transcript

Speaker 1:
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Make sure you go to katecasey.substack.com and get my what to watch list. There's stuff in True Crime, there's sports, there's reality TV, there's something for everybody. Also, you can go back and check out all the archive lists. For example, last week, it was pretty heavy on True Crime, so make sure you check out the list. But also, if you go to katecasey.substack.com, you can get articles that I've written, but also the Book Club tab. You can go through and find plenty of books, especially if you're going on a trip soon or planning a summer vacation and want something to read. Go through that tab for all of my suggestions, but also, in most cases, I interview the author so you can listen to the interview before or after you read it. And I think it's most interesting, especially the ones with J. Randy Tarabarelli about the Kennedys. You can hear about the process for writing the book, but also all of the interviews that took place. And sometimes, there are these little nuggets that I think are most interesting, because a lot of the books sort of crossover with one another. So make sure you check out that as well. Now, this week, I've got some upcoming great episodes. So I've got an interview this week with Danielle from Betrayal. It is an absolutely mind-bending story, a true crime story. Krista Rosa is going to come on the show and talk about Real Housewives of Rhode Island. I know you guys have been so excited for him to come back. He's been working on RuPaul's Drag Race, so he will be finished with the show, and he's going to have plenty of time to watch some of the crazy shows that I recommend to him. And also, I've got a great Saturday series episode coming this week. I hope that you listened to last week's episode, Sally's episode. That one, people keep writing me DMs and saying, I can't stop thinking about it. I know that you are going to fully be obsessed with that story. So, make sure you go back and listen to that as well. And lastly, my bonus podcast episodes. Last week, for example, I talked about the Alex Cooper and Alex Earl feud from a crisis communications perspective. I want you to go and check out this week's episodes too, because I'm going to have a bonus episode about the further developments to that Alex Earl, Alex Cooper story. Especially because a lot of you are asking me, what does this really mean in terms of the podcast industry? Like, what do we need to know that happens behind the scenes? So I've got all of that information for you. So today's episode, Carlos King is back with me. Now, Carlos King is a famed reality TV producer. He's a great friend of mine. We don't always agree on things, which is so funny, and we just sort of roll with it. He's great because he has a different lens through which he looks at these shows because he has worked on so many of them, including the early seasons of Real Housewives of New Jersey and Atlanta. So I love to hear his hot takes. In today's episode, we talk about the Real Housewives of Beverly Hills finale, which let's be honest, a lot of people did not think it was the most dynamic season. The majority of it was about Duret's fallout with the rest of the cast. She's completely lost her mind. I think over the last two seasons, you've seen a different version of her. There has to have been some conversation that she had with somebody in her life who said, you are so boring on this show and you need to become more of the center of a story. And I think she may be like hit the 11 on the dial. She went over her skis and she's completely lost her mind. So she's written a book, and I put that in air quotes called Unburdened. We don't know if the book will be finished. I think it's available for pre-sale. So maybe there's hope with that. But all we saw this season was she unveiled the cover of the book, which I got to be honest, is something that I would have never put in my bingo card. So of course, Erica and Kyle are so sick of her by the end of the season, they don't even show up. We discuss in this episode why that's a big deal. Because on the surface, you think, okay, they don't have to go to every party, or my god, that's so horrible, why didn't they support her? We help you kind of understand what happens behind the scenes, so it kind of clicks into place a little bit better. And then of course, this season we've had Amanda, who I wouldn't say she was a great fit for the show. She's younger. I felt like every episode was an infomercial for her business. We explain why that's a problem. I honestly, as I say in this episode, think she would be a better fit on Real Housewives of Orange County. I know that she spends most of her time actually in Orange County versus LA. I just think she would be a better fit there. And then we talk about Bose and why she has this friendship with Dorit when she's an absolute monster this season, which makes no sense. And the addition of Rachel Zoe as well. Now, I know there's been a lot of speculation whether or not Kyle Richards is finished with the show. I would say probably not. I mean, her youngest daughter is going off to college next year, and that probably frees up a lot more of her time. So if she's got a house in Nashville and wants to live there and kind of unwind from LA, who could blame her? I know that she's been in a lot more acting opportunities that are based out there, but I think that's pretty typical of somebody whose children have all left the house. You kind of recalibrate and maybe pursue opportunities that you previously were unable to do so because of time. So those are the moving parts that we discuss in today's episode. Again, I've got great episodes this week. Please go back and listen to last week's episodes, including my interviews with Juan Christine Marie from Trust Me, the False Prophet, also Gabrielle Vega from The Predator of Sevilla. Lots of great stuff, again, on the bonus podcast but on the What to Watch list. As always, thank you so much for listening to the show. Thank you for your five-star reviews, and also make sure you go into the Facebook group Reality Life with Kate Casey and check out what other people are listening to, reading, watching, etc. this week, this month, this year. So here is my interview with Carlos King. First of all, I love the sweatshirt.

