transcript

Speaker 1:
[00:00] If you crash in a private plane, no one feels sorry for you. I think it's like, we're, that's my biggest fear now is like.

Speaker 2:
[00:05] If you were on a Southwest.

Speaker 1:
[00:06] Yeah, if I'm on Southwest, people will be like, oh my God, what a woman of the people, what a hero, died so young. People hate people flying up.

Speaker 2:
[00:13] They do.

Speaker 1:
[00:14] Yeah, and this elitist bitch, she deserved it.

Speaker 2:
[00:28] Hi, everyone from New York Magazine and the Vox Media Podcast Network. This is On with Kara Swisher, and I'm Kara Swisher. My guest today is comedian Nikki Glaser. She's really having a moment right now. She hosted the Golden Globes this year and last year, and she's set to do it again in 2027. She was just named one of Time Magazine's most influential people of the year, and she's also about to drop a brand new comedy special on Hulu on Friday. It's called Good Girl, and in it, Nikki jokes about aging, fame, and her sexuality. It's personal, raw, and self-deprecating, which is really Nikki's sweet spot. I really enjoy Nikki Glaser. I think she's incredibly refreshing. I think it's interesting what she talks about, especially going there about her sexuality. And I know there's sort of a take that women talk too much about their sexuality. I think she does in a really smart way. And obviously she's engendered a lot of fans, because she is indeed having a moment, and it's in her 40s, and it's well-deserved after a long career. So let's get to my interview with Nikki. Our expert question comes from director and producer, Judd Apatow. Nikki is working on a film with him, and she also used to babysit his kids. This is going to be a really fun one, because Nikki is a lot of fun and very thoughtful too. So stick around.

Speaker 3:
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Speaker 4:
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Speaker 5:
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Speaker 2:
[03:36] Nikki, thanks for coming on On.

Speaker 1:
[03:39] Thank you so much for having me. It's an honor.

Speaker 2:
[03:41] So let's start with Good Girl. I'm a huge fan, obviously many people are, but this is this new special which comes out this week. It's your fifth one, but you've expressed a lot of fear and anxiety about its release. And you said you don't even want anyone to watch it.

Speaker 1:
[03:55] I don't know. I just, I kind of had this revelation when I was editing it, that now that it's like coming out, I guess the editing process is a whole other kind of torturous self-examination. But now that it's coming out and people are starting to see it, and I was hearing from my publicists, like we've sent out early copies of it. So people are watching it like today. It was just, yeah, this sense of doom that people are going to see a side of myself that maybe is a little bit more darker than I, I guess my image is now that I've in the past two or three years and I've had a more mainstream image. And there's maybe something in me that wants to protect that and to keep that kind of popularity coming in because it's made my life a lot easier. And I've used this analogy before, but I'll use it again because it's just so apt for it is that I just feel like stand up for me is like sex. Like I enjoy it. It's something I like to do. It like lets me behave in ways that I would not normally behave, say things, and do things that I am otherwise ashamed of doing. And then when I started doing stand up, you know, it was just like open mic nights and just clubs where there was no worry of it being recorded or anyone being able to even, you know, review it. I mean, I never put out clips online or anything. And so it was like, even if people came up to me after the show and quoted me back to myself, I could almost deny what I'd said because there was no proof of it. So it was like this safe space. So it to me, when I think about my stand up, it's like hearing people kind of talk about, you know, if someone after sex were to be like, oh, that thing you said, or that one time you did that thing, you're just like, no, no, no, no, no.

Speaker 2:
[05:35] We shall not speak of this.

Speaker 1:
[05:36] I don't want to hear about it. It's just so, it's embarrassing to me. So when people see my special, I kind of change the subject really quickly. I just want kind of, even now I'm like, let's move on to something else.

Speaker 2:
[05:47] I'm so sorry, this entire podcast is about your comedy.

Speaker 1:
[05:50] I have to promote it.

Speaker 2:
[05:52] We can talk about Pete Hengseth if you'd like.

Speaker 1:
[05:55] Oh, no, thank you.

Speaker 2:
[05:56] He just quoted.

Speaker 1:
[05:57] Yeah, who just quoted Pulp Fiction.

Speaker 2:
[05:58] What a moron.

Speaker 1:
[05:59] As a Bible quote. Yes.

Speaker 2:
[06:00] You can't write this up.

Speaker 1:
[06:01] I know, you really can't.

Speaker 2:
[06:02] So do you get like this with all your specials?

Speaker 1:
[06:05] I do. I think I just started to explore that feeling because I'm like this with everything I put out. Not everything, because there's some things that I don't have a problem watching, if I'm acting or if I'm singing or like any kind of, but when I'm being myself, I have a hard time watching it. I think it's like editing a special is the most uncomfortable thing I've ever done in my life. And honestly, in the past, I've had to delay the releases of specials because I just couldn't watch it and I couldn't edit it. And I'm not someone who pushes deadlines, but that's the only time in my life that I've had to because it's just so incredibly painful.

Speaker 2:
[06:43] But you want to edit, right?

Speaker 1:
[06:44] Yeah, you do, because sometimes you outsource and you go, oh, I'll trust my friends to look at it and give me their notes on it. And then in the end, the self-consciousness that makes me not want to watch myself is the same kind of self-consciousness that makes me as the only one who could edit it.

Speaker 2:
[06:58] Because it's you.

Speaker 1:
[06:59] Yeah, it's me. Yes.

Speaker 2:
[07:00] I mean, I just did that with a special ed for Santa and I very much was like, it's me. Don't tell me what I am. So how do you overcome that? Do you not?

Speaker 1:
[07:10] The one time I struggled with it, I was reading The Tools by Schultz, I'm thinking his name is, I forget his name, but he is kind of controversial now. But there was one quote in it, it was like, I love fear, fear sets me free. And I was just repeating that to myself over and over of like, I just have to be uncomfortable. I just, I mean, honestly, the only reason I do it is because I have a team of people that are asking me to do it. Otherwise, I probably would never release a special ever. Or if it would just wasn't a part of my career, I would love to just have stand up, be this thing that is just live in the moment and there's no record of it.

Speaker 2:
[07:47] Which is your favorite part, right? So Phil Stutz, Phil Stutz is the author.

Speaker 1:
[07:50] Phil Stutz, yeah, Phil Stutz, sorry, yes.

Speaker 2:
[07:52] So you eat fear for breakfast? Is that the message?

Speaker 1:
[07:55] Yeah, that's the thing of like, I love fear. I run into fear. Picture fear as like a wall that you have to run into. And so I kind of go into that of like, I know that my self-esteem is built upon doing things that are hard and conquering them. So I know that on the other side of doing this horribly uncomfortable thing is me feeling better about myself. And it does always wind up that way. The thing that I fear most of regretting some decision I made. I mean, there's so many regrets I make in the edit where I look back and I think, oh my God, why didn't I just say this extra line? Or why didn't I describe this part differently? Or why didn't I make a funnier face at this moment? And I just have to think, okay, I've worked a lot on that of listening to a lot of Sam Harris meditations and podcasts about regret and how there's no point in it, first of all, and also there's something that me not doing that funny face or me not making that extra tag that really only fits that joke. I can't really use that again. There will be some use for it someday. Even in talking about it right now, this is a use for me regretting something is talking about regret. I'm here with you.

Speaker 2:
[09:03] But you can also, editing is a constant process. Like I know Mike Bibiglia does things over and changes them on the course of his journey essentially.

Speaker 1:
[09:12] Well, that's my problem is that I should be watching and listening to myself through the course of putting together a special and I don't. I just go off of memory. And if I were to even watch my set one time before and review it, like everyone tells me to, I could be so much better. So I think there's always just that fear of realizing my potential. It's not about what I-

Speaker 2:
[09:33] Or you don't want to look at yourself. Because one of the main topics in the special is your appearance and the pressure to maintain it, which is interesting. There's a line where you say, when you look fuckable, your life is great. And a lot of your jokes center on how you embrace that harsh truth because it helped you professionally. Talk a little bit about that.

