transcript

Speaker 1:
[00:00] If you like exciting audio dramas, then you'll love my earth-shaking new podcast, American Afterlife, presented by Pair of Thieves. I'm Scarlett Estevez, and I play Cielo, a girl forced to survive on her own after an earthquake devastates the Pacific Northwest. Luckily, creating this audio drama wasn't a solo mission. I'm grateful I had a wonderful team with me. Make sure to listen to this suspenseful story wherever you get your podcasts. American Afterlife, listen tomorrow on Apple, Spotify, or wherever you get your podcasts.

Speaker 2:
[00:30] What's Your Mount Rushmore Podcast?

Speaker 3:
[00:32] This episode, our favorite cocktails.

Speaker 2:
[00:34] It would have never occurred to me prior to The Big Lebowski to say, can I get a white Russian?

Speaker 3:
[00:39] After watching that movie, I think I even said to Susan, I'm like, I want to have a white Russian now.

Speaker 2:
[00:43] So out of context to turn to your wife and say that once, you know what? I want a white Russian. Yes. What did I do?

Speaker 3:
[00:50] Mail order bride. Get on the Internet and find one.

Speaker 4:
[00:54] What's Your Mount Rushmore? I don't know.

Speaker 5:
[00:56] Listen, wherever you get podcasts. Yes, welcome back in to UAP. Stephen Diener back with you here, as always, on the Unidentified Alien Podcast. Now past 200, well into 200, here's episode 201, and happy to be back with you as we will conclude this conversation with our military intelligence insider, Anthony Williams, who's always so gracious with his time and insight, and I just truly appreciate that he comes on here. No other show, doesn't do any other show, doesn't do any other interviews, nothing. No other media other than UAP, and man, that means a lot. So can't wait for you to hear our conclusion here of our conversation, as in part one, of course, if you didn't hear it or if you just need a little refresher, we really kind of covered hard the missing scientists and government officials, military officials who have either gone missing or unfortunately been killed, all in connection to something having to do with either aerospace and government secrets and the UAP topic. So we covered that really hard, that investigation to kind of try to put some type of perspective and clarity on what might be going on there. And then we went into the congressional efforts from the big three, Tim Burchette, Annapolina Luna, and Eric Burleson, some of the things that they've been saying lately in the public and what we should make of those. And then that led into what you're going to hear right now in part two, which is some of the things that they're trying to do in Congress. The main thing that we've been hearing about, the 46 Videos. What's on those things? How come they haven't been released? Why did the Pentagon not abide by the April 14th deadline that they put in there to their letter to the Department of War? Well, these are all things that we talk about now in part two, as I actually present the list to Anthony, and he has seen all the videos. He's seen every single one that's on that list. And exclusively here on UAP, he's going to give us his review on some of the videos that I bring up to him. We don't do all 46, that would have taken way too long, but I do bring up a handful of these to him, and he goes into some detail about what's on those videos and why they have not been released. And quite frankly, you're going to find out that some of these, or all of the videos should be, but there are some things on here that I didn't know about, like government documents, and that's where things get sticky. So we uncover it all here during this episode, and Anthony even touches on some other videos that he thinks should be on this list to be put out to the public, including two additional Jellyfish UAP videos that have never been seen by the public, both occurring in 2025 over Iraq, and he talks about those. I had never heard of that until I spoke to him here on the show where he revealed that. So we cover all of that and more to finish off this conversation in part two of my series with Anthony Williams. Always so insightful, always such a unique perspective, and happy to bring the rest of it to you here, right now, on UAP. Enjoy. The big point of contention over the past couple of weeks really has been what's the deal with these 46 videos? Representative Luna puts the word out there, she puts the screen shots out there. We have gotten in touch with Secretary of War, Pete Hegseth. We've sent him a letter. It's me, it's Burleson, it's Burchette, it's a few of the people in Congress that have sent this letter, formal letter asking for access and asking for these videos to be put out to the public. And it's probably too much to go through all 46 videos, but I would like to maybe rattle some off to you, or if there are even some that you have off the top of your head that you want to bring up, feel free to do that as well to see if maybe you can comment on some of these. Is that fair enough?

Speaker 4:
[05:06] Sure.

Speaker 5:
[05:07] Before I get into it, are there some that you do want to bring up off the top of your head?

