transcript

Speaker 1:
[00:00] This show is sponsored by Deadly Nightmares, a podcast from ID. Picture yourself alone in the middle of nowhere, and somebody's following you. On Deadly Nightmares, a podcast from ID, you can hear real stories from ordinary people who were stalked by predators. On each episode, survivors describe the moment they sensed something was wrong and how they managed to escape. Then investigators and family members speak the details of each case sharing exactly what happened. These terrifying stories are the stuff of nightmares and they're all completely real. Listen to Deadly Nightmares wherever you get your podcasts. Welcome back to the 2020 True Crime Vault.

Speaker 2:
[00:55] We had a 74-year-old woman killed. A 35-year-old woman killed. Somebody needs to tell their story. The blood, a lot of blood all over the mother and the daughter.

Speaker 3:
[01:10] Angel and Mom were definitely a package team. Why would you murder two innocent people, two innocent women?

Speaker 4:
[01:15] We have an extremely psychotic, taunting killer who is taking pleasure in the homicide, who is taunting the police and writing this letter. About 12.30 or so, I got my knife and did the dirty deed. What a rush. Don't bother checking for prints or DNA. I'm wearing a body suit and gloves.

Speaker 2:
[01:36] And then a second letter came in.

Speaker 5:
[01:39] I write to you again. I must confess, I have done it for a second time.

Speaker 4:
[01:45] And we had a killer, apparently, who was traveling the country.

Speaker 5:
[01:49] The two letters sent by the killer made it pretty clear. He's not only one step ahead of the cops, but the murder spree isn't over. It starts on Friday night, the 4th of July weekend in Norfolk, Virginia. John Straft is a rookie officer working weekend shift.

Speaker 2:
[02:34] It's about 1.30 in the morning, patrolling the East Ocean View area, driving around. I was by myself doing normal routine patrols in that area. When I got the call from dispatch to respond to Friday Street.

Speaker 5:
[03:03] The victim keeps hanging up. The 911 operator keeps calling her back. This could be anything, an accident, a burglary. It is much worse.

Speaker 2:
[03:29] As I'm approaching the steps, I can see that the interior front door is open and the screen door is shut. And I can also see that there's a light on inside the residence.

Speaker 4:
[03:42] In front of him, there is the faded, sort of beige, oriental rug on the floor, and there is a lot of red, what he takes to be blood.

Speaker 2:
[04:03] I immediately drew my weapon, opened up the front door, walked in, asked the elderly female, is there anybody else in the residence? She said, my daughter is in the bedroom. I looked around. My main concern was, is there the person that did this?

Speaker 6:
[04:22] Is that person still in the residence?

Speaker 2:
[04:27] Definitely nervous, but your adrenaline takes over for the situation at hand.

Speaker 4:
[04:33] The lady that was apparently called 911, her name was later determined to be Vonda Goina, and she actually was 74 years of age.

Speaker 7:
[04:46] This woman has been stabbed multiple times, and her throat has been slit.

Speaker 2:
[04:50] So when the elderly female said, my daughter is in the bedroom, and I took a couple of steps towards the bedroom, walking down the hall.

Speaker 5:
[05:03] He knew what he was going to find, a second victim.

Speaker 2:
[05:10] I could see that she was clearly deceased, covered in blood, laying naked, facedown on the floor.

Speaker 4:
[05:15] She was later identified to be Angelique Guayena. She was 35 years old.

Speaker 8:
[05:21] Within the blood-soaked bed, you have this heartbreaking image of her childhood teddy bear, also soaked in blood. It is an image that is hard to forget. They've already checked Angel's room. Now, they have to go through every other room in the house, the closets, the kitchen, to make sure that the killer is not still inside.

Speaker 5:
[05:47] Detective Walter Whiteside arrives just minutes later.

Speaker 9:
[05:51] Unfortunately, I've been to a lot of homicide scenes. It was probably one of the worst. That room literally just looked like something out of the movies. It didn't even look real. Very rarely do you see a scene that gruesome. It was very clear that she had more stab wounds than what you could possibly count. I think it ended up being over 37, 38 stab wounds. There was just no rhyme or reason to why the amount of injuries were inflicted on the victims.

Speaker 5:
[06:27] He can still hear Vonda calling out for Angel.

Speaker 9:
[06:31] She kept asking me how Angel was doing, you know, if she was dead, if she was okay. It hits home. It does. You try to separate yourself from that, but I've got three children, so, you know, you do kind of empathize. You have to as a human. It's horrific.

Speaker 8:
[06:50] And he's starting to realize how many times that she's been stabbed. He knows at this point he doesn't have a lot of time.

Speaker 5:
[06:57] As EMTs work, Whiteside steps out to call a homicide detective. Who tells him what has to happen next?

Speaker 9:
[07:03] He asked me at that time to do a dying declaration.

Speaker 7:
[07:07] So a dying declaration is a legal term. Now, normally somebody has the right to confront their accuser in court. This is the exception to that. The accuser is actually dead. So with their last breath, it's presumed to be the truth. A dying declaration can be used in court, but there is one rule.

Speaker 9:
[07:26] The person has to believe that they're going to die when they give you the statement. And then, ultimately, they have to die. Normal human compassion is to just tell everybody, oh, you're going to be okay, keep fighting, we're helping you. It's completely counterintuitive to look at someone and tell them, you're going to die. Basically, there's no hope, you're not going to survive this. For them to tell you their last thoughts is, this is who did it to me. That's very powerful.

Speaker 5:
[08:00] Walter Lucas, she says.

Speaker 3:
[08:11] Two women stabbed to death inside this Frieden Street home. Tonight, Norfolk police are looking for the person responsible. Seventy-four-year-old Wanda Goyena died in the hospital yesterday, one day after getting stabbed. Her 35-year-old daughter, Angelique Goyena, died early Saturday morning.

Speaker 4:
[08:27] The door frame around the front door had not been forced. No fingerprints on any of the exterior windows to the house, no signs of some sort of forced entry.

Speaker 7:
[08:40] But nothing is stolen, and there is no murder weapon. All the DNA and fingerprints belong to Vonda, Angel, her living fiance David, and other family members.

Speaker 5:
[08:52] The detectives have only one clue to pursue. They have to find Walter Lucas.

Speaker 3:
[08:58] As a family, we gathered and tried to find out what would possibly be a motive, and we couldn't come up with a thing. Why would you murder two innocent people? Two innocent women.

Speaker 10:
[09:17] Mailbox 1, you have 3 old messages.

Speaker 3:
[09:21] Well, my answering machine from 15 years ago...

Speaker 9:
[09:25] Happy birthday, ready?

Speaker 3:
[09:27] It's Angelique and mom singing Happy Birthday to me. I kept it, so a month later, they're not on our planet. I've kept that for 15 years, and somehow it's still intact. We always call her Angel. I mean, it's like you say, if your parents called you, you know, by, Angelique, come here. You're in trouble, right? If you say, Angel, would you come here? Then you're not in trouble, you know?

Speaker 5:
[10:08] Angel is the baby of the family. She's younger than her three siblings by 16 years, and she loves fantasy novels. She loves dressing up in Elizabethan style. She writes poetry, she writes stories, and she and her best friend even wrote stories together.

Speaker 11:
[10:23] There was mythology and there was history. She wanted to believe in the good of everyone, which is something you don't find very often anymore.

Speaker 3:
[10:37] And that's why for her to be gone and stolen away like that, it was heart wrenching.

Speaker 5:
[10:47] This was a woman who loved imagination, loved the magical world.

Speaker 11:
[10:52] We went to a Renaissance Fair. I think Angel enjoyed just kind of the fun and the carefree nature of it. We went to Virginia Beach and on the beach, and we saw the Satchel of Neptune. Just hung out, and just spent time.

Speaker 5:
[11:14] Angel's job may be in a sandwich shop, but her heart is clearly in her poetry.

Speaker 12:
[11:25] First, you must open your heart and take a chance.

Speaker 4:
[11:31] Angel and her mother, Vonda, were very close.

Speaker 3:
[11:35] Angel and mom were definitely a package deal.

