weeks ago, and I'm thrilled to say it is so easy and I am down seven pounds. I feel great and I'm at a weight that I haven't seen in 16 years. Let's just say I am thrilled. I truly believe I have found the answer at the age of 69. I eat what I want and I do 16 to 18 hour fasts depending on my workout schedule. I have a goal to lose 20 more pounds and I'm confident I will reach my goal with no problem. I did listen to the Fast Feast Repeat audio book which was so educational. I am ready to conquer this overweight problem thanks to you. My drinks of choice during fasting are black coffee, black tea, water, and mineral water.

Speaker 1:
[16:05] Well, that is awesome. Well, Cindy, I think you're doing great. I would like to encourage you, you're pretty much new to this. You're four weeks in to the clean fast and you're following. If you're fasting for 16 to 18 hours, and I'm assuming your eating window is somewhere between six and eight hours, you may find that you need to tighten that up as time goes on. Just something to think about. If you plateau, I mean, if you're really happy with the weight, you get to a weight and you're happy there and you don't lose the 20 pounds, but you're happy, then keep doing what you're doing. But if you find that you plateau and you do want to lose those 20 more pounds, tightening up your window is probably going to be the solution to that. Just something to file away.

Speaker 2:
[16:49] Right. Yeah. I was thinking the same thing. And you're like, I'm down 7 pounds, great. But what we see in the early days, the first several weeks of fasting is that people shed a lot of inflammation. It's a lot of water weights. And so if you get to eight weeks in and you're really not seeing more weight loss, that's when you'll know if that's your goal to tighten things up.

Speaker 1:
[17:10] Yep. So now we have a question from a listener. This question is from, I don't know who it's from.

Speaker 2:
[17:16] Oh, my bad. Sorry. Oh, my gosh.

Speaker 1:
[17:21] See if you can find who it's from. I'm going to read the question. If you find who it's from, you can share it in a minute.

Speaker 2:
[17:25] Oh, I know exactly who this is.

Speaker 1:
[17:27] Okay.

Speaker 2:
[17:28] Who is it from? This is Jody from Finger Lakes, region of New York.

Speaker 1:
[17:32] Okay. Hello, Jody. She said, hello to my favorite ladies. I am a long time faster. I feel like when I hit my five-year fast reverse year on January 1st, I can say that now. I think you absolutely can. I think if you're several years in, you are a long time faster. She said, I've maintained for four years. I can truly say that I live the lifestyle and I help others through my small coaching business. However, even coaches can have questions. And you know what? I will never stop having questions about things.

Speaker 2:
[18:04] You either Sheri. That's why I didn't get her name down because she asked this question and my brain went, ha, and I had to start looking for the answer.

Speaker 1:
[18:14] So funny. But you know, we never stop looking for the answers to different questions that pop up. Because the minute you think you know everything, well, you don't. Anyway, so she said, when I first began my journey, I invested in Zoe and I learned that I have poor blood sugar control and good fat control. This was back in January of 2022. I wonder if you know if these results from Zoe have any connection to my fasted insulin. Here's the thing. We could guess things about that, but they have never taken anyone's fasted insulin and then compared it to the other results. It would just be guessing. I mean, can we talk about blood sugar control and how that might relate to insulin?

Speaker 2:
[18:59] Right. I would assume if you have poor blood sugar control, that you probably are not insulin sensitive.

Speaker 1:
[19:06] Yeah. But if that's something you can change or not. Yeah.

Speaker 2:
[19:10] Like some people are just more prone to genetically, right, to having like reactive hypoglycemia because their body may just push out more insulin when they eat. So, yeah, I don't think that they test that per se.

