transcript

Speaker 1:
[00:00] And here's the other thing, and now with that set up, and I think it's, look, I never, I finished second twice, one time to Michael Bogard, another time to Eric Decker, lost to both of them in the sprint. We didn't finish here, but they were still, they deserved to win. With this version, finishing on top, I mean, it would take just such an extreme scenario where the best man didn't win. I mean, Remco Venipel won today. He was by far the strongest rider in the race. He deserved to win, to win, and he won. And so, I mean, as far as I'm concerned, I like watching bike races where the best man wins. Okay, everybody, welcome back to The Move Podcast, talking about the 2026 Amstel Gold Race. Let me tell you, I loved this race. Such, I mean, such, such a great race. The people are great. The course, while it has changed over the years, it's just such a, it's a very hard race, very technical. Oftentimes, weather can play a factor. Certainly, wind can play a factor. They had a version of this race in the 1998 world championships that I did. Just a great race in such a cool part of Holland. Fun one, fun, what to do back in the day and a fun one to watch joined by Spencer Martin over there in Boulder, dude, that's Boulder. I'll be in Boulder tomorrow, dude.

Speaker 2:
[01:41] Got to embrace the lifestyle when you're here, bro.

Speaker 1:
[01:46] Have some tea down at the coffee shop and Johan Bruyneel. Where are you y'all? You're in Madrid, right?

Speaker 3:
[01:53] I'm in Madrid.

Speaker 4:
[01:54] Yes. All right.

Speaker 1:
[01:55] All right. How are you?

Speaker 3:
[01:57] Pretty good. Pretty good.

Speaker 2:
[01:58] Okay.

Speaker 4:
[01:59] You're looking fit.

Speaker 3:
[02:01] I'm training, man. I need that. We still have, I still have my challenge on with Spencer, you know, restarted in January.

Speaker 1:
[02:08] You have no chance.

Speaker 4:
[02:10] Who?

Speaker 1:
[02:11] You.

Speaker 4:
[02:12] Well, I saw him. I saw him.

Speaker 2:
[02:14] You wanted a 17 hour week, two weeks ago.

Speaker 3:
[02:16] Dude, that's crazy, man.

Speaker 4:
[02:19] Yeah. No, he can handle the gravel too.

Speaker 3:
[02:22] I won it last year against Spencer and I'm on my way to winning it again.

Speaker 2:
[02:26] Well, it's just a mileage for the year. Kilometers, total kilometers in a year.

Speaker 1:
[02:29] Oh, okay.

Speaker 2:
[02:30] Johan is putting in the kilometers. Okay.

Speaker 4:
[02:33] Do you guys remember when you'd make fun of me for riding too much? I know you guys like have the most mileage and I'm riding probably less than any one of you guys now.

Speaker 1:
[02:42] Yeah. And that one talking is the star of the show, George Hincapie. George, welcome.

Speaker 4:
[02:47] Thank you. Great to see you. Lance, tell us why you love Amstel so much as opposed to, I know you always did well in Liège. You did Flanders with me a couple of times, but why, why Amstel?

Speaker 1:
[02:58] Well, outside of the, well, I guess to start, when people think about Holland as I did for many, many years, you think of this country that's just completely flat. And of course, there's always wind all over the country, but you just think of these, the, you know, the canals and the bike paths and Amsterdam and a place that's just pancake flat. And then you get to this part, this little corner of the Netherlands, which is the Limburg region, which actually isn't that far from Liège, where we'll be next weekend, or the Ardennes, as they are known. And it's very, very hilly and the roads are narrow. You have to be in position. Of course, nowadays, I can't recall the last time we did a spring classic in the rain. Just watch it on TV. But that was always the assumption 20 years ago. It's like, well, we know a couple things. We know it's gonna be hilly. We know it's gonna be windy. And we know it's gonna be raining. So we have to, it just makes the fight for position to be at the front before these really tough climbs, because they're very narrow. So if it's, if you're not at the front, you know, it's just very difficult. So I loved that. Also, it was just starting and, Johan, you'll know where I'm going here. It was, it's just that time of year where it's, and I think we actually even described it as this, over the years where that was sort of the first checkpoint.

Speaker 3:
[04:38] That's the first test.