Speaker 4:
[05:13] From that list, no, but there are several videos that are not on that list that I think should be. There are several videos that even the Hellfire Missile Strike of that UAP that Congressman Burleson played at the last hearing, while that is alarming and disturbing in its own right, I'm glad he showed it, there are much more convicting videos on that list and some that are not on that list. One in particular, there is a video quite long where we see a UAP target locked on and it cloaks itself and disappears off the screen, so much so that the platform can't maintain lock. So it means it's doing something more than just cloaking itself, it is changing the way it appears in space and time. That video is on the list. There are other videos of UAP flying information that are on that list. There are several that are quite anomalous that made that list that I have seen, that I agree those should be on that list, they should be made public, they should be shown. And there's no classification associated with them other than the platform in which they are stored.

Speaker 5:
[06:42] Unreal. I'll start with this one. For UAP information, if this sounds familiar, over Iran, August 26, 2022, it's actually number one on the list. Does it ring a bell? And can you tell us anything about it?

Speaker 4:
[06:58] Yep. Yeah. I mean, I can tell you about it. It will really demand the attention once it's been released in public, but yeah, it is for UAP flying in formation deliberately. If you look at the way other things move, balloons, birds, the common misconception of UAP, you know, those shifts move, you know, they tend to reveal themselves and their behavior. What remains anomalous about this is that they hold this flight formation and shift the form of the formation multiple times in the way aircraft, birds, balloons floating in the air do not do.

Speaker 5:
[07:48] And so, you can tell just by that video, and people would be able to tell from that video that they're not looking at something prosaic, like there's something happening here.

Speaker 4:
[07:58] Correct, yep.

Speaker 5:
[08:01] So, all right, well, that's number one on there. Number four, cigar-shaped or fat-spherical UAP is how it's described on the list that was put out. October 15th, 2022. Can you comment on that?

Speaker 4:
[08:17] Yeah, this one, this one's really hard, and some of our top imagery analysts that look at these things, are, it's labeled UAP because they can't tell if it's a tic-tac-cylinder cigar-type shape or if it's an oblong bablazar-type saucer, because it appears to be a side-profile shot. So, is it a fat orb-looking thing? Some of these UAP are in very, very weird, unique shapes. Others are more, more common, probably the orbs being the most common lately. So, this is one that not only is it anomalous due to its behavior, but it's also anomalous because of its shape.

Speaker 5:
[09:03] Yeah, and that's what actually stood out to me. That's why I wanted to bring it up, was that shape. We've heard about the cigar shape, or kind of like that long, cylindrical type of shape. We've heard about it, but it seems a little bit more rare these days, especially if you're talking about a video from 2022. It feels like we hear more about like that cigar shape more in the past, maybe like, you know, 60s, 70s, 80s, even into the 90s. So to hear about one within the past four years is kind of eyebrow raising a little bit. Did that one stand out to you?

Speaker 4:
[09:42] Yeah, and to echo your point, we have other videos captured of tic-tac-like objects more recently than 2004. But it is definitely not the proponents, the majority of what we're seeing lately. I would chalk that up to these orbs that we are seeing. That is the most common thing that we are seeing now. But these cylindrical shapes, these cigar shapes, these flying propane tanks, as they were referred to back then, even as recently as Virginia, that case, that was the shape of the object seen there. It is a shape that I would say is common. Disks, orbs, cigar, tic-tac-type shapes, flying triangles, these would fall into the realm of commonly observed. Less common today, for sure, or at least with captured video that we're seeing, where orbs are the massive amount of UAP that we see are more orb-like shaped, metallic in nature, sometimes with sunlight bright, illuminating color, other times just metallic.

Speaker 5:
[11:00] Speaking of that shape, this one stands out to me. Number seven on the list, Anthony, is a spherical UAP pulsing over water jacker 2X. Is anything there that you can shed some light on?

Speaker 4:
[11:19] Yeah, so the color pulsing, which is observed in the video, also aligns with the report on that, where it was actually fading in and out of different colors. So, not only is it pulsing in brightness, but it's shifting between a green hue to a red hue, to an orange hue to a white hue. So, it's changing colors as well.

Speaker 5:
[11:44] And you can see the color, then this isn't like some type of black and white.

Speaker 4:
[11:49] You can't see the color in the video, but the pilot flying, they could see it in real time. That correlates with that report.

Speaker 5:
[11:57] So, that's really, really intriguing. It's very compelling, because you're talking about multiple different colors that don't match FAA lights that would be on an airplane or any other aircraft, civilian or professionally piloted aircraft.

Speaker 4:
[12:12] Yeah, red and green lights flash. They don't pulse.

Speaker 5:
[12:17] Yeah.

Speaker 4:
[12:19] And they flash, and they're for anti-collision. They're to determine which direction that airplane's flying. There's all the different reasons why they have those lights. Similar to anyone that boats, we have the red and green lights and a white light in the back on our watercraft and our aircraft to indicate which direction it's going, which way it's facing. And our aircraft are no different within the flight corridors that they operate. This was not doing that. This was slowly fading in and out and pulsing brighter, dimmer. That is not something that any of our aircraft do.