Speaker 2:
[08:58] Thank you. You know, a little merch never hurt nobody.

Speaker 1:
[09:01] No, exactly. Exactly.

Speaker 2:
[09:04] I'm loving the bob, the blonde bob that you do. And it's getting longer.

Speaker 1:
[09:09] No, I had to cut it. I would look like the lead singer of Poison for a little bit. It was bad. Do you watch The Valley?

Speaker 2:
[09:21] You know what? I'm ashamed to say I watched all the episodes last season. I know that I'm three episodes behind. I'm going to spend this week in catching up. It's been a very busy year so far, but I love The Valley. Jessie Lolley is my favorite.

Speaker 1:
[09:36] You always like the weirdest people.

Speaker 2:
[09:41] I love him. I love Jessie. I love Brittany. I love Jasmine. I love the cast, but Jessie is like, I think he's good to me.

Speaker 1:
[09:50] I brought you here today to talk about Real Housewives of Beverly Hills, because of course the finale has aired. I know that you had Amanda on your show, and I know there have been times where you've really enjoyed Dorit. And so I needed to know what you thought of the finale, and have you seen the clips that have come out that are for the reunion part one?

Speaker 2:
[10:12] I saw the trailer.

Speaker 1:
[10:13] Okay.

Speaker 2:
[10:15] I don't watch the clips, only because, oh, I never watch the sneak peek clips for teasing the next episode, because I want to watch the episode in full. And I'm old school, okay? I like to be surprised a little bit.

Speaker 1:
[10:32] Okay.

Speaker 2:
[10:32] So I did see the trailer, though, and I have tons of thoughts about that. Now, okay, the finale I thought was underwhelming, like this season has been, it was a nothing burger. I am completely over Kyle vs. I can't, it's teetering along the lines of Melissa Gorga and Teresa Giudice when they were beefing, and how we were sort of like, we're tired of seeing this. Something has to happen. They never put the show on a two year pause. And within that time frame, the family's made up. And now we know that Teresa and Melissa are back. And guess what? I'm looking forward to seeing what that looks like. The finale overall, I'm sick of it. What's interesting to me is seeing Erika get activated, which I think like, yeah, we can dive into that a lot too. When it comes to Amanda and Dorit, listen, I think Dorit is performative. I think the Cigarette, I think the See You Next Tuesday, I think having no sense of humanity when she's talking to a person is awfully strange to me. And it makes you sometimes question the character of Rachel Zoe and Bows, like, how can you be friends with this woman who acts like an a-hole? And she's so self-absorbed, and I don't find anything likable about Doreen so far. I mean, I love her a lot because I was like, oh, she's interesting and she's witty. Now she's just an a-hole.

Speaker 1:
[12:24] Okay, so Boze, for example, she's been in corporate America and has dealt with a multitude of dodo birds. And when Doreen is talking to her and explaining something, and one thing that really drives me crazy about Doreen is the way that she speaks to people. It's like she treats everyone like their children. Oh, baby dear. Oh, baby girl. Like, don't call me baby girl. Don't call me that. And so she always says stuff like that to Boze, and then she'll explain something and go on and on and on. And I'm just looking at Boze thinking, you've had to sit through stupid conferences, seminars, business meetings with people who talk in circles. But somehow, outside of business, you have the patience for this woman who doesn't know what she's talking about, never can land the plane, and probably still has no idea anything about you that's personal, because she doesn't ask anybody questions.

