transcript

Speaker 1:
[00:08] Hi, everyone, and welcome back to That UFO Podcast. As always, my name is Andy, and joining me today, first time guest on the show for a big news update to go through a ton of stuff, including new Donald Trump statements, Anna Paulina Luna on reading the Book of Enoch, missing scientists, Jeremy Corbell documentary, new disclosure day footage, and a whole lot more, including a lot of involvement from yourselves. I've got Dan Cleary from Others From Another Mother, and that is hard for me to say. Dan, welcome.

Speaker 2:
[00:38] Hi buddy, how are you? I love hearing you say it, by the way. Your accent really makes it sound much cooler than it really is.

Speaker 1:
[00:43] Others, if I do the old Others From Another Mother, that's probably a bit more. Yeah, yeah, do the old radio station voice. But yeah, listen, I've been on your show. I don't know how long ago even it was now. Time means nothing to me these days. So it could have been three weeks, it could have been three months, it could have been three years. I think it was a couple of months ago now. Yeah, it was a few months ago. I really appreciated you hosting me, mate. So thank you. If someone's listening or tuning in to this, we're going to talk news. But very quickly, Dan, who are you? What do you do? What's brought you to the UFO dance?

Speaker 2:
[01:14] Oh, hi, well, my name is Dan and I have been into the UFO stuff since I was about eight years old. Kind of around the time that George Knapp broke the 51 Bob Lazar stuff. And just in school, in my elementary school, in the library, there was a little section, like a science section. I remember there being like four or five UFO books and flipping through that as a little boy and seeing like pictures, which some of them, I think it probably was like Billy Meyer pictures that were in these books.

Speaker 1:
[01:43] Yeah, yeah.

Speaker 2:
[01:44] And just being completely, just awestruck by the idea of it. And that's been kind of my whole life. And I've seen some cool stuff. I saw a really cool triangle when I was about 15 or 16 years old in Massachusetts, where I grew up. And I've been into it forever. And I think, I don't know about you, but I kind of go through dips and valleys with my interest in it. And as a kid, super into it. As a teenager, less so, because I'm playing music and everything. And then, but always kind of keeping tabs on things. And then when YouTube kind of started kicking off, I started seeing that like, I can go back and look at all these old episodes of sightings and unsolved mysteries and things that I grew up as a kid watching. And obviously, the last 10 years, things have just exploded and decided to get much more involved a few years ago. And yeah, it's been a fun ride so far and still going strong.

Speaker 1:
[02:42] Yeah, and with the roller coaster ride, yeah, I think it's been six years since the podcast started, almost to the day. And yeah, I think I had that as a kid, big interest kind of fell away. Not fell away, but just, you know, I was a kid same as yourself before the internet, and then I saw the internet come along, and I remember getting like your Britannica Encyclopedia Britannica. It was called the CD-ROMs. CD-ROMs is bringing it back for the kids there. Oh man, yep. Yeah, I would go to the library, I've said so many times, I would get like UFO books, VHS on the Loch Ness Monster, all that kind of stuff.

Speaker 2:
[03:19] Of course.

Speaker 1:
[03:20] And then it was like through 2012, 2015, 2016, my Facebook memory still pop up with, just watch this UFO documentary, just watch this one, Herod Obama might be announcing UFOs next week. So the interest has always been there. And then obviously starting the podcast, it's kind of never went away since because it is basically a full time job. Now, and I think given what we're going to talk about, it's so on the nose right now because the world is an absolute hell hole in so many ways. I'm sure there's lots of nice things happening, but if you open your window, if you turn on the news, there's a lot of negativity. But the UFO subject seems to be so close to the tip of the spear at the minute. It's really breaking through in so many ways in the mainstream. We'll start with Donald Trump and I'll get your thoughts, Dan, on a lot of stuff here. So Donald Trump, of course, a couple of months ago had that little back and forward with Obama that really blew up. Saying about, you know, he shouldn't be talking about classified information, etc, etc. Donald Trump has a way with words, doesn't he?

Speaker 2:
[04:22] He sure does.

Speaker 1:
[04:23] He likes to use them. I don't think he's always exactly sure and exactly what he's going to say at any given time. He does go very much off the teleprompter quite a lot. But we've got to this point where even he was at a turning point USA rally about three or four days ago now. And he said at that moment, he gave an update on the files being released. 46 videos that Anna Paulina Luna and the task force are looking to get. And he basically turned around at this rally and said to the crowd, I'll paraphrase, you guys like this stuff, you're a bit out there, you're a bit crazy. I don't know if he means younger generations, whatever it was. But we're going to release the files. Pete Hegseth is going to release them. It's coming very, very soon. So that was the biggest update we'd had in terms of this. We've got the alien slash aliens dot gov website, which has now changed status to still not being live, but it now looks like there is a website behind the screen you get when you try to access them. There has been a change there. All kinds of rumors that could house the videos, the photos, the files. At this point, what's your take on what we're actually going to get coming? Because I've got a feeling we could expect something to drop in the next couple of days, if not week.

Speaker 2:
[05:37] Sure. I don't know what to expect. I think with UFOs, first of all, try to keep my excitement low and try to be pleasantly surprised, because I think we've all been so disappointed before. And then when you pair that with this particular administration, there's a lot of talk of like, this thing is coming soon, this important thing is coming soon, and it doesn't really ever materialize. I know that when he was running initially in 2016, he said he had this healthcare plan that was going to replace what we have is Obamacare. He said, I'll tell you about it in two weeks. That was 10 years ago, and we still haven't heard about it. So I think Luna is on top of it. I think Luna is fighting. I don't know what she's gonna be able to get. I'm optimistic, but very patient to see what happens. I know that they do know exactly where to look. I know that they have the links for those videos and all that kind of stuff and the documents. I don't know what to expect. I don't think we're gonna get all 46. I don't know if we'll even get any actual videos for us. I'm expecting maybe documents, maybe a couple of videos, but I don't really know. There's nothing, there's no signs as to, there's no precedent before now to let us know what we might get now, if you know what I mean. I don't know.

Speaker 1:
[07:01] There is an assumption that this is gonna be public, and how much of it is going to be public, isn't there? That you see, this is being requested, but as a case, they're gonna get access. It has been put across, though. I think it's fair to say that this is going to be released, and we will all get to see what there is. I'll give you what I think we're gonna get.

Speaker 2:
[07:20] Okay, please.

Speaker 1:
[07:20] So I think we'll get 46 videos. I am gonna put numbers to them, right? I reckon 75% will be, bin them straight away, okay? They'll be just nothing, blobs, you know, could be anything, could be balloons, could be birds, could be whatever, could be flares dropping. They'll be no use. I think you'll then get 15, 10, 15% of them that are interesting. But again, for me, like that hellfire missile video from back in the hearing, it'll be something that is likely prosaic, but people are gonna argue it's something more interesting than it maybe is, and that will cause lots of arguments. I think we might get a couple, this is probably more hope than anything. There might be a couple of ones where we go, right, wait a minute, that's genuinely interesting.

Speaker 2:
[08:07] Sure.

Speaker 1:
[08:07] It'll still be flare footage, it'll still be black and white, it'll still be hot, hot, white, you know, black, cold, all that, whatever it is. But I think we might get one or two that are really worth talking about. That is more hope than expectation. Like you see, I keep my expectations low. I still think we're gonna get some of this stuff, but I'm just gonna bring in here now. You are friends with Jeremy Corbell, aren't you?

Speaker 2:
[08:33] I am, yes, I am.

Speaker 1:
[08:35] Yeah, and that's worth noting. We're gonna talk about Jeremy Corbell's documentary later on that's coming out soon. But you're saying, you know, Jeremy Corbell has said he is aware of the 46 videos. He has seen some most, if not all, of these videos himself already.

Speaker 2:
[08:52] I believe so. That's what he said.

Speaker 1:
[08:55] How does that sit with you? So obviously I speak to Jeremy, not in the same way you do, but I will come to talk about Jeremy as a person with a documentary release because it really focuses on him as a person.

Speaker 2:
[09:07] Yeah.

Speaker 1:
[09:07] But there's a guy who has no security clearances, just has some connections, has some good friends, and he has seen these videos allegedly that they're struggling to get out publicly. So there are ways to do it if he's seen them.

Speaker 2:
[09:29] I don't know his process. I'm smart enough to know not to ask him how this stuff works, and he wouldn't tell me even if I did ask.

Speaker 1:
[09:37] Yeah.

Speaker 2:
[09:37] I mean, he is a complete professional when it comes to this kind of stuff. We've hung socially a bunch of times and never once has he been like, you want to see something cool? He's never gone to the computer in a secret bat cave and pulled out a flash drive. It doesn't work that way. I mean, he takes this very, very seriously in protecting sources and protecting whistleblowers and protecting anyone who risks a lot to come forward and speak to him and share whatever they share. I don't know if they give him a link. I don't know if these people give him a copy of it. I don't know how it works. I have no idea. I don't really want to know. It's a dangerous world that he's in and I don't really want to be a part of that, but I'm glad it's happening. I wonder too if some of these videos are kind of like the Tic Tac, Gimbal and GoFast where they weren't technically classified. I wonder if that's the only way that it's able to come out because all three of those were, like Chris Mellon realized, right, that they were not actually classified. Is that correct?

Speaker 1:
[10:49] One was online already for years. Yeah, one was already online and just had been kind of passed around, but no one paid attention to it.

Speaker 2:
[10:57] Okay, so I wonder if it's kind of that. I do feel very confident that we will not see any kind of satellite imagery. I don't think we're going to see any kind of 4K, you know, disc from above type stuff. I think that stuff is very, very, very protected. But I think you're probably right as far as FLIR. I would like to see some cockpit iPhone footage of someone taking something with an iPhone, which we've heard has happened quite a few times. Isn't there, I want to see this triangle, this triangle coming out of the water video that we've heard about.