Speaker 5:
[12:55] So strange. I mean, what was made of it after this report came through? I mean, it just was put in a file and said, let's go have lunch. I mean, how is this not bigger?

Speaker 4:
[13:06] Yeah, that's the other alarming thing with much of this reporting. The initial reports can be found, but there's, with any other topic, you can look to find the resolved intelligence or the resolved information about these incidents. Where these reports go and what is made of them is not put anywhere. There's no repository to go find what the belief is, what was made of it, just the initial reports. So these are going up somewhere, they're being harvested, compiled, and not released back down to inform the force as to what it is that they're seeing. It doesn't give a very reassuring nod to any of these pilots that are capturing these things on film, that, hey, yep, it's a thing. Nothing else to tell you about it.

Speaker 5:
[14:07] Yeah, and I just, I find it hard to believe, Anthony, there's still a handful more that I'd like to get to here. But there's still, I find it hard to believe that it would, something like that would just come down to carelessness, you know, a lack of performing your duty. I have a hard time believing that things would just get lost or would not be characterized correctly or whatever it might be. It feels like something like that, where it's just, you know, left alone, forget about it, it feels like that's an intentional directive. Am I crossing a line by saying that or does that make sense?

Speaker 4:
[14:49] No, no, you're spot on. And it's not the only subject that we do that with. If we're collecting a bunch of information or intelligence on a specific subject that we need to look at it in its entirety, then we do that. We will collect a bunch of data, analyze it and then draw a conclusion. That conclusion is then put out in the form of an intelligence report and what we're not seeing is any analyzed or concrete data coming back that illuminates any more knowledge other than what these pilots are observing. So we're left in a state of confusion. And that's not normal. Wow.

Speaker 5:
[15:33] But again, nothing to see here, right? I'm wondering...

Speaker 4:
[15:36] Correct.

Speaker 5:
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Speaker 4:
[17:32] Yeah, so the Voodoo is the call sign for the platform that captured the video.

Speaker 5:
[17:39] Okay.

Speaker 4:
[17:41] And that is another anomalous video that it is the shape and color of it. And with a lot of these, the title is not super descriptive to really wow the public. It's the fact that these videos were identified by our military as anomalous, analyzed, continued to be deemed anomalous, and these titles were given to our congressmen and women so that they knew exactly what they were going after to request these specific videos.

Speaker 5:
[18:17] And do you remember anything about that specific craft or object that was captured?

Speaker 4:
[18:26] Yeah, the cranberry one looks like a cranberry. That's why it's labeled that way. Both shape and color.

Speaker 5:
[18:33] So strange. I'm curious about, it's so weird. There's two instances here, and I don't know if it was, if it's two separate videos, Anthony, or maybe just a typo of some sort, but they're both labeled US. Coast Guard C-144 UAP 2 Tic-Tac IR Hot, with, it sounds like a football play, with the date of April 24th, 2024. And there's, that's number 13 and 14. Is that a typo, or did that, was that doubled up on purpose?

Speaker 4:
[19:08] No, it's two separate videos. So some of these captures are quite long, and rather than one long video to upload, they'll break the video up. There's actually, I believe it's on the list, there's other videos that are labeled one through six, one through four. Those are the same incident, but the capture goes on for so long that those videos are broken up to keep the size of the files down for uploading.

Speaker 5:
[19:34] Okay, gotcha. So with that one, I mean, it sounds pretty descriptive. It sounds like the US. Coast Guard caught a tic-tac on IR footage. Is that something that was?

Speaker 4:
[19:45] Yep, that's right.

Speaker 5:
[19:47] Is that over US waters or is that international? Do you remember where this happened, I guess?

Speaker 4:
[19:57] I don't remember. I would have to go back and look. I don't remember where that was captured. And sometimes the location can be what makes something classified as well. Although that video in itself is not marked classified on any of the networks, none of these videos that are on this list are marked classified. There are some that are, some of the videos that are marked with classification markings. All of these that you've listed so far and all the ones on that list, those are not. So in reality, there's no reason why those couldn't be released to the public.

Speaker 5:
[20:34] So it really just comes down to, and that's also the very, you know, interesting, and maybe in some cases even frustrating part, is that these are not marked classified. Can we say that about all 46 videos, Anthony? Or are any of these marked specifically classified, top secret videos?

Speaker 4:
[20:52] I would have to go back through that list and look again, but I remember looking at it initially and being very familiar with those videos. And none of them struck me as the ones that were labeled secret or top secret.