Speaker 11:
[11:38] She was the caretaker for her mom, who had dementia and heart problems, and that was her world.

Speaker 13:
[11:46] Well, it was like my little sister was my mom's keeper. They did watch TV, they read. Angelique would write poetry and photography and art, you know, painting and drawing. That's what they did.

Speaker 3:
[11:59] My mom was from West Virginia, and she was a hoop. Oh my gosh, but, you know, you couldn't pull the wool over her eyes at all. You know, we all tried, you know. And she was very creative as well. That's probably where Angelique got a lot of her creativity. Angelique and mom would always go to the store together. They would go out to the beach to go to, you know, one of the stores for the Wicca.

Speaker 5:
[12:28] They love the Wicca store, both of them. Wicca is a pagan spiritual practice. Some Wiccans even call themselves witches. They see all of the earth and sky and moon, all of nature, as a mother goddess.

Speaker 3:
[12:41] Angelique's always been fascinated with the stars. It kind of opened her eyes to nature, sunsets, leaves. There's definitely energy to things. It's kind of like the force, be with you kind of thing.

Speaker 8:
[12:55] Beyond that, they also love tarot cards, reading each other's future and fortunes.

Speaker 3:
[13:00] The tarot cards were, I remember them having tarot cards, both of them. Tarot cards, palm reading, that kind of stuff.

Speaker 8:
[13:10] They had a love of reading. They had a love of tarot cards, nature, walks in the park. They were really in tune with one another, more so as friends, beyond that mother and daughter special bond. They did everything together. They went everywhere together.

Speaker 3:
[13:26] Except for, of course, when Angelique would go out on a date. Mom couldn't go there. Angelique met most of the guys she dated online.

Speaker 13:
[13:36] She wanted to be married, and she wanted a family. Yes, she did. She talked about it.

Speaker 11:
[13:42] I know that's something she definitely wanted, and she was hopeful.

Speaker 3:
[13:46] She did tell me she really wanted to have a child, and she was concerned that she was too old, she was 35. She was on the, all over the page with dating. One guy, he was really into motorcycles, and so she'd be the passenger. And this one fella she dated was a pilot, small cop planes, and he let her fly. And it seemed to be exciting people that she would date.

Speaker 8:
[14:17] In 2006, Angel decides to put herself out there, so she signs up to a dating app, and then days after, she meets a man who's a father of two.

Speaker 12:
[14:27] What you can't live without? My dreams of finding happiness and love. The last book you read, stories with werewolves, vampires, and other magical creatures, my sons are both in scouting, so we like to go camping and things like that. I live with and take care of my mom. I would love one day to get my poetry published. I've dreamed of a knight in shining armor. Don't laugh, but I've kept a medallion of gold and silver of a knight upon a steed for the day I meet him.

Speaker 8:
[14:57] Angel's discovering so much more about David Hoshaw. He is an electrical designer. He's a scout master. He's seeming more and more to her like he could be the one.

Speaker 11:
[15:11] I remember Angel telling me he seems sweet. She told me he had two boys and they were a big part of his life. I think Angel wanted from David just to kind of be that prince charming, that knight in shining armor.

Speaker 5:
[15:28] Angel meets the sun. It's all great. It even meets David's ex-wife Naomi.

Speaker 14:
[15:32] David was an Eagle Scout. So of course he got the boys into scouting. They went camping with the scouts and they really enjoyed it. He was an adoring father.

Speaker 3:
[15:44] When I first met David, my initial thought was, he looks cuddly. He looked cuddly to me.

Speaker 8:
[15:51] Within a matter of months, they fall in love. David proposes, and now he's moved in with her and Vonda. And Angel is just off and running, planning a wedding.

Speaker 12:
[16:03] December 18th, 2006, David Wayne Hosha Jr. David is my fiance, and this will be the first of many Christmas memories that we will treasure. We are planning on being married September 15th, 2007.

Speaker 11:
[16:20] Angel was into the renaissance, and she was having a special dress made. It was very much Angel. It was red trim, you know, just kind of fairy tale.

Speaker 3:
[16:32] And her shoes she actually bought from a store and decorated them the way she wanted them, you know, artists and all.

Speaker 12:
[16:41] I think my married name will be pretty, Angelique Elaine Hosha. I wonder if our children will have dark hair like me and blue eyes like David.

Speaker 11:
[16:51] I still have the dress that I purchased to wear as Maid of Honor.

Speaker 5:
[16:58] Of course, neither of those dresses are ever worn. Two months before her wedding, Angel is killed. Police don't have much to work with at this point, just a dying declaration with the name Walter Lucas. Who is this guy? Police need to track him down. Turns out Walter isn't hard to find.

Speaker 3:
[17:22] Walter is my ex-husband. We were married in our twenties, and then, you know, we got divorced, but he stayed in touch with the family. Everybody loved him.

Speaker 7:
[17:30] Not only does he seem unlikely, the detectives find that on the night of the murder, Walter was more than 200 miles away.

Speaker 15:
[17:36] When the detectives told me that Vonda mentioned my name, I knew I wasn't the one, because first off, I wasn't there, and I knew that she had Alzheimer's. I just shrugged it off. But he said my DNA was there, and I said, well, of course, I was there the week before, visiting them.

Speaker 7:
[17:57] But his alibi checks out, so they have to cross Walter Lucas off the list.

Speaker 15:
[18:01] At the time that I was interviewed by the detectives, they said they don't have any leads.

Speaker 7:
[18:08] If there is no break-in, the next question police ask is who could get into the house.

Speaker 5:
[18:13] The only people with keys are the two dead women and members of the immediate family.

Speaker 7:
[18:19] Everyone who has a key, family, David, the fiance, all have alibis, too.

Speaker 4:
[18:23] The family members confirm that David Hoschaw is a couple hours away, and he's on the Middle Peninsula in Virginia at a Boy Scout week-long camp.

Speaker 5:
[18:35] David is with his 12-year-old son. Other parents see him there at 11 o'clock Friday night. Now, 6.30 Saturday morning, he's there for camp breakfast. And David drives back into Norfolk that afternoon.

Speaker 14:
[18:49] That Saturday was when he brought my oldest back to me, and everything was fine.

Speaker 8:
[18:56] Police track him down, and they tell him that they need him to come down to the station.

Speaker 14:
[19:01] And then I had gotten the call from the police department saying that my ex-husband was there, and that he needed a ride. The whole time, I'm like, what happened? And David just said, well, you know, if I was there, I could have saved him. And I'm like, what do you mean, if you were there, you could have saved him? You would be dead too.

Speaker 13:
[19:25] Yeah, it was confusing, because we had no way to go after. No evidence.

Speaker 8:
[19:31] Days are passing and there's no arrest, no clues, no clear direction. They want justice, they want answers.

Speaker 7:
[19:39] It takes a little piece of your soul and it breaks your heart just a little more every time you have to tell them that there's no breakthrough in the case.

Speaker 5:
[19:45] But two weeks later, a pretty startling development. A single piece of paper changes it all. It's a confession.

Speaker 7:
[20:13] The police at this point are just stymied. It's been a month since the murders. There is no evidence, but then a development that most murder investigations never see. A letter from the killer, and it's postmarked from Chicago.

Speaker 4:
[20:30] The act of the killing was not enough. Essentially, the killer is reliving it in writing this letter. So that is highly unusual. You don't have a clue, do you? I met the pretty biatch at the beach a few days before I killed her. She had her mother with her. She told me she was getting married in September, but she wanted to have one last fling beforehand. It references Angel and her mother going to the beach.

Speaker 8:
[20:57] Now, investigators cross check her diary, where she actually talks about going to the beach with her mom. And the dates line up.

Speaker 4:
[21:20] There's also a description about going to a laundry and everything else, and all that was consistent with the habits of Angel and her mother.

Speaker 7:
[21:29] How would the writer know all this unless they knew the women, unless they were actually there?

Speaker 4:
[21:37] When it came to going all the way, she told me she was having second thoughts and couldn't do it. About 12.30 or so, I got my knife and did the dirty deed. What a rush. I should have gagged her first because she screamed and woke up her mother. That's mother M-O-T-H-A.