Speaker 1:
[04:40] Yeah, like where are we? Where's, are we competitive? Are we on track for July? It was just, and it helps that it's a race that you really want to do because you could have these checkpoints at places that you don't have a connection to. But that was always the first one. And for whatever reason, I just always enjoyed this really great relationship with the Dutch people. And of course, Leo Van Bleet, who's been the race director there for 30 years, this was his 30th edition of the race, this 30th and final edition. He's now stepping down. Tom Dumoulin is taking over. He was always lovely. Congratulations to him for having just a great career and really building a race that, you know, this is not, when you think about cycling and you think about the monuments and you think about the spring classics, right? Of course, you've got San Remo and you've got Flanders and Roubaix and Liège and then this one is almost in a way been the redheaded stepchild. But it's become a classic. It's that special. It has all the makings of a classic. Of course, through the years had had incredible winners, through the Dutch glory years and the Glutch, not just from the rider's perspective, but from the teams going all the way back to to PDM and Buckler and Rabobank. And this was this was there. They had to win this race. Now that is, I suspect, no longer the case. But boy, this was the second biggest race on the calendar for them. And some could argue maybe the biggest. I don't know. It was just I always I always loved doing it. I always got excited for it and fun to watch. I mean, you know, of course, the course has changed over the years as have many of these. It still kept its character. It's still damn hard. You still have to be in position. I love the finish up the Cowberg. Like I think that's, you know, in many ways, Johan, I mean, they copied a little bit of the Flanders model. Flanders, of course, you have the old Quermont. They're going to go over this numerous times. We're going to set up this experience at the finish. And they did that with the Cowberg.

Speaker 3:
[06:58] Yeah, it's the same. I mean, if you look at the people on the coming, already in just before that corner, then all the way up, it's the natural arena, right? I think the Cowberg, they do it three times in the race, if I'm not mistaken.

Speaker 2:
[07:11] That's right, yes.

Speaker 3:
[07:14] So yeah, I mean, the atmosphere there is crazy. I mean, I remember when, as a cyclist, but then also being there with you, Lance, in the final of the race, I mean, the noise when you hit that corner, it was crazy.

Speaker 1:
[07:27] Yeah, the grandstand there. Yep, and here's the other thing. And now with that set up, and I think it's, look, I never, I finished second twice, one time to Michael Bogard, another time to Eric Decker, lost to both of them in the sprint. We didn't finish here, but they were still, they deserved to win. With this version, finishing on top, I mean, it would take just such an extreme scenario where the best man didn't win. I mean, Remco Vennepoel won today. He was by far the strongest rider in the race. He deserved to win, and he won. And so, I mean, as far as I'm concerned, I like watching bike races where the best man wins.

Speaker 3:
[08:14] Yeah, for sure. Yeah, I mean, I think, I think, you know, maybe people were a bit, I mean, at least the Belgian fans, you know, like I got messages from people during the race, yeah, Remco's gonna leave, you know, he's gonna go by himself. That didn't happen. He did the majority of the work once these three guys were away, but I think, as we said many times, you know, especially when you're two guys in the break, you know who's the strongest. And it was clear for me during the race, but then also confirmed after the race, in the interview of Skjell Moser, that he knew he had no chance. He was happy with second and, you know, he had settled for second already. So I don't know if Remco, if they had talked, if there was an agreement, Remco didn't really need to drop him because he's more explosive than Skjell Moser.

Speaker 1:
[09:05] There was a little bit of conversation. I don't know if you noticed that, a little bit of back and forth at the start of the final time up the Kalberg. And I'm just sitting there going, I wonder what they're saying. But then I kind of thought about it and I said, I know exactly what they're saying. Skjell Moser is saying, I'm. I'm fucked. Don't worry. I'm happy to get second or some version of this, like Remco looked great. And one could say, and of course, we were in this pattern of going, why would anybody pull with Pogatar? Just sit on the wheel. This is not that situation.

Speaker 4:
[09:39] No.

Speaker 1:
[09:39] And Remco knew exactly what was going to happen there. And Skjell Moser was probably pretty dang happy to get second.

Speaker 4:
[09:49] I agree. I mean, he won last year, was still there. Said he grew up watching these races as a kid. So be there amongst it at the final. I think it was still a huge success for him today.

Speaker 2:
[10:01] Well, yeah, big result for him. I mean, in his back, a little overstatement, but his back's kind of against the wall in that team. You know, they brought in someone to do his job, which is never great. When you're a GC rider and they spend a ton of money to bring in a GC rider that they think is better than you, I think it probably didn't sit that well with them, Johan. And I think today was a big statement saying, hey, I won this race last year. I got second today. Like I'm still the man in this team.

Speaker 3:
[10:27] He was there, man. I mean, listen, he was, he was, I think the moment Remco went, I actually, Gregoire went first, no? And then Remco, yeah, it's up over.

Speaker 2:
[10:35] And then Remco dropped Gregoire smartly, right? Cause he's so fast.