Speaker 1:
[09:50] Yeah. I actually just was rereading Tina Fey's Bossy Pants. And she had a great part in that that really synthesized everything I want to say about that is that one of the things she learned from Lauren Michaels is that, don't feel bad about asking for a makeup touch-up or perfecting your lighting or making sure that a scene that you're putting together on SNL is dressed well and detailed and pretty because if people are drawn to it, optically, they're going to hear you more. So I think in the end, it's just about really wanting to be heard and feeling like when you are pretty, both men and women are drawn to watch you and then therefore listen to what you have to say.

Speaker 2:
[10:33] Interesting. Does it bother you at all? Yes. It was really interesting because I was watching when you were talking about it, I was like, she thinks she looks bad? You know what I mean? It was interesting.

Speaker 1:
[10:41] Yeah.

Speaker 2:
[10:41] I mean, the obvious question is male comedians don't face that same kind of, in fact, many of them do not look good in any way whatsoever.

Speaker 1:
[10:47] No, they don't and they lean into that and I'm very envious of being able to not have to care about that stuff because it is so time consuming and I feel like I would get a lot more done and I would just be more rested and just a more well- balanced person if I didn't spend so much time on all the upkeep to look a certain way. But then there's a part of me that also feels bad that they don't get a chance to really level up and that they kind of don't have as many options to draw the eye as women do. So, we're getting into manosphere talk here of like, women just, but there is a part of that that I do have some compassion for with men where like, if they have a zit, they just have to have a zit.

Speaker 2:
[11:28] Well, they could look smacks, you know, it's a thing.

Speaker 1:
[11:30] Well, now, yes, they could break their bones with a hammer and see how that works out for them.

Speaker 2:
[11:36] That guy's not doing very well today.

Speaker 1:
[11:38] No, he's not. No, he's not. But yeah, it's something that I struggle with. I'm both grateful for it, but I also resent it deeply. And I'm also terrified of it eventually kind of falling away from me.

Speaker 2:
[11:49] So, you made it material. No, you were talking about facelifts. That was very funny. People come before you with their bad facelifts, presumably. Yeah. Yeah. Now men are in the bad facelift period of time, I've noticed.

Speaker 1:
[12:01] Yeah, they're getting them now too. And I get why. I mean, it's really, there's really good work out there now that can be done really subtly. You kind of, you can't, you don't notice it as much anymore. And that's the other thing is like the more success I've had and the more money I have, the more options I have to look hotter. And it kind of feels like if you aren't doing everything you can and reaching again, your potential in that realm, you're failing in some way. And there's almost like a wistfulness for when I used to not be able to afford Botox. And I could say, okay, well, I look like shit because I can't afford to look hot. And now that I can afford to look hot, it just feels like, God, why am I not doing this thing? And oh my gosh, they came up with the, and the peptides and I should be doing that laser. And then there's another, and then you do that laser. And then two months later, they go in and they go, oh no, that laser removes the fat on your face. You need the fat on your face.

Speaker 2:
[12:53] So there's the peptides.

Speaker 1:
[12:54] And the peptides. I mean, I just listened to you talk to that guy about them. And I'm so glad to hear that maybe I shouldn't be doing those because I was for a second. And then I fell off because I didn't feel any difference.

Speaker 2:
[13:06] That's correct. I won't go into it, but men are more into it than everything. I'm getting yelled at by a series of gay men right now. And I don't really care what you say. I mean, sure, use it, knock yourself out. But one of the things, it is that vicious. Although I was just thinking as you were talking, like, I can't think of a male comic who's actually hot. I mean, I can think of a lot of actors.

Speaker 1:
[13:25] Yeah.

Speaker 2:
[13:25] Who?

Speaker 1:
[13:26] I mean, there's some good looking ones. I mean, I don't want to name things because I don't want to give them any credit because I'm not such a fan of their material. But there are some that are attractive, but it is distracting and I think that it hurts them in the end.

Speaker 2:
[13:45] Oh, interesting. I think it's a very low bar for men.

Speaker 1:
[13:48] It is a low bar. I mean, it couldn't be truer that just like men just age. We just accept they're aging a lot more and we trust them more as they age. We think they sound smarter and have more to say, and we let them pause longer and take longer to tell stories, and we hang on their every word. Whereas I just don't feel, I'm just fearing that when I start to show the signs of aging that people won't care anymore. There's proof behind that.

Speaker 2:
[14:17] Yeah, it's true. But this special was recorded in St. Louis, which is where you grew up and where you live now, correct?

Speaker 1:
[14:23] Yes.

Speaker 2:
[14:24] The Midwest is a very different place than New York or LA. Now, St. Louis is a pretty hip place actually, people don't know that, but it's pretty cool city. You joke about how people don't care as much as what they look like, and actually insult the audience. So talk about living there. I didn't realize you lived there.

Speaker 1:
[14:40] Yeah, I moved back. I was in New York and LA pretty much after college, just pursuing this career. And then I found myself in New York during COVID. And I just was like, I'll just move back home with my parents because this is scary and work has dried up. So I just moved back into my childhood bedroom in pretty much March of 2020. And then I hung out there for 10 months, living with my parents who are like, my favorite people and we just had a great time. And then as soon as they kind of were like, it's time for you to move back out. I just didn't feel the need to go back. I think I was actually very lucky because I was at a point in my career where I didn't really need to be on the coast to be seen and to be thought of for projects. People were already kind of aware of me. So I kind of reasoned, if someone wants me to do something in LA and they don't have a week's notice to give me and $400 for a Southwest flight, then it's probably not a project I even want to do anyway. So I feel like I can just be in St. Louis. And also I just feel like I know that I'm addicted to work and I can really hurt myself with it. And I guess kind of felt like I'm going to keep work on the coast so that if I really want it, I go to it and it's not just something that is just always outside my door and making me feel like I'm not doing enough. If I'm living in New York, there's always a set I can go do that night. There's always a podcast that I can jump on that day. And here in St. Louis, I don't feel those pressures, so I can kind of just relax.

Speaker 2:
[16:14] What is it like living there?

Speaker 1:
[16:15] I sleep late, I play with my dogs, I take a Pilates class, I go visit my parents and hang out with them. I visit my sister and her kids, I kind of just do honestly nothing. I do a lot of sleeping because usually when I'm here, I'm just catching up from just non-stop. Go, go, go, go. Yeah, yeah.

Speaker 2:
[16:37] What is the mood there? I mean, St. Louis is more liberal, obviously, and I have friends who live in Kansas City, same thing. But what's the mentality difference? Do you feel that or not?

Speaker 1:
[16:49] Well, just in terms of show business is the thing that I pay most attention to is that people are not as driven, not show business, business in general, I just don't feel like people are as driven here for good or bad. For me, it's good because I just don't feel, as in competition with others, I think here it's about what your yard looks like and how your home is decorated and what school your kids go to, and those are not metrics by which I measure myself at all. So I feel a lot more free here to not judge myself and not compare myself. And also, people just don't care about celebrity here. It doesn't feel gossipy, it doesn't feel like I'm being watched or that, and I've told this story before, but it's just so funny to me that the week before I hosted SNL, sitting in the hair chair getting my hair done, and she's like, do you have any fun plans coming up? And I go, oh, I'm hosting SNL next week. And she goes, fun. And then just keeps going. And I'm like, if, it was just, I was ready for her to go, what? Because it hadn't been enough. And there's just, they just don't seem to be as awestruck by those things. And much to my parents' chagrin. I mean, my parents are so disappointed.