Speaker 5:
[21:56] The detectives think the use of that kind of slang, biatch, mother, is kind of a clumsy way of trying to make them think the writer's black.

Speaker 4:
[22:05] Angel had previously dated white men, African American men, different types of employment, which is one thing that confused the issue.

Speaker 7:
[22:15] The writer clearly knows the victims.

Speaker 4:
[22:19] Don't bother checking for prints or DNA. Obviously, I'm wearing a body suit and gloves. Clearly it showed a killer that was reveling in what he had done. Really was unconcerned with talking about the act itself. And then lo and behold, a second letter is received. It's mailed from Gaylord, Michigan, which is a small community in the middle of Michigan.

Speaker 5:
[22:43] This one is so badly spelled, it's hard to read, let me try.

Speaker 4:
[22:56] He's now saying that he's killed someone possibly in the Midwest.

Speaker 5:
[23:00] It gave me such a rush, I can't explain. I will never forget me first, the Goyenas.

Speaker 7:
[23:07] So now they're checking the Midwest for unexplained homicides. A killer could be roaming from state to state. He could easily have come through Norfolk.

Speaker 4:
[23:17] Norfolk, Virginia has one of the highest per capita murder rates in the United States.

Speaker 9:
[23:22] You have large ports, you have international airports. You're kind of the hub for 95 and 85 areas where people are traveling north and south a lot.

Speaker 4:
[23:31] We have an extremely psychotic, taunting killer, who is taking pleasure in the homicide, who is taunting the police, who writes in a vernacular words that are more commonly used by an African American or someone else other than somebody in the family. Both letters and envelopes were forensically checked, no DNA on either of them.

Speaker 7:
[23:55] Taunting the police is not a smart move. It tends to make them even more determined. The case is about to add another detective and the most bizarre twist yet.

Speaker 5:
[24:06] The man comes into the station, says he knows who did it, hands them a ceremonial knife, and tells them he's a vampire.

Speaker 16:
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Speaker 1:
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Speaker 4:
[26:47] There's no immediately available forensic evidence, meaning that there's no suspect fingerprints. We have no DNA at the scene.

Speaker 5:
[26:58] It's pretty clear investigators won't be able to rely on forensics to identify the killer. No physical evidence, no sign of forced entry. But that in itself gives them two important clues. First, his murders were likely planned. Second, it's probably someone Angel and Vonda know. A close friend, maybe a romantic partner.

Speaker 4:
[27:20] We have this fiance, and they're set to get married in September. We aren't aware of any motive for him to want to do harm to his fiance, and furthermore, he's out of the area.

Speaker 8:
[27:32] This is a dead end for them. At this point, the rest of the family and the friends have been ruled out. Prosecutor Phil Evans needs a confidant, someone that he knows will get the job done. So, he turns to a man that he's worked with many times in the past.

Speaker 4:
[27:49] Let's get Rick Malvin on this case. We'll work it together.

Speaker 2:
[27:55] Phil and I have worked a lot of cases together. I won't say it's like brothers, but it's pretty close.

Speaker 4:
[28:02] Rick was the best of the best. He was someone who could translate the crime scene, but he also understood what it really means to develop evidence for the courtroom. I went to the house with Detective Malvin. We walked through it. You could still feel the murder in the house.

Speaker 2:
[28:28] I knew that this case was going to be difficult, but deep down, I felt that this was a solvable case. It may take time, but it was going to be a solvable case.

Speaker 4:
[28:40] They approached this from the standpoint of, we're going to start at ground zero. We weren't at the crime scene. We're going to go back and go through everything so that we are comfortable nothing was missed.

Speaker 2:
[28:52] Nobody is perfect when they commit a murder. I may overlook something, but there is no such thing as the perfect murder.

Speaker 5:
[29:01] At this point, Evans and Malvin are worried about something else. The killer made it pretty clear, he's not only one step ahead of the cops, but the murder spree isn't over.

Speaker 2:
[29:10] Anyone working that case should have taken that letter personally, and I did. And then a second letter came in, taunting.

Speaker 6:
[29:20] I must confess, I have done it a second time.

Speaker 2:
[29:24] I was going to do everything I possibly could to find that person.

Speaker 6:
[29:28] The cops up here are a lot smarter than yous.

Speaker 4:
[29:31] It really puts an increased energy on Detective Malvin, and certainly I felt it. We had a victim's family here who was just gutted. They lost their mother and sister, and we had a killer, apparently, who was traveling the country. At the very least, if he wasn't killing other people, he was perversely enjoying having killed the Goianas.

Speaker 7:
[29:56] You don't just look at suspects in a murder case. You also look at the victims. By 2008, Detective Malvin and his partner are digging deeper into Angel's past, and they find the ties to Wicca. Remember, Angel and her mom were interested and hung out at this Wiccan bookstore.

Speaker 3:
[30:14] Angelic's relationship with Wicca was more interest. I think that kind of trickled down to mom as well, because mom got interested in that.

Speaker 8:
[30:24] Wicca became popular in America back in the 50s. You know, you can think of lunar rituals and secular worship. It is not black magic and Satanism. It's more defined as nature's religion, where earth is a source of spiritual power.

Speaker 4:
[30:42] Angel had become associated with a group that loosely operated out of a bookstore called the Mystic Moon.

Speaker 5:
[30:51] Wiccan rituals often involve a special set of mystical tools, commonly including a wand, a pentacle, a chalice, and a large knife called an athene, used only for symbolic purposes.

Speaker 4:
[31:05] To the police, that opened a Pandora's box of, well, who did she meet there? January 2, 2008, there was a call to the Norfolk Police Department. There's a man that wants to talk to you on the Gojina case.

Speaker 2:
[31:21] He considered himself a vampire. We met with him. We invited him down to the office.

Speaker 4:
[31:33] And he said he was part of that community where there were some people who were involved in vampirism. He also, disturbingly, implied to the detectives that he may know something about Angel's murder.

Speaker 2:
[31:53] He produced a knife that he said that was used by someone else to commit the murders.

Speaker 4:
[31:59] So now the detectives had a knife in their possession.

Speaker 7:
[32:02] The case is taking a pretty bizarre turn. More than six months after Angel and Vondo were stabbed to death, Detective Malvin is sitting across from a self-described vampire, someone who claims to draw pleasure from ingesting blood, and someone who turns over an athame knife he says is the murder weapon.

Speaker 2:
[32:19] The knife was submitted to the lab. There was no DNA blood trace. And the knife could not have made the injuries on the bodies. And so once we talked to him and knew that he was not close to the family, I didn't have a problem eliminating him.

Speaker 5:
[32:40] It's another costly detour, squandering time and resources. So Evans and Malvin take a harder look at someone who seemed to have an airtight alibi, Angel's fiancee, David Hoschaw.

Speaker 2:
[32:53] He came to take his sons to a Boy Scout camp, and he had been away from his fiancee for a while. He certainly could have left the Boy Scout camp. He could have get to the house without being noticed.

Speaker 4:
[33:11] We looked into David Hoschaw's background. The more we looked, the more disturbing information came. He becomes stronger, not by evidence of this crime, but by information about his behavior in the past.

Speaker 2:
[33:30] We had a subject for an ill woman killed. A 35-year-old woman killed. Somebody needed to tell her story. That's it. The house looks so different. Everything's changed, everything's new. And that's a good thing.

Speaker 5:
[34:01] Detective Rick Malbin is a veteran homicide detective with 15 years under his belt. But this case is different. Malbin begins an investigation that will span two years, four states, and a couple thousand miles.

Speaker 2:
[34:15] I got here during the early morning hours. The initial investigators were here, you'll see, when I arrived.

Speaker 9:
[34:24] Rick Malbin was one of our senior homicide detectives. He was definitely one of the go-to guys. He had a very good reputation.

Speaker 3:
[34:35] Detective Holden was just very focused, and it was like the bulldog sense about him that he's going to get something done. You know, he's going to do something.