Speaker 3:
[10:38] And he came, Scalemosa came from like fifth, sixth position. So he went up, you could see he was on a good day. He was on a really, he was, he was on the limit, but he was not really, I don't think he was ever in trouble of, or about to get dropped. And you know what, I mean, the fact that straight away he took the decision that whatever he could, whenever he could, he did his share of the work tells me that he was settling for second and it's a great result. I mean, listen, if you win the year before there were, I've seen some interviews from, from people, by the way, one of your, your good friends, George, said that a track should little track should definitely forget about Skjell Mose. He had no chance in this race and that they should gamble on, who was it, on Craig Anderson, who happens to be, by the way, in the race. Um, you know, these are the little things that motivate somebody and showed he was there. You know, he, he, he was, he won it last year. Today he was the second best of the race.

Speaker 1:
[11:44] Well, I mean, if you're on, you just can't help himself, right, George?

Speaker 3:
[11:51] I'm just saying what I read.

Speaker 4:
[11:52] Well, I mean, I feel like these days, it's gotten so, so competitive, so important. Like you're on the podium of a World Cup race. It's still a big deal for these teams, even though he won last year. And you could see, you know, people just think that these guys just arrived there in that position. But we all know from first-hand experience how difficult it actually is, the positioning battle, the thousands of corners in Amstel Gold Race, the small, tiny roads, how dangerous they are. We unfortunately saw Juergensen have a terrible crash. Hopefully he's okay, but he laid there for a while. And I mean, they could just, you could just lose the whole race in one little slide, like we saw those guys.

Speaker 1:
[12:30] I mean, if anybody just is really, really bored on, and I mean, anybody listening, I'm not asking anybody on the show here to do it, but if anybody listening, sitting at home has absolutely nothing to do. Go find one of the riders Strava files from today. Just zoom in, count the turns. It's, especially towards the end. It is turn after turn after turn. Didn't seem as stressful today. Maybe the lack of rain was there. The field seemed a little thin.

Speaker 3:
[13:05] Yeah, but it's also the speed, Lance. I think, for me, for example, I do have flashbacks of back in the days where we said, positioning and the whole bunch going to a critical point did not happen today. It's so fast. I mean, if you look at the average speed, I mean, 43 kilometers average, and it's 3,400 meters of elevation in total. It's like there is no more fighting for position because the moment they get there, they're all dead. I mean, there's 10 guys that can still go. And we saw one acceleration and that was it.

Speaker 1:
[13:39] Yeah, let me just, I'm sorry, Johan. Let me just, for the folks who don't think in meters or kilometers, that's 11,000 feet of total vert with an average speed of approaching 27 miles an hour.

Speaker 2:
[13:58] For six hours.

Speaker 1:
[13:59] For six hours. 11,000 vert.

Speaker 4:
[14:03] The one big difference of this one.

Speaker 1:
[14:05] 27 miles an hour, sorry, Jacob.

Speaker 4:
[14:07] This World Cup, we saw San Remo, 50k or 30k to go. There's four guys, three guys. We saw Flanders, one by one by one with already 40k to go. We saw Rubé, it was done with 80k to go, essentially. Here, we still have essentially a peloton with 55k to go, which is the one difference, even though it's super hard, like the riders are still there working together, working for their teammates. So it's different in that sense that riders can stay together a lot longer in this race than, you know, the cobblestone races and the Chipresa, for instance. Yeah.

Speaker 2:
[14:44] Well, I mean, we should also shout out Jan Tratnik. Man, he set that thing up. It wasn't a lot of drama going into these corners because Red Bull shredded this race. And then we needed one acceleration. George, you mentioned Mateo Jorgensen crashing. There was a five rider group that made it clear with Kevin Vaclán, Roman Grégoire, Jorgensen, Evan Opel-Scalmoza. Two of them crash out, Vaclán and Jorgensen. And do you, Johan, do you think the race is any different if they don't crash out or is Rimco winning this no matter what?

Speaker 3:
[15:14] It would have been different. Yeah. I mean, because I think, I think Jorgensen, there was a goal for him. I think he came there in really good shape, came from the, from altitude training on the Tede. Vokelein is obviously also a rider that this, this race suits him well. So it could have been different. I don't know if it would have been a different winner. I don't think so. I think Rimco quality wise is still a little bit ahead of those guys. Although we have to say Jorgensen, when he won Pyrénées, he did beat Rimco Evenepoel, right? Yeah. But hey, I mean, Focolin looked like he got back up on his bike. Jorgensen stayed on the ground, looked like shoulder or collarbone. George, do you have any information?

Speaker 4:
[15:57] No info yet, but yeah, he was there for a while.

Speaker 3:
[15:59] But didn't look good.

Speaker 1:
[16:02] Well, I mean, they replayed the crash on the coverage I was watching. I mean, that does not look good, and he stayed down. He just didn't get, I mean, classic collarbone. I mean, when they replayed it, there was nothing to break the fall. It was, he was on the bike, and then he was on his shoulder. Like just that looked like, which of course is so common in the sport. But I saw that, for sure he's not getting back up, and then you start to be concerned with time off the bike.