Speaker 5:
[21:08] There is one, when we talk about locations. Yeah, go ahead. I'm sorry.

Speaker 4:
[21:13] Well, I was going to say there are some videos that I feel are over classified that are marked secret and are marked top secret that I don't feel should be. But again, the person that captures that classifies, they're the originator of that classification. And it's a problem that we have within the Department of War and with our government as a whole of over classification. So for the majority of these, I don't see anything that should have these things classified and not seen by the public.

Speaker 5:
[21:46] Yeah, that does seem to be one of the biggest issues. It's just that over classification hurdle that we always have to go through. And that's why we haven't seen these. There are some locations, though, that kind of stood out to me, Anthony. One of them was at Eglund Air Force Base in Pensacola, here in Florida. And again, something that kind of just, you know, there's a lot of code to this, so I don't know if this will help when I read it off. IIR 1665 SO 30123, and then it's Dash Eglund Air Force Base. It's number 18 on the list. Can you tell us anything about that?

Speaker 4:
[22:23] Yeah, that's not a video. That's an intelligence report. So that is a report that's a written report of a sighting. And a lot of times, there's more data in the written report than there is in the video. While the videos have wow factor for the average person that sees them, those intelligence reports are where the observer can get into great detail, describing exactly what they saw, where they saw at the length of time, how it was behaving, how it was maneuvering. Whereas with a video, you need to kind of glean all that yourself. And if you're not a trained observer in how to analyze these videos, there are a lot of videos that quite honestly look anomalous, but are not. They can be written off. So a lot of times, these written reports are as important or more important. That's an example of a written report.

Speaker 5:
[23:20] OK, I see. Interesting. So did you remember anything about that report that would stand out?

Speaker 4:
[23:28] Yeah, unfortunately, that is classified.

Speaker 5:
[23:32] All right. I will leave that one alone, then. We hit the classification wall. I find somewhere along the line during our conversations, I end up finding the classification wall at some point.

Speaker 4:
[23:44] That's OK. I'm just always careful not to cross it.

Speaker 5:
[23:47] For sure, for sure. I don't want you to. Kazakhstan. What can you tell us about administrative revision, IR.? Is that another report from the International Airport in Kazakhstan?

Speaker 4:
[24:00] That's another classified report.

Speaker 5:
[24:02] It is. OK. So a lot of the videos that are on this list aren't necessarily classified, but some of the reports are actually maybe where those are the ones that maybe they're more weary of as far as putting these out.

Speaker 4:
[24:18] Yes. Well, and not only that, but some of these classified reports, our congressmen and women have security clearance to where they are able to view these things. They are absolutely within their right to see them. So there are some items on that list that they will see that the general public will not, and that's okay, because they're the ones that we elect that represent us that are pursuing this on our behalf. The things that they can share, you know, I have no doubt that they will, evidenced by the fact that Congressman Burlison played that video at the last hearing. Right. They want disclosure as bad as any of us. Some of the classified items on that list, I know that they will pursue de-classification if they can. And if they can't, they can't. But for their breath of knowledge, raising their conviction level, they need to see these things.

Speaker 5:
[25:19] Right. I guess including this one, this sounds like it's another report, so it might get the same kind of answer here, but I have to ask about it. Number 21, several UAP in vicinity of Columbus, Ohio Airport.

Speaker 4:
[25:33] Yes.

Speaker 5:
[25:35] Anything on that that we can mention or no?

Speaker 4:
[25:37] No, but it goes right in line with a lot of the other mass sightings that we've seen over the last four years in the US. That one is specific to Columbus, Ohio.

Speaker 5:
[25:47] Wow. So that, and I got to tell you, I'd never even heard of that. I don't remember seeing that in the news. I don't even really remember seeing that around a lot in the space that I occupy, which is trying to investigate all these claims. Did that happen within the past five years? There's no date on that. Can you tell us, recollection-wise, when that may have happened?

Speaker 4:
[26:09] Yeah, it's recent, and I don't remember the exact date either. But I will say that pros, cons, good, bad, or indifferent, you know, AI has really created the realm of disbelief with a lot of the videos that are being seen, a lot of the things that are being said. So in the public spaces, you know, and quite honestly, there are even still with the average citizen that has interest in this topic, if they saw something, there's still a level of hesitation or lack of understanding of where they would go to report, where they would go to say they've seen something. You know, and in local news, local media, there is still a little bit of laughability around the subject.

Speaker 5:
[27:02] For sure.