Speaker 1:
[19:26] No. So she said I had the first her insulin done in August of 2021 and it was 6.6, but currently it is 4. Here's another thing about fasted insulin that I really want to continue to reiterate all the time and that is we know how blood glucose changes within a range every single day. If you took your, if you've ever won a CGM, you've seen your blood sugar change and if you haven't won a CGM and you've taken your blood sugar, if you have a blood sugar value, 30 minutes later, it's going to be higher or lower or exactly the same or somewhere within a range. So the same with blood sugar and fasted insulin. Your fasted insulin is not a number. Like you're not like, all right, I'm 6.6 and that means all the time, I'm 6.6 and now I'm four, so I've gotten better and now I'm four. You might be exactly the same as you were when you got a 6.6 and now you have a four. It doesn't mean that you got better. You might get better, but we don't really know how much you're fluctuating within that fasting insulin range. Maybe you were fluctuating slightly higher and now you're fluctuating slightly lower. We can't tell. You would have to have a lot more data to know. We just don't have continuous insulin monitors or a lot of fasting insulin data because people don't do it very frequently. That's not a test. We have like a CGM will tell us our blood sugar constantly over the course of a day. Everybody always be a little cautious when comparing two fasting insulin numbers because they are a snapshot in time. Now, if one time you got a 25 and the next time you got a four, we're not going to fluctuate that much from day to day. But I think four and 6.6 are very close together. Anyway, I just wanted to pop that out because sometimes people are really disappointed that their fasting insulin looks like it's worse. When really it just might be a-

Speaker 2:
[21:21] 5.2 a year ago and today it was 6.3 and I've been fasting, why did it go up? But it could have been you didn't sleep well, traffic was heavier driving to the lab, you had it at a different time of the day.

Speaker 1:
[21:35] You ran up the stairs before they did the blood draw and your body pulsed out some glucose and then your fasting insulin went up a little bit just because of that, because exercise raises our blood sugar. Our fasting insulin is always changing in the background to match what our blood sugar is doing. I just wanted to keep that in mind. Jodi says, I've worn CGMs and I've learned that I have a pretty good insulin response overall. I guess she's meaning a blood sugar response and then she's assuming that that means she's insulin sensitive. So she said, I'm wondering if what Zoe tests is similar and also changes over time with this lifestyle. I'm guessing it does, but I wanted to get your insight on it. Do you want to just talk about that for just a minute?

Speaker 2:
[22:19] On the...

Speaker 1:
[22:20] Well, that exact question that she asked. Then we'll go on to the rest because now she's still going to talk about LDL, for example. Do you think that... I mean...

Speaker 2:
[22:28] I would assume that... I mean, I don't... So when they're looking at your blood sugar control, they're looking at what was your response to...

Speaker 1:
[22:38] To their cookie.

Speaker 2:
[22:40] Right. I mean, I did it back when it was the predictive study. I haven't done a new updated, Zoe.

Speaker 1:
[22:45] Now it's a cookie.

Speaker 2:
[22:46] So we had muffins and then you also ate regular food. You were a CGM. You also pricked your finger. I mean, like it was a lot. So I can't speak for how they're doing it now. In fact, right now, you can't even do it. So I don't know even what the new one's going to be. But I'm assuming that what they're doing is they're looking at, this is what you ate. They want to see how did your body react to it? What was your blood sugar rise after you had the cookie? Similar. What was the fat in your blood? Which that's going to be her next question.

Speaker 1:
[23:24] Yeah.

Speaker 2:
[23:24] So as you become more insulin sensitive, it makes sense to me that your blood sugar control would improve.

Speaker 1:
[23:34] Right.

Speaker 2:
[23:34] Because that's our goal.

Speaker 1:
[23:35] Right.

Speaker 2:
[23:36] When you're not insulin sensitive, then your body's pushing out insulin, but it's not working to keep your blood sugar as tightly controlled. Now, with that said, by the time you did, Zoe, you've been fasting a couple of years, and if your insulin was 6.6, then you were significantly more insulin sensitive than-

Speaker 1:
[24:01] Most people.

Speaker 2:
[24:02] Most people out there on the street.

Speaker 1:
[24:04] Yeah.

Speaker 2:
[24:05] So if you still came back with poor blood sugar control, I think that just means that you need to be more careful about how and what you eat.

Speaker 1:
[24:15] Exactly. All right. So we go on. She says, I know that when Gin speaks of her results, she says, I clear dot dot dot well. Actually, I always say, I don't clear fat well, because that's what I found out. I don't clear fat well. Now, she mentioned she does have good fat control. Mine is not as good. So Jody says, I also struggle with a high LDL, which I've spoken to Sheri about during a one-on-one coaching session and wondered if or how that could connect. Clear fat well, but high LDL. Just my curiosity getting the best of me. On a side note, the ZOE test also showed that my gut diversity was high, the good guys, and since that time, I did receive an email from ZOE saying they identified more good gut bugs, and that now my diversity is exceptional because I had those at that time. How cool is that? Thank you for always explaining the science and physiology of our bodies in such understandable terms. You are both such great coaches and I strive to offer the same clear information and support to my clients. All right, so you know a whole lot more about LDL than I do.