Speaker 2:
[34:54] That's from my mother. I pray that I don't get the tunnel vision and let me see through the lies.

Speaker 8:
[35:02] Fishing through all the lies, Detective Rick Malbin and his partner, they've been following dozens of leads. All of them are dead ends. The only real solid clue that they have at this point are these two letters. But who wrote those letters? And was it truly the killer?

Speaker 4:
[35:18] I can't remember a case where the police department ever received legitimate letters like this in connection with a real homicide. Can you? No.

Speaker 2:
[35:28] We explored the possibility of it being a serial killer. Letters were taken to the FBI lab and they determined that it wasn't a serial killer. So that narrowed down, I searched and David Horshaw looked more like a suspect to me. There's no reason to write a letter like that other than to try to throw the police off.

Speaker 4:
[35:55] Obviously, whoever wrote it put Norfolk in strange handwriting that's not the same as the return address. Right. Part of trying to look at everything is each person of interest. We want to know everything we can about them. My way of doing my job and Rick Malden's way of doing his job is we're going to get every detail we know. We're talking about this guy, David Horshaw. Who is he?

Speaker 5:
[36:23] For Angel, David Horshaw is the man she wants to grow old with. But in the month before they exchange wedding vows, it's clear she is having serious doubts.

Speaker 12:
[36:33] I haven't heard from David except before work this morning. He says he misses me, and I hope he does because I miss him.

Speaker 7:
[36:40] Horshaw has a job doing electrical work for Virginia Company with US. Navy contracts. Detectives learn he tells Angel he's been placed on a project in the Midwest. Most of the time, he'll be living up there and commuting back to Norfolk. But you gotta ask, is that really why he's gone?

Speaker 4:
[36:58] Angel's diary entries in the last weeks of her life, she was frustrated on one level because he didn't seem to be engaged, and he didn't seem to be his normal demeanor towards her.

Speaker 11:
[37:19] He worked for a naval contractor. He was supposedly building a ship. But why are you building a ship in Wisconsin or Michigan? How is it? It didn't make sense. You would think it would be built in Norfolk, not the Midwest, Great Lakes.

Speaker 12:
[37:49] I hope this means my capacity to love is increasing as well.

Speaker 11:
[37:52] There were definitely red flags that David possibly was cheating or hiding something from Angel, just when she couldn't get ahold of him, and he's not where he's supposed to be.

Speaker 4:
[38:06] When the forensic investigators were going through the house, one of the things that was of interest was a computer.

Speaker 2:
[38:16] We got the search warrant for the computer, and once we got it to forensic, that's when we found out when he changed that password.

Speaker 4:
[38:26] The forensic analysis of the computer revealed that on June 24th, 2007, David Hoschaw, as the administrator for the computer, changed the password to For Amanda.

Speaker 7:
[38:40] Amanda? If David's marrying Angel in two months, who is Amanda?

Speaker 2:
[38:45] Amanda came into the picture when we realized David Hoschaw had changed the password on the computer.

Speaker 8:
[38:53] It's early 2007. Angel is buzzing, planning for this wedding. Turns out, David Hoschaw, he actually goes back to the dating websites, and he ends up connecting with, and starts to date, another woman.

Speaker 4:
[39:12] So while he's traveling for business, to stay up there to work, he was actually cultivating another relationship in that area to Amanda, to another woman. All the while, Angel is preparing for a wedding in September.

Speaker 11:
[39:33] Angel was very trusting, but when someone hasn't necessarily given you initially a reason to doubt them, why should you?

Speaker 5:
[39:43] That password unlocks more than a computer. It also opens an exhaustive search. Detectives start digging into everything David Hoschaw said he was doing before, during, and after the killings, starting with his airtight alibi. Was he really in Boy Scout Camp the night of the murders?

Speaker 4:
[40:00] We knew he was roughly 80 miles away at 11 p.m. at night, and he was there at six in the morning. That is not physically impossible to drive to Norfolk, two hours, commit a brutal homicide and drive back, but it's unlikely behavior.

Speaker 7:
[40:17] Detective Malbin knows that the whole case is writing on the letters. Prove he sent them and they have their killer.

Speaker 4:
[40:26] When you're looking at individuals capable of committing a homicide, David Hoschaw does not jump off the pages. He doesn't look like he's going to be a threat to anybody, but sometimes people that present that way are actually the most dangerous.

Speaker 8:
[40:42] Turns out, David Hoschaw was more dangerous than anyone imagined.

Speaker 17:
[40:48] It's like a whole nightmare. I never thought in my million years that I would be in.

Speaker 14:
[40:54] He came down the hall and grabbed my throat and started strangling me.

Speaker 18:
[41:00] I just felt something just smack across the back of my head, and I just blacked out.

Speaker 2:
[41:13] When I walked in the residence, I was slightly in shock of what I saw.

Speaker 11:
[41:18] Two people are no longer with us, who should be, who were good people.

Speaker 3:
[41:24] What would possibly be a motive?

Speaker 5:
[41:27] Could the murders somehow be tied to Angel's interest in the occult?

Speaker 7:
[41:31] Remember, Angel and her mom were interested.

Speaker 19:
[41:33] Whoever did this must be some kind of monster.

Speaker 4:
[41:36] Extremely psychotic, taunting killer. We got two letters that we have a killer taking credit. For the double homicide we killed. I skipped town pretty quick. I move around a lot, so good luck catching me.

Speaker 14:
[41:52] But if you ever confronted him about anything, the switch would just flip in his brain.

Speaker 18:
[41:58] I just felt something just smack across the back of my head, and I just blacked out.

Speaker 17:
[42:05] It was just like I was thrown in an alligator pit, and I needed to fight my way out of it.

Speaker 18:
[42:10] And I think truly there was something more sinister going on.

Speaker 2:
[42:26] We've had several homicides in the city of Norfolk, multiple deaths. This case was unusual in the sense that it was a mother and daughter.

Speaker 5:
[42:37] Angel and Vonda Gojana were killed so brutally right in their home. How could there be no evidence to go on?

Speaker 2:
[42:43] There was no signs of force entry. There was no DNA or fingerprints.

Speaker 5:
[42:47] The police investigation of everyone Angel knew, including people from the Wicca bookstore, has led nowhere. And the self-proclaimed vampire who went to the police, it was a false lead.

Speaker 3:
[42:57] Angel was humble. She was kind.

Speaker 4:
[43:00] She was writing how excited she was to get married.

Speaker 2:
[43:03] I was trying to catch a killer. I was going to do everything I possibly could to find that person.

Speaker 5:
[43:11] Where do they go from here? Angel's best friend thinks she knows.

Speaker 11:
[43:16] It was David. I just had a feeling.

Speaker 7:
[43:21] Remember, early in their investigation, police reached out to Angel's fiancée, David Hoshaugh. At the time, he seemed to have a credible alibi.

Speaker 5:
[43:31] David talks to police and tells them he was about 80 miles away on a Boy Scout trip.

Speaker 7:
[43:36] But it was some of what David said during this interview that piqued their interest.

Speaker 4:
[43:40] What was interesting was he never asked them, why do you need to talk to me? If you got called by the Homicide Squad, your first question is, what is this about?

Speaker 2:
[43:50] When he was talking to the detectives, he tell them, check my Easy Pass. Well, you can leave the Easy Pass at the Boy Scout camp.

Speaker 7:
[44:00] When a person is being interviewed in a murder investigation, and they're providing you a lot of information, it means they're totally innocent, or they're somehow involved and they've gone to a lot of trouble to make it look like they're totally innocent.

Speaker 4:
[44:12] David Hoshaw became like a onion in the case. The more you peeled him back, the more strange information came out.

Speaker 7:
[44:20] A disturbing picture of Hoshaw's past begins to emerge.

Speaker 2:
[44:24] We knew that there were at least six women that David Hoshaw was involved in, and we investigated all six of them.

Speaker 4:
[44:33] David Hoshaw had been married three times prior to becoming engaged to Angel.

Speaker 14:
[44:39] I am Naomi Hoshaw, I was David's first wife. We were 16 and we met at Bush Gardens when we worked there.