Speaker 2:
[16:38] Yeah. Well, I guess if it's just collarbone, those guys come back and like...

Speaker 1:
[16:42] Come back, but we're sitting here watching a race thinking he's gonna be affected.

Speaker 2:
[16:45] Yeah, I had to think about that. Just think about that group though. I mean, to be, that's an exclusive group. A double peri-niece winner, Remco Evanepol, Shkelmoza, defending champion, Greg Warr and Vuk Lahn. And that's it, right? At 42K to go. Like there's not, and think about the winner, Remco Evanepol is the last person that's not, Remco Evanepol, Wout Van Aert of Purgotra to win a major one day race as Shkelmoza last year. And then before that, maybe Phillipson at San Remo. It's the same guys every time because these races are so hard.

Speaker 4:
[17:17] Let's not forget the season that, well, the momentum that Visma has right now and also Ineos. I mean, they've won a ton of races this year. So in their mindset during that, they made that final selection. They have perhaps a lot less pressure from their team, but they have a ton of motivation with the way, how well their team has performed throughout the year. So they were, in my opinion, in a definitely a winning situation until the crash, for sure.

Speaker 1:
[17:42] Yeah. Yeah. Let's take a little commercial break.

Speaker 2:
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Speaker 3:
[19:11] Yeah, I want to also shout out to Benoit Cosnefra. What a race. I mean, he finished third, but so he missed the initial break. I think he was out.

Speaker 4:
[19:21] I didn't even know he went to UAE.

Speaker 3:
[19:23] Oh, yeah, he did. And he was already really good on Friday in Flash Brabanson, Brabant Sepeil was second in this race a few years ago. Photo finish with Michael Kiatkowski, if you guys remember. But he did all the work. And there was this one, this other French rider from EF, who gave him some turns now and then, but he did everything. Everybody else is sitting down, sitting, sitting on. And finally, he wins the sprint for third. I mean, two minutes down. So I think that also shows you the difference between those two riders and the rest, but still a great third place for him after doing all the work in the back.

Speaker 1:
[20:03] Yeah. And UAE just can't help themselves. Just got to be on the podium, like in the best way. I'm not, I'm not deep.

Speaker 2:
[20:15] They've actually been in a slump. And for UAE's normal performance, like Ineos is closing in on them on the win rankings. That's unheard of in recent years.

Speaker 4:
[20:26] Well, don't they have like 10 guys out with injuries?

Speaker 2:
[20:28] Yeah, they have like a lot of guys. A lot of their key class of guys.

Speaker 4:
[20:32] Yeah.

Speaker 1:
[20:32] The interest, Remco's interview at the end, one thing stood out. They asked him about, they're asking, obviously asked him if he was going to do Liège, which he pretended to be on the fence. We're thinking that's not the case.

Speaker 4:
[20:51] No, Flesch.

Speaker 3:
[20:52] Flesch well on.

Speaker 1:
[20:53] Did they? The interview, I don't know if they were talking about Flesch or anyhow.

Speaker 4:
[20:57] Yeah, no.

Speaker 3:
[20:58] Liège is doing it for sure.

Speaker 1:
[21:00] Okay. Well, what was interesting was the entry of Paul Seychast already in this conversation, because it was being billed as this three man battle between Remco, Pogachar and now, Paul Seychast. Like this kid overnight, not overnight, but in a year is, and you guys have all the numbers to back this up. Apparently, this is the real deal Holyfield. But that was, he's in the conversation. Boom.

Speaker 2:
[21:33] Yeah, he's, yeah.

Speaker 4:
[21:35] What he, what he, what he did at Pay Basque, I mean, just incredible. Pogachar is, I would say.

Speaker 3:
[21:42] He toyed with everybody. He did whatever he, whenever he wanted. And then, you know, there's obviously the data also. I mean, I guess this, the one, the one statistic, I think we all hang on to Spencer is this climb he did when he won that race in France there in the beginning of the season. And he did a few seconds slower than Pogachar on the same climb. What was it? Seven, more than seven watts per kilo for 29.

Speaker 2:
[22:11] I have it pulled up right here. Seven is, yeah, it's 16 minute climb. And he's dropping strong guys like Matteo Jorgensen and Lenny Martinez again, shot out the back, like the juniors. This is a teenager by the way, 7.2 watts per kilo on this climb. This was 40K from the finish. He soloed to the finish, increasing his gap that whole time. That's scary, folks, if you're a GC rider out there. You don't want to see that.