Speaker 2:
[25:19] Well, so I actually, it's funny because I've had the same question.

Speaker 1:
[25:24] Yeah.

Speaker 2:
[25:24] When I did the Predict2 study, which was like the precursor of ZOE.

Speaker 1:
[25:28] To ZOE, yeah.

Speaker 2:
[25:29] Yeah. Same results. Poor blood glucose control. Yeah. Great fat clearance. Got high scores for fat clearance. At that point, I was like, well, I've always eaten fairly low fat, but if eating fat is not inflammatory for me, then maybe I have room to introduce more into my diets, and my LDL skyrocketed. So I'm like, how could that be? Well, so your question forced me, thank you Jodi, to really look into this, because I'd never taken the time to do it. It always kind of been that little light bulb in my head that was like, I wonder how that is. I did a little deep dive, and I also included some resources in the show notes from Zoe that explains this, so you can read it more in detail. When Zoe blood test shows that you clear fat well, it means that your body efficiently processes and removes triglycerides from your bloodstream after eating. If your body removes triglycerides from your bloodstream after eating, that results in higher blood fat control score. What this indicates is that you had a lower risk of metabolic inflammation, reduced risk of heart disease, and a healthier metabolic response compared to those who struggle to clear fat. Now, like if you struggled to clear fat and you had poor blood glucose response, to me that would be a metabolic swan wreck. Yeah, like you wouldn't want to be there, right? But so you have like one thing not working great for you, but you also have one thing that is working great for you. So what clearing fat well means? If you have a high blood fat score, it means you have lower cardiovascular risk because if fat lingers in your blood for too long, it can damage your arteries and lead to heart disease. A high score means your body clears the fat faster, which minimizes damage. It also means it's not as inflammatory. So it means that your body should not be experiencing chronic low grade inflammation triggered by high fat meals. And it also just means that you probably have better metabolic health and it's often linked to a healthy gut microbiome, which affects how you metabolize fat. However, LDL cholesterol is sort of a different beast and it comes more from like your liver and how your liver metabolizes and pushes out fat and clear and like, I don't want to say disposes of it, but yeah, like sort of detoxes fat from your body. And that's a whole other deep dive. Do a deep dive into how your liver processes and uses and affects your LDL level. And so anyways, basically, they just basically say that if you have strong fat clearing scores, it means that your body is adept at handling dietary fat without causing undue metabolic stress. Now, everything I've read, I could not find any connection to LDL with that, right? And they really just talk about triglycerides. So probably going to take a little bit deeper dive than what I did here, but there is some links. And they also have, I did not know, a really great resource section on their website with all sorts of information. And if you just Google a question and then like Zoe or predict to study, it brings up different white papers.

Speaker 1:
[29:12] Yeah. And to go back to what you say, I've talked before about my body doesn't clear fat well. When I eat too much fat, I definitely feel increased inflammation. Like I'm puffy right now. You can probably tell how puffy my face is. I've just gotten off that cruise ship. I was on a cruise for five nights with my family. There were 11 of us. We had a great time. I ate two meals a day. And the first few days, Sheri, oh, I'm so full. Like the very first meal we got on, my sister and her husband and me and Will had like this special get on early and they give you a special lunch or whatever. So I was like, well, I'm doing it. So we're having our special lunch at noon. It was like a filet mignon from the steakhouse.

Speaker 2:
[29:53] Sounds delicious.

Speaker 1:
[29:54] I know. I had like filet mignon and then for dinner, I had chicken and the next day for lunch, I had like a burger. So I was eating like a lot of meat early in the cruise. I felt so full and just uncomfortable. So about day three, I was like, all right, no more meat. So I mean, and I did have like a little bit like something here and there, but for the rest of the cruise, I was like choosing the vegetarian options, heavy on the beans, things like that. I felt so much better.

Speaker 2:
[30:20] It is interesting that you say when you eat high fat, you feel inflamed and you had good blood glucose control, but you had poor fat clearance.

Speaker 1:
[30:29] Right.

Speaker 2:
[30:30] I'm the opposite. I have poor blood glucose control and great fat clearance.