Speaker 1:
[11:32] That's a throwback to four or five years ago now where we had the, it was going to be, and I'm probably going to get slaughtered now for this. It was going to be a photograph of a triangle coming out of water, unmistakable. Wow, that's not just a black chip on the camera screen. That's a real solid object. Then it was, it's a picture from a screen grab of a video. And then it was, it's a video. So whether this thing even existed or it took on a life of its own, what is actually out there is very much up for debate. But there was a time where people were really pinning their hopes on this coming out. Elizondo didn't downplay it, and he was the guy at the time. And he didn't downplay it. He didn't shoot it down. Not literally, not the craft itself. He didn't shoot down the idea that there was this photograph or video that existed. I get, I think even at this point, we have to be very, I'll always, I've said this so many times. I would always rather see a video or have a photograph made public for people to tear it to bits. And within five minutes, John Greenwald and Mick West and all those guys have solved the puzzle. Excellent, brilliant, been it and we can move on. I don't have an issue with that. I would always rather see the stuff and have it torn down because they can't solve and prove everything. That's even if you go into Metabunk, there's still plenty of things that they go, we can't actually see what this is. But it's not UFO, it's not an alien. Cool. But we don't know what it is. And that's the interesting stuff that, and yeah, so that would be cool if we got some cockpit stuff, that would be really interesting for me. You bring that one up. It would be nice if it wasn't all, you know, some of the stuff like the jellyfish and the mausoleur and just that type of military camera.

Speaker 2:
[13:23] Yeah.

Speaker 1:
[13:23] Something a bit more raw, something a bit more eye catching, something different. I think I'm ready for something different. And if it was 46 Flir videos, I think there's an element of, ah, okay.

Speaker 2:
[13:36] Yeah, I know what you mean. At least the mausoleur was in color. You know, at least that was something that was in color. And that was a little bit different. It was somewhat, I mean, it's hard to tell size, but it seemed a little bit up close and at least it was in color. It's been explained to me a couple of the videos that are in that file. And there's a couple of very, very weird things that might not be what people are hoping to see, but very weird shapes and things behaving very strangely. Haven't seen it, but looking forward to seeing that. And I imagine that will be one of them if it comes out.

Speaker 1:
[14:13] You know the screen grabs that have been released recently of the star looking objects and the X-wing. Yeah, X-wing looking objects, all that kind of stuff. Like, are we talking that kind of thing?

Speaker 2:
[14:26] I don't know. Oh, as far as what I heard was in there?

Speaker 1:
[14:31] Yeah, or what you're expecting, yeah.

Speaker 2:
[14:33] Not like that. Something that's kind of more bizarre. At least one of them is much more bizarre and behaving very strangely. And I think it's a video. But the chandelier wand, that new stuff, I don't know how I feel about that. That's a single photograph, an anonymous single photograph nowadays is very, very hard to pay much attention to because you just have no idea where it came from. And the fake stuff is so easy.

Speaker 1:
[14:59] Yeah, I think on Night Shift a few days ago, this was what I, my name is brought up by Clint, I think it was.

Speaker 2:
[15:05] Yes.

Speaker 1:
[15:07] That guy who wrote Atlas, very nice, very nice advertisement of the book from him. And you remembered my name, which was great. And you mentioned, you know, it was Andy McGrillen and he was like, I wonder what he thinks of this.

Speaker 2:
[15:19] Yes.

Speaker 1:
[15:19] And I think it was to do with those photos. And I think there's a lot of really interesting drones out there that are Chinese, Russian, US, you know, various different countries, superpowers, militaries, private contractors. Whether those photos are those or not, I don't know. But yeah, I think that was a big reason for when we had the initial task force report that had the massive reduction on shapes of UAP. I think if we managed to redact that, I think a lot of those photographs show classified US drone systems, classified Chinese drone systems, classified Russian drone systems. Maybe there are one or two shapes that aren't human drones. But I think a lot of that probably was, yeah, those are ours or a friend of ours. I just happened to catch them on camera. I think that's probably the case. And it might be the case with those kind of weird pictures. I'll try and remember to put some of those up on the screen for folks kind of watching on YouTube just now. But yeah, there are kind of, like you say, pointy chandelier looking Christmas bobble type craft. There's going to be a lot of weird looking drones, a lot of them.

Speaker 2:
[16:30] And here's the thing too, is like, let's say that's real. And some people say that's too good to be true. But at some point with technology, we're going to get pictures that are legitimate, that are real, that look fake because of how good they are. You know what I mean?

Speaker 1:
[16:46] Or just some part, if we're truly, yeah, sorry, if we're truly looking at something non-human or we have not seen before, then when do you go, oh yeah, that's real? How would you know?

Speaker 2:
[16:58] I mean, the best way, I've said this for years, the best way is just to see it yourself. I mean, once you've been there, so it's the kind of thing where, once you see it yourself or experience it yourself, it doesn't matter what Mick West says about anything. Like, once you know it's a real thing, that's it. But yeah, seeing is the best part. I don't know how we're gonna navigate the future with photographs and videos. And how much will people care? I just don't know. I don't think, like I have some young people in my family, I have a goddaughter who's in her early 20s, and I have a niece who is 16. And I asked them, I'm like, what do you guys think about UFOs and aliens? Is it in your conversation? Like, are you tracking this at all in your lives? And they're all like, yeah, we hear about it, we know about it. And it's like, that's cool. So they just, I don't think this...

Speaker 1:
[17:56] Do you know what I think they mean by that?

Speaker 2:
[17:58] Yeah, tell me.

Speaker 1:
[17:59] As they scroll, they see it and they scroll past it, they go, yeah, okay, cool.

Speaker 2:
[18:03] I think you're probably right.

Speaker 1:
[18:04] It's another news item. I don't mean that even in a bad way. I think it is just like, there's so much thrown at younger generations and us. I imagine a lot of folks listening to this right now, maybe in bed, God help you listening to me and Dan of an evening trying to get to sleep right. But how many of us go to bed, get our phones out and plan on checking emails for two minutes, but 45 minutes later, we're sitting on X or Instagram or Facebook and we're a hundred videos deep. And it can be any topic. Yeah, it's so easy. So you've got all this stuff thrown at you now. And it's such an overload of information. And I think back to how smart I thought I was when I was 15, 16. My stepson's about to turn 22. And I remember at 22 thinking, my dad's a dick, my mom's a dick. They're always hard on me. They don't understand how difficult it is working 20 hours a week in a supermarket and trying to go out the weekends with my friends and just trying to navigate life. This is so hard. And they don't get, I'm more mature than they think. And I look back and go, I would have fucking slapped me if I had to go back and just be like, what, shut the, stop it. And I think now being that age and having all this information thrown at you, 24 7 at your fingertips, what's right, what's wrong? I've said before, I think we're getting to a point now where what's actually true and false doesn't even matter to people anymore. It's like build your own narrative of what you want the world to be. And you can find people who believe it, who will go along with it. And that's it. Truth, truth or fact, truth or false, truth or fiction, it's all the same thing. Your friend, Jeremy Corbell, what is it? Praise and blame, it's all the same. I think that's the same truth and fiction for a lot of folks. It's just the same thing. And for UFOs, for aliens, for NHI, I think you've got youngsters who now just go, yeah, probably.

Speaker 2:
[20:07] Yeah, right. And that's not a bad place to be in, of a yeah, probably. I think I'm happy that they're not scared of it for the most part. I wish they were a bit more interested. And I think if something, if this whole movement progresses to the point of like, if things do show up in the sky, I think it will command attention from young people and everybody. But I know there are some young people who are pretty interested in it, and that's been great to see too. But yeah, I just talk to young folks. They just, they're tracking it, but not crazy interested, it seems like.

Speaker 1:
[20:48] Yeah, it's still not real when it's behind a screen, it's still not real. So you can read and you can watch videos of anything. The other week, a lot of folks were under the impression we were on the brink of nuclear war, and how close or how true that was remains to be seen. But everything on your phone is just out there in the internet world, and you can choose to believe how real or genuine, how close something is, like I say. Some people don't even, I'm amazed. I speak to my wife sometimes and I'll be like, oh, did you see what happened today with the US and Iran? She'll be like, no. How have you not seen that? Because she-

Speaker 2:
[21:26] That's my wife.

Speaker 1:
[21:27] Yeah. She doesn't necessarily, not that she doesn't care, but it doesn't immediately impact her or affect her. So yeah, the petrol and diesel is a bit more expensive. The groceries are a bit more expensive.

Speaker 2:
[21:40] Right.

Speaker 1:
[21:41] But generally, until it hits you and physically impacts you, like you say, it's one thing to see the UFOs, see the files, see the people talking about it. We're going to get to this with the scientist stuff. I've got a point I thought about the other day. We'll talk about that, Dan. But until you see they physically appear in the sky or in front of you, I don't think it will really hit people what is happening and what we're dealing about. That's a totally different scenario.

Speaker 2:
[22:08] Yeah, because if President Trump comes out next week and makes this declaration that it's a real thing, half of the country will think it's complete bullshit. In this country anyway, I'm just speaking from America. Politically, it matters where the message comes from. If you see it on the YouTube video or on the news, people will just say it's fake. And there's people that say it's a PSYOP, it's all the government. So there's no crystal clear way to get through this. And we all kind of take our own different paths to get there. But it's messy waters to be in, that's for sure.

Speaker 1:
[22:46] Yeah, so on that, I'm gonna give you the choice here being first time and all that on the podcast. Do we segue into the Book of Enoch, Anna Paulina Luna comments, which are related, or do we go with the scientists being missing, which again are also related to this whole current state of ufology?

Speaker 2:
[23:06] Let's go Enoch, because I read up on it a little bit before we started, let's start there. It's bizarre.

Speaker 1:
[23:13] Cool, I think this is gonna be like the uncensored, unacknowledged and unprepared version and section of the podcast here, Dan, where we've got minimal notes, minimal knowledge, but we're gonna talk about it anyway, and isn't that very 2026 of us?

Speaker 2:
[23:25] Let's do it, we're professionals, we're professionals.

Speaker 1:
[23:28] Professional bullshitters, yeah. Yeah, that's right. So, Anna Paulina Luna, the other day, put a tweet out, an ex, whatever you want to call it these days, just saying, read the Book of Enoch, okay? So, as far as I know, and I'm sure lots of people listening to this will have a breadth of what that means to them, either, for me, it's a Bible thing, right? That's as far as I would have known, if you asked me a few months ago, what's the Book of Enoch? And I went, a book in the Bible? And I don't think that's a million miles off. However, what's your understanding of the Book of Enoch and what it is?

Speaker 2:
[24:03] What sounds like it's passages or something that was taken from some old texts, and it's about a man who maybe was like, was he brought to heaven, but he didn't actually die and he met angels and fallen angels and learned about fallen angels teaching man, like about forbidden knowledge with metallurgy and teaching man about warfare and that kind of stuff. Is that kind of what it is?