Speaker 2:
[18:07] They want to dine out on it.

Speaker 1:
[18:09] Oh, they want everyone losing their minds because they lose their minds. But I just tell them like, people just don't care about that stuff as much here. And it tickles me actually.

Speaker 2:
[18:19] That's funny, fun, fun. That's really good.

Speaker 1:
[18:22] Oh, fun. Fun. Like I have a college friend's wedding coming up.

Speaker 2:
[18:28] Right, exactly.

Speaker 1:
[18:29] And I go, did you hear I'm hosting? I'm not watching it. I'm not hosting a party. It's just, no, oh, fun. So I appreciate that. Like it's just not, it's important, but okay. It humbles you.

Speaker 2:
[18:40] Yeah, I get it. I get it. Now, shifting, total shift. Another major theme in the special is your vagina. You spent about 15 minutes talking about it, the anxiety you felt when you were younger about how it looked. Even in 2026, a lot of people are uncomfortable with a woman talking frankly about her sexuality. Why did you choose to make it such a big part of your special? I enjoyed it myself.

Speaker 1:
[19:01] You know, well, the main reason is that the jokes just killed on the road. I mean, there was, there's just a thing you feel on stage where you start doing kind of the dirtier comedy that I've been like known for, where you just feel a pop from the crowd, where they just get energized. It's at the end of the show. They've been sitting there a while and they somehow summon all this energy to laugh so much harder at those jokes.

Speaker 2:
[19:23] So when you're like, now the vagina comes out, right?

Speaker 1:
[19:26] Yeah, it was just like, you know, there's a part of me that felt it was hack or, you know, so many women get female comics get told, oh, you talk about your vagina and sex and it's like so easy. And I never want to feel like I'm doing the easy hack thing. But I can't deny that it was killing. And I also thought, you know, if I let that kind of rhetoric determine what I talk about on stage, I'm just going to be placating into the again, like the male comedians that I've started in my career trying to impress. And I just I just don't want to do that. And I also just feel that it's it's still important. I feel like women still need to be really a lot more open about their sexuality. And it helps a lot of women and men understand women's sexuality more. So I just felt, you know, if there was still some girl who has not heard me in the course of my career talk about my insecurities, about my vagina, I want to reach that that girl and let her know, like she's not alone in the way she feels about hers and the anxiety you have when presenting it to someone new.

Speaker 2:
[20:26] Right, because men never talk about their penises.

Speaker 1:
[20:29] Exactly. I know there's not enough. It's really I'm excited for them to tackle that some point. Yeah, it's just it. But there is a part of me that is ashamed of it and that maybe I put it at the end of my special hoping that maybe some people wouldn't get to it so I wouldn't be judged for it because it's you know, it's something that I know it works. I am I'm embarrassed of doing you know, you I get called a sex comic all the time and I get kind of there's been opportunities I've lost out on. I would say earlier on in my career that were more mainstream network TV.

Speaker 2:
[21:02] Like talking about your washing machine.

Speaker 1:
[21:05] Yeah, that that people said, Oh, she's too dirty so she can't go on this show because she's just going to talk about her vagina. And they didn't realize that I know when and when not to do that. So I, you know, and I also just don't want other female comics to have to suffer what I have created for them, which is like more evidence that all we talk about our vaginas. But I think there's so many different ones, they all look different. So I feel like there's a lot of different angles to cover.

Speaker 2:
[21:29] I felt it was perfectly fine to talk about yours. It was like fun.

Speaker 1:
[21:32] Thank you, Kara.

Speaker 2:
[21:33] And by the way, men do talk. I have a four-year-old who does not stop talking about his penis and he's not even a comic yet.

Speaker 1:
[21:39] I mean, it is fascinating and it's not.

Speaker 2:
[21:42] I'm three boys in. I only have one daughter.

Speaker 1:
[21:45] You've heard it all.

Speaker 2:
[21:46] I've heard all about it.

Speaker 1:
[21:48] It is what we're not supposed to talk about. And I think that's maybe one of the reasons I am talking about is because I didn't have a chance in growing up to ever make jokes about it. You can't touch it. If you even itch it in front of your parents and you're just playing with it, what are you doing? There was a shame around it. So I think I'm always just drawn to the things that as a kid or a teenager, I just felt like I couldn't talk about.

Speaker 2:
[22:10] So speaking of your parents, your dad was sitting in the front row of this. He's listened to that before, presumably, right?

Speaker 1:
[22:16] Yeah. I think he had heard it before. He'd come to see me on the road before. Yes.

Speaker 2:
[22:20] Yeah. He handled it well.

Speaker 1:
[22:22] They have been through the whole thing with me. I started out 20 something years ago, really putting them on blast and talking about really disgusting stuff. I was a late bloomer, so I was just exploring my sexuality and really bringing it all on stage. So my parents were always in the crowd supporting me and just stayed quiet about it. They'd never shamed me about it or said maybe don't do that or, oh, this is so embarrassing. But I came to find out later on that it was really embarrassing for them and really uncomfortable. And I never even considered their perspective on it. I think that if I would have, it would have hindered my creativity in some way to consider how they felt and to have empathy for them in those moments. And I did have a moment, I would say 15 years in, where my dad was in the crowd and I was describing giving oral sex or something, and I just saw his shining bald head in the background. And I had to stop and I was like, I cannot believe I'm doing this. Dad, it just dawned on me how uncomfortable that would be for him. It wasn't even about how I felt. I don't have embarrassment around it for some reason, but I saw it from his perspective because I guess I could see my reflection in his head. And I was like, I am so sorry. And it was this awakening on stage that happened in real time. And after that, I was a little bit more, you know, like I just told my parents like you can go to the bathroom for this part of my set if they would come to my show. Now, this one in particular, I was like, I think they can kind of handle everything that I'm talking about, but they're just so proud. They don't care.

Speaker 2:
[23:52] Yeah. Your dad was asked about advice to others whose kids get in a comedy, said get some thick skin.

Speaker 1:
[23:56] Yes.

Speaker 2:
[23:57] Which I think is the right answer for a parent. That said, your special ends on a kind of full circle note. You talk about rejecting insecurity and feeling confident in face of imperfection. Talk about that because that's where you get to accepting yourself, and at the same time, it doesn't go away.

Speaker 1:
[24:15] Yeah. I don't think it ever goes away. I feel like I am always striving for, I guess, perfection. Acceptance of myself is more the thing that I'm trying to strive for now, is acceptance, and I like that it's an ongoing battle. I think it is what fuels me to keep going and to even pursue this career, because it's an empty pursuit. And if I wasn't trying to achieve the world thinking something of me and how they perceive me, I really wouldn't continue going. There's no point in doing it. I mean, the money is nice, so that is something that I like about it. But the attention, I mean, that comes from a really sad place of wanting, expecting a crowd of people to sit for an hour and listen to me talk into a microphone. I'm not singing, there's no dancing, there's no lights, there's no video show. Like, I mean, it's really expecting a lot of a crowd. I'm honestly shocked that people go to comedy shows and have the attention span for it now. I'm always really impressed by people. I mean, I do as well, but I'm always really proud of myself afterwards. Like, I just watched someone monologize. It just feels like something that we shouldn't have the attention span for anymore. But I feel like I hope it never goes away. I kind of like my insecurities. And I'm secure in my insecurities, is what I feel I am. I really am. Like, I feel like I had a friend once who would never admit she had low self-esteem, and she would always say to me, I can't believe how you could admit that you have low self-esteem. That's just something I probably do have. She couldn't even say that she even, she was like, I might have it, but I would never ever say that to anyone and say it out loud, and especially to everyone. And I've just never felt shame about that. Really, I know that that's okay. And I just am, I'm always on a quest just to be as honest as possible. And I think that that is also, if I am as honest as possible and people still like me, then I guess I feel likable deep down, because I think there's something about this business that feels so fake, that when people like me because of, you know, the Golden Globes or a roast or a photo shoot I did, or you know, whatever it is, I can't really let it in, because I'm like, well, that's not really me. You know, that's, it is me, but it's months and months of work that was to make this one version of me that is so glowy and so unattainable for me, if I don't completely, like, you know, doing a Golden Globes, I have to give up my entire life. It's not, it's like an Olympics. It's not something that I could keep doing forever. And so I don't really like the praise for that. Then there's the praise that comes where people go, well, then I'll praise you for how hard you work. And I'm like, well, I don't like that either because that means I'm not talented. That means, oh, you just work harder than everyone else. So I'm just never really satisfied. And I think I need that. It's the engine that fuels me.