Speaker 1:
[30:34] Right.

Speaker 2:
[30:35] Refined carbohydrates inflame me. Like pizza crust. If I was to eat a big sandwich on a big crusty French bread roll, I would be puffy and inflamed. I feel it. I feel it in my feet. I feel it in my hands the next morning. But fat doesn't seem to have any bearing on that. It's literally breads, pretzels, that sort of thing.

Speaker 1:
[31:02] Well, that kind of stuff does cause water retention. Just carbohydrates tend to cause water retention.

Speaker 2:
[31:08] It makes my joints hurt. I get up in the morning and my feet hurt.

Speaker 1:
[31:13] Oh, not just because you're retaining fluid, not just, okay. It's so interesting. But I was like, I felt uncomfortable. And I'm like, I've been eating meat at every single meal. I've been eating two meals a day. And then when I switched over and said, all right, that's it. I'm just eating vegetables. I ordered all the bean stuff, lentil stuff, whatever I could find. I felt so much better. And so I got off the cruise ship on Saturday and then I fasted all the way till I got home. And then I didn't eat till dinner. Had a pretty short window. And then I got on the scale the first time on Sunday. Now my weight was up a couple more pounds. I had just gotten off the cruise ship. So, you know, we tell people not to weigh. When they get off a cruise ship. And I hadn't weighed since 2017 and I got right on the scale. But that was it was like it was a couple of pounds higher than it is today. So the 135, I think, is more like my normal.

Speaker 2:
[32:05] I weigh because I think it's fun to watch that inflammation leave my body. I'll be like, I wonder if I can get rid of it in five days if I eat real clean.

Speaker 1:
[32:13] Well, I don't have a baseline number. I wish now I wish I'd weighed before I got on the cruise ship. But I am down 2.2 pounds since the day I got off Sunday. I weighed on Sunday, like I said. So I'm down 2.2 pounds of probably inflammation weight. But I don't think that's my rule. Definitely, you can't lose 2.2 pounds of fat for two days.

Speaker 2:
[32:36] Well, in a week, you'll have a good baseline to go off of.

Speaker 1:
[32:39] I will. I'm going to have a baseline. Now, I'm just really curious to see what my maintenance range really does look like. I felt like I was maintaining within a range, but now I'm going to have the data to know for sure. Again, I'm no longer scared of the scale. Let's just, I wonder how much of that is coming from the fact that Chris makes me feel very confident in my body.

Speaker 2:
[32:58] Maybe.

Speaker 1:
[32:59] Maybe, like I suddenly am like, I don't need that external fear.

Speaker 2:
[33:02] Or you've just healed your relationship with your body over the years. Because I feel like I have.

Speaker 1:
[33:08] Yep.

Speaker 2:
[33:09] Yeah.

Speaker 1:
[33:10] Yeah. I think so. And just the confidence.

Speaker 2:
[33:11] You know, the other thing is too, you've been fasting now for going on 11 years?

Speaker 1:
[33:18] Yeah.

Speaker 2:
[33:19] Or 11 years now?

Speaker 1:
[33:20] 14 is when I started.

Speaker 2:
[33:22] Oh, 14. Okay.

Speaker 1:
[33:23] Going on 12. Yeah.

Speaker 2:
[33:24] Okay. Yeah. Because I started in 15. So you clearly have not eaten up all your muscle mass. No.

Speaker 1:
[33:31] My muscle mass is excellent according to the scale. And also my bone density. Like I said, I don't know how accurate it is, but my bone density is excellent. So I have excellent muscle mass, excellent bone density, low visceral fat.

Speaker 2:
[33:44] Awesome.

Speaker 1:
[33:44] Yeah.

Speaker 2:
[33:45] All right. Well, we have a question from Salt Lake City. She says, Hi ladies, I've been intermittent fasting for nearly two years. I began by reading Fast Feast Repeat on the recommendation of my primary care nurse practitioner who is a big fan and thought it would be a good fit for me due to my family history of type two diabetes. I jumped right into clean fasting with an 18 six window, which eventually moved to 19 fives. I found fasting to be relatively easy. I was thrilled to lose 40 pounds in the first year and the non-scale victories were even better. While my fasting glucose and A1C were not in the problematic range before I started fasting, they both improved in that first year and my triglycerides dropped almost in half. I have struggled to be as consistent in the second year, especially as I know that now I need to focus on the quality of my food during my eating window. I have support and I'm committed to getting back to consistency. I have two questions. My first question is this. I do not drink coffee and therefore only plain water during my fasting. I'm curious whether you've ever researched Creo Brew, which is a product made from unsweetened cocoa beans. Currently, I only have it during my eating window and I prepare it with Stevia. If I were able to drink it with no sweetener at all, would it still break a fast and be comparable to black coffee, or be comparable to black coffee? I'm not referring to the flavored options I have, but just to the more basic flavors like Ghana, the flavor profile is quite bitter as a reference.