Speaker 1:
[24:38] Maybe. So listen, I'm not an expert and neither are you. And what I'm not going to do is spend, I don't have the time to spend weeks researching this, okay? So I'm going to hand over and read some comments from someone who is an expert, one of the listeners to the podcast, Nick, has a religious background. I can't remember what exactly he does. Forgive me, Nick, you'll be listening to this. But on the Discord, he put in some wonderful commentary that I'm going to go with. This is true. And a lot of people appreciated this, okay? So Nick said, a few thoughts on the Luna Enoch comments, as I've done a lot of research in this area. And let me just premise this by saying, my understanding of Luna saying that because she mentioned it before on Joe Rogan, and kind of scatter guns, this isn't the first time she said this.

Speaker 2:
[25:20] She said it three or four times, I think.

Speaker 1:
[25:22] Yeah. Yeah, it's not the first time, and she's not the first person either. My understanding would be, you're hinting at, there is some stuff in this particular religious text, which hints at interactions with non-human intelligence. It could be analogies, it could be symbolism, it could be straight up, we spoke and talked to aliens, but under the guise of angels, demons, whatever it may be. That would be my understanding and my assumption. And I think a lot of people might be in that same place. What Nick said, though, was, this will take a minute or so to get through. Lots of evangelical, there's like four points as well here. Lots of evangelicals inevitably bumped into the Enochian material at some point and ask the same questions Luna asks. Why isn't this in the Bible? Has there been a conspiracy to hide this? But there are good reasons to believe it was never considered inspired scripture. In that sense, it was never removed. It was generally never considered authentic. It's about like how we might weigh and evaluate text within the MJ12 set. Yes, the ancient Jews had it in their collection of writings, and although they considered it important, that does not mean they thought this was on the same level of authority as the rest of the Old Testament canon. When Luna says Enoch was removed from the Bible, that's more an opinion that isn't well supported by evidence. So that's the first point, okay? Secondly, I'm not sure what questions she thinks Enoch answers as it relates to the phenomenon. Same goes for all these ancient texts. They have a lot of interesting details, but it doesn't all fit in a satisfying way, unless you want to pick and choose which details to believe. Maybe some of the details are accurate, but it's an open question as to whether it even relates to the phenomenon at all because I don't know if it does. I see a tendency right now for Christians to use anything as a C. We're talking NHI, and there are NHI in the Enoch Bible, so my world view is right. That was the second point. Third, he says, my best guess is Enoch is a Jewish take on all the myths of the ancient world related to the water paradigm. There may have been a desire to write their version of the story during their time in the Babylonian exile. That does not mean there isn't a there there to the original story. It's just that Enoch should probably be interpreted together with other texts, and he names Enuma, Elish, Gilgamesh, which are much more mythological and less literal history. Enoch also comes much more later than other texts like Genesis, Job, or Isaiah. If it was actually written by Enoch, as it claims, I think it would be a stronger manuscript tradition going back further. For more information, Wesley Hough and Michael Hesse are good sources on this stuff. The danger is to be too dismissive or too enthusiastic about Enoch, and both those guys are pretty balanced. And then Nick adds, also, one other thing that makes me kind of mad when I think about it. There is no one Book of Enoch. In the same way, there isn't one majestic 12 document. It's a collection of documents preserved in fragments and compiled together. Does Luna mean just the Book of Watchers, the Book of Parables? Does she know there is a Slavic version and an Ethiopian version? At least Timothy Alberino knows this and can parse out the differences, but I doubt Luna can.

Speaker 2:
[28:41] Interesting. Thank you, Nick, for the education. That was very helpful. I think I understand that Ethiopia at the moment is still the only country that really takes the Book of Enoch seriously as canon still, I believe.

Speaker 1:
[28:58] No idea.

Speaker 2:
[28:59] So I've read. I mean, who knows? It's the Internet, who knows? Interesting. My concern with it is that it's more angels and demons talk.

Speaker 1:
[29:09] Yeah.

Speaker 2:
[29:09] Which again, I don't know what the phenomenon is. You don't know what it is. Could it be angels and demons? I guess maybe. But for me, I feel like we're hearing a lot of demons talk lately and I don't really know exactly where it's coming from. I know we've all heard about the Collins elite and this idea of this US government group of Christians who are against the UFO truth coming out. But I was-

Speaker 1:
[29:38] Like far right evangelical Christians. Yes, exactly.

Speaker 2:
[29:42] So I had dinner the other night with Jeremy and George Knapp and I brought up the Collins elite to George and I said, George, is the Collins elite, in your studies, is it like an actual group with a name? And he said, no, it's just people. It's certain people with certain ideals that push this demons thing. So it's not an actual group according to George Knapp. And when George speaks, I kind of think it's, he kind of knows what he's talking about.

Speaker 1:
[30:10] Okay.

Speaker 2:
[30:11] But I feel like the demons talk is like a cop out because it seems we're being told, it's demons, leave it alone, don't talk about it. Or at least deep in government, the word seems to be to telling people that are asking questions, this is demons, leave it alone. It sounds like a cop out as a way to just not talk about it, just to not do any kind of investigation. It's strange to me. Curious what you think about that.

Speaker 1:
[30:40] Yeah. I don't think that's an unfair way to look at it. That it's a way to not speak about it. I don't think UFOs would be the only thing folks with, and I'm speaking from the point of view of someone who is not religious in the slightest, right? Everyone's got the title to believe what they want to believe.

Speaker 2:
[30:56] Same here.

Speaker 1:
[30:58] In 2,000 years, people might dig up Harry Potter books and believe there was a wizard called Harry Potter and all that kind of stuff.

Speaker 2:
[31:03] Can you imagine? It could happen.

Speaker 1:
[31:05] After the nuclear winter dies down, you know? Again, I'm not religious. I done RE at school and I was reasonably good at it, and it just seemed to me that all these different religions have very similar stories in a lot of different ways. I get this crossover between various prophets and Jesus appears in different religions and all that kind of stuff, right? But I think, like you say, there are folks with very strong religious models, ethics, and beliefs, and they're raised from birth to believe and disbelieve certain things that don't fit into those world views at times. One of my big learns, to be fair, and I'm just going to caveat to save myself here, I think, from a bashing from some folks. Before I started the podcast, Dan, I always had a kind of lazy idea that when we find out aliens are real, that that will end world religion, it will all come crumbling down. Actually, the religious folks I've spoken to have been some of the most reasoned and prepared people for non-human intelligence. How often they'll say that it has built into various religious scriptures and texts, and that God has made various worlds, that's capital G God and all that kind of stuff. That was one that I definitely got wrong from that perspective. Me too. Dan and Priscilla's our new book coming out about AI and religion and stuff in the coming months as well. When it comes to Collins elite folks, I can see there being this group that their world views are X, that does not allow Y to come in, but they've probably been exposed enough to know, let's call Y aliens or non-human intelligence, they've been exposed to enough to know, no, there's something to this, there is a there there, that this is real, whatever this might be. But because their belief that X is so strong, they just have to go well, what in my beliefs is the epitome of evil or do you avoid, do you not want to entertain, do you want to stay away from, what are you being protected from? Well, it's demons, it's the devil, it's satanic. Okay, that's what this must be then, because this is such an unknown quantity, and that's how they protect themselves and those around them, that's how they wrap their world beliefs up. But the problem being that this Collins elite, these shadowy cabals are running the free world allegedly, and they are shaping policy and shaping our lives directly and indirectly with these beliefs in the background. And that is what upsets so many people because then you have no transparency, you're having it decided for you, well, you can't know because I think this. And that's not right. And again, that boils down to the whole, you've got recovered craft, you're keeping it secret. Okay, but are we alone or not? There are so many ways they can come out and confirm we're not alone and disclose without bringing forward how they're going to use the propulsion in various wars and battles and subscriptions for free energy. You're not going to get free energy anyway. So yeah, I'm totally, totally on board with that. I asked folks on the Patreon a question I like them to answer. With Luna alluding to the Book of Enoch, it's clearly something she's been told by, and I've put here, in certain names, okay? Matthew Brown's alluded to it previously. And others, what exactly are they getting at in terms of NHI? And I've put here a quick summary. The Book of Enoch describes fallen angels, the Watchers, who corrupt humanity by sharing forbidden knowledge, leading to divine judgment and the Great Flood. Cool. So, a few different people, I'll read through some comments here, folks. Dan, so Dahlia, President of Chikinlandia, who you may have heard on Listener Collins if you've checked those out before. Dahlia's wonderful. She just commented, it's a fear tactic. So what's your take on, it's a fear tactic?

Speaker 2:
[34:58] The Book of Enoch or the demons thing?

Speaker 1:
[35:01] This commentary around watchers, demons, all that kind of stuff, NHI being tied in.

Speaker 2:
[35:06] Sure. I mean, you have people that say it's all, it's bad. And there's the abductees that talk about it being such a horrible experience. And you have people like Stephen Greer or Whitley Strieber. And Whitley Strieber has said it's a terrifying thing, but there's also so much love involved. On your last episode, I listened to it last night. Whitley's saying that he considers himself part of these beings' family at this point. Like the woman, the image of the woman, female alien or whatever, how he sees it as family, even though it's been a tumultuous relationship. I think it runs the gamut, but the fear tactic is, yeah, that's completely valid. But I want to know, the people that think it's scary, I'd like to know where that's coming from in them. Like, why are they scared of it? Because I haven't seen much yet that makes me terrified. I mean, the idea of being taken from my home, that's a very scary thing, but we also don't know why that would happen. If you have a dog and you take your dog to the vet, your dog's horrified, it has no idea why it's going there, why it's on this table, why you're giving it a shot, but it's because you care about it. So there's that aspect as well. But I mean, everyone's different. I don't know. I mean, everyone has different views on this.

Speaker 1:
[36:28] Do you think animals in the zoo get scared when they get visited?

Speaker 2:
[36:32] Maybe at the beginning, and then maybe you get used to it. I've been to quite a few zoos and a certain point, like you go and you watch the gorillas and they just kind of look at you like you're looking at them. Just like, okay, what do you want me to do?