Speaker 4:
[27:02] National media has actually done a very better, a much better job of taking the topic seriously. Peter Ducey just questioned Caroline Levitt within the last couple of days as to these 10 missing people. And, you know, so it's getting the attention in the right places, but it doesn't surprise me that you're not aware of that. There are hundreds of reports that come in all the time that I think the average person, even someone engaged in this topic, is blissfully unaware of.

Speaker 5:
[27:34] Boy, that's very true. Do you still have some time, Anthony? I might want to keep you too long if you need to go.

Speaker 4:
[27:41] I do. I've got a few more minutes.

Speaker 5:
[27:42] Okay. Real quick then on this list, and then we'll just get to the last couple of items here before you have to go. There was one thing that kind of caught my eye, and it wasn't even really the name of something. It's the frequency of which some of these call signs come up. You know, I see call signs like toxic six, greed, hackney six. A lot of these call signs come up quite frequently, and with different dates, and with different sightings. Are these the... So does that mean these are the same people who are seeing multiple sightings on different dates? Or what does that point to?

Speaker 4:
[28:22] Yeah, so the call sign for a lot of these are the platform and the pilot at the time.

Speaker 5:
[28:29] Okay.

Speaker 4:
[28:30] So these could be the same pilot, or more likely than not, they are different pilots on the same aircraft.

Speaker 5:
[28:38] Interesting. So, I mean, there is a possibility, then, that you have, like, the same person seeing multiple sightings, one in October, one in September, one in, you know, the next year in April, like, that we could be looking at something like that?

Speaker 4:
[28:52] It could be more likely than not. A unit, or a wing, or a flight company, they're going to have multiple pilots. They'll have way more pilots than they do airframes, and that is for crew rest. It is to rotate and keep some of these aircraft flying persistently. That exceeds the ability of one individual to maintain all that flying. So, these platforms, anyone that you named, HyperVoodoo, Toxic, Hackney, all these different call sign platforms, will have multiple different pilots on them days and days on end. Some of these platforms fly almost every day. They go down for maintenance, routine maintenance, or on order, and then they get right back up, get back up flying again.

Speaker 5:
[29:45] Interesting. Okay. And last thing on this list, actually, I'll just go to number 46. This was kind of interesting to me. High resolution, Hackney 4X observes UAPs at 1715Z on September 23rd, 2019. Break that down for us. What does that mean? And do you remember anything about what they saw in that video? High resolution.

Speaker 4:
[30:12] Yeah, so the 1715, so that's 515 in the evening, Zulu time, so that's built off of Greenwich time.

Speaker 5:
[30:22] Gotcha.

Speaker 4:
[30:23] What we refer to in the military as Zulu time, obviously, the date after it. Some of these are very high resolution videos. That is one of them. That is very clear because it's not a thermal sensor, creating a picture off of a heat signature, but rather a camera recording in real time. It's a high definition camera.

Speaker 5:
[30:44] Wow, so an actual high resolution video, I think that would be something that a lot of people would welcome instead of some type of white blip on a screen, which is good enough. But if we actually can see some definition, that's a pretty big deal. Before we're done here, Anthony, I do want to ask you about something too that some videos that you've seen that aren't on this list that you think would be worthy of being on this list. I mean, what pops into your head? I know you mentioned the one that, you know, you kind of see like that cloaking ability, which is unbelievable. But I mean, what else pops into your head when you think about that?

Speaker 4:
[31:21] Yeah, a couple other videos. I think most of your audience will remember, you know, when Jeremy Corbell and George Knapp released the video of the jellyfish UAP over Iraq. What I think would be very eye-opening is the fact that there are two additional videos of that same jellyfish type shape in different parts of Iraq months apart. Another video capturing it over Saladin, Iraq, on March 21st of last year, 2025. And then over Mice and Iraq 17th September of last year, 2025. So those are just compounding and confirming that original video, and that it's not a one-off. There are more examples of that out there.

Speaker 5:
[32:18] That's wild. Because that's one of those things with the jellyfish, who is always kind of looked at as an anomaly. You know, like, what is this shape? And there's been other reports of it in some other areas since then. But to hear that, there's actually, you know, hard evidence videos of more of those jellyfish type of UAPs over Iraq just last year. I mean, that just goes to show how, I don't know, I hate to say clueless. I mean, what is the right word? I mean, these things just keep popping up, and we can't or won't do anything about it.

Speaker 4:
[32:53] Yeah, and that that exact shape has been seen in other areas too. One of them witnessed was over New Mexico, and it was called, the video was labeled La Bruja, which is Spanish for the witch. Because they didn't view it as like a jellyfish, they viewed it as what looked like a flying witch. So, you know, that that anomalous shape, less common, would be categorized as an uncommon shape, has now been seen and reported on multiple times.