Speaker 4:
[22:35] It's scary, and not only that the numbers are scary, but to be able to continue on on the flats, the downhill and the flats, and not show any weakness there is even more scarier.

Speaker 3:
[22:44] Yeah, he won the race with three minutes, I think.

Speaker 1:
[22:47] You know what? Listen, however, I mean, I know it's, to your points, Spencer, it's scary if you're a GC rider. Let me say it another way. If you are a couch potato, like all of us, oh baby, this is good.

Speaker 2:
[23:04] Yeah, it is.

Speaker 1:
[23:05] Like, let's go.

Speaker 4:
[23:08] I agree.

Speaker 1:
[23:09] It may not be this summer, but it's next summer.

Speaker 3:
[23:13] Yeah, we have to, I think we have to wait. You know, there's a lot of debate, you know, obviously he's French, he's on a French team. He's going to do the Tour de France, right? This year, personally, I think it's a mistake to send him already to the tour. I would send him to the Vuelta with, you know, a full team around him, super support and see where he gets in three weeks. He, for sure, he wants to go to the tour. It seems to me that he is already the guy calling the shots in the team. So he will go to the tour. But I think we should give him some, you know, be a bit patient, because, I mean, France is crazy now about it with him. I mean, even, you know, there's these discussions of him maybe leaving the team after the end of his contract in 2027. French President Macron had jumped in and made a statement that he wants him to stay on a French team. I mean, there's a lot going on. He's still 19 years old, guys. And they're talking about a potential 8 million euro contract. That's what his agent is asking for 2028.

Speaker 4:
[24:24] That's wild.

Speaker 3:
[24:26] He is a great cyclist, but let's not burn the necessary steps. I'm curious to see what he can do in three weeks. I'm sure he's going to be fine, but...

Speaker 4:
[24:36] I agree with you, Johan, but I think we should also point out the present too. Like, historically, if you do a full gas San Remo, full glass Flanders, full gas Rubé, you're not going to be that great in Liège-Bastogne-Liège. Now we're talking about a frequent nature in Pogacar. I'm sure it will be great, but technically speaking, Seychelles is a much better preparation with Pays Basque, the Hilli stage race for next weekend. So if they're in fact kind of close, you might want to put your money on Seychelles because of the lead up to that race. I mean, you do a hard Rubé, shit, you can be completely exhausted for two weeks. Obviously, we're talking about Pogacar, a completely different specimen, but.

Speaker 3:
[25:16] Pogacar made a small adjustment, George. He skipped Amstel, which was last year maybe his least strong race because he went, he got real back in, didn't win. I think it was already crazy to do San Remo, Flanders, Rubé and then still be in the win for Amstel. That's very rarely seen because they're completely different kind of riders. I think with two weeks, I have no doubts about who else is going to be on. I mean, I hope Seixas is close. I mean, we were there, George, Stradiv Bianca, he was the last guy hanging on to put the car on that climb. But Liège is different. It's a monument. It's 260 something kilometers different.

Speaker 1:
[26:04] Does Jonas race? No, no, no, he's not.

Speaker 2:
[26:08] Yeah, it's too smart for that.

Speaker 1:
[26:10] Well, yeah. I mean, and he keeps. You see the story about him, everybody up in arms because he was in Tenerife training with no socks on and had like a speaker on his bike box on his bike. These people, these fucking bike nerds are just like, oh, you can't do that. I mean, shut up.

Speaker 2:
[26:32] Shut up.

Speaker 1:
[26:34] Actually shut up. When you win the Tour de France a couple of times and ride like that, you can do whatever you want. Okay, shut up.

Speaker 2:
[26:45] Not just won the Tour, beat Pagatra at the Tour.

Speaker 1:
[26:47] Yeah, I mean, I saw the clip. I'm for sure. I think it was Sep Kust the posted it up with no socks. I was like, yeah, baby.

Speaker 3:
[26:55] He was filming. I mean, I don't know him at all personally, but I'm convinced he could not care less about what people think. The guy just does his own thing.

Speaker 1:
[27:10] I ride, I often, not often, but from time to time, fairly often ride with no socks. Let me tell you something. Feels good. It does. I'm not, especially if you live in a hot place like here in Austin. Dude, feels good.

Speaker 4:
[27:27] Like whatever.

Speaker 1:
[27:30] Full Triggy look. I love it.

Speaker 2:
[27:34] RIP the shoes.

Speaker 4:
[27:35] I feel sorry for Anna when you put them shoes in the house.

Speaker 2:
[27:38] So I just, we have a garage.

Speaker 3:
[27:43] These guys ride with ankle socks, right? I mean, they're not using, they're not riding with no socks.