Speaker 2:
[27:13] Yeah, yeah. Well, it's interesting because I think comics are very vulnerable and they're telling a story and to hold people's attention is very difficult. I don't know if you remember there's a movie Tom Hanks and Sally Field did about comics that still stays with me to this day. I don't know why. It wasn't a huge hit or anything else.

Speaker 1:
[27:29] Punchline, I think it was.

Speaker 2:
[27:30] Punchline, yes.

Speaker 1:
[27:31] What stays with you about it?

Speaker 2:
[27:33] The vulnerability of them and the insecurity and still walking out there. Cruelty a little bit towards each other. It was very unlike Tom Hanks too, because he was a little bit cruel, right?

Speaker 1:
[27:44] Yeah, yeah.

Speaker 2:
[27:45] And the desperation. I just, every bit of, and Sally Field does that desperation better than anybody.

Speaker 1:
[27:50] Yes. Well, that's the comedy I like most is that, is when someone is sharing a part of their psyche that's really shameful and that is, you know, is really embarrassing. I don't really like comedy that's just talking about the other day, this happened, or just observational comedy. Although I respect it and it's not something I can do. It just isn't my cup of tea. I really like when people are kind of humiliating themselves in a way that makes me like them more and feel closer to them. It makes me like myself more.

Speaker 2:
[28:24] We'll be back in a minute. Support for this show comes from Framer. If your website is filled with mistakes, you can bet it will be the last time a potential customer will visit it. Framer is here to fix that. Framer is an enterprise-grade, no-code website builder used by teams at companies like Perplexity and Miro to move faster. With real-time collaboration and a robust CMS with everything you need for great SEO, not to mention advanced analytics that include integrated A-B testing, your designers and marketers are empowered to build and maximize your.com from day one. So whether you want to launch a new site, test a few landing pages or migrate your full.com, Framer has programs for start-ups, scale-ups and large enterprises to make going from idea to live site as easy and fast as possible. Learn how you can get more out of your.com from a Framer specialist or get started building for free today at framer.com/kara for 30 percent off, a Framer Pro annual plan. That's framer.com/kara for 30 percent off, framer.com/kara. Rules and restrictions may apply. Support for this show comes from Delete Me. Delete Me makes it easy, quick, and safe to remove your personal data online at a time when surveillance and data breaches are common enough to make everyone vulnerable. It's a terrifying reality that this is something we all need to think about whether or not you're a public figure. Delete Me can help protect you and your family's personal privacy and the privacy of your business from doxing attacks or sensitive information can be exploited. I have been using Delete Me for years. I think it's a great experience. I find out a lot about myself online, much of which is untrue, but at the same time, it's collated in a way that's really troubling. It's really important to get a hold of your data and I use their very smart dashboard. Last year, the New York Times wire cutter named Delete Me, their top pick for data removal services is not a surprise, so might be the time to try it for yourself. Take control of your data and keep your private life private by signing up for Delete Me. Now, at a special discount to our listeners, get 20 percent off your Delete Me plan when you go to joindeleteeme.com/kara and use the promo code Kara at checkout. The only way to get 20 percent off is to go to joindeleteeme.com/kara and enter code Kara at checkout. That's joindeleteeme.com/kara, K-A-R-A, code Kara. So, now might be the time to try it for yourself.

Speaker 5:
[30:58] Support for the show comes from Amazon. There are the things you can plan for. A first birthday party, a movie marathon, a renter-friendly bathroom reno. And then there are the things you can never plan for. A surprise rainstorm, a Blu-ray player calling it quits, stick-on tiles that looked way better on the package. For all things planned and unplanned, Amazon has you covered. You'll find low prices on everyday essentials and last-minute lifesavers. Shop Amazon and save on essentials. Save the everyday.

Speaker 2:
[31:36] Let's talk a little bit more about your style of comedy and some of the major themes you like to explore. Now, obviously, you noted this in the show. You gained a lot of fame from your appearances on Comedy Central, Roast, a lot of good ones. The Tom Brady one really sent you over the top, I think. The jokes you made about him were brutal, and he was sitting right there, which I thought was great. Can you just talk about roasting? Is that a different thing? Because you kind of set it off hand in an interesting way in the show.

Speaker 1:
[32:03] Yeah, it feels like a different skill. I mean, for me, it's about joke writing. That's what drew me to Roast most of all is I love really tight jokes. I like one-liners. I like just a real sharp turn of phrase. It feels like little math problems. It just is, to me, has always been an expression of intelligence that I've expected in the Mitch Hedbergs or the Steven Wrights or Wendy Liebman's just these like, just being so concise. So I always like that about it. And also you don't need much of an attention span. You're just on to the next joke before you're bored. I really don't really enjoy storytelling comedians because I can't, I just don't care enough to walk through an entire story with them. And it's not very often that compelling the whole way through. And it feels too self-important, all the pauses and just expecting the audience to follow you on this journey to the bank. I just don't care. But so I always loved the sharpness of the joke writing. And it was just something that, yeah, I think that I first got started doing it, just helping my friends write jokes. They were doing the roasts and I would just submit jokes and see what I could get on. And I got some on it. It was just such a good feeling to write a joke that people were talking about. And then I think the other thing I like about it is that it's like, you get to be so brutally honest.

Speaker 2:
[33:19] Yeah, mean. You have to have the right amount of mean.

Speaker 1:
[33:22] And honesty is mean, you know? Like just Taylor Swift's lyric, you called me up again just to break me like a promise so casually cruel in the name of being honest. Like, you can be so mean and just say, but I'm just telling you the truth. Do you not want the truth? And so it gives me permission to do that. That's why I like them is there. It's protected by this. It feels like the most protected space of free speech, of like this guy signed up for this. They didn't give any parameters or they gave some and I'm adbiting by them. And so now I have to find loopholes where I can hurt this person in ways they don't even know that they were going to be.

Speaker 2:
[33:58] What was the parameter there?

Speaker 1:
[34:00] You know, there was just like stuff of like, hey, maybe don't, you know, in the past rows that I've done, it's just like, don't go after their kids. Don't go after maybe a person in their life who's sick or old or, you know, like it's stuff like that that I, I always respect. I don't mind anyone telling me, hey, don't joke about this. It's going to hurt my feelings. Like, fair enough. And that's never my goal, but it is my goal to find an angle that other people haven't explored. And when you get it, it's like that feeling of when you write a joke that no one else has thought of, and it's a new type of joke that none of the rows have ever done. Because a lot of it, it's just like, you know, plug and play. Like, you can really write a good set using a lot of the same tropes and tricks that have been done before. So that's, it's a really fun nut to crack. And it's just, yeah, and you're just allowed to be a psychopath for seven minutes. I mean, it's insane, the things that I've gotten away with saying.

Speaker 2:
[34:50] Was there one joke you liked or wanted to put in?