Speaker 2:
[13:17] Yes, yes, yes. And it goes to show you what I've always said. These shows are built on alliances versus friendships. And I think because Bows came in last season, and we have to go back just a little bit to understand the mentality of Bows on the show. Because I don't feel like Bows in real life will be friends with Deree. I think Deree offers nothing of substance. And I think Bows has a lot of substance, right? Before Bows started filming her first season, she reached out to Garcelle to have a meeting with her.

Speaker 1:
[13:54] Okay.

Speaker 2:
[13:55] To ask Garcelle, well, tell me the tea about the girls.

Speaker 1:
[14:00] Okay.

Speaker 2:
[14:00] And Garcelle said, no, you will get to know them for yourself and form your own opinion. And I thought that was super smart of Garcelle. I bring that up to say, Bowles already went in trying to understand the assignment versus coming in saying, I'm just going to go and beat me and we'll see what happens and roll the dice.

Speaker 1:
[14:26] When I started my podcast, I worried so much about its success. Is this really the right decision for me? And what if I fail? But that leap was one of the best decisions I ever made. And then I think about all of you that have done the same, starting your own businesses. Shopify has helped so many of you ease some of your worries with their expertise, helpful tools, and easy to use platform. And trust me, I wish I had the same when I created my podcast. Shopify is the commerce platform behind millions of businesses around the world, and 10% of all e-commerce in the US from household names like ABAdernation and Skims to brands, just getting started. Get started with your own design studio with hundreds of ready to use templates. Shopify helps you build a beautiful online store that matches your brand style. Accelerate your efficiency whether you're uploading new products or trying to improve existing ones. Shopify is packed with helpful AI tools that write product descriptions, page headlines, and even enhance your product photography. And did I mention that iconic purple shop pay button that's used by millions of businesses around the world? It's why Shopify has the best converting checkout on the planet. It also helps boost conversions, meaning less cards going abandoned and more sales for you. It's time to turn those what ifs into cha-ching with Shopify today. Sign up for your $1 per month trial today at shopify.com/katecasey. Go to shopify.com/katecasey. That's shopify.com/katecasey. Which I understand, because she has a corporate background. Why would you go into anything without being prepared? Which gets the question, should you go from corporate America to the television show? Maybe it's not a good fit.

Speaker 2:
[16:10] Maybe not, right? I happened to enjoy her a lot last season, because I thought she came in, to your point, asking the questions to everybody. Like, wait, I'm confused with this, I'm confused here.

Speaker 1:
[16:21] Right.

Speaker 2:
[16:22] You and I both know this for sure. The moment you start your housewives career, your sense of reality is gone.

Speaker 1:
[16:31] Gone, maybe gone.

Speaker 2:
[16:32] It's gone. It's immediately gone. And you're seeing that a lot this season, which is why 98% of the audience aren't feeling Bows this season the way they did last season. They, I was turned off when she's talking to Rachel Zell saying, we got the same hairstyle. I'm Rachel Bows. And it's like, why are you dumbing yourself down? Like, you are an educated, smart, accomplished woman. And that's what we, you're marbling over the same hairstyle. Like, first of all, you don't have the same hairstyle for, for the obvious reasons I won't point out. Secondly, the way she sort of caters to Dorit is very strange to me because it doesn't, Dorit is such an a-hole that I don't understand why Rachel and Boz aren't like, come here, girl, you're being a bitch.

Speaker 1:
[17:33] It's wild.

Speaker 2:
[17:34] You need, I love you. Me and you have friends where I literally tell my friends, if they talk shit, I'm like, and I have this reputation when it comes to my friends because I have one word. If I feel like they went too far, they all say to me, here comes Carlos, he's going to say, be nice. Yeah. He went too far.

Speaker 1:
[17:52] He went too far.

Speaker 2:
[17:53] Aren't you the same with your friend group?