Speaker 1:
[27:48] Well, then he's not done it right. Then I'm going to join the comments and tell him he's not doing it right. I don't care about the speaker. I think although the choice of music, what? But just do it with no socks. It feels so good.

Speaker 3:
[28:05] It was, was it Ramp? Was it Primoz last year in the tour that all of a sudden showed up with ankle socks?

Speaker 2:
[28:11] Yeah. Yeah.

Speaker 3:
[28:12] In the stage to, what was it? Where Pugacar won.

Speaker 2:
[28:18] That one stage where Pugacar won.

Speaker 3:
[28:20] Yeah.

Speaker 2:
[28:21] The Otakam stage. But Johan, so it is a, it's different, right? It's a monument next week. Liège, long race. Paul Seijas has done well in monuments. Top 10 at Lombardy last year. Wasn't even a full pro season, 30 European championships, 13th at world championships, road race, 270 K long as a hard race. And he was following Pogacar when he attacked. So I wouldn't automatically ride him off just because he's young.

Speaker 3:
[28:48] Yeah.

Speaker 2:
[28:48] Okay. But do we think, how do we think Remco Evenepoel does? Today's winner next week at Liège.

Speaker 3:
[28:57] I personally think he's going to be good, but he's no match for Pogacar. I mean, today he was the big favorite, the best quality rider. Logic has been respected. He won, but I don't think that this performance of Remco is up there with the level of Pogacar, especially not in Liège-Bastogne-Liège. I don't think so. The only thing that's a lot different compared to last year for Remco is, well, last year, first of all, he started really late because he had that crash and broke his shoulder. And I think Liège was his third or fourth race of the season. Not that that matters anymore nowadays, but he was completely out of position. He was on his own. Like he started La Redoute in 40th position. This is not going to happen this year with the team he has. He's going to be brought to the bottom of La Redoute in good position. That's going to be that's that changing. Obviously great motivation. Now the morale must be incredible after today's win. But I think I think Pogacar had more gears.

Speaker 4:
[29:56] I'm going to disagree with you, Johan. I'm going to just for the sake of anticipation and excitement. I think the way we're seeing guys actually starting to beat Pogacar, I was like, maybe we don't need to go toe to toe with him, pull for him when we're in breakaways. Maybe they kind of sandbag and not pull as much now and just think more about getting to the finish line faster. Remco has had a really good build up to this week. And I'm sure this week is super important for him as we just saw today. And then we have Seixas in the mix. So I think it's going to be quite interesting. And hopefully Pogatar does not just ride away from them. And we have a really exciting finish like we've seen in the last couple World Cups.

Speaker 1:
[30:40] God bless you.

Speaker 2:
[30:40] Yeah, bless you. So today was a big thing circled on Quinn Simmons' calendar. Like he said, he had an interview a couple months ago. Said he was skipping Flanders, all the Cabo classics and he was going to go all in on Amstel Gold. Finished his 28th. Can't be, I cannot imagine that's what he was aiming for. What, any tips, like, are you, would you guys change his calendar, change his approach at all to these one day races?

Speaker 4:
[31:10] I would say no. I mean, we saw last year, he was really focused on the world as well. Didn't have a great worlds. And then week later, he basically did one of the most impressive breakaways we've seen all in 2025 season in Lombardy. So I would not definitely not count him out for next week. It's a one day race. Maybe it just didn't feel great throughout the day, but I would think he's going to get better and better throughout the week.

Speaker 3:
[31:35] He had an off day, off day, off day.

Speaker 2:
[31:37] Is he, I'm trying to open up, I'm trying to start a conversation here about, so he's like 10 kilos heavier than a lot of these guys he's competing against. Is he doing the wrong type of one day race?

Speaker 3:
[31:46] I agree, Spencer. I was going to say, I would love to see him in the Cobble Classics.

Speaker 4:
[31:54] I just don't think he loves the Cobble Classics. I know as a junior, he did the Junior Roubaix with Luke Lampardi, and this really incredible junior USA team. I think that was the only one that said he probably never wanted to go back, so he might just not be a huge fan of the Cobbles.

Speaker 2:
[32:12] He has to do so much more power than everybody else in these races. Mathematically, it's an uphill battle. You know who's a really good Roubaix rider is his little brother, Colby Simmons. He's done it twice, finished inside the time line both times.

Speaker 3:
[32:25] The funny thing is, Spencer, we're talking about him being 10 kilos heavier than these guys. He looks big on the bike, but if you stand next to him, I've seen him in his suit in the Vuelta, the guy's waist is like this. He's so skinny. He cannot be any lighter. You know, he's a tall guy.

Speaker 2:
[32:47] Yeah, that's the the tallness really starts to hurt you. Yeah.

Speaker 3:
[32:51] Yeah.