Speaker 1:
[36:49] I wonder, is that the same then, that we are going to be the animals in that zoo where this superior species with better technology that can come and go and then out your house if they want. They have no boundaries or at least let's say one of those entities, whichever involved with abductions, can literally come and go from your property whenever they want. They don't see it as your private property, Dan, that's your apartment, your condo, your bed, your room. You've got a lot. You've got a roof. You've got a ring doorbell system. You know, they don't care. That means nothing to them. It doesn't even compute that that's a thing. So they'll come and do that. That's going to be terrifying for folk to try and explain that. But then when you go to the zoo and you pay your admission fee and you walk through and see the gorillas, they don't have a choice but to have you stroll through and look at them. And do you know what? Sometimes you can feed the animals as well.

Speaker 2:
[37:41] Yeah, right. Right. I mean, think about when even when you walk through the woods, like the woods is the home of so many animals. And we just walk through there, take a leak on a tree. People throw their litter on the ground. I mean, it's, if beings are coming to watch us because it's fun or to mess with us while we sleep or to take us to take samples to study, we do the exact same thing to every animal on this planet. So when people get upset about it, I have a tough time having sympathy because we do that and we would do that. If we, the moment we get the ability to go to another star system or to another planet with a tlent life, if we have the ability to go into a community of gray aliens or whatever and scoop one up, we absolutely will do it if we haven't done it already. Who knows? But I just, we have no right to be upset about these kind of things. No right whatsoever.

Speaker 1:
[38:43] That was something you guys touched on on the night shift show because it's something I've talked about before. I love the kind of off the beaten path conversations with us, and I could go way off on tangents here. We'll save that for another time perhaps. But the idea, for example, it was brought up, I think it was Clint, I wasn't sure, who was saying that, who are these beings visiting us? Is it the 1%? Is it their version of astronauts coming here? So is it the best of their society? Is it a rogue element of their society?

Speaker 2:
[39:14] Is it teenagers just out on the weekend going for a ride?

Speaker 1:
[39:17] Is it a joy ride? Do you remember the episode? Did you ever watch South Park? Yeah.

Speaker 2:
[39:20] Of course. Yeah, yeah.

Speaker 1:
[39:22] So remember when Cartman gets the phone that he can do prank calls, but you do prank calls through time. It's like, imagine you get that power where you can do prank phone calls. Actually, if anyone wants to have a little bit of Scottish heritage, look up a show called Burniston, B-U-R-N-I-S-T-O-U-N, a really funny Scottish comedy. It's on Netflix, right? They have one where basically it's a sketch show, very Scottish humor. The accents might be hard for people to understand, but they're good. That's me saying that. They have one where they go back in time to prank themselves when they were younger, where they'll basically tell their girlfriend, the boyfriend's cheating on them. Then they go back and remember, oh, you punched me and I've got a black eye from it. They're basically pranking each other going back and forward. We just don't know and it can sound ridiculous, but like you say, other alien fathers jumping on board a UFO, going, bye honey, I'm off to earth for a couple of weeks. I won't be back till the kids, I'll see them in a few weeks time and I'm going to head off. Is it a military expedition? Like you say, as a joyriding teens, we don't know. Imagine it was just like the last of a civilization.

Speaker 2:
[40:36] Sure. A civilization that's died out, that's coming to find a new home.

Speaker 1:
[40:42] They just sent, maybe it's one that's dying out and three-body problem-esque. I think we're past spoiler territory now on that.

Speaker 2:
[40:50] I just started rewatching it. I watched the episode three again last night.

Speaker 1:
[40:54] Wait. Of the English version or the Chinese one?

Speaker 2:
[40:57] The English version. I know you love the Chinese one, right? You love the Chinese one.

Speaker 1:
[41:00] I'm not that guy. I watched the subtitled show and I'm better than you, right? But the Chinese one is so much better. So much better. I'll do it. Really, really worth it. Worth the time. So yeah, like, as it's something where you've got a failing civilization that sent robotic grays out to investigate and go, is there somewhere else we can go either for help, you know, as a stopover to learn, who knows? We really don't know at this point, but I think those are all really interesting conversations. And all of that to say, as and when whatever gets disclosed gets disclosed. All I want answered for a first off is, are we alone? And for them to say, yes, yes, we are. Or they can't say yes, we are. So the answer is no, we're not.

Speaker 2:
[41:46] That's enough for you.

Speaker 1:
[41:46] And we go from there.

Speaker 2:
[41:48] That's enough for you to start.

Speaker 1:
[41:50] As a starting point, because I think that's where you then get mainstream science, mainstream academia. All of that gets on board. The funding comes in, the support comes in, the belief system comes in. I think public education becomes a major factor at that point where people are willing and open to listen to this stuff. So yeah, for me, that would be a huge, huge step. That's step one, but I don't think we're hovering around the step. Various people have their foot over the step, but they're not quite taking it yet.

Speaker 2:
[42:24] Yeah, of course, of course. Though we're not a lone thing, I get that it's a big opening statement to make. But I think we all, not just the UFO folks, but people, I think people in general accept the fact that we're not the only intelligent life in the universe. I'm almost sick of even having to say that. I think we all know with the vastness of the universe that we're not alone. But I guess when you wouldn't, I think it would need the caveat of we're not alone here on this planet, or that we're not alone, that we know there's life elsewhere, but we also know for sure that it has been here. I think we need to have that part.

Speaker 1:
[43:02] Oh, it's got to come with context. Not just, you know, yeah, we're not alone. There must be something out there. It's going to come with that. We're not alone and they've been visiting.

Speaker 2:
[43:10] That's what I thought you meant.

Speaker 1:
[43:11] We're not alone and we've got some bodies. We're not alone. There's been an incident, you know, fucking something happened last night at the White House. UFO turned up, went, stop it. And whatever that would entail. Iran, Strait of Hormuz argument, flying saucer goes, right, enough's enough. Open this up. And these diesels costing him an absolute fortune. Patreon and Apple is available, folks. So yeah, all of that kind of stuff. You know, something to happen that is unequivocal. We're not alone. And we're going to start rolling out all of that, because I think we're still a long way off that whole public being really on.

Speaker 2:
[43:54] You're right.

Speaker 1:
[43:54] I think the vast majority of your average member of the public believes there is something out there. I think then it starts to split down. Has it visited here? Yes or no? And then it tails off. But yeah, I think people are ready for that. I don't think people are ready tomorrow to see a UFO fly over the nations of every, the capital of every nation in the world. And I think people would freak out quite a bit. But I think it's a really easy way to get folks acclimatized to that pretty quick.

Speaker 2:
[44:23] I don't know that we'll ever be ready for that. That's the kind of thing where I don't think anyone can be. I mean, you and I are very open to this topic, obviously. And I tell myself all the time that I want to see that. I want that to happen. But when it actually does, I might be like...

Speaker 1:
[44:40] I would shit my pants, yeah.

Speaker 2:
[44:41] Yeah, right, right, right. It might be like...

Speaker 1:
[44:43] Probably, yeah.

Speaker 2:
[44:44] Shit my pants because of excitement, but maybe then the survival fear thing does kick in.

Speaker 1:
[44:50] Yeah, there's total fear of the unknown because you don't know.

Speaker 2:
[44:53] So unknown, yeah. Yeah, but I do want it.

Speaker 1:
[44:57] Yeah, I mean, I've said before, Dan, they might come out and go, right, we're Steve and Greer, we've been talking to him for a while. He's the guy that we want to catch up with and we go, okay, Greer was right. They might come out and completely rubbish all of that. They might be like, nah, that's all bullshit. Yeah, there's no mantis beings. That's all nonsense. That's not a thing. They might come down here and say, actually, we have not been visiting you for that long. It's been like five years. We don't know about these others. You know, that for me would be really interesting. That was not the idea of, you pull the gray out in the White House lawn and go, yep, thanks, so we're not alone. And they say, yeah, we don't know what those black triangles are. Those aren't ours. So do you know? Cause we don't. Again.

Speaker 2:
[45:40] I've heard you mention that on your show before and I love that idea. And I think that makes sense. I think there's probably a chance that, a chance anyway, that there's things visiting here that are not aware of each other. Although at that point, you must have the universe mapped out. I mean, we don't know how it works. We have no idea how it would work. But these are the things that once we get to a moment of disclosure, whatever it is, that's when the good questions start. Like you were talking about their society and Clinton and I talk about privately all the time. Like, what is their society like? What do they have? Entertainment. Do they have taste in clothes? Do they, are there different craft for different, like do they zip around in their own worlds in craft? Or do they just levitate? Do they go anywhere?

Speaker 1:
[46:26] Is there a hierarchy? Yeah, is there a hierarchy? Is there a structure? Is there downtime?

Speaker 2:
[46:29] Is there government?

Speaker 1:
[46:30] Is there sport? Yeah.

Speaker 2:
[46:31] Is there school? Like, are there parents? Are they born? I just, there's so many, so many amazing questions.

Speaker 1:
[46:39] And you know people will say, oh, they've evolved past all that. Well, why?

Speaker 2:
[46:43] Yeah, what makes you think that?

Speaker 1:
[46:44] Are we gonna get to a point as a species where, I don't know if you watch baseball or basketball or NFL or soccer.

Speaker 2:
[46:50] I watch baseball. Baseball is my favorite thing in the world, yeah.

Speaker 1:
[46:54] Are we gonna get to a day as a species where we go, do you know what? We've kind of outgrown this baseball thing. Yeah, we're just gonna stop. I don't know.

Speaker 2:
[47:05] I would love to, if we make it another 500 years or a thousand years on earth, I do wonder if we will have those kinds of things. It's impossible to imagine. If you look back 500 years ago here or 2000 years ago, I mean, it was an unrecognizable place. I imagine in another 500, but I can't imagine where we'll be.

Speaker 1:
[47:25] Do you know, just before we move on to some more questions here, I am watching The Man in the High Castle just now. I wasn't well about four weeks ago and done that thing where for a week, I was like, I need to find something to watch. I have not, have you heard of it before?

Speaker 2:
[47:39] I've heard of it, but I don't know what it is.