Speaker 1:
[17:55] Please, have you met me? I'm from Philadelphia. Yeah. Those are the kind of people you need to encircle yourself with. And I fear, not fear, because I don't really care enough about her to fear it, but Dorit probably has zero friends in the real world anymore. I don't know if she had them beforehand. She certainly does not have them now. She encircles herself with people who she's paying to do her hair, make up, or run errands for her. I don't think there's anybody in her life that she listens to that can say, pedal the brakes. You've become a monster. I just don't think they, if they existed at one time, she has cut them loose.

Speaker 2:
[18:35] Yes, once again, we know that the moment, and I want the world to know this. It's one thing to be the reality star and you lose a sense of reality and that is a real thing. Kate, let me know if you agree with me. I mean, being a housewife is something completely different. The, because your overnight success happens immediately. And it's such a juggernaut of a show that you're infamous. You're not even famous, I think, until your fifth season. You're infamous because we know the average time that a woman career can last on Housewives on average is three seasons. And then once you're off the show, no one cares about you. Look at The Real Housewives of Dallas. So the shelf life isn't there. And I think when it comes to Doreen, I think you're right. She's been on the show for eight seasons. She's, as somebody who loves a villain, as somebody who loves a woman on these shows who are in your face and all those things, I do appreciate Doreen for giving us great moments. The reason why it's hard to watch her is because she's not coming across like a good human being. And that's where I draw the line.

Speaker 1:
[20:00] Do you think that somebody said, oh, the scene with you smoking, everybody loved it, so play that up. Do you think that people said they loved it when you said C-U-N-T, like play that up. Do you think that somebody said, you want to keep this job, lean fully into villain?

Speaker 2:
[20:14] So do you remember this tidbit that came out of Lisa Rinna's book?

Speaker 1:
[20:19] I never read it, so tell me.

Speaker 2:
[20:20] Okay. So Lisa Rinna said, there was a housewife, she did not name names. And she said this housewife was on the verge of losing her job. And Lisa Rinna told her, you have to be more real. And you have to be honest. And you have to do what it takes to keep your job. And everybody assumed it was Dureed, because around the timeline that Lisa gave, it was when Dureed came back and started to tell us she's divorcing PK. PK is an alcoholic.

Speaker 1:
[20:59] You're right.

Speaker 2:
[20:59] She's smoking a cigarette. And it was like, that season of Dureed, we were like, who are you? And what we've learned is the cast have said Dureed's been smoking before she got on the show. She always smoked. She was just smart enough to do it behind the scenes. So, yes, I think she's trying hard to keep her job, and she listened to Lisa and Renna.

Speaker 1:
[21:23] By the way, the small things say so much. We always say that, right? The fact that you were not honest about smoking cigarettes, what else are you not honest about? We know people who smoke cigarettes. That's a huge part of your life. I've got a friend in New York. When I go visit her, she's like, we got to go to a restaurant that has a patio. I got to be home. That's a big part of their life. But I also, I'm sorry, but why has she been protected? You're accommodating somebody in their pursuit of hiding a big part of their life.

Speaker 2:
[21:56] Well, remember, on your podcast, and it's funny because I referenced this episode a lot on my podcast. On your podcast with Alex Baskin, maybe Kate, I want to say it was maybe back in 2019, if I'm not mistaken, you asked him as a production company, because at the time he was working for Evolution, and Evolution at that time produced both OC and Beverly Hills. Alex Baskin has now got its own production company that produces both. But at that time, you asked him and you said, what's the difference between producing OC and Beverly Hills? And I will never forget his answer. He said, oh, OC, they lay everything out on the table. Everything is there for the taking. And he said, but in Beverly Hills, they protect each other and you have to extract, you have to work hard to extract anything out of them, because they will hold each other's secrets. That's the reason.

Speaker 1:
[22:57] It's so annoying because I like to know every detail about the way a person moves through life. The cigarette is this very specific thing. And now you're late probably a lot of the times because you're smoking cigarettes. Like call her out.

Speaker 2:
[23:13] Kate, in the words of Oprah, aha moment. That's why she's late all the damn time because she's smoking and she's trying to like wash off her hair.

Speaker 1:
[23:25] Yeah.

Speaker 2:
[23:25] That makes more sense to me. Because I don't know anybody in my life that smokes a cigarette.