Speaker 1:
[32:53] Didn't hurt Jorgensen normally.

Speaker 4:
[32:55] Yeah. And Seishas is pretty tall, isn't he?

Speaker 3:
[32:58] Yeah, he's tall.

Speaker 2:
[32:59] He's too tall. That's that's the only thing going against him. We're looking back.

Speaker 3:
[33:02] He's the tallest tour winner since. I've read somewhere an expert who was saying, you know, let's let's not overhype sex. I mean, whatever. I don't know how he got the information. Let's not overhype him because he's still going to grow. He's still going to grow a few centimeters. And maybe he may be too tall.

Speaker 1:
[33:20] Where would you get this information? I don't know about that. I think you're done growing north and south.

Speaker 3:
[33:29] Yeah.

Speaker 1:
[33:29] No.

Speaker 2:
[33:31] What do you mean? Am I not going to keep growing?

Speaker 1:
[33:33] No. At 19 or 1920, you're not getting... Listen, I'm not some evolutionary whatever. I feel like that's it. I don't think you all... You don't have a growth spurt at 20.

Speaker 3:
[33:47] No.

Speaker 2:
[33:48] And Johan, I mean, if he does keep growing, it's an issue. But how does this person know this?

Speaker 3:
[33:54] I have no idea. I don't remember who it was either, but it was somebody saying that he anticipates he can still grow a few centimeters and that's going to be a problem. I don't think so.

Speaker 1:
[34:05] Where are you? What rabbit hole are you going down on the internet? With that particular side...

Speaker 2:
[34:11] I did not make this up. I might just...

Speaker 1:
[34:12] Don't go to that one again. Whoever says... No, no, no. Any... No, no. Okay. Well, I hope to make it next week. And I have to fly to Hawaii for a conference. It's just hella early there. But now that you guys are sitting here talking... We are talking about this, and I'm like, damn. It's kind of like a two-in-the-morning setup for me.

Speaker 2:
[34:35] Yeah.

Speaker 3:
[34:39] For the show or to watch the race?

Speaker 1:
[34:41] Well, to watch... I mean, you would... If you wanted to... Yeah, if you wanted to see the bulk of the action, that would be 2 a.m. Oh, that's hard.

Speaker 4:
[34:52] Yeah.

Speaker 1:
[34:54] So I might miss the bulk of the action. But it sounds amazing.

Speaker 2:
[34:59] Could be a great race.

Speaker 1:
[35:01] Yeah. I was trying to look up that none of these betting sites have the odds up right now. DraftKings doesn't have it.

Speaker 2:
[35:09] If you just...

Speaker 1:
[35:10] Nobody has any preliminary odds on Liège. I thought that might be interesting.

Speaker 2:
[35:16] Do you guys want to... Speaking of that, do you want to guess the Tour de France odds right now? It's crazy. Pogacar is minus 390. As we sit here right now. I would not bet that right now. Too many things could happen between now and July.

Speaker 1:
[35:31] That's a bad bet. What about Vanguard?

Speaker 2:
[35:34] Plus 400. Not terrible money, actually, if you believe in... The one I've already bet on Paul Seychast to win this Tour de France, plus 1,100.

Speaker 1:
[35:48] Oh, that's it. I'm sorry. He's the top. He's the third top favorite.

Speaker 2:
[35:56] He's...

Speaker 1:
[35:57] Is there somebody between 400 and 1100?

Speaker 2:
[35:58] Renka or Ebonapol is the same money. So they're tied. Yeah, not going to happen.

Speaker 1:
[36:03] We'll short that one. That's... Yeah.

Speaker 2:
[36:09] Hmm.

Speaker 1:
[36:12] I mean, Jonas is the best bet there. I mean, if you were going to risk 100 dollars to win 400, that would be...

Speaker 3:
[36:20] I think the only way Seychast can win if something happens with Jonas and Pogacar, that's the only way. He's not going to beat both of them.

Speaker 2:
[36:30] I don't know about that.

Speaker 3:
[36:32] I don't know.

Speaker 2:
[36:33] But Jonas is doing zero. He's not going to be... I mean, anything could happen to him.

Speaker 3:
[36:39] Being at 80 percent of his strength, he's going to win the zero.

Speaker 2:
[36:42] That is true, by the way.

Speaker 1:
[36:44] I'm with you, Johan. I think Paul should... I love this idea of taking the strongest team they can take to support him in a race like the Vuelta, and just kind of do a dry run.

Speaker 3:
[36:59] Yeah.

Speaker 1:
[36:59] Like, this is three weeks, this is a great team. See how he responds.

Speaker 3:
[37:04] They have a strong team now. They have built a strong team. In the meantime, they can still reinforce for next year, based on the Vuelta.