Speaker 10:
[44:48] It's all the fun and splendor of old Europe, but a lot closer.

Speaker 14:
[44:53] At first, neither one of us liked each other. I looked at him like, oh, he's too preppy and his uniforms aren't too perfect. I gave him a little bit of attention and he gave it back a million fold. I felt special. Of course, when he asked me to marry him, I definitely said yes because that's what I wanted.

Speaker 4:
[45:16] He then joined the United States Air Force and was transferred out to Spokane, Washington area.

Speaker 14:
[45:22] The good times were good, but what I remember are more of the bad times. He would be very lovey-dovey when he wanted to be. But if you ever confronted him about anything, Switch would just flip in his brain. I found out I was pregnant, and he was like, no, you're not pregnant. You're not pregnant. And I was. I was on bed rest at the very end, and I got up because I wanted something to drink. He came down the hall and grabbed my throat, and started strangling me. My oldest son, he was just screaming and screaming and screaming, and he just wouldn't stop. Finally, David let go, and I went and picked up my oldest son and calmed him down. I was terrified, and I didn't know what was going to happen next. And then there were some letters that I found.

Speaker 6:
[46:28] To my one true love.

Speaker 5:
[46:30] During his first marriage, David also started to groom and unlawfully touch a 12-year-old friend of the family.

Speaker 6:
[46:37] I went in there in hopes to be alone with you. Your mom would not have known.

Speaker 14:
[46:41] I didn't know what was going on. I was naive. You're in your twenties, and this person is still in elementary school.

Speaker 6:
[46:50] Love forever, David.

Speaker 14:
[46:53] You knew she was 12. That's the part that I could never wrap my head around.

Speaker 4:
[47:03] Naomi had complained to the United States Air Force about domestic abuse. The 12-year-old girl and her parents cooperated with the United States Air Force. He pled guilty to both indecent acts and assault on the 12-year-old. The United States Air Force chose not to criminally prosecute him in a court martial, which could have sent him to prison and administratively discharged him from the Air Force. With an other-than-honorable discharge.

Speaker 14:
[47:31] I filed for the divorce, and he never fought me.

Speaker 7:
[47:39] After his discharge from the military, David follows his ex-wife Naomi back to Virginia to stay close to his kids, where he begins online dating.

Speaker 2:
[47:48] One of the women that we talked to indicated he said all the right things, and he wind and dined them.

Speaker 4:
[47:55] After Naomi, he got involved with his eventual second wife, who he was married to for a short time.

Speaker 18:
[48:02] And then there was me. My name is Allison Ashcroft. I am David's third wife. I met David in 2001 through an online dating website. He showered a lot of attention on me, and that was not something that I was used to. At that time, I was severely overweight. And so that there was this person who found me attractive despite that was just mind-blowing to me, and I thought, you know, I might want to hang on to this one.

Speaker 4:
[48:34] We were concerned what we learned from Naomi and the domestic assault. We were trying to see if there's a continuity of violence with Ho Shaw.

Speaker 18:
[48:43] I had an injury at David's hands. I was having migraines and dizziness. David had asked if there was anything he could do to help. And we had a massage roller. So he started rolling this thing back and forth across my neck. He started moving a little faster. And he was lifting the roller up off my neck. And then eventually, I just felt something just smack across the back of my head. And I just blacked out. When I came to, he was standing on the side of the bed, looking down at me, saying, do you think we need to go to the hospital?

Speaker 4:
[49:23] Hoshaw came up with some story that did not include any acknowledgement he had something to do with it.

Speaker 18:
[49:29] I don't think anything was really said other than he may have said he was sorry, and that the roller just slipped out of his hands. Now I realize, you know, I was young and naive then, that I think truly there was something more sinister going on.

Speaker 4:
[49:44] It left that nagging seed of doubt in her mind.

Speaker 18:
[49:48] In 2005, he said, this marriage isn't working out. He said, I can't do this anymore. I'll pack my stuff up in the morning, and I'll be gone, and we can get a divorce. I think if I had tried to work things out with him, if I had stayed, I might not be sitting here right now.

Speaker 7:
[50:13] As detectives dig into all of David Hoshaw's past relationships, they learn that his trail of lies and deceptions only continues to grow. And very soon, he would move on to a relationship with Angel.

Speaker 3:
[50:25] And that's when it got ugly.

Speaker 5:
[50:36] Now that the authorities have learned about David Hochel's disturbing past, the question becomes, what exactly happened between David and Angel?

Speaker 7:
[50:45] When Angelique Goina meets her true love online, there's a lot he isn't telling her, like he's been married three times.

Speaker 6:
[50:54] I have a huge heart of gold that I want to share with my partner.

Speaker 4:
[50:57] What he projected was all the type of things Angelique Goina would want to hear or see in a dating profile.

Speaker 13:
[51:04] I was happy that my sister found someone, but when I met him, I didn't really care for him.

Speaker 3:
[51:11] There was something about him I didn't like. You know, this force and energy, it wasn't good. But Angelique liked him, so I'm gonna like him, too.

Speaker 5:
[51:20] Within a few months, David Hoshaw is moving in with Angel and Vonda.

Speaker 13:
[51:24] When we found out, we were up in arms about that. And he's a bum. He's gonna live in my mom's house for nothing? No, we didn't like that. But my mom wasn't here to stay.

Speaker 11:
[51:36] Angel was hoping that they would live there with her mom and continue to take care of her.

Speaker 5:
[51:42] Angel's diary entries, they start to change. It's not all hearts and flowers anymore.

Speaker 12:
[51:49] Why is he so secretive about his money? I know marriage is a matter of trust, but David is weird with money.

Speaker 11:
[51:57] There was concern that David was not the person he originally appeared to be.

Speaker 3:
[52:03] Angelique would tell me out of the clear blue that he'd have a look on his face like he was disgusted with her and that would really bother her.

Speaker 11:
[52:11] David was wanting her to put Vonda in a managed care facility and Angel was vehemently against that.

Speaker 12:
[52:20] He's been grumpy and moody. Tonight he was even arguing with mom. Well, I stood up for her, of course, but it put me in a strange place between mom, who I love, and David, who I love.

Speaker 4:
[52:34] David didn't seem to have jumped in on getting the wedding preparations together.

Speaker 3:
[52:39] He did nothing. He proposed and that was it.

Speaker 4:
[52:42] She's bugging Hoshaw, who do you want to invite? And he kept saying, yeah, yeah, I'll get them to you. And David Hoshaw is going back and forth to Michigan.

Speaker 13:
[52:53] He wasn't around and I thought that strange for somebody who wanted to get buried.

Speaker 12:
[53:00] David said in a condescending tone of voice, don't question me where I am. Doesn't seem like he was feeling warm fuzzies for me now, does it?

Speaker 3:
[53:13] Angelique called me and she was really upset and said that she'd had a bad dream, that she dreamed she was kissing someone else. And I tried to console her, you're getting cold feet or something like that. Now I kind of looking back at it, I'm like, oh my gosh.

Speaker 5:
[53:32] In spite of all the red flags, even the day before she is killed, Angel is still looking forward to the wedding.

Speaker 12:
[53:38] Friday, 77 days and counting. After work today, as I always do, I check my voicemail and guess who finally called? David. He'll be home sometime tomorrow, and for that, I am very glad.

Speaker 5:
[53:54] That is written just hours before she dies.

Speaker 4:
[53:59] Initially, the family is going to the house and they're going through personal belongings.

Speaker 3:
[54:04] We gathered and tried to find out what would possibly be a motive.

Speaker 4:
[54:09] There were forensic investigators still working on the house, trying to make sure they didn't miss some forensic evidence.

Speaker 13:
[54:15] There was nothing, nothing pointing to any book. We didn't think it was going to be solved.

Speaker 4:
[54:21] A couple times, Hoshaw showed up there, which they thought was strange.

Speaker 2:
[54:25] He was allowed access to the house. He should not have been allowed in the house.

Speaker 13:
[54:30] I think he got a guy at anything he wanted, you know, that could destroy the case. And maybe he did.