Speaker 5:
[33:25] That's so wild. I mean, do we have any idea what those are? I mean, it just doesn't make any sense that something like that shape, with, you know, some type of sphere on the top, and what seems to be some type of tentacles, which is hence the name jellyfish, kind of hanging down. But it looks very mechanical. Is this some type of, like, probing drone? I mean, do we have any idea?

Speaker 4:
[33:50] Yeah, anything that we have seen, and really through the, you know, through the current conflicts going on globally, there's been a massive arms race in drone warfare at a scale that we've never seen. And it really revolves around tech improving and the contentious fighting on both sides, creating the need for evolving. That type of shape is not any shape that would make logical sense, and it's not evolving through any sort of hybrid drone warfare. We're not seeing that anywhere else. There's been no conclusion that, hey, I know a good shape for a drone, let's make it look like a jellyfish. That's not happening anywhere.

Speaker 5:
[34:42] So there's no reports of something like that, that type of shape, that type of build being used by anybody throughout the world?

Speaker 4:
[34:50] No. No.

Speaker 5:
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Speaker 4:
[36:18] You know, I think staying up on the topics, keeping an open mind, and it gets easy to get sucked into a different camp. I think any person that's speaking publicly about this that advances the conversation is a worthy voice. I would just, you know, continue to caution around what we know and what we don't know and what we believe and what we feel and what we think. You know, because it gets real easy to get wrapped around, you know, a certain camp and, oh, these are the Nordics or these are the Grays or this is this. And there's enough hard evidence out there. There's enough collected data that demands attention. And I think we just need to be open minded that any of those potential possibilities could be real. You know, and there's other accusations made by other whistleblowers that that might be true as well. And I'm thinking specifically of like Michael Herrera's claims that he's made. You know, it gets to be very easy where we write things off and things don't pass the sniff test. I would just encourage everyone to remain open minded as, you know, as we inch and creep at a snail's pace ever closer to disclosure. I think, at least my opinion, I think the genie is out of the bottle. I think that happened in 2017, and I think the lexicon is just catching up. Because I even have family members that are now asking me, people that have had no interest in anything that I do, asking me about this subject out of the blue. Hey, what do you think about this? And not knowing that I have personal interest in this topic, it's just on everyone's radar. So, I would remain everyone to stay focused, stay open-minded, and not get sucked into a camp of, this guy is good or this guy is bad, or this guy is a Psyop, or this guy is that. That all might be true and it all might not be true. But I will say, for the most part, I believe we have a lot of people, some that will never be known about, that are coming forward, that are sharing what they know, specifically to our congressmen and women right now that are pursuing this. And for good cause. But also at the same point, some of these whistleblowers, some of the biggest names out there have been very transparent about how this has affected their lives. So, there is a hesitation or reservation by some to really go out there and just full open commodo about this topic because of that. And I think that's okay too. And people need to understand that. A lot of these people have families, they have children, they're doing more than just opening themselves up to ridicule. They're potentially affecting their livelihood and their ability to protect, feed, furnish, their lives. So, I think we all need to look at it from that lens. I know it becomes really easy to be very critical of people, but I would just encourage patience on our part because we have a very limited role in it. And I would encourage swift action by those like these congressmen and women we've talked about today. They should go fast and hard and get on it as hard as they can. For the majority of us, we should continue to advocate with our politicians. We should continue to push the topic. But we need to exercise, I think, patience and remember not to judge too hard. You know, others, when we've not sat in their shoes.

Speaker 5:
[40:44] Yeah, all well said. Very well said. Is there something that can be done, Anthony? You think about the over-classification issue. You know, we were talking about that earlier. That seems to be, well, not really seems. It, I think, clearly is a hurdle when it comes to trying to get some of this information, you know, video and otherwise out there, is just over-classification. I mean, what can possibly be done to try to kind of break down that wall?

Speaker 4:
[41:11] Well, Burchette, Burleson and Luna that you mentioned, they know how to do that. They know how to get that declassified. They're the original classifier that originally classified it. That is usually based off of a security classification guide that dictates if it contains certain things, it must be classified at this level. And there are a few people that can declassify those, the largest of course being the President of the United States. And I think, like you mentioned, Secretary Hegseth, Tulsi Gabbard is another one that they could approach the President and say, hey, there's no compromise of national security. I think we can declassify these. And I'd like to believe that he would.