Speaker 1:
[34:53] Yeah, there's always times, even with the Golden Globes, there's always times where it's like, oh, this is the best joke I've ever heard or written, or someone in my writing staff writes. And you just can't do it because it's just going to make the room feel too weird, or it's just too harsh for that moment, especially like a Golden Globes. And you just have to let it go, and it's so painful, but you just think, okay, maybe I'll put that in my book someday when that person's dead or something.

Speaker 2:
[35:23] Speaking of the Golden, you don't touch on politics a lot, although you did include some jokes about Epstein files in your opening monologue, which I thought was interesting. Talk a little bit about that, how you made the decisions there.

Speaker 1:
[35:33] Yeah, I mean, I was so immersed in it at that time anyway. I have gotten away from it, like I think we all have, unfortunately. But Melania brought it back. She really did. And we still don't know exactly what that was preempting, but I'm waiting every day for that other shoe to drop. But yeah, I was just so, I was reading so much about it. I was so mad about it. I mean, if you like true crime, there's a lot going on in there. And there's a lot that the mainstream media can't even report on because it's too grotesque to even paraphrase. I mean, it's like, it was crazy, the stuff I was getting into. So I think it was on my mind a lot. And also it's one of those things that no one can deny is wrong. Like that to me felt totally safe to go after because, although there were people in that room that night that were definitely in the files, like no one's going to say that's mean of me. It felt like, for lack of a better term, a safe space to go to. For a monologue. But in the right way because I think actually Epstein, you know, 2019 till the drop last winter was like kind of an easier joke to make and to reference because we didn't know the horrid details of it as much. And I think it was a little bit more risky given that. But I forget the joke. Oh yeah, it was like, oh, a lot of A-listers in the room tonight. And by A-listers, I mean people who are definitely on A-list that has been heavily redacted. I felt like that was safe enough because you're not getting into any of the details of it. And I didn't say his name, and it's just I said list. So there was a lot of things about that that I felt like worked.

Speaker 2:
[37:14] Well, list is now Epstein, just for people to be clear. Exactly, that word is the world. Your biggest hit was your CBS joke, though I have to say, I think that one got the most attention. Were you surprised by that?

Speaker 1:
[37:24] No, I think I knew that. I was so happy that CBS did not cut that because that was one that I was really worried that they were going to see. And I would have understood if they were like, can you just not, like we're paying you a lot of money and we're putting a lot into this. Can you not throw us under the bus? But they liked it. And I think when I did in rehearsals, a lot of the crew and cameramen were all laughing. And I think the powers that be saw that and just knew it was undeniably just going to be a killer. And I think that they wanted that show to be killer. They wanted the press that would maybe come from me doing that headline more than the bad press associated with it. And I thought it was really, I was really happy that they let me do it.

Speaker 2:
[38:10] It was a great joke. It was a great joke.

Speaker 1:
[38:11] Thank you.

Speaker 2:
[38:12] And I'm glad they let you do it. I hope they continue to let people do that. We'll see. So let's get to our expert question. Every episode, we get an outside expert to ask one. Here's yours.

Speaker 6:
[38:21] Hi Kara and Nikki. It's your old friend, Judd Apatow, here in Savannah, Georgia, directing a movie during World War III. I have a question. Is it possible to be funny during World War III? Also, is it possible to not gain weight? How can we be funny when the world is so weird, when our government is stranger than every single character from Dr. Strangelove? Anyway, just wondering.

Speaker 1:
[38:58] Well, he's a great example of someone who is continuing to be funny. I miss all this. And I think that, no, I mean, I've really struggled with it because it's just made me so depressed that it's hard to be funny. And it's hard for me to even look at my own life and be funny about it or think that anything in my mundane life that I'm complaining about, like my lip filler is interesting for anyone to hear about. But I think that we just have fatigue with all of it. And people need to just, I know that's often used a lot of like, we just need an escape and it's just a reason people give to justify making bad art. But I think that it's true. I think people do want to think about anything else. And I think that I want to talk about anything else. And it's almost nostalgic to worry about the dumb stuff.

Speaker 2:
[39:49] It was interesting because you had said to Howard Stern that you pulled some political jokes from your monologue, for example, like Trump and ICE. Was it fatigue or that you just was hard to strike the right tone as you noted?

Speaker 1:
[40:00] I just don't want to say his name, to be honest with you. Like I just don't want to give him airtime. There were lots of jokes that said ICE and Trump. And the ballroom, we had jokes about it. I just didn't want to say his name. I just felt like I knew he would be watching and I didn't want to give him the satisfaction of having anything to respond to. And I just don't want those words to come out of my lips. I mean, I can't even, I really don't listen to him. I don't watch him. I just read what he says. I sometimes watch it on mute, but I really, I can't stomach it. And so I just don't, and I don't talk about it on stage because I don't, when I'm doing my stand up, I don't want to know who in my crowd might be on that side because I don't want to resent anyone in the crowd because then I get angry and it starts to, and no one likes an angry woman especially, but just in general, it just doesn't mix well. And I can just, when I get heckled or something or something disarms me on stage and there's an angry side to me, I just lose the crowd instantly. It's like they don't trust me anymore. Like the bus driver that is driving the kids to school is suddenly freaking out and everyone gets scared. And so I try not to just, I try not to talk about it because the times that I have and I felt like the crowd go in a certain way, I just start aiming my jokes at only the side that I like. And these people made money and I don't want to make them feel bad. And it's not their fault that they have the ideology that they have. I would too if I had their same brain and grew up in the same family and the same place in America. I try to remember that no one has free will and everyone that likes him, I would like him to if I was that person. I try to remember that I feel lucky that I have the brain that I have that knows how ridiculous it all is.

Speaker 2:
[41:50] Right. No, it also does bring down. I mean, some of the comedy can be very funny, but it's sort of gotten not funny. Like you see a lot of the daily shows and stuff like that, and they do a nice job, I have to say.

Speaker 1:
[42:01] I like Kimmel's anger at it. Kimmel is able to harness his anger and frustration with it in a way that I really find soothing to me. Also, Jon Stewart's just consternation at it all, and frustration is a really funny device for it.

Speaker 2:
[42:17] Yeah, it was great that he was the one being saved by Jesus Trump.

Speaker 1:
[42:22] Was that him? Was that Jon Stewart?

Speaker 2:
[42:23] No, it wasn't, but it looks like him. Then in the back, I just a few days ago interviewed Jose Andres, who's doing World Central Kitchen, and the guy in the back looks like him with a hat. And he said he's gotten 7,000 texts from people because it looks like him.

Speaker 1:
[42:38] What an honor.

Speaker 2:
[42:39] And he's like, what was I doing there? I don't understand. I was in Gaza feeding people. And then I was in this picture. And it does go look at it. You're like, well, what is happening?

Speaker 1:
[42:49] I really haven't taken that image in outside of his doctor, his medical garb.

Speaker 2:
[42:54] Yeah. And then there's a character from a sci-fi. The whole thing is whoever does this, I kind of want to meet all Trump stuff.

Speaker 1:
[43:01] It feels like they don't even watch it or review anything they put up.

Speaker 2:
[43:05] I just kind of want to be in the room as they make it. Like, what are you thinking?

Speaker 1:
[43:08] Someday we're going to find out.

Speaker 2:
[43:10] It's a teenage boy. It's some really fucked up teenage boy.

Speaker 1:
[43:13] I know.

Speaker 2:
[43:14] Mostly wants to hear about your vagina. We'll be back in a minute.

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Speaker 10:
[44:26] No one goes to Hanks for his spreadsheets. They go for a darn good pizza. Lately though, the shop's been quiet. So, Hank decides to bring back the $1 slice. He asks Copilot in Microsoft Excel to look at his sales and costs, to help him see if he can afford it. Copilot shows Hank where the money's going and which little extras make the dollar slice work. Now, Hank says, I'll line out the door. Hank makes the pizza, Copilot handles the spreadsheets. Learn more at m365copilot.com/work.