Speaker 1:
[35:13] Well, we have had this question a bunch of times over the years and we always give the same answer. We would not recommend that as part of a clean fast. And it's going to have those chocolate notes even there. Even if the flavor profile is bitter, it's still chocolate. You're brewing cocoa. So save that for your eating window for sure. You know, you're in your second year. You said you've struggled to be as consistent. That's really what I would focus on. Consistency. I know for a fact, in hindsight, over my maintenance years, I can always tell when I'm a little loosey-goosey and it generally, little tiny bit of window creep, but it mainly is food quality. It always, for me, always comes back to food quality. Here's the thing. I feel better when I eat better food. It's not just that I want to be smaller so I eat better food. I feel better when I eat better food. I just talked about how I felt so inflamed and yucky after a couple of days of eating the food that doesn't work as well for my body. And when I was like, now I'm going to prioritize beans and lentil soup. And I still didn't eat, you know, I still was eating more than I needed. I was on a cruise. I was eating two meals. But I felt better instantly when I added more high fiber foods and focused on that. So quality of food. I want everyone to disconnect from the idea of I'm only eating better food because I want to lose weight. Or like the idea of eating better food is like punishment. And then when you lose the weight, you can go back to eating the other food. We feel better when we eat better food. And you know, I really think that's an instrumental part of the Eat Like a Grown-Up program is why we're choosing to eat like this and why we're going to do it for health long term. And we're going to feel better when we do it.

Speaker 2:
[36:59] All right. So the second question is about electrolytes during a longer fast. I have done only one 36 hour fast and while I didn't feel particularly dizzy or weak, I did have a headache. I attribute that to not knowing what I was doing with electrolytes. I would like to add in longer fast a few times a month. I have sodium tablets and as well as magnesium, zinc and potassium tablets and I'm not sure how much to take on a 40 hour fast, roughly 7 p.m. to about 11 a.m. a day and a half later. I would be doing at least one fasted workout during that time. It is normal for me to work out fasted within normal 19.5 without any electrolyte supplementation and have no problem.

Speaker 1:
[37:40] All right. The first thing I would encourage you to do is, if you don't have the second edition of Delayed on Deny, I would go ahead and get that and I would read the ADF chapter. I would not start eating on an up day at 11 a.m. I would start eating earlier than that and that's all really explained in the second edition of Delayed on Deny. We've talked about it a lot on this podcast. Up day, you need longer than opening at 11. You're going to have a hard time waking up your appetite to get in a full up day. Eight to 12 hours is what we recommend and err on the side of longer. As far as electrolytes, I've personally never needed electrolytes. If you didn't feel dizzy or weak, but you did have a headache, I mean, could that be electrolytes? Yes, it could have been. Could it be something else? Yes. There are lots of reasons why we have a headache. It could be related to your blood sugar. It could be related to atmospheric pressure. It could have been a one-time thing. Sheri, would you talk about electrolytes? Because you're somebody who does need electrolytes. Talk about how you know you need them and how you feel when you need them.

Speaker 2:
[38:48] Well, first of all, let me just address zinc. While fasting is not usually a great combination.

Speaker 1:
[38:55] Because it makes you queasy?

Speaker 2:
[38:58] Yeah. Zinc has a way of making people very nauseous on an empty stomach.

Speaker 1:
[39:03] Yeah.

Speaker 2:
[39:03] So, I would... I can't use zinc.

Speaker 1:
[39:08] I can't either.

Speaker 2:
[39:08] While I'm fasting.

Speaker 1:
[39:09] No.