Speaker 5:
[42:00] Yeah. Well, actually on that note, so where do you see this all going, Anthony? I mean, now to kind of wrap up here, how do you see this all going, just maybe over the rest of this year? Do you think we actually get some answers on some things? Do we get any announcements? Do we get any releases? I mean, just based off of the environment that you're around right now, where do you see this kind of going?

Speaker 4:
[42:24] I don't see Burleson, Berchette, or Luna letting this go. I don't. And I think they will get access to these files because there's no justification for them not have access to them. So I think they will get them. And I think they'll make a push. I would expect to see over the next year, some of these videos come out, some of these, I don't know about the reporting, but I think some of these videos will get out. People will see them. And when it comes to disclosure, I've heard all the same rumors that you have about what's on the president's mind, what's in his head with regards to disclosing. You know, the jury is still out on that. We'll see. I know I'm anxiously waiting to see what he does and says. I think there's definitely a certain level of knowledge that I even know that I think could absolutely come out. And I think the world deserves to know the truth about some of this for sure.

Speaker 5:
[43:26] All right. There's, I know I said that was the last one, but this just popped into my head. So I promised this is the last one. You've already spent so much time here today. If you had the opportunity, let's say someone contacted you from the Trump administration and they said, Anthony, we want you to come in and tell a president, why should he be intrigued by this and compelled enough to release some information? What would you tell him? Would you show him a video that you think would push him kind of like to say, hey, this is really interesting. The public hasn't seen this video or give him this report. What would you say to kind of sway his opinion on it?

Speaker 4:
[44:04] Ooh, that's a good question. I think the president, I don't know this to be fact, but I think he's already there. I think he has seen or been briefed to enough to know what it is that's at least to some degree going on. And I think more than any other president in my lifetime, he's been very transparent about his opinions, and very transparent about actions he's going to take. Not necessarily timing, but what he's going to do. And I think probably the most telling statement was him responding to President Obama's claim that aliens are real. He came right out and said that was classified information that President Obama divulged, and he shouldn't have done that, and that he could declassify some of that and bail him out for divulging classified information. So I would look to that happening. And I think I would encourage the president to make a decision based on the potential for positive, not the fear of bad. We should know the risk involved, but we hear a lot of continued secrecy off of the fear of how the reaction from the public may be perceived. And I don't think that's a smart way to make a decision. I think we should analyze and assess the risk, but I think we also need to weigh the potential for good and the leveling up of understanding our place in the universe. I think that outweighs any potential disruption. Quite honestly, there are a lot of things, a lot of technologies that are quite disruptive. I would argue the Internet, AI., automobiles, the Industrial Revolution, all of these have been very disruptive to the way the world worked prior to their launch. And I think this is just another one of those topics that if it is revealed, you know, whatever it is that is revealed, if it is deemed to potentially be disruptive, it may be. But that also might be okay. There have been a lot of subjects over the years that have been very disruptive to the way we've existed prior to that. And the human race and society seems to adapt and overcome. And I think we should trust that we can do that again.

Speaker 5:
[47:00] Yeah. Well done. Anthony Williams, Episode 200, as we finish off here. Unreal, man. It's always so great to catch up with you here and to hear some of this inside information and get your insight. It's always so unique and it's always so appreciated to get your insight here on the show. Like I said at the start, I wouldn't want to do it, and I didn't want to do it with anybody else for number 200 other than you. So thanks so much for agreeing to come back on here and be a part of this. And hopefully we can get you back on here. Maybe before Episode 300, we can do something else again.

Speaker 4:
[47:34] Absolutely. Always great talking to you. Such a huge fan of the show. I think it's podcasts like yours that keeps this subject in the forefront of people's minds. And I think if we took a look at all the podcasts on this subject and the amount of viewership, you know, and the way it's grown over the years, this is becoming a very important topic to a lot of people. And so honored to be number 200 for you, and very thankful for you and others like you that are operating in this space.

Speaker 5:
[48:14] Thanks so much, buddy. Really appreciate it. And well, we'll talk again soon, and I really appreciate all your time to come on here. Anthony Williams, thanks so much right here on UAP.

Speaker 4:
[48:25] Thanks, Stephen.