Speaker 2:
[44:57] Let's end talking about business of comedy in Hollywood generally. Obviously, podcasts become a huge part of comedy right now. You had one for a few years, but ended last year. Talk about, is it shaping comedy, these podcasts because a whole lot of comics are doing them now, like a lot.

Speaker 1:
[45:13] Well, it's getting people to go see comedians because they find out about through podcasts. I think it's helping in that way, but I think that it's made the bar a bit lower for comedy because, stand-up comedy takes work and it takes effort and rewriting and punching up and reviewing and trying your material over and over again. That has become a lost art because there's just this expectation now that you should just have fresh stuff all the time and just be able to be funny on command. I think that it's lowered the bar in the sense that, yeah, people are just expecting, they expect less, I guess, and so they're entertained by less. But I think I hear a lot, I mean, when I'm looking on Reddit and reading about people going to see stand-up shows of their favorite podcasters, that they're often very disappointed because it's not what they expected it to be because it's not the right place for the level of professionalism for a podcast. I mean, it needs to be more polished.

Speaker 2:
[46:14] Why did you stop doing it? Now, we went on tour and did really well because it was the show. We just did the show.

Speaker 1:
[46:19] Well, yours is polished. You have notes, you've done your research. You have a system in place and you work hard on it. There's a lot of different ways of podcasting. I enjoy the ones that are just shooting the shit. There's time and a place for that. But I stopped podcasting because I wasn't giving it that effort. I just was sitting down and just shooting from the hip and saying things that I hadn't really thought through and couldn't really back up. And I was just feeling like I was getting to a place where my words were being taken more seriously and being paid more attention to by like page six. And I was getting things poll quoted that I didn't even remember saying. And it was becoming kind of embarrassing. And it was also like, you need to have a video podcast now. So it was about doing hair and makeup every day so you could look presentable enough for this to live online forever. And when you level up in show business, like now I need full glam for when I'm going to be on camera. I didn't get it today or there's a time and a place. But I just was feeling like this burden every day of like, I have to look a certain way and some days I would just look tired and then that's out there forever and then people are pulling. It was just too much pressure.

Speaker 2:
[47:37] You didn't like it. I love it. Every time I do it, I love it.

Speaker 6:
[47:40] You have to love it.

Speaker 1:
[47:42] I did love it and there's parts of it that I miss. I miss having that connection with people who feel like they know you and you get to talk to them every day. Yeah. I have it too with celebrities. So I really liked providing that for people because I felt like, yeah, if you listen to my podcast and you think you'd be friends with me, you're probably right. I'm really myself on this thing. But I just felt like it was for people who were paying attention that wanted something that weren't just looking to listen to something on their drive to work, who were actually trying to pay attention to what I say and glean something from it. I think I was falling short and I really like to make, I was just, as I get older, I just want to put out things out that I'm proud of and I wasn't proud of it. And so I'll go back to it when I can work on it.

Speaker 2:
[48:25] Yeah. Do you feel like you have to be on them? I mean, to say how important of podcasts become to comedy as a business?

Speaker 1:
[48:31] Yes. Yeah, so important. I mean, it's just a way, yeah, it's like doing the Tonight Show was the biggest deal ever to me, even when I did it after the boom. And like, you know, first time I was on Tonight Show 2009, the hugest deal in comedy and was so until probably five years ago, getting and it's still a big deal to get a late night set, but nobody sees it. Nobody really, it doesn't move ticket sales like a podcast does. So you still have to go on these podcasts. You have to weigh. And especially now that, you know, some of the most popular comedy podcasts are on the wrong side of things. There's a moral dilemma there of what am I going to do?

Speaker 2:
[49:15] Look at Polar. Polar, there's a lot. It's changing, I have to say.

Speaker 1:
[49:18] Yes, there's a lot more now to do that are just, are getting the same level of attention that are not problematic. But it's heavy right wing.

Speaker 2:
[49:28] Yeah, Scott and I are always in the top 10, but we're always surrounded by Candace Owen and Mark Levin.

Speaker 1:
[49:33] Yeah, that's what it is.

Speaker 2:
[49:35] Megyn Kelly is always hanging at the top, and looking down on us with her angry eyes.

Speaker 1:
[49:41] I mean, the thing is I do feel like I still need to do them. I am nervous about them every time I do it. I did one last week, I did Call Her Daddy, and it was like a two-hour conversation. It was so much fun talking about sex openly. She's such a girl's girl. I just felt like we were like best friends by the end of it, and I maintain that we are. I really feel a friendship with her. But I was talking like I would a best friend, and I was feeling like, oh, I wasn't even thinking about censoring myself in any way, knowing that this podcast makes headlines. And then a week later, I wake up to just headlines about Nikki Glaser says that she likes for her boyfriend to sleep with other women. And it was like five different headlines showing up in my feed, and I don't even follow myself. I don't look for news about myself. I like avoided at all costs. And it was just really embarrassing because I was like, that was just one little thing I talked about like, oh, I'm kind of turned on by this idea of it. And then it was just, everyone I knew had seen it that day. I went in to like do some voiceover work. And even the people on the Zoom and the voiceover were like, well, a lot of headlines about you today. And I'm like, that is so humiliating that they know this.

Speaker 2:
[50:53] Go to the hair lady. Go to the hair lady.

Speaker 1:
[50:55] Exactly. Oh, fun. No, that's the one she would know about and care about. Oh, no. And so that's the other thing that's like, I just get like nervous now because I, in these spaces, I do feel like a connection with the hosts. And I do feel comfortable. And I feel like, oh, no one's really going to listen to this too hard. And then I just have to pay more attention now to the stuff I say. But then, you know, it just goes away in a day and no one cares. It's like, it's fine.

Speaker 2:
[51:21] Exactly. I never pay attention. Apparently, I've gotten to 17 Beeps with Megyn Kelly. She always talks about her show and I ignore it completely, except one time I wrote, because it was so much of it, I wrote back, I go, it's never going to happen between us, Megyn. And that ended it. That ended it. It's just nice. Please stop.

Speaker 4:
[51:39] It's getting worse.

Speaker 2:
[51:40] Sort of like the Taylor Swift song about, what's her name? Charlie XCX.

Speaker 1:
[51:44] Oh, yes. Yes.

Speaker 2:
[51:45] Yeah. That was a great song.

Speaker 1:
[51:47] I love that song. It's so fun.

Speaker 2:
[51:48] It's so petty.

Speaker 1:
[51:49] It's delicious. It's so much fun. But I just, I mean, did you, do you find, you probably find out about most of these headlines because you have friends texting you or?

Speaker 2:
[51:59] No, I don't care. I don't pay attention to them.

Speaker 1:
[52:00] Because I don't pay attention to it. It's just like I find out from people who write to me.

Speaker 2:
[52:05] I don't even pay attention to my friends text me about it.

Speaker 1:
[52:07] That's so good. I got to start blocking them.

Speaker 2:
[52:09] I have four kids. I don't got time for this.

Speaker 1:
[52:12] I got to get kids. That's maybe my problem.

Speaker 2:
[52:14] You need to, you can borrow mine if you like. I've got a lot and they're all different ages. A couple more questions. Hollywood's in the middle of a huge shakeup, talking with the bigger business, obviously podcasts are part of it. But tens of thousands of jobs have been lost. It's still reeling from COVID and labor strikes and production moving abroad. Marvel's just moving to England. There's a lot of fear over obviously Paramount's pros takeover Warner Brothers. I've never been so inundated with celebrities who want to come on and talk about this Paramount deal and really big ones, which is really interesting. Do you think about it at all? Because you have, as you said, your stand up career could go on, right? As long as you have great material.