Speaker 2:
[39:09] Absolutely not. I would be very just cautious about that. As far as magnesium and potassium while fasting, that should not be an issue. If you're having a headache while you're fasting, first of all, you said you've only done one. I don't know where you were in your fasting history when you did that. Sometimes people have a headache while they're fasting just because their bodies are not adapted to fasting that long. And so, a lot of people will hear when they start like ADF, they have a headache the first couple of days. Kind of like when you first started fasting originally, and you started, introduced the 18.6 and then moved to the 18.5. It's really common to have headaches. But if it was something that you did again and you got a headache, more often than not, you may just need some sodium. I always recommend taking magnesium at bedtime. So if you're taking magnesium at bedtime and you were to have a headache, I would simply do a pinch of high-quality salt. You can simply put it under your tongue, kind of let it absorb, wash it down with some water. You want to be careful that because you're not eating and you're fasting, that you are not over hydrating as a way to keep your mouth busy. Having the down day meal on the down day is really beneficial for replenishing your body naturally with electrolytes from food, from minerals from food. So if you really needed other electrolytes, you're going to have issues like muscle cramps, spasms. I get eye tics. I get hand, finger, toe spasms. Not so much like charley horses, though some people do. And then headaches can be a sign of needing some sodium. It can also be a sign of needing some magnesium. So it can't hurt you if you have a fast safe electrolyte and you want to take it. But if you're unsure if you need it while you're fasting, I would start first with just, like I said, a pinch of high quality salt. If that takes your headache away, you just know you're a little sodium depleted.

Speaker 1:
[41:16] Very good information. All right, now it's time for our segment called What's Your Why? Most of us have weight loss in mind, so it's fine for that to be part of your why. But there is so much more to what intermittent fasting can do for us beyond weight loss. In 28 Day Fast Start Day by Day, there's a reason why I asked readers to craft their why statement before beginning. I genuinely believe when your why is deeper than weight loss alone, you're more likely to find long-term success and you're more likely to view intermittent fasting as a lifestyle.

Speaker 2:
[41:48] This week we have a why from Bridget in Massachusetts. She said, my why for intermittent fasting started with weight loss, and that is still very much part of it. I want to feel strong in my body. I want to reach the 130s as I had never had before. I want to feel confident and proud of myself. But over time, my why has deepened. I am recovery from severe drug abuse. I spent my teens and most of my 20s poisoning my body and neglecting my most basic needs. Today, more than 12 years into recovery, and over four years into intermittent fasting, I feel the best I have ever felt in my life. IF represents the opposite of how I used to live. It is intentional. It is aware. It is disciplined. Instead of harming my body, I am protecting it. Instead of disconnecting from myself, I am paying attention. IF gives me information. It helps me understand what I am putting into my body and how it affects me. Knowledge is power for me. Structure feels safe. Just like my recovery program, it teaches me to take things one day at a time. I do not have to be perfect forever. I just have to make the next right decision today. That blueprint has changed my life. I fast because I want to be healthy and present for my family and for the people who rely on me. I fast because I want energy, clarity and strength. I fast because I respect my body now. Weight loss is part of my story, but healing, awareness and longevity are the bigger reasons I continue.

Speaker 1:
[43:18] I love that so much. And Bridget, congratulations for all of your progress, your changes, your disciplined lifestyle for beating drug abuse. That is amazing.

Speaker 2:
[43:29] That's hard to do.

Speaker 1:
[43:30] Yeah, and you know you're strong if you can do that.

Speaker 2:
[43:33] All right, so we have a question from Sel from Australia. She read, I've been fasting since May of 2025, and I've been doing 19.5 daily. Some days, 21 hours, and if I have a long run, I do tend to have shorter fasts. I am turning 43 this March. I am 161 centimeters tall, or 5'3, and 61 kilos or 134 pounds when I started last year in May. Now my weight won't move. I am at 127 pounds.

Speaker 1:
[44:04] All right, so you know what we did. We ran it through the Smart BMI, and I also ran mine through the Smart BMI. What I weighed today just to see, Sel, you and I have exactly the same Smart BMI. Like literally, exactly. That's exactly what my Smart BMI was. Your Smart BMI is 23, and so is mine.

Speaker 2:
[44:25] No, that's her conventional BMI.