Speaker 1:
[47:41] It's like the Nazis and the Japanese won the Second World War. They basically got the bomb before the US did, so they drop it on Washington and they won the war. It's set in occupied US where the Japanese have San Francisco, California, West Coast area. There's a little neutral zone and then the Nazis have most of the East and they are like the power. And it's really interesting, there's these films that show the Allies winning the war in our timeline. I won't spoil how well that comes about. It's four series. I've really enjoyed it. I've powered through it in four weeks and I've got one episode left to watch of the fourth season. It finished six years ago. But in a recent episode, this isn't spoiler territory. They are in a cafe and it's set in the 60s. And this is in our timeline where a black man and woman approach the counter. Everyone in the cafe is white and they stop. And it's the whole, we'd like to pay for some food, nope, go round the back, I'll bring you food. And there's a whole, like that, that kind of, that whole racial tension heats up and you get the guys at the counter, we don't want your kind in here. The police come along, they arrest them. And I just said to my wife, that was only like 60 years ago. Like that was, that's not that long. And it's just like how different the world is, but also such a short period of time has elapsed and how much has changed and how much has happened to the point then even technologically where we were 60 years ago, 100 years ago, to where we're going to be with the advent now we have, AI is in our lives and is changing everything. I think we're at a point where most people now in a day, at some point we'll use AI in some way, shape or form, whether it's an LLM, whether it's something on their phones, whether it's checking stuff out, ChatGPT, Claude, co-pilot, whatever people use. I think a lot of offices now use it for software. People are just expected to use it. So it's changing us and it's changing us rapidly. And is this our next evolution? Is this going to be how we meet NHI? Who the fuck knows? Really interesting times. Listen, let's get through some more questions, Dan, because we're still to get through. I'm only going to get a couple of these and some of them are massive. So, where are we? So yeah, Scottish Trumpet Guy said, I think the term NHI came along at a very appropriate time in the evolution of the disclosure process. It allows almost everything that has sentience or consciousness to be labelled as one thing, regardless of whether they are related or not. Similarly, with UAP, there are, of course, ups and downs with these blanket terms, but it does allow humanity to address historical, religious and current extra slash ultra terrestrial from the same baseline. So again, NHI, for me, that's angels, demons, you're just following along the labels to that, which you've kind of alluded to, haven't you?

Speaker 2:
[50:39] Yeah, the NHI, go ahead, go ahead, please.

Speaker 1:
[50:44] No, no, no, I was going to move on in one bit, go on.

Speaker 2:
[50:48] I think the NHI label is mostly just to, for the sake of not letting people like Aero or whatever, hyperfixate on the word alien, extraterrestrial, whatever. It is, it's a catch-all, I think, so people can't catch you with specifics of language more so, which I think is brilliant. But the idea of it including AI and other things like that is fascinating. At a certain point, I think we're going to have to consider the fact that AI will be sentient, which I think it may have already happened at some point, but it's going to be a form of intelligence we need to acknowledge as something with sovereignty or something that has its own rights possibly. But it is changing very, very quickly.

Speaker 1:
[51:41] Yeah, massively. Stuart says, I'm a bit sick of all the illusions and suggestions and obfuscations. It's not helping. Just spit it out and let us decide for ourselves. Whoever told them was told by someone else who interpreted something they read somewhere. I think we're a bit past this, especially if there's hard evidence in the shed. What do you think of that?

Speaker 2:
[52:03] That's where I'm at. Of course, I feel that way. But there's so much more than just spilling the beans. Especially when we're talking about 80 plus years, if not longer, of so many laws being broken, and people being killed, and careers being destroyed, and technology is hidden from society possibly it really could be a life-changing thing. It's a horrible thing. And I've been pretty on board with this idea of amnesty for people that have been through this. I've been pretty vocal about I'd be okay with amnesty for people that have hidden this stuff or worked on projects. And then recently, just hearing the kind of stuff that has gone on with whistleblowers, past and present, I think I've changed my mind. I think that there is some really, really horrible things that are going on behind the scenes that are not really forgivable things. And even like, I was on board with amnesty even for people that had committed murders, because I think it's, would be for the betterment of civilization and humanity. But it's just, some of it is so awful that maybe it's not worth the blanket amnesty. What do you feel about the amnesty thing?

Speaker 1:
[53:27] I don't think you'll find out the names or identities of those people who have committed those crimes anyway. I think it would be high level, you know, Jack Nicholson, you can't handle the truth levels of officiating. That's true. Where people made decisions for good or for bad. And yeah, I honestly think even that the amnesty thing, this is for me such a, I don't know if that's going to be controversial or not. Some people will disagree with this. I think it's too blue sky thinking that the UFO community believe there's going to be some kind of South African apartheid style, you know, court around this and people will be held to account. As in when the general public realize and are told, we are not alone, there is NHI, aliens are real, whatever it is, the general public aren't turning around and going, right, let's start holding cases for people who cover this up.

Speaker 2:
[54:27] Right.

Speaker 1:
[54:27] It's too big, it's too life changing from that point on. That becomes for 99.9% of people, it doesn't matter anymore. The new reality is, we aren't alone, we're not top of the food chain, there's going to be new technologies, maybe new medicines, maybe new wars to fight. You know, we don't know if we have to protect ourselves. Something turns up and goes, by the way, we're here to warn you, something's coming that isn't good. You know, we don't know. So, whatever happens, the last thing I think on most people's mind, especially the general public, is going to be what general covered this up back in Roswell, because his great rise that he jailed is not going to happen. Not a chance, it's too big a story. So, nah.

Speaker 2:
[55:12] It's a great point. That's a really great point. I think you're spot on. And if anything, that might, if I were those people that would be implicated, I would be pushing for full disclosure at that point, because at least it will make so much noise that people won't be asking the questions like you just said. It's kind of a good strategy in a weird way. And for the people that are most implicated.

Speaker 1:
[55:34] And we're going to get to talking in a minute about those scientists, right? But do you think the folks pulling the triggers on these incidents are still going to be around as and when that time comes either, or are those dispensable assets?

Speaker 2:
[55:49] What do you mean?

Speaker 1:
[55:51] So like, it's not, for example, I'm thinking like one of the highest up guys in the US military. Pete Hegseth is like the Secretary of Defense slash war.

Speaker 2:
[56:00] Yeah.

Speaker 1:
[56:00] He's not going, and some people might not believe this. He's not going around pulling the triggers on scientists, right? Other people do that. Other people that are uniformless, nameless.

Speaker 2:
[56:13] We don't know their names, yes.

Speaker 1:
[56:15] Almost Mission Impossible style, you don't exist, right? Those are the folks doing that. So do you think those folks are going to be around to be hauled up in front of a jury?

Speaker 2:
[56:27] Will they be around? Yes.

Speaker 1:
[56:29] Do they have social security numbers?

Speaker 2:
[56:32] I don't know. And also, I worry that most of the disappearing stuff may not be happening from connections to the US government. I think it probably is happening more with defense contractors. I think that's probably where most of the nastiness might be coming from. And again, those people, I don't think, you make a point about if names will come out. Names will not come out officially, but if there's people that know those names who are in the general public or whistleblowers who have no names, who might feel more comfortable at some point, those names might come out that way. Maybe not necessarily from the government, but from people that know better.

Speaker 1:
[57:16] Yeah, I don't think you even find those names, all those people. Honestly, it just seems such a right or wrong, like a moot point that people won't care. There won't be time for it in all of this. There's aliens, but right, we've got to hold people accountable. Someone on X will want that and no doubt there'll be an X space on it, I'm sure, and 55 people will be in there shouting at each other and co-hosting and speaking. Most of us won't bother because there's a new reality.

Speaker 2:
[57:46] Sure. I guess it also depends on who's in charge, in which countries and which governments and which leaders want to prosecute or how far they want to take it. I mean, Brazil might have a different opinion of who to hold accountable than the US does, and they might actually prosecute somebody. I don't know. I think it's going to be a case to case thing.

Speaker 1:
[58:08] Do you think leaders at that point are going to want to look back and learn the entire history of these cover-ups and what may or may not have gone on? Or are you then writing a new history going forward of this is how it's like? You could almost reset calendars at that point. We currently are still 2026, we're 2026 years after Jesus was born. Is that right?

Speaker 2:
[58:34] Born or died?

Speaker 1:
[58:36] Born or died. Yeah. A, D, Anno Domini, whenever it was. We're living off of that calendar here. There could be an argument that as and when you find out 8th of July 2026, you reset everything to a new calendar because that was the first day we learned that aliens are real. Because that is a whole new way of our species living.

Speaker 2:
[58:56] Sure. A new knowledge, Andy.

Speaker 1:
[58:58] A new knowledge. A new drone show. A new drone show. Listen, we touched on the science. Yeah, go on, round up on that and then we'll get to the scientist stuff because you touched on it.

Speaker 2:
[59:08] No, that's an interesting point of does, how much does our sense of history and ourselves change the moment that that happens? I don't know that we'll change the calendar, but it will definitely be a turning point in history and turning point in sciences and humanity for sure. It'll be fascinating. It's really fascinating. Yeah.

Speaker 1:
[59:33] You touched on the scientist stuff, right? And we're gonna touch on this here because I didn't think we'd still be going 50 minutes just on the first news story. We'll get to more of the-

Speaker 2:
[59:42] Let's keep going.

Speaker 1:
[59:42] We'll give you enough stuff another time, yeah. And there's so much to get through. The missing scientists, again, folks, very briefly, because some of you will be really well versed in this now, others not so much. That's all started in the news, especially for the UFO folks with General Neal McCasland going missing. That was back in February. So we're nearly two months on. McCasland has been missing now. He was allegedly the general named in the WikiLeaks documents that Tom DeLong had been advised by on the UFO topic and he talked about. So he goes missing. He has very little on him in terms of possessions, clothing, anything like that just disappears one day without a trace. His poor wife is dealing with that. But then it comes out and he's alleged to have all these, and he will have all these secrets around classified technologies, information, maybe, maybe not to do with aliens or UFOs. I think you're going to probably touch on that, Dan. But he is a guy who is extremely knowledgeable, and if you were China, Russia, a foreign asset, some kind of private entity, he would be the kind of guy you would want to pick his brains to be really polite around what he knows about US intelligence secrets and all that kind of stuff. So him going missing is a worry. We've now got to the point two months after that, where there are now 11 scientists, engineers of that ilk, linked to various exotic projects, propulsion projects, weapon systems, and it's being written about, it's being tweeted about. I'm going to be really wary and careful on this because there are people here who, some of which haven't ever turned up, some of which were found to be no longer alive. People are speculating on how that happened. Again, it's that old gunshot wounds in the back of their head, but they've done it themselves, etc. There are families. For example, Amy Eskridge is a name people may or may not know. I don't know if you want to touch on that one, Dan. But her father, she is one of those scientists who worked alongside. It can be linked to McHaslin's company. Her father's online saying, look, I don't want my daughter's memory dragged through the mud and related to the UFO topic and aliens. This is a bunch of nonsense. She had issues and I think there is an element of you have to respect that. And people are going a little bit too far for me on this. And wanting to do that thing that a few folks have mentioned here before where because it doesn't fit your narrative or you want it to fit your narrative, you find a way to build it in. There may be something here that is quite strange. But Dan, I think you've kind of alluded to this. Is your way of thinking with a situation that people are looking to potentially fit puzzle pieces here that aren't necessarily from the same jigsaw?