Speaker 5:
[48:27] And that will finish off our two-part episode here with Anthony Williams to take us to number 200 and now past 200 as we finish off episode number 201 here on UAP. So thank you again to Anthony for coming back on here. Always look forward to have him on. I'm sure we'll do it again sometime in the future to get his unique and exclusive perspective on all these issues. As we continue to move forward, all the things that we spoke about here in these past two episodes are not going away, whether it's the missing government officials, whether it's these videos that people are waiting to see, whether it's disclosure coming from the Trump administration, or some type of indication or speech or something, whatever it might be, these things are not going away. And I say that so I can make the point that even though this conversation is over and these episodes are done, I'm not going to stop covering these topics. I'm going to keep investigating them, I'm going to keep my eye on them and continue to discuss them either just with you or with another guest as we continue to learn more about these important conversations. So I'm just happy that we could do what we did here over these past two episodes with Anthony Williams. And I really, really hope that you found it to be insightful and useful to the overall conversations surrounding the UFO topic right now. Because personally, I thought that was an extremely fascinating back and forth that I was able to have with him. And I just love getting his perspective, because he's on a different mentality, you know? He's got all this experience with all these topics on a behind-the-scenes perspective. And so I just think it's so valuable to get his insight on all these things. And I always learn a ton, and I hope you did too, throughout these past two episodes. So much more to uncover as well. But with that said, we're going to actually go into a little bit of a different topic coming up here on UAP on episode 202, coming up in a few days. I'm going to bring on a married couple named EJ and John. And you heard me say at the beginning of the year, one thing I wanted to do this year on a more conscious effort was to speak with more everyday people here on the show. And that's what I was able to do with EJ and John. They're a very, very fascinating couple who have not only developed their own kind of like sky watcher technology that they're trying to test out and put out to the community, which was interesting in itself, and you'll hear how they develop that, but also to hear about their own experiences with alien abduction and even encounters with angels and how all that has connected throughout their lives even before they knew each other. They didn't know until later how it all connected before they even knew each other. So we're going to kind of depart a little bit from what we've been talking about here over the past couple of weeks and get into a personal experiencer story with EJ and John, and I think that's something that you're going to enjoy from a different point of view outside of some of these topics that we've been covering here recently. It was a funny interview and it was really interesting to hear about their lives. Again, just everyday people like you and I and how the phenomenon has affected them personally and the experiences they've had throughout their lives. So, I look forward to presenting that one to you coming up here on UAP for Episode 202. And then stay tuned because I've got a lot more coming up here and even more things to update you on. A lot of behind the scenes stuff that I'm still working on. I'm always working on things behind the scenes. But interviews, I guess I can touch on that. Planned, I will throw this out there. We have planned to bring on two very special guests, one being Roni Vernet, who is a top-notch, world-renowned UFO investigator out of Brazil. I've been following him for years, and I cannot wait to have him on. We were speaking just a few days ago, and he's like, yeah, let's do it. You know, we agreed on a date, so he should be coming on here soon to UAP. Roni Vernet, it'll be great to have him on. You talk about somebody with just an incredible knowledge and background on this topic. My goodness, the things he's going to be able to shed some light on is just going to be irreplaceable as we have that discussion here on UAP. So look forward to that coming up. And also planned, and this is really, really cool, not to say that everything else we've done isn't really, really cool, but I'm super, super excited for this. Something that I've thought about doing for a few years now, and I cannot believe it actually seems like it's coming together, is to have Laura Eisenhower on the show. Yes, the great-granddaughter of President Dwight D. Eisenhower. How cool is this going to be? I've been speaking to her over the past few weeks, and we're setting up a date for her to come on to the show here, and hopefully I will be able to present Laura Eisenhower on the show here as well. She's very much into this topic. She travels literally around the world talking about her experiences, and I can't wait to talk about what she's experienced, and of course, the meeting. I mean, I was just talking about that not too long ago here. I think it was episode 195, where we discussed the meeting that Eisenhower supposedly had with gray aliens and with Nordic aliens, and she is the only one in the family, in the Eisenhower family to this day, who actually discusses that subject, that event. So I cannot wait to bring on Laura Eisenhower here. There is so much coming up here on UAP. It's almost even hard to keep up with. But you can keep up with it by downloading and subscribing to the show wherever you get your podcast. It's on all the major platforms that you find a podcast. The podcast, just search UAP and follow along on social media as well. At UAPodcast 850, throughout social media, at UAPodcast 850, again, there. And on YouTube, just search UAP podcast and you'll find all the videos. And you can subscribe to the channel there as well, because you can see a lot of the interviews that I've done on the show that are up there just in its raw form up on YouTube as well, which is pretty cool. So that's it for now. Anthony Williams, again, thank you to him for doing this, for supplying us with so much unique insight and perspective here on UAP over these past two episodes. Could not be more thankful for that. And I cannot be more thankful for you for continuing to come back and stick around here on UAP. And I can't wait to come back with more coming up here soon in the future. So on that note, thank you all again for everything, for all the support, because as you know, it means the world to me. So until next time, it is Stephen Diener here saying be well. Thanks so much. We'll talk again soon right here on UAP, the Unidentified Alien Podcast.