Speaker 1:
[44:27] That's her conventional BMI? Yeah, her Smart BMI is 34 and 70. Okay. I see down there. I don't know what my Smart BMI was. Our conventional BMI is exactly the same. So let me put it that way. That's close enough. Our BMI is exactly the same. I didn't scroll down on mine. So I understand that for me, I feel like I'm about five pounds up from where I like to sit. I get it. For me, I'd like to maybe drift back down to the lower end of my maintenance range. I'll feel a little better when I do. But my body has very much decided where I'm going to maintain over the years without me having to be too dramatic about anything. And your body is going to do that as well. Your body is going to decide. And one factor is how much muscle mass do you have? You said you have long runs. And when you do have a long run, you have a shorter fast. So, it might be that you need to tighten up even on long run days, so that you're burning more fat, if you would like to lose more fat, if your body is going to get you a little bit lower over time. Maybe you don't need to have a shorter fast on a run day. But maybe your body is exactly where it wants to be. Or maybe your food quality could get a little bit better, and you could lose a little bit more weight if you make changes in your food. Because we don't really know how your food quality is, right? So just those are things to play around with. You are your own study of one. The good news is we have the same BMI. And also you and I are both right in the middle of the healthy weight range for our height and our age. So that is a really good thing. And the better news is if you just focus on a few things, see what happens if you keep that window to five hours a day every day. Is there room for improvement?

Speaker 2:
[46:22] See, that was my suggestion. She said she's doing 21 hours some days, and then if she has a long run, she does shorter fasts, but she doesn't really say how much shorter. And I almost wonder if she just kind of kept the boundaries of a five-hour eating window every day. If she wouldn't feel like she needed to break fast early on the run days. And just keep a more consistent eating window, ignoring your fast length, just focus on your eating window each day, and just settle in to somewhere like around four to five hours each day. And I would not be surprised if that wouldn't help you a little bit, just with some consistency. Yeah.

Speaker 1:
[47:07] And by the way, I did look up my Smart BMI, I scrolled on down and our Smart BMI's are exactly the same as well. Thirty-four out of seven.

Speaker 2:
[47:13] Right in the middle.

Speaker 1:
[47:14] Where she and I are exactly in the right place, or in the same place with our Smart BMI and our regular BMI. And again, I realized I would feel better if I were down about five pounds, which is probably where I normally find my happy maintenance weight to be. So I understand. But for me, when I need to tighten it up, what I've done over these years of maintenance, whenever my clothes feel like they feel right this minute, I tighten up my window a bit and I focus on food quality. Fewer restaurant meals. Right. That's the thing that's been the biggest difference with having Chris around. We've had a little celebratory more restaurant meals.

Speaker 2:
[47:52] It's that new love. It is. Yes, we're having a lot of fun. It's that you're happy and you're out living life.

Speaker 1:
[47:59] We're living life. Baseball season. Going to all the baseball games. That's been a challenge for me.

Speaker 2:
[48:04] Tailgating.

Speaker 1:
[48:05] Well, the baseball games are funny because I don't want to eat at the ballpark. So the game might start at two o'clock on, let's say, a Sunday, and then it goes on for hours and I don't want to eat at the ballpark. So if I eat before I go to the ballpark, then when am I closing my window? Anyway, so that's been a challenge for me. It's just kind of funny that I'm having a challenge.

Speaker 2:
[48:30] Yeah. Well, you're outside of your norm.

Speaker 1:
[48:34] I'm doing something different. Exactly.

Speaker 2:
[48:35] And you're having to learn how to flex a little bit differently.

Speaker 1:
[48:39] I'm learning to flex around baseball season. Exactly.

Speaker 2:
[48:43] So before we get to the tweak of the week, I just want to take a minute to talk about the coaching that I'm doing and how you might know that it's right for you. Do any of these sound like you? You feel like you might need some one-on-one support for your IF lifestyle. You have started and stopped without ever being able to create a sustainable lifestyle, and you just need help trying to figure out how to make that happen. Maybe you're stuck in a plateau or you just aren't seeing the results you seek. You've lost your initial motivation and you need to find your excitement again. You're struggling with how to structure your eating window and how to balance nutrition or how to dial in a flexible eating window that supports your busy life. Or maybe you just need help breaking free from self-limiting beliefs or help with mindset. So whether you're looking for a one-time session, quarterly sessions, or a month of one-on-one support, or you can check in for daily accountability, I have options available for you and I'm here to help you with all of that and more. Bottom line, I want to help you succeed in living your best life. Sad news for me is I'm going to be having surgery and not be working for probably about 12 weeks here, and the next, I don't know when, sometime this spring. So my availability is going to be a little bit wider than it normally is. So if you reached out before and our timing didn't align, reach back out again because I'm going to be opening up my schedule because I will just be at home seven days a week. I might even open up some Saturday mornings. So yeah, don't hesitate to reach out. There's a link in show notes or you can always email me at sheri at fastfeastrepeat.com.