Speaker 1:
[23:32] Of course you don't. Very few people in the world still smoke cigarettes. I mean, people smoke, they're probably vaping, you know? Yeah.

Speaker 2:
[23:41] I know that. Vaping. Cigarettes is, I don't know that anyone at all. But with that being said, are you saying that if a person smokes cigarettes, that's a huge part of... See, I didn't know that.

Speaker 1:
[23:53] That is a huge part of someone's life. It's a time sucker.

Speaker 2:
[23:58] Really?

Speaker 1:
[23:58] Think about it. Every time, you have to go back in time because you've even been around somebody who smokes cigarettes, like everybody does.

Speaker 2:
[24:04] My father used to smoke cigarettes.

Speaker 1:
[24:06] Well, that took up a lot of his life. And you notice the only time that she was on time this entire season was when it was for her book. That small moment says a lot about somebody. Your time is not important, but when it has to do with me, you better be here and you better be on time. She's talking to the party planner. And that party planner is like, we can't really do anything until all the women are here, and I'm going to tell you why. The publishing company that she went through, I think they're predominantly self-published books, but they clearly were part of the party, paying for the party, I would assume, because they mention them, you have representatives there, and they want to get their money's worth. So they're probably saying, let's wait until all the housewives are there, so they can have their moment to promote the business.

Speaker 2:
[24:56] Absolutely.

Speaker 1:
[24:57] So they're probably pissed off at her too, but you make your bed, you lay in it. You didn't care about anybody else's time throughout the season, you held production up, and now you expect everybody to give you the same respect. And it's like, what? But I wish that stuff was called out more, and I hope that they do it on the reunion.

Speaker 2:
[25:16] Well, to your point though, wow, I never even thought about it that way. Yeah, because as a producer, the moment the cast have something to promote, oh, honey, they will make sure to schedule it around the time that everyone's available. Because the press opportunities you get, the photo ops, all of that, being in the press and all of that stuff makes your, whatever you're selling, it makes your investors happy, it makes the brands happy. So now that I'm thinking about it, she's less pissed about them not showing up because of whatever beef they had. She's more pissed because she promised her publishers, yes, all the housewives would be there.

Speaker 1:
[26:06] She doesn't care about them and if they were there to support her, it makes her look bad.

Speaker 2:
[26:12] And maybe that's why, because the thing is this, if I'm a publisher investing in DeRitte, I need the stars of the show to be there. Kyle Richards has to be there.

Speaker 1:
[26:23] She's got to be there. Erica Jane.

Speaker 2:
[26:25] Erica Jane? It's not in the middle, but the top three would be Kyle, Erica, and Kathy Hilton.

Speaker 1:
[26:36] Yes.

Speaker 2:
[26:38] Only Kathy Hilton showed up. So, yes, to be pissed. And Kate, do you think Kyle and Erica knew that? And that's why they-

Speaker 1:
[26:46] Absolutely. That was the fuck you to her. That was it. I mean, that is a power move. Think about it. If I have a production deal with Netflix, and you and I are in a fight, and my show is going to debut called Podcasting in the Real World, and they expect you to show up because they're like, oh, it'd be great. It's going to look great on TV and the promotion and social media, and then you don't show up. That's your fu to me.

Speaker 2:
[27:24] So good.

Speaker 1:
[27:25] So that's like, it's like, all the fights that they have are things that are happening off camera. And that's why I think we're at a point in the Housewives ecosystem, I think it's time to just call that stuff out.

Speaker 2:
[27:40] Well, you have to, because the thing is this, my brain is tired of watching them argue. Okay, I can't watch another scene of like, well, you did this to me with PK or you're trying to form an army against me. And it's like, we're still talking about this three years later.

Speaker 1:
[27:59] By the way, that's why Dorit was mad too, when she gets to Kathy Hilton's house, and she's walking down the steps and the party is for Theo Grace, the jewelry company, and she sees they're all sitting there. She's not really mad about an intervention because she likes all of the attention and the moments. She's like, oh, you bitches can come to this party, but you made me look idiotic in front of my investors. You see what I mean?

Speaker 2:
[28:31] Oh, okay.

Speaker 1:
[28:33] Are you catching what I'm throwing?