Speaker 1:
[52:50] Yeah. To be honest, Kara, I don't look at it at all. And I know I should. And I feel really embarrassed that I don't pay attention to it that much. And that when my friends get in conversations about it, I just kind of slowly back out of the room because I don't really under, I feel too ignorant to kind of understand that kind of talk. It just like my brain shuts off and I don't, it's like when people try to explain football to me, like I don't understand mergers and monopolies. Like I just don't, I'm just not that kind of intelligent and I just know what I should know. And I try to understand, there are times where I go, please explain it to me and I'll get it all and then it falls out of my head right away. I mean, I do, I feel for everyone going through it and I just worked on a movie that filmed in Los Angeles and I could just sense the gratitude of everyone on that crew and how-

Speaker 2:
[53:39] Because that's dropped rather considerably, yeah.

Speaker 1:
[53:42] Yes, these people, it was like maybe one job they get a year. And I've worked with makeup artists for years who were able to make a living and now they're thinking of moving to Las Vegas or Atlanta. I mean, everyone in that town is suffering, so I feel so much for everyone. And I will say that I do, that's why I really don't spend my money. I'm always worried that it's going to drop out from underneath me at any point. And that's why I'm going on tour again, right on the heels of putting out a special. And I have to go to New York this summer and write a whole new hour in three months, which I'm going to get done and I'm excited to do. But it is like, I'm going on tour again in August, which is insane because I just got off tour. But I'm worried that people aren't going to have the money to go see people on tour. And someday, the live entertainment is going to take that same hit. So I'm trying to capitalize on it as much as possible and enjoy the luck that I've had in this business. But I also just really am very cautious and save my money. And I don't live like I see a lot of people living. I don't spend.

Speaker 2:
[54:55] No private planes?

Speaker 1:
[54:56] You're not getting on and off the private plane? No. Also, for fear of like if you crash in a private plane, no one feels sorry for you. I think it's like we're, that's my biggest fear now is like whenever I am in one. Yeah, if I'm a Southwest people be like, Oh my God, what a woman of the people. What a hero died so young. They would make my note. But you know, like it's, but if I die in a private plane.

Speaker 2:
[55:17] There's a whole genre of death comedy that you could do.

Speaker 1:
[55:20] Oh yeah. But I thought about it because I've been in some private jets and I'm like, if this goes down, it's like the amount of sympathy me and my family are going to get is so, is going to be so much less because of the private plane.

Speaker 2:
[55:31] People hate people flying up private.

Speaker 1:
[55:33] Yeah. And this elitist bitch, she deserves it. So I like, I do think about that. And I do feel like it's a huge waste of money. And I don't mind flying. I'm not famous enough that it's like really a hindrance to me to be in the airport amongst the people. It's like, I understand when people do it with where it's like, people give Taylor Swift shit about like flying privates. Like she cannot be out in public.

Speaker 2:
[55:53] She cannot be out in public.

Speaker 1:
[55:54] It would shut down the airport. It would cause delays across. She can't do anything else. And so I don't fault her for that ever. And so, but I can still do it. I can be in boarding group C.

Speaker 2:
[56:08] Two more questions. The other destructive force, something you've talked about, the Hollywood is AI. You said in the past, you don't mind semi content. It's obviously I like when it creates a video of Trump and Russian President Vladimir Putin making out. Do you think about it, about content around AI? It's some of its, I mean, like Iran is killing it right now, making these Lego commercials about, I mean, videos about Trump, for example. They're very funny, actually.

Speaker 1:
[56:33] Yeah. I mean, when done right, and people behind it have a good point of view and are modifying it and working with it, and you can create some good stuff if there's a human behind it. But, and I've used it a little bit just to generate some starting places for jokes where I'm just like, okay, what are some angles that Nikki Glaser would take on this thing? And it'll just give me a jumpstart, like anything. Like if you were, when I used to work with my friends, yeah, with your friends. And so I think it's good for that, but I'm just like, it's just made me sad that it's like, it's ruined wonder a bit. You know, like when I see something, when I see like a whale approaching a boat on-

Speaker 2:
[57:19] This is Scott said this, he can't watch animal, he's so angry about the animal.

Speaker 1:
[57:23] No, you can't enjoy any kind of animal footage anymore. It was already sad to watch anyway, because most news about nature is really depressing or any kind of stuff that you see. So I was always kind of like scared to watch it. But now it's just like, I just, I don't trust anything anymore. And I can, I think that that's the part of it that I'm like upset about is that it's just made, you know, it's made entertainment less enjoyable because there used to be like, I can't believe they caught this moment. And then you just go through the comments. The first thing I do now when I see videos, go through the comments and see who's, who's debunked it.

Speaker 2:
[58:00] Debunked it, right. And it's AI. Yeah, there's one with a tiger trying to kill a hippo and then a crocodile's eat it. I'm absolutely, I love it, but I'm absolutely certain it's AI.

Speaker 1:
[58:10] Oh, I wouldn't want to watch that anyway. Oh God, I can't.

Speaker 2:
[58:13] It's actually strangely satisfying.

Speaker 1:
[58:15] I hope that's AI. Yeah.

Speaker 2:
[58:17] Yeah. Yeah. Also, you're a vegan too. Yeah, animal killing is not something that's really pleasant to watch.

Speaker 1:
[58:23] No, I can't handle any of it. No.

Speaker 2:
[58:25] Yeah, I would imagine. So last question, you just wrapped a movie with Kim Kardashian, who is lovely, by the way, because I know her pretty well. You're in the process, lovely, so polite, so surprising.

Speaker 1:
[58:36] So nice. Yes.

Speaker 2:
[58:37] I was like, you were somehow well-raised, although it doesn't seem like you in the show, but you are. But you're up in Calabasas. I'm feeling her father was a critical part of her life too.

Speaker 1:
[58:48] Yeah, absolutely.

Speaker 2:
[58:49] So you're in the process of writing and starring another one produced by Judd Apatow. You're having a moment, and that should matter, but you're having it in your 40s, as you know, the difference between Millennials and Gen Z and stuff. And you told Time Magazine, congratulations on being part of the Time 100. Thanks. You've always dreamed of having this kind of success and thought it would happen. Can you just go on about that, and then what you think you want to do next with it? Because it gives you a certain power, obviously.

Speaker 1:
[59:19] Yeah. Well, there was just a point, I think, Amy Schumer and I were really close around the time that she blew up. It was 2013, and we're around the same age, and we've done the same type of comedy, and I always felt like she was just a peer of mine that I could look up to in certain ways. She's a little bit older, so there's a big sister energy, but she was just like someone that we just were in the trenches together, and then suddenly she blew up, and I remember she's like a movie star, and I was just struck that I wasn't jealous. There was a moment where I was like, I am just so happy for her, and I remember I was able to understand that I wasn't envious, because there's just no way that I would ever do that. It just seems so unreachable to become the kind of star that she was. And so I just, I think that was the moment that I was like, I don't, I'm never going to have that, and I can just be happy for her and put it over here and support her and truly have no envy. Cause I always was so worried that my whole life is just going to be being envious of women who do better than me. My sister was prettier than I was and more popular. It was just like a thing that got embedded at me at a young age of like, I am just this jealous person that I really hated about myself, but for some reason I was just so proud of myself that I was able to just be so happy for her and just want her to continue to succeed and really feel that in my bones. And then I was like, I really accepted it around 2014. I was like, you know what? I'm a touring comic. I headline clubs. I make good money. I don't have to ask my parents for money anymore. I get to appear on shows here and there. This is like a good life. This is successful. I did it. I am making a living doing stand-up comedy, and that's enough. I was really like, and I think I was also past the point of wanting fame and realizing that there was an emptiness to that, that was never going to be satisfying enough, no matter how much I got it. So I just kind of like, I don't know, I just was, I let go, and that's what I was able to do.

Speaker 2:
[61:22] Maybe being older is better.