Speaker 1:
[50:19] Well, I know that the surgery is the last thing you were hoping for.

Speaker 2:
[50:23] I know. I'm going to be climbing the walls.

Speaker 1:
[50:27] Reach out to Sheri, get her off the wall. So now it's time for our tweak of the week. This is from Karen from San Diego. I started Intermittent Fasting two and a half years ago. Although I only needed to lose about 10 pounds, there are so many other benefits that have kept me wanting to keep IF as my lifestyle. I've struggled to stay within my eating window of four to five hours. I've never used an app since I prefer to try my window and not my fast. I think it was Gin who recently mentioned setting a timer on your phone is a good alternative. I decided to try this. It's amazing what this little tweak has done for me. I set my timer for 20 hours and I do not eat until the timer goes off. As soon as I start eating, I set it for four hours. It seems so simple, but it has given me a hard boundary. When I set my timer, that is my commitment. It hasn't come up yet, but I know there will be days I will need or want a longer window, which will be fine. I'll just set my timer for longer. It's nice not being concerned about what time it is and simply looking at how much time is left on my timer. It's much easier to commit ahead of time and commit on a one-day-at-a-time basis as it provides flexibility. I commit when I'm in the right frame of mind and I'm no longer acting on impulse. It's all about the tools that work for you.

Speaker 2:
[51:48] Well, we love to leave you with an inspiration or a motivational message to carry you through the next week. And this week we have a quote from Nick Cave, shared by Jenna in Nebraska. The quote is, rather than feel impotent and useless, you must come to terms with the fact that as a human being, you are infinitely powerful and take responsibility for this tremendous power. Even our smallest actions have potential for great change, positively or negatively, and the way in which we all conduct ourselves within the world means something. You are anything but impotent. You are, in fact, exquisitely and frighteningly dynamic, as are we all, and with all respect, you have an obligation to stand up and take responsibility for that potential. It is your most ordinary and urgent duty. Jenna shared, It was true for me and it might feel true for others listening, but after so many failed diet attempts, I felt powerless over my weight and my body, and I reached a point where I had just given up and accepted there was nothing I could do. Yet each year I started to despise my body more and more. Then I discovered this podcast. A friend at work told me, just listen, listen to a few episodes. I've been online friends with Sheri for over 15 years, and I've watched how fasting has transformed her health. Give them a fair chance and hear what they have to say. I don't know who this was that told her this.

Speaker 1:
[53:06] I know that's cool.

Speaker 2:
[53:08] Yeah. For the first time, I gained hope and I realized that by giving up, I was not doing anything to contribute to the change I wanted. Six months ago, I started IF, keeping a variable four to five hour window. And all I can say is that this one small action has created drastic change. And the more I take charge of my health, sleep and food quality, the better I feel, the better the scale reacts, and the more excited I am about the future. I have a newfound confidence and courage to stand up and take responsibility for other things in my life that I had let go while mired in my fat suit of misery. Life looks so much better now that I realize that the power to create change starts with me.

Speaker 1:
[53:47] I love that. Thanks so much for listening today. We would love to have you join us in the Delayed on Deny community where you can interact with both me and Sheri, plus the most supportive bunch of intermittent fasters you'll find anywhere. Go to ginstevens.com/community to join us.

Speaker 2:
[54:06] Don't forget to subscribe to this podcast through your favorite podcast app. And if you haven't already, please leave us a five star review. That helps new listeners find the show and we really appreciate it.

Speaker 1:
[54:17] We're a community driven podcast. So to submit your success stories, your questions, your favorite, tweak it till it's easy moments, or anything else you want us to share on the podcast, go to fastfeastrepeat.com/submit. And then listen each week to see if we share your submission or answer your question.

Speaker 2:
[54:38] Until next week, thanks for listening.

Speaker 1:
[54:53] This podcast was edited by Resonate Recordings.