Speaker 2:
[28:35] Oh, baby, call me Alex Rodriguez, I caught it.

Speaker 1:
[28:50] And then also, when Dureed says to Erica, I don't know, what have you talked about this season? You have nothing going on. When Erica starts to cry, she's not crying for Dureed and her friendship. She's crying, she's looking at Alex and all the producers, who fed her this bullshit? I haven't bled for you guys? I haven't talked about my nightmare life?

Speaker 2:
[29:14] Yeah.

Speaker 1:
[29:15] She's crying for them and the audience. She's not crying. She doesn't give a shit about Dureed.

Speaker 2:
[29:20] No, and I even said she was crying because she's like, Dureed, how low can you go to fuck me and to embarrass me, not only in front of Alex Baskin and the producers, in front of these women? Like, I don't bring it. Like, I haven't brought anything, which is why she said, I brought See You Next Tuesdays to this group, I brought you to this TV show, you did, and you're late, shut up. She's pissed because she's like, you have now put me on the spot when it comes to my job.

Speaker 1:
[29:53] That's right.

Speaker 2:
[29:54] Right.

Speaker 1:
[29:55] Remember when she said, I say important shit, you just say a lot of shit? I'm paraphrasing.

Speaker 2:
[30:01] Yes, yes, yes.

Speaker 1:
[30:04] And they're also like, we protected you. And when they're like, and they give two examples, it was like, the dog thing, that's really, like, who gives shit about the dog? And I'm not cutting on the dog, but it's really more about you were set up to look terrible with production and Lisa and to look like an idiot. And we protected you. And then we protected you when the rest of the world thought you set up this fake burglary, we protected you. So then for you to say this nonsense about why we've never been there for you, you can give me, as Chris DeRosa would say, 8,000 breaks.

Speaker 2:
[30:44] And guess what? The thing is, and I did catch that too, because the thing for that moment was to go up against Lisa Vanderpump was a no-no.

Speaker 1:
[30:55] Oh, no.

Speaker 2:
[30:56] And it's funny, because when they flashback that moment where Erica did take up for the read about Lucy, Lucy, Apple Goosie or Juicy, whatever, it was, I'm sure you call this because you're Kate the Great. It was the look that Erica gave when she defended the read, and she was like, I mean, the reads, I spoke to the read and she didn't know anything. It was sort of like Erica showing the read, I'm going against Lisa Vanderpump, arguably the head honcho of the show, in defense of you. It made Kyle also feel comfortable doing it. And to know that you not only put my job on the line by highlighting what you consider my lack of bringing it on the show or clocking in, you're now saying this woman you met two years ago at a party. Let's see if she goes up against anybody for you the way we did. We risk our reputation amongst the fans, because Lisa Vanderpump's fans are brutal.

Speaker 1:
[32:08] Brutal.

Speaker 2:
[32:09] Yeah, so let's see what Bows does, because let's be clear. Tell me if you disagree. I don't see Bows going up against anybody if that makes her look bad with the audience. I don't see her doing it.

Speaker 1:
[32:26] Yeah. I was surprised we didn't get more from her second season. I think anybody who's worked in corporate America has had to be uncomfortably direct to people.

Speaker 2:
[32:40] And the thing for me is this, where do we go from here? Because I saw the reunion trailer, and I love the fact that they're doing more of what you're suggesting, which is, and hopefully because three parts isn't warranted, so I'm hoping it's because we're getting what Kate is highlighting, which is break more of the fourth wall. We see Kyle tell Erica, yeah, she's like smoking and doing all these things because the fans like it and she's not who she is anymore. And then to read saying Kyle has the power to get anyone off the show is like, now this is shit. I want to hear.