Speaker 2:
[62:38] Oh, absolutely. And I think it's something that humans try to do. If something's confusing, we try to find a way for things to make sense. And also we live in a day and age where we love scandal, we love death, and we love crime, and we love secrets and all that kind of stuff. That doesn't mean that stuff doesn't happen, but I think people do make connections where there isn't connections. And the bottom line is that there are important, talented, knowledgeable people that are dying and disappearing. That is a fact, and that is bizarre. Do I think that all 11 cases are connected? Absolutely not. But if two of them are connected, that's a major story. If just two are connected, that's a huge thing. And with Amy especially, obviously, I did not know Amy, but I have a few friends that did know her personally, and I've had these conversations of what was her deal. And I am comfortable with the idea that she was indeed deeply into anti-gravitics and that kind of, very important world-changing technology. And I think she had figured some stuff out and others have as well. And I think that would make her a target to some people, but I also believe that she had some serious struggles. And some, I don't know if it was mental health problems or some kind of breakdown, but I think it's-

Speaker 1:
[64:12] The burden of genius, like having that level of intellect.

Speaker 2:
[64:16] That or it could be maybe she did get threats. I mean, I posted a video on Twitter the other day that came from a longer presentation that she had done in 2019 on antigravity. And she's doing this talk and someone in the crowd yells out, you know, what about innovators that are afraid of disappearing? And she goes, well, that's definitely an issue. And she suggested that, you know, sometimes that's why working in the public and being public can be safer in that case. And another guy in the room says, just because it's public doesn't mean that you won't disappear. And I think that's a pretty poignant point, a very, very important point. So I think it's possible for someone to both be a target for an attack or to be taken or to be taken out. And then someone can also just decide to end it themselves. I think both things are possible. And I don't know what her case is, but the people that I've talked to that know her, I think are relatively comfortable with the idea that she chose this on her own. I don't know. There could be more to it than that. I mean, it's definitely strange, but that's, I just, I can't speculate further. I don't know.

Speaker 1:
[65:38] Yeah. Another name that was linked very recently, and this was brought by a few folks on the YouTube comments. The Daily Mail, the US version, had pointed another suspicious death of a whistleblower or potential whistleblower, Matthew James Sullivan, 39 years old, died May 12th, 2024, reportedly taking his own life. Former US Air Force intelligence officer, he worked on DARPA projects. Allegedly, he and David Grush had been communicating about coming out and testifying, as David Grush has. It was all being arranged when unexpectedly he died before he could testify in a whistleblower hearing about UFOs. Eric Burleson himself has come forward and this is now going up the chain. This is now being picked up by major outlets in the United States. It's now looking like, I think, Burleson's comments where they have to literally wrestle the intelligence services to the ground on this. That looks like a potential whistleblower coming forward. I made the point in my notes that we always say, and I say we, I mean, general UFO community, keyboard warriors, we want first-hand legacy witnesses coming forward. What we've had and we've been fortunate is folks coming forward telling us testimony, telling us stories, telling us what they have seen and heard. We've not yet had someone come forward and say, I've worked on the craft. Other than maybe Bob Lazar, but that story I think has to stand out on its own because of the timeline. Let's talk about where we are right now. So is this proof of how dangerous it actually is for the people we want to see? So the demand we have on, we want the scientists dragged out of Area 51, out of S4, put in front of a stand and, okay, tell us what you work on and the ones that can go, yeah, I've dissected an alien being. Yeah, I work on this propulsion system from a craft that crashed from space. We've had it for 50 years and it's located at seven floors under the desert. We want those types of folks standing up and speaking publicly. But these seem to be, if we're looking at some of these missing persons cases and deaths, if these are indeed the people that are working on those things, does that not point to the actual real life extreme danger? And that it's not just as easy for all of us to demand, we want you in front of a witness stand. Because like you say, just because you're public, doesn't mean you won't disappear. And General Neil McCasland, I think is a great example of, he just disappeared.

Speaker 2:
[68:17] Yeah. And so did the Monica Reza woman. She disappeared on a hike. Like there were people-

Speaker 1:
[68:23] She was eight months before McCasland. Similar area, similar hike.

Speaker 2:
[68:26] Yeah, something like that. But she was on a hike with, from what I understand, she was on a hike with people. She was in the back and then she was just gone.

Speaker 1:
[68:36] Someone looked away, looked around and she wasn't there.

Speaker 2:
[68:40] That's craziness. But to your point, I think, is it proof of that? I don't know if it's proof of that, but it definitely points to another possibility of nefarious actions happening. And it's my understanding from the very little information that we have about Mr. Sullivan, is that he was a hands-on, like touch the thing, worked on the thing guy. It sounds like he is one of the guys that we're been talking about, hoping to hear from for, since, since Lazarus, probably. We want more of those guys. And if he was, and I do understand that no one in his world accepts the fact that he took himself, that he, you know, killed himself. They all think that's complete bullshit. So I have to kind of believe that. And it just seems like a warning to others that might want to talk. And I know that there, there's another whistleblower who, who had a very, very mysterious death that, I don't know if that story will come out or not, but this, this is a little bit of a theme of the last, you know, three or four years. And it is, I think it is trying to send a message and I hope it doesn't work, but you know, there's a, there's a huge risk to working on these things and obviously a bigger risk to speaking, which again makes me just so proud of the people that have come forward and truly risked everything. And some have lost a bunch just to, just to kind of let the public know what they're aware of. But there's clearly dangers, clearly, clearly dangers.

Speaker 1:
[70:20] Does it make you view any of the folks who have come forward any differently? In other words, how do I word it? That not that they're not important enough, but that they managed to get through the system and come forward. Is it that their stories were similar to some of the videos we've had? That they're just, and I'm going to use boring quote unquote enough to make it through, because they're not that dangerous in terms of what they know and what they've been exposed to. Whereas some of these scientists like you see are literal first hand folks, is it a case that makes you look and go, huh, so are you telling the truth? Is this misinformation? Are you being put in a position to think you're telling the truth and you aren't, but it serves a greater purpose for those keeping the secrets. It just makes me think that it's, so it does seem there is a real danger to life for some folks. When you even look at what Grush went through with the PTSD, with the medical records appearing within 24 hours of a FOIA request, you know, all that stuff. Yet there's other folks who have managed to come out and at least publicly we've not heard it being that difficult.

Speaker 2:
[71:36] Publicly, yes. I think that there's more than one person that has testified that is a lot more important than people realize, who might have more experience than people realize. And I think that those people are just as, could be just as much targets as the people that have been taken out so far. And I don't know, I don't get the rhyme or reason. I don't know why those people haven't had more consequences. The people that have spoken, whether it's Lou or Fravor or Dylan Borland or Jeff Nussitelli, any of them, I feel that could be easy targets. And I feel like taking one of them would send a strong message. But maybe taking out someone that all these guys know is a more cruel way to threaten people, maybe. Because I think, I believe that Matt Sullivan was known to these guys who have testified.

Speaker 1:
[72:36] Do you think he was one of Crush's 40 witnesses?

Speaker 2:
[72:40] Isn't that the word? I have not heard that, but I think I've read that just on Twitter.

Speaker 1:
[72:45] I genuinely have not seen or read that, I'm just presuming.

Speaker 2:
[72:48] I wouldn't be surprised, but I don't know, I have no idea. I have no idea. I don't even want to, actually, I wouldn't even speculate, I don't know. But it does sound like he was a hands on guy. Will that slow things down? It might. Again, I hope not, but it's a super unfortunate and shitty thing that is clearly happening. And that one, I'm more comfortable talking about like him than I am Amy Eskridge, as far as nefarious stuff. Because by all accounts, this guy wouldn't have done that.

Speaker 1:
[73:25] Yeah, there was no signs of it.

Speaker 2:
[73:27] But again, I don't know if you've lost anybody in your life that way. But very often when people kind of decide that they want to end their own life, so many people will be like, we had no idea. We had no idea. So I guess at the end of the day, you really never know. But this one seems like there's a lot more pointers to, this was shady.

Speaker 1:
[73:49] Yeah, I got like a not a close family member, but they were actually a footballer. People could look up my surname and find out the guy's name. I only ever met him once when I was younger. He was at an event the night before, about my age, late 30s, early 40s, at a charity event telling everyone about a new initiative he was working on. It was going to be youth football, how much he was looking forward to it, all the plans for it. And the next day his wife found him in the garage.

Speaker 2:
[74:17] That's what I mean.

Speaker 1:
[74:18] You don't know.

Speaker 2:
[74:19] You just don't know. I think all of us, our closest friends, our family members, our spouses, you think you know someone as well as possible, but it makes you wonder maybe we really never really know anybody. You just never know. You never know what someone's going through. And it could be a spur of the moment decision. I mean, I don't know. It's a sad thing all around, no matter what.

Speaker 1:
[74:43] What I'll say to folks is, they want more information on this. I'm not looking to really, for multiple reasons, dig too much into it because I think there's so many spurious links to what you're seeing now, Dan. I think some tabloids are also picking up and running with stories that aren't necessarily there. And they're looking for sensationalism in a very delicate area. Not that there isn't some really strange coincidences at least with this. And like you see, there very likely could be some strong links that point to something more nefarious going on. But Pavel from Seco Activo has just done... We've not seen it because it literally was live as we were recording. A bit of a deep dive into the Amy Eskridge story and the deeper surroundings around that. So folks should go and check that one out over on Pavel's channel. I believe it's finished now. So by the time this comes out, it's going to be tomorrow anyway. Go and check that one out. Pavel will have done his work there on that. And so we will keep an eye on that one, Dan. But move on to the last couple of stories I want to touch on, folks. Kind of nicer ones to talk about, to be honest. The first one I'm going to touch on is Disclosure Day. The Steven Spielberg movie is around seven or eight weeks away from release now. And as we came on to record, a TV spot has leaked that actually does have a little bit of new footage in it, but we'll get to that in a second. So just a few days ago, Steven Spielberg appeared for the first time in his career, I believe, at Comic Con, which is crazy thinking of his first time. I believe it's his first time on stage at Comic Con. And I read that in one of the articles, one of the big sites. So I think I've got that right. He showed five minutes of exclusive footage. Most of it is what we've seen in the trailers. However, they did show the beings apparently, none of this is leaked online yet. He said that there's more truth than fiction, and that the trailers that have been released do not show any of the final third of the movie. I love that. Yeah, I'm a huge fan of that. How many movies do you go and see these days where basically the film is in the trailer? Even the end scene sometimes, and you're like, this looks like how it finishes, and it's there. So yeah, none of the final third is in the trailer, and I love that. So here's what is being reported. So very, very mild spoilers here, folks, for what's going to be in the trailers. So it says here, the final shot of the preview zoomed in on the eye of the deer, and that was one of the posters that have advertised the film. And it says here, presumably the same deer in the previous trailers. And as the camera moves across the creature's face, it's revealed to be a large, somewhat humanoid alien, or at least something that looks like an alien. So alluding to these animals, I don't know, shape-shifting or projecting an image that isn't there, but we do see some kind of weird, we see at one point a little girl walking towards the house, and she's got like a deer beside her and another animal. Is that a projection? And it's actually these little aliens taking her, you know, is that in her mind?