Speaker 1:
[37:13] Yeah. Look, there's a world... Of course, our great friend Matthew Ricotello is now on that team. I've watched this sort of unfold. I mean, there's a world where he plays a big... This kid can climb, this kid... He could be sort of...

Speaker 4:
[37:27] Just won a race. Yeah.

Speaker 2:
[37:29] Yeah.

Speaker 1:
[37:30] Yeah.

Speaker 2:
[37:30] He's...

Speaker 4:
[37:32] Yes, he is. George Jura.

Speaker 1:
[37:33] A fun part of that story.

Speaker 2:
[37:36] Do you guys know who did what Johan and Lance are talking about? Went to the Vuelta, focused on that. Showed up next year, won the Tour de France. Yeah, that's exactly what Poguchar did. Won three stages, finished third overall. Worked out pretty well for him.

Speaker 3:
[37:50] There's another guy who's sitting here on the screen.

Speaker 2:
[37:55] I remember that. This is the fourth place, right? At the Vuelta.

Speaker 1:
[37:58] Yeah, I didn't win it.

Speaker 2:
[38:01] I think that's the nice thing about that strategy Johan laid out, is it's less pressure on you to win it, and then you're just rehearsing for the next year at the Tour.

Speaker 3:
[38:11] Yeah.

Speaker 2:
[38:13] Okay.

Speaker 1:
[38:14] Well, congrats to Remco.

Speaker 3:
[38:17] Easy win.

Speaker 1:
[38:19] Great win, but easy win. I mean, he's got a lot of... everybody was happy.

Speaker 3:
[38:26] I think if you would ask Remco, if it was an easy win, he probably wouldn't say he wasn't. He was calm, but still, he suffered.

Speaker 1:
[38:34] Everybody was happy. Skjell Moser was happy. There was everybody who was...

Speaker 3:
[38:40] And as you say, Lance, I think when I finished the show with congratulating Leo Van Vliet with his 30 years of great director, organizing it, a great race. I know Leo, he's a house in the south of Spain. I meet him sometimes there and he's a super passionate guy. And yeah, he's, he did a great job.

Speaker 4:
[39:04] Yeah. Shout out to Leo.

Speaker 1:
[39:06] Agreed. Awesome. All right, everybody. Well, thanks for tuning in. Hope everybody has a great Sunday. We will, we being most people on this show. George, are you doing the Lea Show?

Speaker 2:
[39:18] You gotta do it. Oh, daddy.

Speaker 1:
[39:20] All right, well, dang it.

Speaker 2:
[39:22] You don't even do the race.

Speaker 4:
[39:24] Same little time. How many?

Speaker 1:
[39:25] Do you ever do the race?

Speaker 4:
[39:27] Like one time. I think just once.

Speaker 1:
[39:30] All right, I better get up.

Speaker 3:
[39:31] Gosh, you got second. You got second Lance in English, right?

Speaker 1:
[39:38] I think I got second. I don't ask these questions. I don't know about these. I want to know what I want.

Speaker 3:
[39:43] Do you remember who won?

Speaker 1:
[39:47] Pascal Richard.

Speaker 3:
[39:49] One of the biggest class riders I've ever seen, by the way. Pascal Richard.

Speaker 1:
[39:53] Yeah, he could phone it in for sure.

Speaker 3:
[39:55] He's a super talent.

Speaker 1:
[39:56] Yeah. Olympic champion.

Speaker 3:
[39:59] Yeah.

Speaker 1:
[40:00] Dude, just be like, just not even, you're like, is this guy even racing anymore? Show up, of course, back then, you know, fuck no helmets. That was the glory days. Like when people were like, dude, this, these motherfuckers are cool. Look, watch this. And he was just greased back.

Speaker 2:
[40:18] Bro, you still race?

Speaker 1:
[40:20] He still makes Max Chandry look like a junior at the Olympics in Atlanta. Makes me look like a, like a, like I just born, like I just learned to ride a bike in Liège. Just like, yeah, I'm here.

Speaker 2:
[40:32] How about it?

Speaker 3:
[40:34] If you would see Pascal Richard now, he is still, he looks the same. He's equally fit.

Speaker 1:
[40:39] OK, I thought you were going to say he's 300 pounds. If you could see him now, he wouldn't even fit on the screen. We can't have him on the show. We were going to have him.

Speaker 2:
[40:50] No, that's OK. Good.

Speaker 3:
[40:52] Super, super, super class guy.

Speaker 2:
[40:54] So sweet. Do you guys know who got third at that Liège? Yeah, he's been.

Speaker 1:
[41:03] Who's got the memory now for the old? Oh, yeah, I can reminisce with the best of them.

Speaker 3:
[41:12] OK, thanks for tuning in.