Speaker 3:
[54:37] I just noticed, why isn't he grieving? He doesn't even appear to be shocked.

Speaker 4:
[54:42] At the viewing at the funeral home, Tyre family shows up. Who doesn't show up? David Hoshaw. Angel's sisters and her brother are like, there's something up with David Hoshaw.

Speaker 5:
[54:54] Not only is David Hoshaw a no-show at his fiance's funeral, he makes another stunning move. He packs up, leaves Norfolk, and moves to Michigan to be with a new girlfriend. Remember, as police were investigating Hoshaw, they discovered that shortly before the murder, he changed his computer password to For Amanda.

Speaker 17:
[55:18] Marking.

Speaker 5:
[55:21] Tell me your first name and how you are connected to this case.

Speaker 17:
[55:24] Amanda, and I was engaged to David Hoshaw.

Speaker 5:
[55:27] At Amanda's request, we are not using her last name and have altered her appearance.

Speaker 17:
[55:32] He told me that his ex, Angelique, was murdered. He was distraught. He was confused. He went to the police department and they're questioning him. And I asked him, I said, did you do it? He said, no. He said he was cleared. So I, you know, I believed him.

Speaker 3:
[55:52] When I found out that he had another woman, I went, oh my gosh, Angelique's dream. It's like she was right.

Speaker 4:
[56:00] I set up a meeting with the victim's family, and they were adamant that they knew it was David Hoshaw.

Speaker 13:
[56:07] We all thought it was him.

Speaker 4:
[56:08] We had to get him charged for fear that he would do something else.

Speaker 20:
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Speaker 21:
[56:48] Sunday nights on ABC.

Speaker 19:
[56:50] What happens when the person you love the most turns out not to be who you think they are?

Speaker 22:
[56:55] Everything he told me was a lie.

Speaker 21:
[56:56] I was betrayed. From the number one true crime podcast, Betrayal.

Speaker 23:
[57:00] He's been living a secret double life.

Speaker 8:
[57:02] My marriage ended with a 911 call.

Speaker 3:
[57:04] The tape is blood curdling.

Speaker 21:
[57:07] Betrayal, secrets and lies.

Speaker 4:
[57:09] So many people are living with their own betrayal.

Speaker 21:
[57:13] Sunday nights at 10, 9 Central on ABC and stream on Disney Plus and Hulu.

Speaker 5:
[57:22] David Hoschaw is now living with his girlfriend, Amanda. And while police consider him a prime suspect, there's no physical evidence linking him to the murders.

Speaker 7:
[57:32] The detectives in this case may feel like David Hoschaw is the killer, but they can't yet prove it. And hunches don't count in a courtroom.

Speaker 4:
[57:40] We have circumstances, we have behavior that is strange, but we have to demonstrate there is no other person that could have committed the homicide.

Speaker 2:
[57:51] Well, we looked at everything that David Hoschaw did before the homicide and after the homicide.

Speaker 4:
[58:02] We got two letters that we have a killer taking credit for the double homicide.

Speaker 2:
[58:08] Yep.

Speaker 4:
[58:09] But we needed evidence that showed that Hoschaw was the only person that could have mailed the letters. This is the envelope of the first letter that was mailed on July 23rd from Cardus Collins Processing Station in Chicago. But you were able to nail it down to one specific distribution center that would have applied that postmark. We had to try to find something that would put him around Chicago. So we had to try to rebuild David Hoschaw's activities.

Speaker 7:
[58:48] If they can connect the dots of cell phone records and credit card receipts, they can use the paper trail that Hoschaw left and trap him.

Speaker 2:
[58:56] We started following the cell phone records of David Hoschaw.

Speaker 4:
[59:01] There was a cell call that bounced off a tower within a few miles of where this letter would have had to have been mailed.

Speaker 2:
[59:09] That was really key. We were able to put him between 2.1 and 12.6 miles from that post office.

Speaker 7:
[59:17] So, evidence places David in Chicago near the post office on the same day the first letter was mailed. Can they connect him to the second letter? But this one was mailed nowhere near Chicago.

Speaker 4:
[59:29] August 15th, that letter is dropped in the mailbox in Gaylord, Michigan, which is a small community in the middle of Michigan, middle of nowhere. David Hoschaw's credit card purchases opened a window because his purchase history was literally a road map. We knew that David Hoschaw took his new girlfriend, Amanda, on a little celebratory road trip.

Speaker 5:
[59:59] Tell me about that. Why did you take that trip?

Speaker 17:
[60:02] We went on a trip because I had a doctor's appointment, and we started off in our town, and we stopped at all these little different places.

Speaker 2:
[60:11] There were hotels, there was the zoo, IHOP, movie theaters. We followed all of it.

Speaker 4:
[60:21] Yeah, he's showing Amanda the good time. He's trying to impress her. August 13th and 14th, he was consistently making purchases moving southward on the interstate to the point where he would go through Gaylord on August 15th. Then a few hour time frame, he made purchases north of Gaylord and then south of Gaylord. There's a single highway running through it. What are the odds it's gonna be somebody else who mailed that letter?

Speaker 5:
[60:52] So never saw him stepping away to go to the post office or mail anything?

Speaker 17:
[60:59] No, nothing unusual. I mean, I'm usually the one that's gone, you know, stepping out somewhere.

Speaker 7:
[61:04] Now they've got a string of receipts and cell phone records that all connect David to the letters.

Speaker 4:
[61:09] The problem with that is that doesn't go into court and prove anything.

Speaker 7:
[61:14] Could the answer be witnesses? But it is always a lot more powerful when you have an eyewitness. That carries a lot more weight in front of a jury. So Detective Malvin and his partner go on a road trip, talking to store owners and vendors and trying to get them to come into court.

Speaker 4:
[61:31] We ended up with 23 to 25 different people subpoenaed in this case.

Speaker 7:
[61:35] They present their case to the grand jury and get an indictment and an arrest warrant for David Hoschaw.

Speaker 4:
[61:47] David Hoschaw had set up a separate life. He was moving on. We knew Amanda had now changed her life to live with David Hoschaw and take him into her home.

Speaker 5:
[61:58] David and Amanda have a child, and Amanda's due with their second, but things seem to be headed downhill. David's changed.

Speaker 17:
[62:06] He was acting weird. I'd find him in random places. I'm like, what are you doing? Why are you sitting here? He never had an answer.

Speaker 4:
[62:16] We wanted David Hoschaw not to be prepared for what was happening, and we wanted to create an impact upon Amanda.

Speaker 5:
[62:24] So, 2009, you're pregnant with your second child, and you hear a knock on the door.

Speaker 17:
[62:31] I didn't get no knock on the door.

Speaker 5:
[62:33] So tell me about what happened.

Speaker 17:
[62:35] It was 4 a.m. In a rush in, one officer pushes me to the side, and I'm asking, what's going on?

Speaker 5:
[62:48] So they're running in and just grabbing David and...

Speaker 17:
[62:51] Yeah, they threw him on the ground. I have a baby in the other room. I'm just asking, what's going on? Well, he's under arrest.

Speaker 2:
[62:59] David Hoschaw stepped out. He was handcuffed, and that escorted out of the house.

Speaker 17:
[63:05] And he finally told me that he murdered two people, his ex. But really, to find out it was his fiance, it wasn't his ex-fiance, it was just his fiance.

Speaker 5:
[63:16] What did you say?

Speaker 17:
[63:17] I was stunned, because I thought he was clear.

Speaker 2:
[63:23] He was transported to a state police barracks.

Speaker 4:
[63:28] That was the first chance that Detective Malvin had to talk to David Hoshaugh.

Speaker 2:
[63:34] You ever been advised to go back and forth?

Speaker 17:
[63:35] Yes, I have. I didn't even get time to even process anything. I just, it's like I was thrown in an alligator pit, and I needed to fight my way out of it.

Speaker 5:
[63:45] Amanda has no idea that she's about to break the case.

Speaker 4:
[64:05] I didn't have a confession from David Hoschaw. I had all this other evidence. The only way he could say something is if tactically and psychologically we got under his skin.