Speaker 2:
[77:46] Sure. Or screen memories or something?

Speaker 1:
[77:50] Yeah, something like that. And it's just, yeah, that could be a really good shot, the kind of screen memory that it's happened, but she remembers it this way. But actually, I even wonder, I don't even know if this will work out, but is the little girl actually Emily Blunt's character? But from her past, so she was visited at the field, doesn't remember it, and that's why she's contacted later life. So she remembers all these animals as a kid, but actually it was alien beings. And, you know, so maybe it's something like that. It says here- I like that, by the way. At one point, there's a nighttime shot in which multiple backlit human figures hold umbrellas over, get ready, little humanoid creatures that appear to be aliens. They look a lot like the smaller aliens at the end of Close Encounters of the Third Kind. A later shot shows a thin non-human hand touching a young child's face as they lie on an operating table. Now, on the trailer that just leaked online, and it looks like a leaked TV spot, the two- it's like a 30 second TV spot. The two very, very brief glimpses that look new is, one, there seems to be like a fighter, like a jet fighter in the cockpit, and I mean, it's like half a second, but it seems to be chasing a huge black triangle that has some kind of huge light source behind it. It looks very strange, whatever it is, but it looks like it's fighting an alien craft of some sort in the sky. The other is, it may even be the same shot where there's like a woman, I can't remember if it's Emily Blunt or not, or a young girl, lying on one of those white background rooms. It's got all those kind of patches stuck to them with the wires that we've seen in the other trailers. And the long, unmistakably thin, three-fingered hand comes up and goes on the face. That lasts about a second, so we get a good glimpse of it. So we are now seeing some more of disclosure day. It's definitely aliens. There's definitely huge UFOs coming out the sky, folks. There's definitely some kind of fighting scene. Maybe screen memories, maybe abductions.

Speaker 2:
[79:54] Hybrids.

Speaker 1:
[79:55] There's hybrids definitely as part of it. It looks like there seems to be some kind of invisible car at some point in one of the trailers. You can see it skidding when the rain goes off it, unless they've removed something, but I think it looks like invisible. I'm really excited for this movie, really excited for it. What about yourself, Dan?

Speaker 2:
[80:12] Oh, I cannot wait. The first movie I saw as a kid was ET. That's the first movie I ever saw in the theater. Yeah, that's my number one. And you ask pretty much anybody, what's the best UFO movie ever made? And without missing a beat, Close Encounters is almost every... Well, I know you're an Independence Day kind of guy. I am. Close Encounters is across the board, the usual favorite. And it feels to me like Spielberg is trying to match or top Close Encounters. And I also love the speculation that they are tied together. That it's like a spiritual sequel. Yeah. And now that you mentioned the beings in it and how they look similar to the Close Encounters ones, I do wonder if that might be part of it. That would be a pretty amazing thing if that were the case. But I'm so excited about it. I'm gonna be, actually I'm gonna be in the UK when it comes out and I'm gonna go to the movies with Xander from Night Shift. We're gonna go to the movies together on a day off on tour and watch it. And I can't wait. I can't wait to see this new footage of the triangle and the being. But I also wonder if Colin Firth's character in the movie, he reminds me a lot of like a Kit Green type guy. Of like just the weird scientist who has kind of a shady background who, you know, I don't know, I have very strong Kit Green vibes.

Speaker 1:
[81:44] Looks like he could be a bad guy really obviously, but as there are more to it than that, he actually might not be a bad guy. Yeah, sure. It seems quite obvious he's like the bad guy in the film. But as there may be more to it than that, it could be complicated and he's actually doing something for reasons that might seem nefarious, but actually it's...

Speaker 2:
[82:06] Like beings.

Speaker 1:
[82:06] He won't know. Yeah.

Speaker 2:
[82:08] Right.

Speaker 1:
[82:08] Yep. 100%. Yeah. So, but yeah, it looks really interesting. A lot of cool ideas. I will be amazed if this isn't good. And I'm the first one to be let down by this kind of stuff. And I really like you see, I try and keep my expectations low with anything like this to not be disappointed. But I'm really getting my hopes up that I'm going to come away from this saying this is like a top five film of all time for me. You know, I love that idea. This overtakes Independence Day for me just from the trailers.

Speaker 2:
[82:37] Come on. It's huge.

Speaker 1:
[82:38] Yeah.

Speaker 2:
[82:39] What a statement from Andrew McGrillen.

Speaker 1:
[82:41] Yeah. Are we going to get like a moment that folks, you know, everyone says like scariest moment in a UFO movie when the alien and signs walks past the birthday party window in Brazil? Like is this going to have one of those moments? And does it just open up hybrids, different ways of thinking to the population? I'm very, very excited for this one, folks. Yeah. Look forward to that.

Speaker 2:
[83:05] I would say before we move on, you talk about the scariest alien moment in a movie. The signs walk is great, but the communion thing behind the door, when the gray pops out from behind the door, that scared the shit out of me as a kid. You know what we're talking about when it's kind of peering behind the door?

Speaker 1:
[83:24] Yep. Do you know, I'll tell you what terrified me as a kid. The McPherson tapes, an alien abduction.

Speaker 2:
[83:35] The found footage thing.

Speaker 1:
[83:37] Yeah. Yeah. I've been fortunate to interview the director of that on the podcast, Dean Aliotto before. Yeah. Brilliant to catch up on that. But we watched that. Me and my mate one night were waiting on a WWF pay-per-view starting back in the day. Actually, it would have been WWE at the time because it was after 2002, but it would be 2004. Anyway.

Speaker 2:
[83:58] It's still WWF to me, buddy, for the rest of my life.

Speaker 1:
[84:01] Yeah, it should still be. Yeah. Screw the pandas. And yeah, we were going through the movie channels and it was like whatever was on Sky at the time. And it was that, but again, kind of before, it was before social media and all that kind of stuff and internet being bang right in front of you all the time. And this thing was on and it was like, it was intersplicit with, I'm sure Rick Doty is one of the talking heads. I can't remember. But there's people talking during it. And coming up, there's like a different version of the film. And as if, as if it's real. And but there's one scene where they go into one of the rooms. And it's a dark room, but the camera is pointing out into the hallway, which is lit. And I think it's a kid gets put in the room or one of the adults. And the door slams shut. But just as the door begins to close, you see the gray standing behind it. So you only catch it with the light from the hallway for like a brief second. The best. And it's like bang, ah. And it's just, oh, that gave me chills as a kid. But yeah, some really cool moments on that. And yeah, I'm just really, really excited for Disclosure Day. And I think that could be big publicly for the topic. And I think if you're listening to this or watching this after, in the future, after the 12th of June, I hope the movie ignites the public's imagination and your friends and people will say to you, have you seen Disclosure Day? Have you seen Spielberg's new movie? What's it all about? And just introduce them to the conversation in a different way. And I think maybe you'll get more people on board because I think that could be really, really important with all this kind of stuff. So yeah.

Speaker 2:
[85:36] The timing is great. The timing is really great for everything. As our friend Darren says, a point of convergence. Things are kind of coming together at a nice time. And it does feel that way. And Spielberg has a, he has a knack for catching a moment and telling just a beautiful story. And I have no doubt it's going to be very good. But I think like you, I'm hoping that it's great. I'm hoping it's the kind of movie where I go see it in the theater two or three times. That's my hope. And it sounds like it's going to deliver in a lot of senses for people that are fan of the topic and people that are new to it.

Speaker 1:
[86:16] Well, some mild breaking news, which proves our point there. That trailer has now been removed from the internet, even though it was a leak and people speculated it might not be real. The media has been disabled in response to a report by the copyright owner. So the disclosure day people have taken it down. So it was clearly real anyway. It wasn't AI. So yeah, that trailer's legit. So yeah, good to know. We'll finish up on this one. Friend of yours and I'd like to say kind of friend of mine.

Speaker 2:
[86:46] He loves you.

Speaker 1:
[86:48] Well, who doesn't? That's right. Plenty of folks. But Jeremy Corbell has a documentary due out a couple of weeks before Spielberg's movie that will rival, I'm sure the box office numbers of Disclosure Day.

Speaker 2:
[87:02] No doubt.

Speaker 1:
[87:03] Sleeping Dog. This is a documentary about Jeremy Corbell. The trailer dropped the other week. It very much focuses on himself as a kid, growing up, who Jeremy Corbell is. That'll be a really interesting look. Because I think, do you know what? I'm really glad I've got you on for this because I was going to talk about it with whoever I was on or myself. But given your close proximity to Jeremy, I'll be really honest, and I always am with Jeremy when he's on the podcast. And I don't think I'm spoiling it. I'm hoping he's coming on around the six year anniversary of the podcast to promote the documentary but be my guest anyway. Jeremy gets a lot of shit from a lot of sides of the UFO debate and beyond. Some folks love him, some folks despise him, and he's got everything in the middle as well. But like he says, praise and blame, it's all the same. So, what's your take on Jeremy as a person and what this documentary is going to show people?