Speaker 1:
[33:19] That's what I want to hear. That's what I want to hear. Like that, let's talk it out. Yeah, let's talk it out. Now, one other clip that they show you is that Erica is talking about Amanda, and she says, Amanda, you filmed a scene where you told the camera guys, make sure that you get my Chanel bag on the floor. And she said, we didn't get the real you. We got to like a lot of that. And then they talked about, for a brief second, about how she was emasculating her husband by pointing out that she bought the house. She makes more in a month than he makes in a year. And so they're going through these things. But I thought about that one part where she said, you asked the cameraman, make sure you get my Chanel bag on the floor. And I remembered that she'd been on that episode of Selling Sunset. And I thought, oh, she's treating this like it's Selling Sunset. Selling Sunset is a whole other dynamic where you want to show how all your crazy ass outfits are. You're going to say something insane, walk out the door. You don't really have to explain your business because none of the agents on Selling Sunset, I don't think they even really sell the properties. I think she treated Real Housewives of Beverly Hills like an infomercial for her business, but also she thought it was filmed in the same way that Selling Sunset was.

Speaker 2:
[34:33] That makes a lot of sense. That is hilarious.

Speaker 1:
[34:36] Yeah. So Erica says she's too young for the show. And what I think she means by that is she's like an influencer. Influencers can curate in an image. They don't really have to give you the nuts and bolts of their businesses. They could just kind of say whatever, where it is. So I think she's trying to say that's the mindset. But this is a group of older women who are not of the influencer age. They're like, they've, you know, they're not in that age bracket. So they, that's kind of like the argument Olympics. So Amanda's treating it like a Selling Sunset episode, and they're treating it like the argue Olympics. So they're just in two different wavelengths. I think Amanda is, I think she just treated the show like an infomercial. Like every single moment is about her brand and her business. And so it's just, I never really got a sense of who she really is. I, she lives near me apparently. I'd love to go out to dinner with her and just go, okay, who was your first boyfriend? What are your parents really like? Are they weird? Do you hate your siblings? You know, like that kind of stuff is what people really want to know. I don't want to be sold your business 24-7. I want to get to know you really well and then I'll care about your business. But I don't care about your business and then care about you.

Speaker 2:
[35:58] And that is the way it works.

Speaker 1:
[36:00] I think she's better for Real Housewives of Orange County. I think she's a better fit. Because Orange County...

Speaker 2:
[36:06] I can see that. I can see that.

Speaker 1:
[36:07] She's got the small kids. She's younger. But also I think that she kind of... I feel like OC really embraces the influencer personality. I think she would feel more at home here than with the women. Beverly Hills is a whole other dynamic. It's like, you know, you have to be part of the industry. She's not, you know... I think Sutton struggles with that because she's not part of the industry. And she'll never be accepted because of it. And she's also new money. I think Beverly Hills, unless you're like, you know, Selena Gomez, you know, like you've got new money, but you're also like super powerful. It takes them a long time to accept people.

Speaker 2:
[36:52] Yeah, yeah, yeah. And that's been evident as we watched the whole season. So yeah.

Speaker 1:
[36:57] Yeah. Well, thank you. I appreciate your insight.

Speaker 2:
[37:02] I mean, listen, I love hopping on your podcast.

Speaker 1:
[37:05] We always have to think about the smoking now.

Speaker 2:
[37:08] I. It provided so much context to her.

Speaker 1:
[37:17] Yeah.

Speaker 2:
[37:18] And like you said, you're hiding that. What else are you hiding?

Speaker 1:
[37:21] What else? By the way, why didn't we ever see her house? I think we saw one time the first episode, when she sits down with Boz. If she's spending so much money on clothes, why can't I see her house? Because what you're projecting is that she's like a hoarder or she's got a shopping addiction. Disprove it to me. Show me her house.

Speaker 2:
[37:42] So good.

Speaker 1:
[37:42] Yeah. Tell everybody where they can listen to your podcast and follow you for everything.

Speaker 2:
[37:47] Yeah. So Reality with the King podcast, wherever you get your podcast, we're also on YouTube. And you can follow me at vcarlosking underscore on all social platforms.

Speaker 1:
[38:04] I want to thank my great guest, Carlos King, and remind you to make sure that you click subscribe. Please leave a five-star review. Join the Facebook group, Reality Life with Kate Casey. My what to watch list is at katecasey.substack.com, and follow me on social media. My Instagram is at KKCCA, TikTok, It's Kate Casey, and Twitter threads and blue sky at KKCCA. Check back tomorrow for an absolutely do not miss episode.