Speaker 2:
[64:20] We're here to talk to you and we're about to get to the answer to your question. When we walked into that interview room, I expected to get a confession. I was so pumped. Do you recall mail of a letter from Northrop, Wichita? No, I don't. Hold it, settle up. That's an old book. And the person that mailed that letter took credit for the deaths of Angelique Ann Bonthoom.

Speaker 4:
[65:02] I think he was unnerved but trying not to show it, and he's sort of like processing the situation, talking in a normal tone of voice.

Speaker 2:
[65:10] You will be able to defend 2.1 miles of the post office that processed that life.

Speaker 15:
[65:17] Okay.

Speaker 8:
[65:18] You think that's a coincidence?

Speaker 15:
[65:21] But like I said, I don't remember being in there until 23rd.

Speaker 2:
[65:24] Okay. But, but?

Speaker 15:
[65:26] That would be one hell of a coincidence.

Speaker 2:
[65:28] One hell of a coincidence, right? I wanted David to know that we knew almost better than him what he had done after the homicide. Let me give you a little history on your trip. You stayed at the company in room 333. You ate pie hut, you had a potato pancake breakfast, a funnel cake meal.

Speaker 4:
[65:49] There is a psychological tactical game that goes on in the room.

Speaker 13:
[65:54] It's hard.

Speaker 2:
[65:55] I know.

Speaker 13:
[65:55] It's hard talking about it for the first time.

Speaker 2:
[65:57] But I guarantee you, once you get it off your chest, you're going to feel a lot better. I know your heart is burning right now, man. It got to a point where I told him that he wasn't going home, that he was coming back to Norfolk to stand trial for killing Angelique and Vonda. And then he broke my heart.

Speaker 10:
[66:21] I need to speak to my attorney. I need to speak to my attorney.

Speaker 2:
[66:28] He said, I need to talk to an attorney. He knocked me down. I didn't get anything from him. He lawyered up. And I knew he wanted to talk to Amanda, and Amanda had asked to talk to him.

Speaker 17:
[66:42] I asked if I could speak with David to find out what's going on. They told me, we'll get him ready. So I waited.

Speaker 2:
[66:51] I want to let Amanda understand whatever she wants to say tomorrow. You want to see it?

Speaker 4:
[66:57] It was one of those things where sometimes, like, it's the drop of water in a still pool, you allow the drop to fall and then it will take its own course.

Speaker 12:
[67:18] What is going on, David?

Speaker 15:
[67:22] Being arrested for murder.

Speaker 17:
[67:24] Did you do it? Please be gone.

Speaker 24:
[67:29] Did you?

Speaker 10:
[67:32] I love you with all my heart.

Speaker 17:
[67:33] Did you hurt these people?

Speaker 10:
[67:39] I know we do.

Speaker 15:
[67:41] I've asked for an attorney.

Speaker 5:
[67:42] I don't want to say anything else in front of the police, So, what did detectives say to you about talking to David during the interrogation?

Speaker 17:
[67:51] That I would have a private conversation in a room, and I could talk to him, and it would be just me and him.

Speaker 10:
[68:01] Thank you.

Speaker 4:
[68:05] Sect of Malden advised David Hoschaw of his legal rights. This was in an interview room in which there was a camera that was discreetly placed.

Speaker 5:
[68:15] So did you know it was gonna be recorded?

Speaker 17:
[68:17] No, I never knew that. Maybe I just, I need, you know, I'm just not the smartest cook in the bunch, but I thought it was just a private room.

Speaker 2:
[68:26] He had a right to remain silent. He didn't have to talk to Amanda, especially about the case. He didn't have to answer her.

Speaker 10:
[68:37] I got crazy. I'm sorry. I'm so sorry.

Speaker 5:
[68:47] Looking at you on the interrogation tape, it's almost as if you seem like you're in physical pain.

Speaker 17:
[68:53] I was sick to know that my baby's daddy did this. I mean, come on. It was distraught. I thought maybe I was having a nightmare.

Speaker 25:
[69:20] I went down there to try and break up and things got...

Speaker 17:
[69:24] I was so confused. It doesn't make sense to me. Why were you there at that time? If you were gonna break up with her, why didn't you do it during the day?

Speaker 2:
[69:36] A man had started going off. She picked up the letter. Did they have this letter?

Speaker 25:
[69:42] That was stupid. I was trying to get him off my back.

Speaker 2:
[69:49] He eventually told her he mailed a letter to get us off the tail. So at that point, I knew I had the right person.

Speaker 4:
[69:57] He took ownership of being the writer of the letters in this exchange with Amanda, and he said that, you know, I mailed them to get them off my tracks.

Speaker 17:
[70:07] I never understood how he had time to write these letters. So he must have wrote them before and had them ready to go.

Speaker 4:
[70:17] If he had never mailed the letters, there's a very good chance the evidence would never have developed to charge him.

Speaker 12:
[70:24] Did you invent the movie?

Speaker 2:
[70:34] He said enough to Amanda to strengthen my case. I couldn't wait to come out and call Phil. It was a great feeling.

Speaker 4:
[70:46] He acknowledged that he went to the house to break up with her, but then things got out of hand. He admits to her sending the letters. A confession really is an admission of certain facts.

Speaker 17:
[71:10] I was pregnant at the time, and I just found out that my man is guilty of killing two, not one, but two people.

Speaker 10:
[71:20] I'm sorry I've hurt you.

Speaker 25:
[71:22] That's what hurt me the most, is the pain I'm causing you and our family.

Speaker 17:
[71:29] All I could think of is why I wanted to get up and slap him. His smirky face. But I didn't, because it wasn't worth it.

Speaker 10:
[71:50] And I want to see it again.

Speaker 17:
[72:00] He lies. All he does is lie. I feel there's more truth to the story, and I figure the only way I could get the truth is through the courts.

Speaker 22:
[72:14] The man accused of killing a Norfolk woman and her mother now faces a capital murder charge. In Norfolk yesterday, a grand jury indicted David Wayne Hoschok.

Speaker 4:
[72:24] The problem with the case is, the first thing a defense attorney's gonna do is stand up in court and say, you do not have one piece of evidence that demonstrates when a client committed the crime.

Speaker 1:
[72:36] We gather here tonight to bring women back to their rightful place.

Speaker 21:
[72:41] The Testaments, a new Hulu original series from the executive producers of The Handmaid's Tale.

Speaker 24:
[72:45] It's easier to accept a story than believe that the people around you are monsters.

Speaker 21:
[72:50] The battle isn't over. Watch the new Hulu original series, The Testaments, streaming on Hulu and Hulu on Disney Plus for bundle subscribers. Terms apply.

Speaker 23:
[73:06] It was Wednesday morning, about 10 a.m., when Leslie Jenning-Prier's colleagues became concerned she hadn't come to work.

Speaker 22:
[73:13] In 2001, Leslie Prier was living in the suburbs of Washington, DC., when on a spring morning, the unthinkable happened.

Speaker 23:
[73:21] There were signs of a struggle, but no forced entry.

Speaker 6:
[73:24] This woman was strangled and she was beaten.

Speaker 11:
[73:26] She was found in the shower with the water running.

Speaker 22:
[73:29] For the next two decades, Leslie Prier's case remained unsolved, and the shocking truth about the real killer stayed hidden until very recently, when new technology allowed investigators to do what had once been impossible. I'm Stephanie Ramos, and this is Blood and Water, a new series from ABC Audio in 2020.

Speaker 17:
[73:53] And he almost got away with it.

Speaker 24:
[73:55] He almost got away with it.

Speaker 22:
[73:57] Coming April 28th. Listen wherever you get your podcasts.

Speaker 11:
[74:17] You want people to be held accountable for their actions. Two people are no longer with us, who should be.

Speaker 7:
[74:24] His past is horrific. He preys on those that are insecure, and maybe people he perceives as being weak.

Speaker 15:
[74:32] He was a predator.

Speaker 7:
[74:38] David Hoschaw, in jail, is waiting for his murder trial to start. The prosecution seems to feel pretty good about this. They have a very unsympathetic guy to put in front of this jury.