Speaker 1:
[61:24] I think it just, it allowed me to relax and not want it so badly, and I think the industry rewards that. I was just able to do the things that I really wanted to do and not pick and choose projects based on, is this going to be a cool look, or is this going to get me to the next level? It was like, is this going to be fun and do I care about this? And so I was able to do better work because of that, because I wasn't just constantly doing things that I felt like I should do. And I think that that is what I was ultimately rewarded for, was that the Tom Brady roast was exactly the kind of thing that I was passionate about, that I knew that I was better at than most people, is writing these kinds of jokes. And I fought to get that position on that roast, because I knew it was going to be a big deal, and I knew that I could kill it. So it was just, I think it was just, I really, it wasn't like a, you know, that quote in Time that said, like, I never thought I was going to have this kind of success that I have. It was almost, you read it and you think, oh, she was like sad about it. I wasn't even, I was like, I really was like, okay, good, you know, like, this is, I'm so happy and I'm famous enough. And then it happened and I'm at this next level. And now it's shitty because it feels like you have to maintain it. And it feels like now it just couldn't be taken away. Whereas before, I was the underdog.

Speaker 2:
[62:42] It's like rich people, they can't stop grabbing money.

Speaker 1:
[62:45] That's it, like I get it. And I understand that desire that it's never going to be enough and that you, and that it's going to, if you lose it, it's so much more embarrassing than not ever getting it. Because if you don't ever get it, not that many people know you didn't get it. You weren't that famous. But now a lot of people know I have it. And now a lot of people can know that I lose it. And I think that's it. And it will go away at some point because it always does and you can't take it with you and you're like, I'm going to die and it's like it's going to go away. So I'm just trying to prolong it for what? I don't know. I think I, there is a part of me now that just wants to hoard money so that I can have a nice bunker. I mean, that really is like a thing that I think about a lot.

Speaker 2:
[63:28] You don't want to live in a bunker.

Speaker 1:
[63:31] I don't. But I think my parents will want to, or my sister has a family, so she'll probably want to be living during the apocalypse. I'll just off myself when I lock them in it, but I feel like that's now the goal. It's good to have plans.

Speaker 2:
[63:49] Good to have plans.

Speaker 1:
[63:49] Yeah, it is.

Speaker 2:
[63:51] Yeah. I was talking to a really rich guy who has all these apocalypse plans, and he detailed me them in detail. Very well-known person. And he has a motorcycle that takes him to this place, told me where the address was, and he goes, what's your apocalypse plan? I said, I'm going to come kill you and take you. You just told me the whole gameplay. And then he was like, wait a minute, I didn't think about that.

Speaker 1:
[64:13] Oh yeah. He needs to stop telling people. I have one friend who's a billionaire, and I'm really in her good graces, and I think I have a ticket to her bunker if I need it. But it's about like, okay, my boyfriend now has to learn how to fly a helicopter, because how are we going to get to that? There's things I think about and I put it off, and by the time it happens, I'm not going to be ready. I don't even have a go-bag.

Speaker 2:
[64:33] I see the next special shaping up right now, your apocalypse girl. Yeah.

Speaker 1:
[64:37] But yeah, that's what keeps me going now, and I'm just having fun.

Speaker 2:
[64:42] Now that we're having the apocalypse, is there anything? What is your next thing besides these new projects, right, continuing to do that?

Speaker 1:
[64:47] Yeah. I mean, it's making more movies. I just finished this movie and it's going on tour again in August. And my goal is this summer to completely keep it open and go to New York and work on my stand up every single night all day long. And that's pretty much it. I have to build a whole new hour. So it's also about going out there and living life and not working so much. So I have stuff to write about. Yeah, that's true.

Speaker 2:
[65:11] You got to do things. Well, I'll come watch you. I'll come watch you.

Speaker 1:
[65:14] I would love to meet and person.

Speaker 2:
[65:16] I bought a place in New York for bring the kids up there. So I will come watch you.

Speaker 1:
[65:20] I would love it any time. And I want to just say, I first found out about you, I was listening to the Succession podcast.

Speaker 2:
[65:27] Oh, that was a good podcast.

Speaker 1:
[65:28] It was such a good podcast. And I rarely do this, but I was just like, who is this lady? I was in my car and I have to say, I was like, I need to find out everything about her right now. Just your voice, just the way you talked. I just was so drawn to you. You're so incredible. And it sucked me right in. And your new docu-series on CNN is so compelling. It's so good. And it's so funny. You're the perfect person to take us on that journey.

Speaker 2:
[65:53] Yeah. Where do you meet my Kara-tar? When I create a digital version of me, a 3D version, you'll like that.

Speaker 1:
[65:58] Oh, my God.

Speaker 2:
[65:59] It's very funny.

Speaker 1:
[66:00] I mean, I can't even believe that you did the, where you had to put your face in the aging thing and it told you how old. Like, you did so much stuff that I was like, oh, I'm glad she could do this because I would be.

Speaker 2:
[66:11] Thank you, Nikki.

Speaker 1:
[66:12] But they got it exactly spot on. That was incredible. And you showed us a side of Brian Johnson where I was like, I was watching with my boyfriend. She made me kind of like this guy. I mean, you definitely- Except sad.

Speaker 2:
[66:24] I roasted him and made him a human.

Speaker 1:
[66:27] You did a great job with him. I'm sure he is even really happy with that appearance.

Speaker 2:
[66:31] I'm not so sure. No, he's not.

Speaker 1:
[66:32] He should be because I was terrified of him before and I really afterwards was like, oh, he's sweet. And there's the sadness that it's like, oh, okay.

Speaker 2:
[66:41] At the very end of the show, at the very end of every interview, I ask people how they want to die. Like, it's a question I ask everyone and we strung them together. Hands down, he had the best answer.

Speaker 1:
[66:51] Now I'm wondering how I want to die. But thank you, Kara. I think, I mean, I guess everyone just says in their sleep, but I also was thinking a bridge falling on me because I heard about a woman who got squished by a bridge and it just happened so fast that you don't hear it, you don't think about it, and you are like pulverized into dust immediately. And that I think, I know it sounds really horrible, but I just wanted to be as quick as possible and I would like to just, they don't even have to cremate me, they can just, you know, I'm already dust because it would just be the most- Oh, okay.

Speaker 9:
[67:24] I had not heard that one.

Speaker 1:
[67:25] And I wouldn't know about it, I would just be in traffic, like checking my ways, when I'm going to get there, and the answer is I'm getting there right now. Don't know which way I'm going, but I'm on my way. But I hope no one else is injured in my bridge collapse.

Speaker 2:
[67:37] No one, you're it, you're so far ahead. Anyway, I really appreciate it. You're wonderful.

Speaker 1:
[67:42] You are so great to talk to. Thank you so much Kara.

Speaker 2:
[67:47] One more thing before we go. Want career advice from Kara Swisher? Now is your chance. We're doing a special episode all about it, and I want your questions. Send a video to on at Vox Media and you might be featured. I can't wait to see what you've got. I'm really interested in people's questions, and I've got a lot of good advice as it turns out. Today's show was produced by Christian Castro Rossell, Michelle Alloy, Catherine Millsop, Megan Burney and Kaylin Lynch. Nishat Kurwa is Vox Media's executive producer of podcasts. Special thanks to Madeline LaPlante, Doobie and Julia Sharp-Levin. Our engineers are Fernando Arruda and Rick Kwan, and our theme music is by Trackademics. If you're already following this show, oh fun. If not, you crashed in a private plane. Go wherever you listen to podcasts, search for On with Kara Swisher and hit follow. Thanks for listening to Kara Swisher from Podium Media, New York Magazine, the Vox Media Podcast Network and us. We'll be back on Thursday with more.

Speaker 8:
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Speaker 11:
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