Speaker 2:
[88:02] I'm really glad you asked. I've seen the film, I saw it a month or two ago, and I've known Jeremy for close to 10 years now. And I get what you're saying, you're right, he gets a lot of shit. And I understand why. He's a vocal, a very vocal, confident guy, comfortable on camera, in his documentaries. He's in his own documentaries quite a bit, and I know that's bothered people before. And I understand it, but at the same time, knowing him personally and talking to him a lot, not on camera and stuff, he's the same kind of guy. And his sincerity and his push for the truth of this, to me anyway, is so, like I said, it's so sincere. It's very valid. He cares about it very, very much. It's very important to him. And this film, which is directed by Michael Lazovsky, who is actually the weaponized producer, the man who produces the weaponized podcast. First time filmmaker, brilliant guy. He made a beautiful film. I think the intention initially was to just kind of capture who Jeremy is when he's not doing this kind of thing with UFOs and like what his life was like growing up. And there is a lot of that in the film, but as they were filming, things just kind of changed and it does kind of become, it is a UFO documentary in many ways. And there are a couple things in that film that I cannot wait to talk about when the film comes out. Subtle things, things that are not focal points of the film, but some really cool, deliberate things that are in there. But I'm looking forward to the general public seeing Jeremy more for like who he is when he's not the UFO guy. Because he's a fantastic son, he's a loving husband, he loves his dogs, he loves his dogs.

Speaker 1:
[90:10] I've got several videos he sent me when I've sent him a text message about something and he'll send me back. Got the dogs in the car like...

Speaker 2:
[90:17] Of course.

Speaker 1:
[90:18] Yeah. You get a read on people, don't you?

Speaker 2:
[90:21] Yeah, yeah, yeah. You have to. And sincerely, he is a really, really great, considerate human being who cares very much about this. And he is fearless. People can criticize him all they want, but the bottom line is you have a hard time finding someone who has done more for the topic publicly. Like these hearings that have happened since 2023, starting with Grush, Fravor and Graves, would not have happened without Jeremy. And that is an absolute fact. It is a fact. Him and George both. I mean, obviously George is the goat, but Jeremy works tirelessly every single day on educating you and me and whoever wants to hear it. And he gets called a grifter all the time. If you guys knew how little money is in this topic, even for kind of the bigger guys, you'd laugh. He's not getting rich. No one's really getting rich, except for a couple of them may be getting rich, but Jeremy's not getting rich.

Speaker 1:
[91:33] Me, myself, Joe Rogan, other than that, yeah.

Speaker 2:
[91:38] You and Joe, it's pretty much, everyone knows that hand in hand.

Speaker 1:
[91:40] Me and my mate Joe, yeah.

Speaker 2:
[91:41] That's right. But the film is beautiful. It's beautifully shot. It's fascinating. You see a lot of him as a younger man and what kind of drives him. And it's emotional. I mean, I cried two or three times during it. There's some stuff, I'm not gonna spoil anything, but there's some heavy moments in there where you realize that people are human beings and that this topic can be dangerous, even for folks like him. You can see in the trailer, there's some clear threats that he's gotten in the trailer. And that's not all of them. He's gotten a lot of them, but he keeps going. I can't wait for you to see it. I can't wait to talk to you about it. And I'm very proud of him for allowing himself to be vulnerable enough to have that made. I know he was not excited about it. And Michael Luzzofsky made a beautiful film that I think is worth a watch more than once.

Speaker 1:
[92:40] Well, I'll just say two things on it. One, I don't cry. So there's that. And two, I accept when my dog died. Yeah, that was the last time I cried. In about 10 years was my dog. Not my wedding, not the birth of the kids. No, just the dog.

Speaker 2:
[92:56] Really? You're not a crier? No.

Speaker 1:
[92:59] My wife was amazed when she saw it. And yeah, the second one would be really honestly, whenever I speak to people, friends, colleagues, all that kind of stuff over the last three, four, five years doing the podcast, if I speak to people outside of the UFO circle, the three names, not always by name, but they'll allude to someone. They'll say, they'll know Bob Lazar, they'll know Stephen Greer, and the third name is Corbell.

Speaker 2:
[93:28] Really?

Speaker 1:
[93:29] Because they'll know either the Netflix documentaries or the Rogan appearances. Greer, they know the history of the documentaries, and Lazar, they know him as the guy who worked on The Flying Saucers. Right. They don't mention DeLong, they don't mention Elizondo, Mellon, Gary Nolan, your normal members of the public. George Knapp, maybe Knapp would be fourth on the list then. But I think Corbell's got age on his side with that one. That I said a long time ago and I don't mean this in a detrimental way. I don't know if I've said this to Jeremy before and I don't know how he would take it. You can maybe tell me. If tomorrow we get the official disclosure from whoever, I could see him being the face of UFOs for TMZ. I don't see Jeremy Corbell being the guy for the name your serious news program anchoring a show for half an hour, 60 minutes. But a TMZ organization which is big, charismatic, in your face, infotainment, they can speak to the younger generation, millennials, Gen Zs, that kind of mash of an audience. Maybe like that Rogan audience probably. I always see Jeremy being that guy who can, at the flick of a switch, you can turn it on, it can do his 12 noon hype, it can bang it out, he seems so enthusiastic, and a lot of that rubs some people up the wrong way.

Speaker 2:
[95:03] Sure.

Speaker 1:
[95:04] I get that because there's people who just I don't like, or we're all like that though, there's people that you just don't take to, and they might be nice people. They might be dickheads. There's also people that I think are absolute dickheads, and they go, I quite like them, I quite like their style, I quite like this about what they do. We're all different when it comes to that. But yeah, I always think Jeremy is one of the three names that people will say, that guy. And that, I think, speaks volumes. He, and this goes for Greer, who you know I'm not the biggest fan of. He has a huge audience. He has quite a specific audience in the UFO topic as well. And I think that you can either completely try and demonize him for whatever he's built, or you can appreciate that he speaks to that element of the audience and hope he uses it the right way. And I say the same thing about Stephen Greer. He's got a huge audience. I think there's elements, though, where he abuses that power. That's a topic for a different day. But you just hope that he presents this topic in the right way. And he is an on-ramp. Corbell is an on-ramp for this topic for people. Fresh off the high seas of the general public, they've landed on the shore of the UFO world, and they've come off the Corbell boat. And it's his bridge that brings them on and goes, guys, in you come. Come and listen to others from another mother. Come and listen to That UFO Podcast. Go and read Liberation Times. Go and check out the Seco Activo. I'm just telling you what it means to be human. Somewhere in the skies, all these different podcasts, blogs, ex-accounts, right? Go and check all these out. But they've found them through that person. And I think he has one of those points that people get involved in the topic. What happens from then on in is up to that individual person. But I think what he's done, the fact that NAP has done so much with him, says a lot. I'm looking forward to this. I think it will give us a fascinating insight into Jeremy. But I do hope there's more than 80% of it is UFO centric. Otherwise, people will slate it just because of that.

Speaker 2:
[97:11] It's mixed in very well. It's very well done. And if you want to watch it to learn about Jeremy, you'll be happy. If you want to watch it for the UFO stuff, you'll be very happy.

Speaker 1:
[97:24] Cool. And he alludes in the trailer to I've kept a secret for 11 years and all that kind of stuff. So he gave a little bit of a teaser in there that he might be spilling. Now, is Jeremy Corbell going to come out and tell us the smoking gun piece of evidence? No. I said no documentary in history will ever reveal the great truth of the UFO topic because anything like that would be on the news within hours for hundreds of thousands, if not millions of dollars. So that's unfair to hold any documentary by anyone to that standard. So yeah, although Age of Disclosure, I think would claim to have blown the doors wide open, which I think is a little bit grandiose of Dan Farah and Co, to be honest.

Speaker 2:
[98:08] But a little bit. I think the movie was good. I thought it was really good actually. But is it the end all be all? It's not, but it did a lot. It's a better documentary than I made or that you made. So, you know, at least for yourself.

Speaker 1:
[98:24] I'll have you know I'm working in a documentary. I am not. I am definitely not. But yeah, listen, Dan, we have gone almost two hours here. So it's been great having you on. I'd love to have you back on again. And because I really enjoy it. I will hold you to that, mate. And as much money as I earn, I don't pay or pay well. So yeah, it's good to always get the volunteers.

Speaker 2:
[98:48] Before we go, I just want to say, I've told you before, I just want to say to your audience as well, I've told you privately that I really think that you are, without a doubt, the best one doing this. I've told you before, I love your interview style. I love hearing you talk to people. Your style is great. You ask a question, you let someone answer. You don't interject. It's really awesome watching you work. And when I first got into the UFO podcast thing, yours is one of the first ones that I found. And it's still one of the only ones that I listen to every episode of. So thank you. And also your Patreon is fantastic. All the extra stuff is, it's worth it. And I get a lot from it. So thank you for all that you do. And it's really awesome to be here. It's, I'm a fan of yours. So this is very cool.

Speaker 1:
[99:37] No, cheers man. I never take compliments very well. It's far from perfect. People seem to enjoy it. And as long as that's the case, then wonderful. And I think there's space for a lot of different voices and stuff in this. And I think what you do, I asked you on because I like your voice and the way you speak and the fact you've been able to sit and talk to you off of very few points here is testament to that. So no, it was really enjoyable, mate. And obviously others from Another Mother is available on, I am guessing, all podcast platforms and YouTube as it normally is these days.

Speaker 2:
[100:10] Exactly. Yep, exactly. And I don't do weekly episodes. It's the kind of thing, I started that just because I love the topic. So you're not gonna see weekly episodes, you're not gonna see a lot, but when I'm inspired to do something, I'll do it and I give it my all. So you will see Jeremy and his director, Michael Laszowski on there very soon. And more stuff planned, but yeah, it's a lot of fun. And I do the Night Shift live stream every Friday with Clint and Xander and Pavel and Eric Schlimmer. And it's a blast. And hopefully we're gonna have you on very, very soon.

Speaker 1:
[100:48] Yeah, I think you guys are saving up to pay my fee, my appearance fee. So once you've got that together, cash unmarked bills, you need to send it over and I may appear. You never know folks, but listen, Dan, great speaking with you. Folks, if you enjoyed hearing from Dan, check out his stuff obviously. I was interviewed by Dan about the book Atlas of UFOs. You can check that one out as well and any of his other great interviews too. If you thought he was shit, let me know and I won't have him back on. If you enjoyed hearing from him, then maybe I'll do so again in the very near future. Yeah, but Dan, always a pleasure, mate. Thank you so much and thanks for listening.

Speaker 2:
[101:21] Take care, buddy.