Speaker 4:
[74:49] It was clear he went to great ends to try to cover his tracks, and we knew that his taunting in the letters, the boasting, would not play well to a jury.

Speaker 5:
[75:00] But District Attorney Evans has a problem, the sort of evidence he's gonna give to those 12 people.

Speaker 4:
[75:06] Nobody said he did it. Nobody said he confessed to me he did it. Nobody forensically said it was his thumbprint, it was his DNA. To be blunt, what we did was we built up a case of circumstantial evidence, layering one piece of evidence, information on top of another.

Speaker 7:
[75:23] This is not where a prosecutor wants to be. Juries like to have that smoking gun, that forensic proof, but that's not the hand that he's been dealt. At the same time, the defense is doing their job, trying to exclude evidence the prosecutor does have, like Angel's diary entries.

Speaker 12:
[75:38] David said in a condescending tone of voice, don't question me where I am.

Speaker 7:
[75:46] They want to throw out the interrogation video.

Speaker 5:
[75:51] But it doesn't work. The judge admits it all. The diary, the interrogation, the jury's going to see all of it.

Speaker 4:
[76:01] The case was set to be tried for a month. We had about 140 witnesses subpoenaed. We were ready to go. We literally had travel arrangements for, I think, half of the vendors in Michigan. Shop owners, clerks at hotels. I don't think anybody could have got food up and down the interstate in the middle of Michigan because they were all coming to Norfolk, Virginia for trial. We produced a mannequin, and we asked the medical examiner to use knitting needles, and we intended to use this at trial to demonstrate all of the wounds. It not only shows just the incredible sheer number of stab wounds in this area, but it does clearly show that Angel sustained defensive wounds.

Speaker 7:
[76:53] A demonstration like that is so effective with a jury. It shows the level of violence of what they call overkill.

Speaker 5:
[77:05] The family has waited three years to hear David Hoschaw on the stand, to see all the proof.

Speaker 11:
[77:11] A lot of emotion. You want that justice.

Speaker 7:
[77:18] The death penalty is on the table, and facing all of that, Hoschaw surprises them all.

Speaker 16:
[77:25] David Hoschaw pleaded guilty to capital murder and first degree murder.

Speaker 5:
[77:29] He was originally scheduled for a jury trial next week. A guilty plea, no trial, and suddenly, it's over.

Speaker 8:
[77:38] Detective Rick Mulbon is excited. He finally got his guy. He pled guilty. He's getting ready to call Amanda and deliver what he thinks is great news. But he was not expecting this reaction.

Speaker 17:
[77:50] I was shocked. I couldn't even handle it. I said things to Rick that maybe I shouldn't have said, but he deserved to go to trial. He deserved to have the whole laundry. All the truth out. To set her family free, to give that family the truth about everything.

Speaker 8:
[78:12] Accepting the plea agreement for two life sentences, first degree murder, David had to stand before the Goyenas, the victims' loved ones, and he had to admit to killing Angel and Vonda.

Speaker 4:
[78:24] He made a very long, very bizarre statement. He then went on to lecture every participant in the court process.

Speaker 6:
[78:34] I want to say shame on you, Detective Mulbin, for his actions. The Lord God Almighty does not like people to be full of pride of themselves. I pray that you lose that pride before it's too late.

Speaker 3:
[78:47] Every word that came out of David's mouth in court just made me angry, just to see him, to see words coming from his mouth.

Speaker 6:
[78:58] Today, for the sake of my family, I'm pleading guilty to this horrific crime, putting their needs and their desires ahead of my own.

Speaker 5:
[79:07] He said he pleaded guilty for his family.

Speaker 17:
[79:12] No.

Speaker 5:
[79:12] Do you think that was for you and your children?

Speaker 17:
[79:14] I think he lied. He didn't take this deal for his family because he knew I wanted him to go to trial. He murdered him. He doesn't deserve to be alive. I'm sorry. It might be harsh, but it's the truth.

Speaker 13:
[79:30] Two life sentences, I think it's what he got. He is ineligible for parole. He's gonna rot there in jail. Would you forgive somebody to kill your mom and sister? I won't.

Speaker 7:
[79:45] The family's most basic question is never answered in court. And that is, why did he do it?

Speaker 8:
[79:52] So, this is really the first time you're talking about Vonda and Angelique.

Speaker 25:
[79:56] Well, I don't mind talking about it.

Speaker 5:
[79:59] And he does talk about it in a prison interview.

Speaker 11:
[80:07] After all these years, I still think about her. I have a tattoo of two butterflies. It's just a reminder. It's always there. And it's something I can see every day. And I know that she's there, even if she's not.

Speaker 5:
[80:30] Remember, to avoid the death penalty, David Hoshaw had to admit that he killed Vonda and Angelique. But he didn't have to say why. And he hasn't until now.

Speaker 8:
[80:40] David Hoshaw agreed to interview with me over the phone since he is in a high-security prison facility. David tells me that night he went to Angel's house to simply break up with her at one in the morning. How were you thinking the night would have played out?

Speaker 25:
[80:58] I would tell her if there was someone else and that things were over, and I would go back to camp. But, yeah, it didn't quite work out that way.

Speaker 5:
[81:09] David claims that when he told Angel it was over, there were tears and raised voices.

Speaker 25:
[81:15] Her emotions got my emotions going, and, of course, her purpose turned to anger, and it just got escalated from there. Yeah, it was like an impulse, and when I started it just kept going. I just couldn't stop.

Speaker 12:
[81:33] You have one minute remaining.

Speaker 7:
[81:37] And his second victim, he says Vonda tried to stop him.

Speaker 25:
[81:41] You know, I know that I can't change what has happened, and so I've chosen to kind of not think about it.

Speaker 17:
[81:53] I mean, I thought, wow, you know, I just got so lucky. He made himself out to be a guy that was a terrific man. He was a boy scout, engineer. I mean, he takes care of his sons. I mean, he's there for them when they need it.

Speaker 5:
[82:10] In a way, David Hoschaw left two kinds of victims, the ones he killed and the ones he left behind.

Speaker 7:
[82:27] Why?

Speaker 18:
[82:29] That monster. I was married to that monster.

Speaker 7:
[82:34] The ripple effect of grief that families experience and loved ones experience in cases like this, it goes through generations.

Speaker 17:
[82:42] He lied and he, you know, about him being in a relationship with Angelique. So he like got me into the circle and then he got rid of her, murdered her because of basically of me. I'm feeling horrible for them. I hate, you know, I'm not hating him. It's like a lot of hate. So what do you do with it?

Speaker 5:
[83:09] The coroner noted something in their report. The only thing Angel Gollina was wearing when she died was a medallion.

Speaker 12:
[83:17] I have dreamed of a knight in shining armor. Don't laugh, but I've kept a medallion of gold and silver of a knight upon a steed for the day I meet him.

Speaker 7:
[83:29] I had an old mentor who told me, you can always see the soul of your victim reflected in the eyes of those who love them.

Speaker 13:
[83:38] And on the 4th of July, it's kind of a hard day to remember, you know, because that's the weekend this all happened.

Speaker 5:
[83:47] Her brother remembers a moment long after the murders when he went by the house.

Speaker 13:
[83:52] It's gonna laugh at me, but I saw my sister, my mom and my sister standing there looking at me. And they were there and they were smiling and I looked back and they were gone. But I know, I saw them, I'll remember that.

Speaker 3:
[84:08] I think I am at peace. I know I am at peace. It's taken me years to get to this place. I just think of them very fondly. My mom's incredible sense of humor. And Angel just got... Angelique was a gift to our family.

Speaker 5:
[84:32] What are you left with when someone dies? Photographs, memories? For the Guyanas, Angel's poems.

Speaker 3:
[84:42] The night with its endless realm of possibilities. What could last forever? That's my girl. That's my girl.

Speaker 1:
[85:13] Find all new broadcast episodes of 2020 Friday nights at 9 on ABC.

Speaker 20:
[85:21] This episode is brought to you by Progressive Insurance. You chose to hit play on this podcast today, Smart Choice.

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